YISkyDive

Ok, so lets take this a little bit further than. I just finished brian germains book for the second time, and it made a lot more sense the second time through. low to the ground, a hook turn is pointless correct? because if your doing one, the rate of turn is so fast that you arnt gaining maximum acceleration, and limiting your capabalitly of having "outs" because of a higher potential to induce a dynamic stall? more approperate is a long and deep 6 to 8 second risers turn that can be speed up as need, but giving your canopy a much shorter recovery arc to the speed? because more speed would = a smaller recovery arc, correct? all the info is plently helpful guys, thanks dave.

haha, to che sales men to che. (sp???) But, in actual performance flight, if one keeps tention on the lines how do you cause your body to wrap the lines? I actually remember a discusion vaguley with my father that if you snap a toggle to hard you could cause the canopy to turn faster than your body can travel inducing a line twist with a toogle at WOT, and causing a definate cut away, i believe. I dont remember the exact specifics, so if any one can eleberate that would help. thanks. -dave.

If a pilot keeps line tension at all time isnt it theoretically impossible to induce line twists? - not saying thats true.. just what i've been told. I thought, or have be taught more or less, it gets Real Bad when you loose tension from excesive direction changes that dont follow smooth input. I thrw myself above my canopy once, and lost line tension.. that was an intresting example of what not to do.. it was like at about 5 or 6,000. High hop and pop, but it def was diffrent. What i did was over exagerate the A card requirement, not realizing that an unsmooth direction change could slaughter or cause a "self gift warp" mess. EDIT: not threw above like a wing over, i was just above my parachute maybe + 10 degrees off of the horizontal axis -dave.

So, when i punch my toggle up high(+1000)ft, and swing in a high G motion, thats a hook? But when, again (+1000ft) i do a carving front riser turn, of 270 degrees, since its a slow but altitude sacrificing speed manuver i am not doing a "hook turn?" I've done a few high altitude clear and pulls ( 3 i think) ...I love em. You can defenitlly learn a lot in that time.. and i always have two seperate parts in my skydive.. my free fall, and my canopy ride. The 210 triathlon can fly like a dog at times.. but it can also generate some fast and fun manuverus up high, even if it is just 1.1 heh. But yah... never knew the manuver was independent to a riser or toggle. Thanks for the reply guys. -dave

Here we go again: As the title explains: What is the diffrence between a front riser turn, and a hook turn? Is a hook turn a toggle turn for a swoop? Or is a Hook turn a 270 degree front riser turn. Netheir of which i am even close to using, but i think i've seen the terms used interchangable in a few threads that i was reading, and it got me wondering.. sorry for all the stupid question posts.. created a new thread becasue it was seperate from the aerodynamics question.

I woulda NEVER thought of that. How hard is the course anyway? just survive the test, and the test dives, and be on your merry way? Or is it as unmerciful as i hear the AFF courses can be (granted no one can be expected as a coach to up hold what aff consists off) merely just wondering the likely hood of passing/ failing with 2.5 hours of tunnel time, 111 skydives, and pre reading the material. Thanks for the replys, they helped.. as i would have obviously failed the card check.

thanks for the quick reply! um, this brought one more question to mind.. that actually i've been wonering about. Why do certain companies (areodyne, PD) choose a steep qlide for there swoop/ performance canopes, while others choose a flatter glide/ trim. and, yah, the diablo had a faster rate of decent, but the glide also significantly changed. maybe other canopies don't do that, but the diablo went from a glide of 25 degrees (estiment) to 45 degrees. It was insane diffrence. This is also full flight characterstics. But thanks for the reply, its cool to know other canopies do not change their angles. -dave

Hey guys, I am going to the Chambersburg,PA(sp) coach course in about 2 weeks, not even. I have read the SIM and IRM with the syllabus and recommened/ required readings, but i dont know what to expect, exactly. 8am to 6pm class hours? and then a free jump period weather permiting or something? Just wondering what your experinces in coach courses has been, thanks guys. also, any tips on surviving the course? I'm assuming its excellent practice to everything by USPA recommendations, wearing a helemt at all times in the plane, and this like that.. but ya, i just have no idea what to expect. any help is appreciated! Thank guys! -dave.

Hey guys, i have a basic physics question on my mind that i can't seem to figure out. When a pilot downsizes canopies, in the same make/model, does the glide ratio increase or decrease. When i saw video of a diablo 170, against a diablo 135, the glide ratio was a horrendous decrease.. but also the diablo 135 was about .15 - .2 over manufactures recommend loading. How does an aspect ration play into that as well? Like why is the Katana so ground hungry and the Crossfire2 have so much better a glide, but relitively same performance? One last question: What determines the F-riser pressure on canopies. Why do some canopies have feather light inputs, and other have body builder work out programs desgined into them? Note: I am not looking at jumping any of these canopies for a long time, but just watching people fly had made this a point of intreste to myself. Just wondering, Dave. Edit because I was focusing on the "Ration" - fixed allowance of food, etc and not "Ratio" - relationship between two amounts.

I use video to a huge extent of learning my "bump", "sweet spot" and flare heights. I thought i was doing Exactly what my coach was telling me. I knew i was. And then i saw the video, and was like damn, more practice. When your doing an approch, theres a lot going on, and what ya think.. may not be what ya ment. So i know i have to practice my technique cleaner up high, so i can get more distance out of my surf. The only thing to be careful of with video is show boating. I have to really calm myself down durring an approach and forget the video until after im done my approach complety. But ya, i have like 50 jumps on video, all from POV to my father taping. It helps a lot

How does a pilot do that? Do you mean "steer" with the risers? or Come X degrees of the windline, turn those X degrees, and then apply Double Fronts? That would obviously have a much slower affect then a true 90 degree carved turn, but im not sure if thats what you mean. Thanks -dave

I feel kinda obligated to reply to this post. I have 108 jumps, and i have begun learning the fundementals on swooping since jump 45. Before I go further in my opinion on this, i'll define a swoop to myself - a controlled accelration of a canopy that will have a three stage affect consiting of a dive, a recovery, and a surf. Turning approach or not, swoops can be completed. I have been learning the ins and outs of double front risers since jump 45, and now at jump 108 i finally am beginning to understand site picture, input, release, and many other important things that pretain to turning approches down the road. I have spent about 63 skydives learning my canopy on landing.. Now some at my local DZ believe its to early for me to doing this, but my opinion holds to the facts of wingloadings.. why would i learn at 200 to 400 jumps with a 1.3 to 1.4 wingloading, and have a much harder time learning the important points and basics, then at jump 45 to 150 under a slower, docile canopy that can be flown in a high performance fascion. The simple problem with low jump number individuals and swooping lies in two concepts, one education. Even i was guilty at a low jump number saying "I WANNA DO A 270!!" but after getting a good smack and some helpful advice, i quickly went to learning everything i could on canopy dynamics and started to progress down the path of approches with double front risers. The seocnd problem lies with in the wing loadings that some pilots learn under. At my DZ i am the only B lisence skydiver doing a 1:1 loading. Others are already at 40 jumps 1.3, and so on.. flying smaller canopies. A small, fast and fun as it maybe causes a huge increase in potential of error. Recovery arcs are longer, inputs are more sensitive, and everything happens faster. Due to this speed increase, its important for those intrested in swooping and canopy control progress in low jump numbers with a low wingloading, while also being taught the essence of brake turns, flat turns, and other evasive manuvers that could save their lives if they find them selves low. This is merely an opinion, but after seeing some expressions at the DZ over my doule front riser approches i was just a little bugged because i believe learning at a low wingloading is exponetianlly safer than at a high wingloading. I'm just flying every little bit of potential energy out of my canopy. Just an opinion -dave

Payback462, you represent Everything wrong with dropzone.com/ uspa/ and the skydiving community. Go somewhere where your pathetic comments mean something. Thats ubsurd to say. Instead of offering to save a jumper's life with useful advice, you advice him to dig his grave. Grow Up. To the poster. I have explored ground lauching and other forms of ground launched flight for some time now. I have not been able to ground launch the triathlon due to not being able to find a safe and acceptable location in close proximity to my place, But before you take any canopy down a hill, there are education investigations that you should consider.. 1) If you can take part of a paraglider first flight course, or talk to a paraglider instrucutor. This will make your attempts with ground launching safer, 2) Understand your take off/ landing areas. Know all hazords, outs, and of course, where you could mistakenly end up.. 3) Talk to a local paragliding or hangliding club. Many states with launchable areas will have clubs that specific clubs use or own.. these can be used and generally is safer than doing the 'run onto a farmer's hill, and begone before the police come' stunt. Though i have never perosnally grounded launched (my place is a good 3 hours away), from lots of education i know its important to understand canopy and flight theory, as well as the theories involved with paragliding. This is just what i have learned.. oh and the proper wing loadings are from what i understand (feel free to correct me if i am wrong) 1.2 to 1.5, with a "flatter" glide canopy. Good luck, be safe.

As a "student" stand point, i always saw my coach/ inst. swooping. It's not a bad example, if they are not digging out of the corner, or doing an ultra aggressive stuid approach. That said, i do not support instrcutors that cut people off, or yell at fun jumpers that are already in the pattern, just so that they can be the first ones down. When i am a paying skydiver, i have the right to be in the proper airspace without getting yelled at. I had a problem with an instructor in Flroida that would not accept that doing Free Fly coaching was gonna put him behind me, and cause me to be in the pattern. If he/ she is getting paied to jump, they must treat all paying customers with respect, thats all.. as for the setting a bad example, no, the student pre A liscence should be asking for information on everything they do. That means S&TA, Instructors, or Coaches. For post A lisence jumpers, hopefully the proper training has been done that they understand that turning approches equal death for the untrained eye. It's as simple as that, responsibilty needs to be promoted on both parties parts, but espcially the students.. because they (I) are the ones learning.. jumpers around them are already experinced and just sharpening their skills. So thats my opinion being one of those "straight in" guys. lol dave

haha, fun fun. there wouldnt be any productive answers to my question though.. would there? not that makin' fun of I isnt ejoyable, i just need the info for how people get air into their pantz, or if everyone just uses the 4 hole system. thanks, ya 'all.

I hate english as a second laungage.. at least this time i didnt get a thread started about all my mistakes.. haha. dave.

Hey guys, I've been working on a set of track pants that are made from AirWalk snowboard pants, non insulated cargo pants. I've made 9 jumps with 0 holes cut into them and noticed a minor diffrence, but nothing major. Some obvious power in tracking, but nothing that would say they track faster than that of a jump suit with booties. (I jumped 9 times basically to have 9 dedicated skydives to learn good tracking form, and too have a good base before i blow them up) This weekend i am sueing some channels in to allow for full inflation, but the question i have is, how far should the channels go down (im using the pressuirzed pants as a refrence), and also, i was going to sue in openings for the cargo pockets to inflate. let me know if you have any ideas, as a base pant to work with though, id recommend to anyone because its uber baggy, and dual layered with zero insulation.. so you can so the outer layer to the inner layer and make a very efficient airfoil.. just for you guys that have done the channels mods, let me know how ya sewed it please, and if you have pictures, post em!

Alan, Thanks for the input.. but one thing im not sure of is my realse.. i actually think im low.. because in the video i attached (really low quality.. but should do the trick) it appears to me that i am "aggresviley" , not "smoothly" A) realsing the fronts, and B) letting the canopy level off.. but your comments very much helped, and thank you for your time in writing that post.. if you wouldnt mind just looking at the video and quickly re-evaluting.. id be much apppreciative (right click, save target as) Thanks again! Dave.

Man guys, you 'al just rippin' apart the immagrant. Sheesh. No one said English as a second language was easy???!!!

Hey guys, I went throw my videos from florida, and took some pictures of one of my better "result" attempts. Its under the 210 tri, and you canopy guru's can cratic it. From what i gather, on jump 68(thatone) i let go a touch late, causing a fairly large amount of tail input to get the level off.. more than should be used? So, if anyone has any suggestion, please by all means use the pictures to explain where "i should" be.. most of my older swoops are similar to that.. now im actually intentionally higher and coast to a flair. i have the video too, its tiny. if anyone wants to host it for the purpose of cratecing it, i can do that. thanks guys

Billvon, I read this as well in Germain's book.. and was rather confused, would you mind explaining this a little bit more? I read the whole book once, and the riser approach section like 3 times but this part confuses me just a little. Thanks. Dave.

Hello guys, my name is Dave and my father is looking into wingsuit flying. He has just under 700 skydives and has asked me to gain a few more details about it before he requests a demo... Basically... what are the proper stes to getting a demo wingsuit, i'm assuming the classic is the apporoperate placeto start, and what rig should one use? I'm assuming a 135 Crossfire2 is a much worse choice to a triathlong 210. Thanks for any information.. and if there is someobvious post that i missed.. my apoliges. Dave

Thought about it, but i work on my home DZ 5 days a week, so i wont have much of a chance to get out there. I want to pay for canopy coaching but im not going to be able too until i am ready to bring turning approches into my landings (wont be for a little) and also manage to save up the moeny for transition canopy. So i guess my options are fairly limited for this skydiving season. Thanks for all the advice though, on all fronts, because you guys have given a good amount of information on this subject, some of which i wasnt aware of. Thanks again dave

On that note.. If one will find themselves in an impact position.. what is the proper emergency procedure? I had it happen once, and i threw my leg infront of me and missed the earth.. but had i hit hard im sure lots of bad things could have happend. j/w what is a good bail out position, PLF i guess? if you can get there intime thanks

Thats my bad lol -dave