steve1

Good for you Lindsey. Taking an interest in what your boy wants to do. In my mind there is nothing more normal than hunting, fishing, and camping with your kids. It's too bad that so many see your thread as an opportunity to jump on the anti-hunting band wagon......

That looks like one cool jump ship! In 1975 that jump suit would have been way cool.... My first jump suits had the two zippers from foot to neck. I couldn't wait to sew on some patches back then. Most jumpers had an SCR or SCS patch sewn on if they were experienced. If you were skygod material you might have a night SCR or 16 way patch. Around 75 or so, most new jump suits had bells on the arms and legs. All that baggy material made for fairly good grips. Right after 75 the jumps suits became huge....Everyone wanted to be a floater and come in late. I quit jumping for about 25 years (around 75), so I'm not sure what happened to jump suits after that.... It's kind of interesting to study the evolution of jump gear.

There are some big mountains north of Anchorage. It would be easy to fly a plane into one, particularly in bad weather. I was sheep hunting north of Anchorage many years ago. (Middle of nowhere). I was hiking through an unnamed valley when I came upon airplane parts scattered over a hundred yard swath. I'll bet that pilot didn't survive either. That's one dangerous place to fly in....

Walkers and canes are kind of tough to jump with. The real challenge is when you try jumping with a heart lung machine!.....

I read that one reason the competition PC malfunctioned more than a Mark 1, was because of the big hole in the center back. It wouldn't inflate properly. I've got over 300 jumps on a mark 1, but I've never jumped a competition PC. Maybe someone who used to jump one can comment on those openings and landings. I used to stand up my Mark 1 most jumps. That was when I weighed like 140 lbs. and had french jump boots....

I was told a PC would oscillate less if it was short lined. Many accuracy people wanted that for competition. I bought a competition PC a while back. I heard they malfunctioned more, and landed harder than the old mark 1's. I had it modified by shortening the two long turn slots on the sides. I also had some material sewn over the big opening hole in the center back. All this is supposed to help with openings, and hopefully soften the landings. I turned 60 this year. I know I'm not as rough and tough as I once was, but I think I can still jump a PC without getting hurt. My last PC jump I stood it up at a boogie. (I couldn't have done that without my frenchies.) I figured I had to show all the young whipper snappers how it was done.....

Thanks Andy! Maybe I'd be better off to keep my opinions to myself. I get way too wound up over things....Maybe that's what happens when you get to be an old fart....I do learn a lot from the Speaker's corner. Sometimes, I'm way off, and I don't mind being set straight....

When I read this, my gut says that they're fully onboard with the hunting ban. I'll never be on board with a hunting ban. Hunting is a tool used to keep game populations down. But things aren's as simple as that. In many places in Montana hunting as a means to control game herds, is not working. Game is being chased off of public land by hoards of hunters. This game ends up on private ranches where the public can not hunt. Many ranchers love this because they can make a ton of money with their own private hunting operation. In the area I hunted elk, this past weekend, the Fish and Game was giving out too many elk tags in an effort, to bring down the elk population. Again this is not working, because the hunters can not access the private ranches. As a result there will again be too many elk, too many hunters, and the only people that are happy will be the private ranches which are becoming a lot like game farms. I'm not playing both sides of the issue. I am just a hunter who is sick of the direction hunting is going in this country.....

I'm still waiting for your's - you're waffling, like a few others here. 'I believe in rights, but this issue rubs me wrong. Maybe something should be done.' ??? I guess I don't understand what I'm supposed to be waffling about. I realize others have opinions. I'd like to hear what they have to say....I thought I made my point clear enough...I'm against game farms. I voted against them in Montana, along with the majority of voters there....

You just made an argument for pure Communism! I think that might be a pretty big jump...No, I'm not an advocate of Communism... In many ways I'd like to think that a land owner should be able to do anything he wants with his land. After all it's his land. But the truth is that it just isn't like that in America. I know places where you can't even build a house because the people don't want them there. I'm not saying that is right, but that is how it is. If the people in a state don't want prostitution in their state they vote to keep it out. The same is true of gambling. If most of the people don't want game farms they should be able to vote them down in my opinion....If it was a constitutional right, things would be different. I'm not a lawyer or politician. Set me straight if some of my thinking is off on this....I'd like to hear your opinion....

I think most game farms in Africa are different than the ones I've heard of in the U.S. In Africa there are huge tracts of land, where the game is kept in with electric wire. Maybe it is possible to have an ethical hunt in such a place. To tell you the truth I'm getting fed up with hunting in the U.S. With our over-population problem, hunting is fast becoming a thing of the past. When I was a kid you could hunt remote areas and seldom see another hunter. It isn't like that now. This past weekend my wife and I loaded up our horses. We drove eight hours to find a place to hunt elk. Long before daylight there was one vehicle after another passing our camp. I knew better than to take off riding before daylight because we didn't want to get shot. After daylight it reminded me of a pumpkin patch. Behind every ridge was a hunter orange vest. This was Montana, not New York. There were many elk killed that morning, but it was a crappy way to hunt in my opinion. Most of the elk were being chased off the public land onto private, where you couldn't hunt. It must be like paradise to hunt some of those private ranches Only the wealthy can afford to hunt there. Game farms are just another example of what hunting is coming to....You pay your money and drive away with multiple trophy's. It's quick and easy, but hardly hunting in my opinion....

I'm not a big fan of government intruding on peoples lives. If something becomes stupid enough though maybe the government does need to step in....

In fifty years of hunting, I've killed a lot of game. Today I have a hard time pulling the trigger on anything. I just don't enjoy that part of hunting anymore. Usually I take my wife and kids out and let them do the shooting. I take care of the meat after it is down. It's about the only meat we eat. But I seldom kill a thing. I still enjoy hunting though. I once heard of another old fart who would go out hunting each year. He wouldn't take any bullets. He enjoyed being out in nature and being part of the hunting process, but he didn't shoot a thing. I've never met anyone like that personally, but what I'm getting at is that there is more to hunting than just killing stuff. Another old hunter that I know, hunts hard every Fall. He's killed his share of smaller animals over the years, and he just doesn't enjoy that much any more. He won't settle for anything but a really big buck. Almost every year he gets skunked. There was nothing big enough for him to shoot, but that didn't stop him from enjoying the hunt.... Many people think that killing is all there is to hunting. If that was true, I'd get a job in a butcher shop. That thought sickens me. Game farm operations make me sick too. Where is the challenge in that?.... I talked to a guy once that worked on the game farm. He said he didn't know if he would ever hunt elk again. He was that disheartened after guiding on that place. Elk are more than just dumb farm animals. They deserve more respect than that. It takes a ton of skill to hunt them successfully. Anyone with a big wad of cash can kill an elk on a game farm....

Sounds like fun Amazon. I still haven't jumped that competition P.C. that I bought a couple years back. Macgregger Lake would be a good place to try it out. Maybe I'll make the boogie this year....

Montana has already voted against game farms. I'm all in favor of property rights, but game farms just seem wrong to me. I grew up hunting elk in Montana. An elk was never easy to get. Sometimes it took weeks of hard work to fill your tag. Many years, I got skunked. For a time game farms were legal in my state. There was a game farm near where I lived. Rich out-of-staters would fly in, and hang out in luxury at the lodge. Then they'd all sit down with drinks, and watch a video of various elk that could be shot on the ranch. They would pick out the one they wanted to shoot on this video. A 350 bull might sell for over ten thousand dollars. Then the same day, they would take a short drive, walk a few hundred yards, and then shoot that same elk. It all leaves a bad taste in my mouth. This is not hunting! Voters voted "no" to game farms in my state, and that's fine with me....

My gosh....240 lbs. under a papillion....now that's what I call hardcore!

I still think something is fishy with that photo....Howard, what gives?

Those papillions were nice canopies. Only jumped one a couple of times. Were they made of a different material? They were shinier if I remember right....

I wonder too about that steep of an oscillation on a P. C. I don't think I ever saw one at a 45 degree angle. Could that picture be doctored up some??? I remember one time when I tried to make a wild turn on my mark I. I was trying to hit the peas, and knew little or nothing about accuracy. I missed the pit entirely. I crashed into the hard packed ground around the pit.....About then, I decided that maybe I wasn't tough enough to do accuracy. On wind jumps sometimes, I'd run with the wind and then do a hook turn into it. If you timed it just right, you didn't have to do a rear PLF (which I hated). I thought I invented doing a hook turn into the wind on a P.C. but have since heard of many others who did the same thing. Sometimes I hooked it in too low. That was no fun! There was a reason people wore French Para-boots and a good helmet back then. Knowing how to do a decent PLF saved lot's of people too.... I was always able to walk away from a low hook turn on a P.C. I might have been limping a little, and may have had a wimpy look on my face, but I was always able to hobble off the field.

Been there. Done that. You could usually walk away from a hook turn on a P.C. (If you were young and tough, and a light weight). I know I couldn't do that now. I'm still damn good looking though!

This has me wondering how much pull does an average pilot chute, on a main, have? I'll bet most riggers know the answer to that. On the old belly wart reserves the pilot chute had about 200 lbs. of pull, at terminal, if I remember right. Much of the time you were facing the door, so if your reserve did open, the spring loaded pilot chute went flying that direction. Not good! I'm just wondering if there is any way a skydiver could hold the canopy inside the plane if the pilot chute did go out the door. The door frame might help for leverage. I think most people know that if a chute does open, the smart thing to do is jump on the canopy and try to get ahold of the pilot chute....if there is time. B.J. Worth had his belly reserve open while he was putting out a student on static line. Luckily they jumped on the pilot chute and canopy, and closed the door before disaster happened.... That was how the story was told to me, by Bob Smith. Bob was flying that load. The student was wondering what all the cussing was about, why everyone was trying to close the door so fast, and why the pilot was grabbing things instead of flying the plane....

Montana has had a lot of drop zones come and go. Some relocated. I have fond memories of the drop zone in Kalispell. That is where the Osprey Club started. They relocated to Lost Prairie. Several of the old timers are still there. Several live next to the D.Z. Missoula had a drop zone in the 60's and 70's. Possibly even the 50's. That's where B.J. Worth started. It moved to Stevensville and then Hamilton. As far as I know it is still in operation. It is supposed to be the oldest collegiant club in the nation. The only thing is I don't think there's any college kids in it now.... Many people remember Williston. I thought they were talking about Williston, North Dakota. It's long gone now. I heard there was once a drop zone in Glasgow. There may have been a small club in Helena. I know some jumping went on there for a while in the 70's. Bozeman had a college club. I knew one guy who burned in there. There may still be some jumping there now with Jeff Swab. Not too many years ago there were two drop zones at Laurel. Now about the only Sport Jumping that remains in Montana is in the Western part of the state, at Lost Prairie, Ronan, and Hamilton....(possibly Bozeman)....

Thanks Sparky on the info. on halo operations. I never went to halo school, but I have jumped out of a C-130 blackbird. It had a lot of secret, stuff on board. It could follow the terrain at a low altitude and had an early version of a GPS on board. The green light would go on when you were over the D.Z. By todays standards this is all primitive, but during the early 70's it was high tech. I even got chewed out when I took a picture of it.... We were in isolation at Camp McCall for about five days. One afternoon we loaded our A-team onto one of these Black Birds. We chuted up over Texas someplace with our mc-1, static line rigs. I was the jumpmaster. You could feel the plane going up and down as it followed the terrain in. When the green light went on I jumped first. I would usually jump last (when I jumpmastered), but some of our team were nervous to jump, and I figured what the heck, I'd go first.... It was so black that I never did see the ground. I wasn't able to drop my equipment. I just crashed into the desert. One guy was hurt, and had to be medivaced out. We worked with the airforce S. F. people. We would set up some type of electric beacon on top of a hill. Jets would then fly a distance and a track to a target. This too was really high tech and secret in the early 70's. By today's standards it would be way outdated. In the early 70's we jumped a new type of chute. It was just like a T-10 except there were two safety forks that were pulled just above your capewells. You'd pull these after opening. The risers would then slide just above the capewells. You'd pull you risers to turn, and then try to even them out before landing. None of this worked very well. The army soon scrapped this idea. I think Special Forces were the first to jump these. Later we started jumping t-10's that were like a 7-TU. I would sometimes wear my Frenchies on practice jumps, and stand up land. This was a sure way to get chewed out. Standups were a no-no. I think those modified T-10's were called Mc-1's, but my memory is about shot.....

Why in the world would anyone want to be a teacher in America. You will work for a minimum amount of pay at one of the most stressful jobs there is anywhere. You will get zero respect. Almost everyone thinks the educational system stinks these days. Almost everyone knows of a crappy teacher somewhere, who needs to be fired. After all aren't all teachers no good??? You'll be told you are not measuring up, over and over again. You need to do more will be the cry.... Your test scores are not high enough. America's kids don't measure up, and surely all this must be your fault. Anyone with a 3rd grade education knows more about education than you do, even though you may have six years of college. Yes, even high school drop outs know more. After all they went to school once and Yes, they must be experts on this subject. And then there are wind bag politicians who think they are experts too. I voted for O'bama. To tell you the truth I have come to reget that decision. His ideas on how to improve the education system seem to be coming from Nutsville. How are they any different than Bush's thoughts. I really can't see any difference. We don't need more "No Child Left Behind B. S." Haven't those ideas proven to be faulty. If you are a teacher or are contemplating entering this carreer field, I would like to say Thankyou! Without caring people like you I'm not sure where I would have ended up. You gave me advice and encouragement when all I got from home was that, I wasn't worth much. I think American teachers need a pat on the back for all the good that they do each day. They put up with a ton of B. S. each day, because they care about kids and they are trying to make a difference....And yes, they do make a wonderful difference much of the time!....

Men tend to succeed far more often in their attempts. Maybe they are more serious or maybe more competent, I don't know. ................................................................ Montana has the highest suicide rate in the nation. Alaska had the highest a few years back. Isolation and alcoholism, are factors. I don't think altitude has much to do with it. Women have greater problems with depression than men, but men are far more successful at killing themselves than women. One reason is that men use more lethal means. One of the first things I ask someone who is contemplating suicide, is how do you plan to kill yourself. If they plan to shoot themselves the risk level may be extremely high. There is no going back after touching the trigger. In other forms of suicide a person may have a chance to change their mind. Most people who attempt suicide don't really want to die that way. They are tired of hurting and suicide is a way out. If you take pills their is time to get help before it's too late. If you try to gas yourself there may be time to change your mind and crawl out of the garage. With a gun it is over fast. Some people fail by not shooting themselves in the right place. Some flinch at the last second. Using too small of a gun might not work either.... I guess the point I'm trying to make is that guns are lethal. In the hands of a suicidal person the chance of death is much greater than if they are contemplating most other means. They did a study once of people who jumped to their death off a bridge. Most of all of them died after jumping, but some survived. They interviewed these survivors and asked them what was going through your mind as you were falling to your death. Nearly every one of them said, I wished I hadn't jumped. After they took that step their was no going back. At any rate, suicide is preventable in most cases. The more lethal the means the greater the danger. There are some who are going to kill themselves no matter what, but most can be helped....