teason

Can't tell you why on your gear it feels the same. Bag design, relaxed stoes (as opposed to those who tighten the snot out of them), pilotchute size and condition... I'm guessing you probably got new gear. that could affect three of those factors. I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

The reason to inspect your selvage edges is that an uneven deployment can result is an 80-20 load on your harness. a damaged selvage edge weakens the webbing. Although main deployments are usally orderly, a reserve deployment is not always. (for example a streamer can put you is a wacky body position with providing decelleration.) If you have student gear, this can become even more critical. I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

Not with line stoes? I'll call shananagins on that. Total absolute and complete shananigans Here's the definition. "Snatch force-The shock produced on the load when the parachute assembly fully strings out and becomes suddenly accelerated to the same speed as the load. Comes prior to opening shock." The canopy is just a one part of the equation. A large part of what determines snatch is the speed of the assembly prior to excelleration. Clearly tight elastics will slow the decelleration prior to line stretch. Here's the equation: snatch force=delta speed/time. There are two ways to reduce snatch. 1. decrease the delta speed 2. increase the time Decreasing the delta speed is achieved by slowing the bag's decelleration off the back. Increasing the time is achieved through various means (packing, canopy design) I believe you may have confused snatch force with opening shock. That is very dependent on the canopy and is the second part of the process. I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

The new ZP mantas are also trimmed nose high compared to the F111. This makes them quite easy to flare as it reduces toggle pressure. I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

"Hello 911? I'd like to report an accident waiting to happen" Let me guess, he said he'd be careful right? I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

I think you know what I mean. But just for the sake of answering the question, I Actually mean MIL-C-5040 type IIa (or just core Type, same thing) It is most commonly used for closing loops. I've also seen Type II used on handgliding reserves quite extensively (as well as spectra). Many other canopies used nylon line ranging from type I in pilot chutes, Type III on military mains, Type IV in early para foils and Type V in early paraplanes. Generally, "nylon line" cover all these types as well as the Mil specs you have mentioned. Type IIa and V seem to be main ones I see, type V also being used in closing loops on Racers. By the way when you say Dacron, do you mean flat braided......? I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

Excactly. It's kind of absurd to go beyond the basic definitions of the different types of line. After a while it just becomes noise. My real point was that Spectra isn't nylon and the lines all have different make up and properties. Strengths an weaknesses, if you will. I was replying to a "stump the wizard" question about the "type of nylon" in nylon line. Just trying to post a point. I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

I just had two real points; first in skydiving nylon line is usually type II or V. Secondly, Spectra is olefin not nylon. Now unless we have those in the textile field out there, the specific type of nylon will probably be useless. I know of about 75. There is a good chance that type II line is made from TypeII nylon!) All you need to know is this; 1.)Type II & V are a nylon 6/6 line which is a poly amide base with an elongation of about 20% 2.)Kevlar is an aramid with very low resistance to abrasion. It's also a bitch to fingertrap and has very low elongation. It also breaks down quickly in UV light 3.)Dacron is a polyester base with an elongation of about 12-16%. 4.)Vectran is a a liquid crystal aromatic polyester noted for its thermal and chemical stability, moisture resistance, and high strength and modulus. 5.) Spectra is an olefin polyethylene fibre with an elongation of about 5% if memory serves. It is 40% stronger than kevlar and 4 time stronger than nylon. In tests, nylon line fails after 550,000cycles Polyester fails after 150,000 cycles Kevlar after 25,000 cycles And the big winner (you guessed it) Spectra with 675,000 Cycles! And by the way, you can also make fabric out of Dacron, Nylon, Spectra and kevlar. Just a fun fact I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

Buzzzzzzzzz. Incorect Cored nylon line predates spectra. It is mostly seen coreless and used as closing loops. Nylon line had a very high elongation propertyof about 20%. This made it an ideal line in the days of old. Spectra is an ultra high strength polyethylene fiber Polyethylene Fiber — (Spectra currently produced in the U.S. by Honeywell) is one of the world's strongest and lightest fibers. A bright white polyethylene, Polyethylene fiber is, pound-for-pound, 10 times stronger than steel and up to 40 percent stronger than aramids. It floats, resists chemicals and water, and exhibits superior fiber-to-fiber abrasion. Basically, nylon is a familly of synthetics not a specific material but when we talk about Nylon line in skydiving we are talking about type II or type V, not spectra. Spectra is Olefin. I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

Spectra is no-stretch now? When did that happen? I know it stretches less than dacron but no-stretch? Are you sur you're not thinking of Kevlar line? Spectra's low stretch attributes are the reason the lines stay in trim longer. If the high stretch attributes are why you want dacron, then why not nylon line? They can stretch up to 20%! The fact is there are many things that can be done to reduce opening forces. Going to a line that is less robust and bulkier seems odd to me. I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

I would have disagreed with that but then I became a DZO. If there shit going on at the DZ it's your job to clean it up. Even if it means you've gotta stay on the ground to do it. I'd give my right nut just to be an instructor again. That was a great time in my life. I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

Deployment is actually the time from pack opening to line stretch prior to inflation. Opening shock is the force applied to decellerate the load. and is also dependent on the speed of the load and slack on the line (line dump). Loose bands = increased bag decelleration = increased snatch. I have seen data from several jumps and the snatch and opening have very distinct peaks. Snatch can be harder than opening shock. As for line dump with freebags, well, yes it does happen. A deployment like that can create an 80%-20% load on the riser. Inspect your MLWs for nicks on the selvage! One company has fixed thier freebag. Still waiting for the rest. I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

Is that why people give me looks when I tell them I'm a certified Chute packer! I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

Snatch force: The shock produced on the load when then parachute assembly fully strings out and becomes suddenly accelerated to th same speed as the load. (from pointers Tighter line tension will result in a lower snatch. p.466 of poynters has a graph that illustrates how the snatch affect opening shock. Basically, the lower the tension, the higher the snatch, the quicker the opening shock. Note: Snatch is usually what makes the opening smack you, not opening shock. Ask anyone who's had line dump! I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

Hmm, interesting observation. I find that it depends on the context. If I'm talking about flying or opening, I call it a canopy. If I'm talking about packing it's a chute. When was the last time you asked a packer/rigger how many canopys they packed on the weekend. Chute just sounds better. On the flipside saying "I opened my chute at 3000'" sounds really Whuffo. No one swoops a chute! I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

Flight concepts also makes one. http://www.flightconcepts.com/powerflight.html I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

Now you are being deliberately obtuse. Does Sunday have relevance to making back to the DZ? no Does Spot have relevance to making it back to the DZ? Yes Oh yes and when you are coming down into the shit, with winds dropping, a smaller canopy with a faster forward speed is always a good idea. By the way, when you are landing off, there are obstacles you may not see until you are 100' away from them. That's when you want a big monster to flat turn yourself out of trouble. You do know what a flat turn is, don't you? Ah yes, a smaller canopy to make up for mistakes. What a great idea. What a clever guy you are. I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

Well it's good to see a sense of responsibility but you were making an argument about larger canopies being less safe than smaller ones. There were three factors in your story. 1. large canopy 2. high winds 3. off DZ landing. Ergo large canopy = less safe in that scenario. That story is an equivocation, however, as it does not state all the facts and considerations. You deliberately omitted facts to make your point as you have now admitted that there are other factors to the incident in question. To equivocate the same story to the opposite point; You had a bad spot, landed off the DZ surounded by obstacles. Thank god your chute was big as a smaller chute would have been more difficult to maneuver close to the ground. The incident reports are, after all, full of inexperienced folk landing off with small canopies and injuring/killing themselves. Don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining. I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

I cant believe that you can honestly blame a canopy for an error. That is the type of excuse that burns my ass. I landed off cause my canopy was to big. I crashed my car cause it was a ford. The other 7 guys went the wrong way on a donut. Take some responsability for chrissake. Ever heard of spotting? Ever heard of winds aloft? Ever heard of finding your outs? Ever heard of target fixation? No .... must be the canopy. Sad. Without some responsibility, it'll happen again and again. I've seen experienced jumpers run back to the DZ, turn around and then fly backwards another 1/2 mile. They acknowledge the error, they don't blame the canopy. True you had low experience as a student, but I gaurentee you that blaming your canopy is intellectually lazy. I'd like to see an arial view, I'd bet there were a couple of outs. By the way, I've suspended student jumping when ground winds have been 7 mph because of the situation you were in. Damn the minimums they are guidlines. They do not trump common sense. One last time. Your canopy size was not the reason your spot sucked or you wound up without options! If a DWI can hit the peas with a 0 forward speed and 30knt wind so can you. Even if you were jumping a C9! I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

That's pretty pc of you, I was told 3-4 pages of playboy were the right wieght! I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

I have this saying...... If you don't know what a Wind drift indicator is .....It's you! I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

There is no excuse for hitting an obstacle. none. period I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

Hmmm, Is that one of those gratuitous assumptions you were talking about. I've got an idea, how about we don't criticize the post but instead discuss the issue. WOW what a novel idea! Seeing that I own a DZ that also teaches hang gliding, maybe I can ad some consideration to the pot. First, it should be noted that Paragliding pilots will often under shoot. It's one of the great predictable outcomes when one is transitioning to skydiving. They are simply not used to the sink. Paragliders and Parachutes fly very differently, for example, a skilled pilot can loop d loop a paraglider! Really, I shit you not. The Hang gliding instructor at our site has this video ... Secondly, going from a paraglider to a Manta is radically downsizing! Let alone a 150, no matter what the wieght. Thirdly, while to canopy pilot will be above average in confidence, and flaring (we will bug you mercilessly if you don't stand up!) An unfamiliar canopy will increase your risk when landing off the DZ. Now that being said, here is what this canopy pilot can bring to the party. First he'll be much more situationally aware than a regular student and far less intimidated by altitude. Second, he'll be able to progress far quicker than someone with no experience. Finally, if he is familiar at all with the RCR, he will probably possess safety awareness that would embarrass 95% of the skydivers out there today. In the end, we can't judge this jumper without assessing his skills, but we can talk about what there is to consider. By the way, if a 190 flys like a bagged out paraglider, and bagged out paragliders drop out of the sky like stones, how would a 150 be an improvement? It would sink even more! If you want more performance, I've got a 396..... I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

Back in the day (when hook turns were "don't ask don't tell") we did alot of straight in approaches. That's when I could really notice a difference in sink rate. Still landed fine though, just had more sink than fly. Good if you wanted to dive, the Stilletto was still a couple of years off and the Nova (it was reported) didn't somuch fly as plummet ("Sharper than a sword" was the ad...Heh) I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.

I've also noticed a tremendous differance between a Sabre 170 and a 150. The Old sabres didn't fly too well when loaded 1.4 or more. The 170 flew, the 150 sank. They were disigned in the days of "1:1, wow! You're extreme!" My Sabre 170 actually has a max exit wieght of 187lbs.(Thats 1.1:1!) Well enough of the history. Going from a 190 to a 170 to a 150 won't seem radically different if you are really light. Going from a Manta 288 to a Sabre2 135, however, would throw you for a loop. I would rather be a superb meteor, every atom of me in magnificent glow, than a sleepy and permanent planet.