n23x

In response to what would I do, Ron, in that exact situation, I'm not sure. I, quite obviously, have no combat training, and the only thing I like shooting at are cans and raccoons. Further, I agree that it must be an overwhelmingly stressful situation, and that the protection of ones own life and the lives of their fellow soldiers becomes paramount. My concern is that we allow this stress to obscure what is really right and wrong, because of actions that happened previously, with entirely different people. If the guy was hiding an IED, or had a weapon he was intending to use (and capable of using) then yah, I understand. If we use that possibility to justify an unarmed shooting with any frequency, then I think that is wrong. Disagreeing with a present action doesn't mean I have to presently have a better option, it just means I think we should be looking for one. I agree with this. .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

So, let's allay all these statements of "armchair quaterbacks" and being "whuffos" to the situation, and the really, really witty "chairborne rangers" (I'll be honest, I laughed). I have never served, nor do I ever intend to. It's not for me. And you're absolutely right, having never served I will never know what it's like to: *Worry constantly for my life and the lives of my unit. *Be in the moment and utilize all my training while being shot at, and try to make the right decisions, because my life depends on it. *Shoot or kill someone. *Go without sex for >6 months while my wife is at home fucking someone else's brains out, to whom she now signs letters with "Love Ya". You're right, I won't know what any of that feels like. Nor do I ever intend to. But I don't need to. We are not examining the emotion of the moment. We are examining the soldiers actions. If we were examining the emotions of the situation, we would never question anybody's actions because they could say "I was scared" or "I was amped up and everything happened so fast" or "I was trying to kill me some of them ******" (insert hillbilly racial slur here), and boop, free to go. Further, we cannot justify an action because "terrorists are known to play dead, wounded, or surrendering". It is a blanket statement that justifies far too many actions. But with your justification, we should shoot all of them, wounded, surrendering, etc., which is preposterous. Rhino, those tampon jokes, while moderately funny, don't really bring much to the discussion. .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

Alright Ron, how many people have you killed. List dates and areas, please. Then, explain how killing (I mean, it is what WAR is all about, right?) makes you more knowledgable regarding moral right and wrong. Please don't shirk the questions that I've asked, I'm sure many would like to know. .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

Wrong. So what you're saying is, I as a civilian cannot gather information that you as a solider could, because I have not been there. You're right, I haven't been there. I have no interest in getting shot in the ass for something I don't even remotely believe in, to shoot at people who I don't necessarily disagree with. Further, I don't need to be a soldier to be able to decide moral right and wrong, time of war or not. Firing on unarmed insurgents: wrong. Firing on them because you think they are going to IED: wrong, but justified IF they had an IED. Did they have an IED? People are not second class citizens, nor does their opinion matter any less because they choose not to serve. If you really want to draw this out, lets talk about your education regarding foreign policy. Enlighten us. To JustinB: Just because some buttfucking hillbillies decide to believe everything FOX, MSNBC, CNN or any other media feed them, and assume that they are actually UNBIASED REPORTING, doesn't mean everybody does. But great try though, really. .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

You don't say it outright, but you imply it every time you use the statement "your type". Further, to incite that nobody but some battle-burnt soldier could analyze the morality or "correctness" of a situation in war is just rediculous, Ron. How recently have you been to Iraq Ron? x number of months? Then how dare you suggest that this soldier did right when you didnt fight with him. You weren't there. Certainly you can see how rediculous that is. .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

I don't pretend to know what it's like to be in that kind of situation, Ron. But those are some pretty big blanket statements to justify killing. War or not. Further, let's be absolutely certain that you understand that military service makes you not even the slightest better of somone who chooses not to serve. It's a respectful choice. But you are no better, no worse. And for everybody else who responded to this thread with "there shouldn't be any rules, or there shouldn't be questioning of soldiers actions", that is such a cavalier view of life. .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

So Ron, are you suggesting that had this been the other way around, and someone shot our "good guys" in an identical situation, you would feel the same? Of course not. I'm simply saying that it should be no suprise that judges from the US excuse a US soldier, when there is room to spin the deed. .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

Paging DrunkMonkey. Waiting for your hillbilly, lackluster-vision-of-human-rights hissy-fits. Man, it works for everybody. .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

Fuck that. Grab your buddies bike, helmet, put on some jeans, and learn the hard way. Not really, take a course, and grow eyes in the back of your head. You will never realize how many morons are trying to kill you until you ride a bike. .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

Think this is a bit unfair, having flown in light aircraft a lot i can tell you gliders are damn hard to spot, as someone else has said they are very skinny, and on more than one occasion a glider has just seemed to appear in front of the aircraft i'm in as it turns. Plus spotting aircraft against the backdrop of a landscape, i.e. if you are much higher than them, is almost impossible at best, especially if you are thousands of feet higher than them. In this situation it would be more the responsibility of the dz ground crew to notify the aircraft that there is an aircraft in the airspace and to suspend jumping. These are just rediculous excuses to shrug BASIC responsibility. Gliders may be hard to spot head on, but with an overhead view, you'd have to be blind to not see them. It is every jumpers individual responsibility to clear the airspace below before jumping. To think that you need some DZ ground crew to do all spotting for you while you're in the plane, or hold your hand the rest of the way, is just absurd. Perhaps they should pull for you as well? .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

Negcamber, very well said. .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

But they are also skydivers that were airplane passengers, who needed to appropriately assess the airspace below them before committing to a jump. Sure you can, but the trick is, your head has to be out to door, and you have to actually take a good look before assuming green means go. .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

How soon was this picture taken after deployment? .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

I began at 8:45 this morning, so I don't know what planning needs to be done. .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

Quote...which is a better truck a Ford F-150 or a Chevy k1500?Quote Well Dave, obviously, the chevy sucks ass. .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

Dave, Excellent Post. .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

Number 4 makes me want to cough a lot for some reason. .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

-show up approximately whenever the hell i feel like it. -check out all machining centers and lathes to ensure non of them crapped out during the day. -fix whatever machining centers the operators broke today (there's usually at least one) -write down machine run times, see how much work the operators (slightly dumber than monkeys) did. -see what's next on the parts list. -bring up the code, or if there isn't any, bring up the solid model of the part and generate the code. -find the soft jaws for the part, or, if there aren't any write a program to make new ones. -load new tools as necessary, and run the part to make sure nothing blows up and the parts are to spec. -prep a bunch of stock for the operators (morons) to run during the day. -look at pornos on the internets. -watch tv. -do a little assembly, and then head home to take a nap. It's tough work, but somebody has to do it. .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

It could have led to atrophy and loss of that portion of the limb, as well. Heal quick. .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

Pyke, In a challenge between General Aviation and Skydivers, who do you think would end up with the airport? If we required that all approaching aircraft held off until every jumper was down, how long do you think that dropzone would last at that airport? The FACT is, if this becomes an issue of regulating GA for our own "benefit"/safety, then DZ's will drop like flies. Kneejerk reactions aren't the solution to freak accidents. .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

Raptors are cool. Fuck Canadian Geese. The more that go in the blender in CA, the less that will be around to walk in the goddamn street when I'm trying to drive to school. .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

Hey Bill, you should have shown them a pick of Rutan's Boomerang. Now there's a plane that's out there. .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

Having been hit by a car while on bike, I can understand your anger regarding this situation. Having it be your child, I cannot imagine. Was this a hit and run? Do you know who hit them? Man, if somebody ran my kid over because they were fucking aroudn in the car, I would have no words for what I would do to them. Reminds me of one of my professors who got rearended on his motorcycle at a stoplight, pushed under the car in front of him, and then the person who rear-ended him got out of the car, still on their phone. Personally, I would have twisted their head off for that, had it been me. Personal responsibility means nothing these days. Sorry to rant. .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

Looks like a Burmese to me. That would be about the biggest ball python I've ever seen, otherwise. .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC

DEFEATED! and now it is only 4:13 am. screw you guys, i'm going home! .jim "Don't touch my fucking Easter eggs, I'll be back monday." ~JTFC