McDuck

What is the sound of one ass-cheek clapping? Ponder Sonic Beef wisdom in the silences of your soul, and this too shall be revealed unto you. Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

After the admonishment several of us got in another thread for a "flame war", I'm wondering if warnings will be issued for the above attack. Probably not. It's only us "non-elite" posting types that get the smack-down from "management" here. That's okay, we'll go make our OWN website, with blackjack and hookers...in fact, forget the website and the blackjack. (blatant bastardized theft from Futurama) Leroy, for what it's worth, you're okay in mine and Cora's book. Thanks again for letting her borrow your second BASE rig. Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

Just like all good legends, it changes from person to person. Add a little alcohol, or anti-freeze, and the tale takes on a heartbeat of its own. I believe Matt 1st and Scotty next. It's all true, every last bit of it. Many a good seifu will change the requirements for passing on their legacy after much deliberation and recuperation from partying. Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

Have a safe trip home, Chad. Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

I'll tell you what, we should be making it back to Riverside sometime in the next 12 months or so. When that happens, we'll hook up with you for a day or so and you can run us ragged up towers for as long as you want, or until we fall asleep in the back of a cop car. Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

Dude. You are the MAN! I look forward to the opportunity to BASE with you, John, and I promise to carry the SONIC BEEF name proudly. I'm probably setting myself up, but is there an initiation, and does it entail drinking myself into a stupor from 2pm on and running the 20-30 miles to my home? Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

Is that the one E did for him? I'm all about the SB. Except I was thinking I would be SS (sushi). I'll talk to SB1 about it. Do you have the tat also? Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

Yeesh! Well, I'd better get my pimp hand strong. 100ft? Oh wait, you said 1000ft! As long as we get lunch halfway up. Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

Thank you sir. What made that arduous climb even worse was having to stop every 50ft or so and walk around on the platforms adjacent to the ladder. I'd love to take another climb, as long as you make sure the elevator is pacing us the whole way so I can gripe and complain about not being able to use it when it's right there in front of me. Yeah, I had forgotten my velocirapduck heritage. My bad. Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

Several weekends ago saw my sweetheart and I make our first BASE off of a 300ft free-stander in this neck of the woods. Sunset climb (no elevator) and dusk jump, PCA'd by our instructor. I could tell you what type of equipment except for two things: 1) I've slept since then; 2) adrenaline after the jump performed a memoryectomy on me. Thank you to my mentor for making me wait until he felt I was ready, HUGE thanks you to our instructor for preparing and drlling us for this jump and ENORMOUS thanks to another BASE jumper for letting us use his second rig. I'm wary about leaving names, but you all know who you are. Thank you very much, all of you. I would have posted this sooner, but 1) I've slept since then and 2) adrenaline after the jump made me think that geese are reptiles. Matt...you missed it. Slacker. Edited to add: PCA'd by our instructor. Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

Nice. I'm gonna whine like a little tramp now and not-so-silently grouse over how I almost went out and bought my own hat but waited in the hopes that one would be bestowed upon me. Yeah, I didn't want to be a poser. Maybe once Matt gets his carcass back here and does a BASE with me, I'll get the woiks. Well, see you at Disneyland. BRING MONEY. Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

Better hope there are no hungry marsupials around...ones that forage for misteltoe. Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

Maybe it's just me, John, but I distinctly remember you advising me several times to wait for quite some time before I started BASE jumping. In fact, I seem to remember hearing you turn down many people who simply weren't ready or had extremely low skydive numbers, etc. And I believe that we had discussed this over the phone as well: it's one thing to take experienced jumpers with reasonable jump numbers for a BASE when they plan on going without you anyway, but quite another to take an AFF student up for a BASE when you are just starting out in BASE yourself. Seeing as how THAT was the original point that was being made, along with how to approach that situation conversationally with the jumper, and not this verbal vendetta that some here are turning this into, I'm glad that actual answers from reasonable people have surfaced. I'm also glad that this issue has seems to have been resolved at the personal level. It makes all of the blatherings of some here seem that much more ludicrous, as the original point is lost in seemingly angst-ridden tirades against you. Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

Okay, I was going to leave this be, mainly due to the fact that with the exception of a few reasonable responses to the original point early on, and NickDG's informed and well thought out answer, this has degraded into an ego contest. I could speculate on how it seems that BASE jumpers in this online community seem to be evenly divided between the uber-egos and those who enjoy learning from and teaching others, but that has become abundantly clear from the first response that derided John for someone's perceptions of his past and current skills. That was way off base (no pun intended) and totally beside the point. What ever YOU think of John, he has been the right kind of mentor in skydiving and BASE for me, always giving me the choice while giving me all the good reasons to wait, learn and take my time before getting into anything new. I'm sure the team for the defense will protest that this touting of my "sky buddy's" character is not relevant, but I beg to differ. John has consistently told me to wait a while longer before BASE jumping. Never once has that deterred me from going to his DZ to skydive, and never once has it occurred to me to BASE with people when he was telling me it wasn't a good idea. I'm not sure what type of person would abandon a DZ simply because the DZO won't give them the OK to BASE, but I know I'm not that type of person. It's sad, but Nick's post carries far more truth than I think he intended. Or maybe I'm reading more into it after seeing the more vehement responses to John's original question and my knee-jerk reaction. If the attitude and demeanor of some of the responses is par for the course in certain parts of the BASE community, then I am certain I am in the right place when it comes to learning and growing in both skydiving and BASE, IF I decide to continue on in it. People who tell me "no" and explain why without exuding a holier-than-thou attitude have not only my respect, but my full attention. People who just want to be known as the end-all be-all of any sport just have the back of my shirt. I think there was more to some of the reponses to John's post than a humble desire to help and guide...and it showed. Being a good mentor seems to me to be less about how many thousands of BASE jumps you have, and more about how willing you are to BE a mentor with that many jumps to begin with. But, you know, I'm a one-BASE-jump wonder. Edited for spelling. Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

Hang on a second...the operative term here being "hang". I was wondering of you could be my mentor, Jason, and show me how to get snagged on a tower while trying to BASE it? I'm just saying. If you're going to be an asshat and try and tell people about their screw-ups, at least have the satchel to mention your own. Edited to add: Unless you AREN'T the Jason that was featured in Skydiving magazine recently. Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

I'm not trying to instigate anything or delve too deeply into things I'm not entirely privy to, but I wanted to make two points, at least. 1. As far as I'm aware, John did not "teach" this jumper with regards to BASE. If he did, and I am mistaken, my apologies. His concern is that this jumper, who is a regular at our DZ, seems to not be taking instruction and guidance from the more experienced BASE jumpers and is taking even less experienced student skydivers out for their first BASE jumps. I'm aware that you gave some examples of how to approach this, and with the exception of the seemingly snide remark about being more selective in who John decides to "teach", your reasoning SOUNDS good. As you seem to be aware of, talking to someone and having them take your words to heart are two entirely different beasts. 2. I'm guessing that a less antagonistic approach to answering John's question might be met with less resentment than I'm feeling right now. John is a good man, a great instructor and a wonderful DZO. I would venture to say that no regular jumpers at our DZ have the least bit of trouble with him. He has gone out of his way to make us all feel welcome and appreciated at our DZ, and takes great pains to ensure we all do our best to be safe in this sport. Since his original post was not an attack on you, or the jumper in question, your approach seems to reflect an unreasonable amount of animosity. I consider John to be a good friend, and as any good friend will tell you, an attack on him is an attack on everyone who calls him friend. I hope you found some lingering sense of peace in writing that response. I truly do. Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

I saw where you were coming from, E. In skydiving, we would not only go into a collective apoplectic fit if someone with low jump numbers found some magical way around the current training and license programs and managed to take someone new up for a skydive, we would all agree that it's insane. Your point was that we all know the risks involved in the sport/s we have chosen, but that there needs to be a way to help reduce potential problems associated with extremely less experienced jumpers taking brand-new jumpers up for their first BASE jumps. I will say, however, that as a brand-spanking new neophyte to BASE, I personally would only seek out the best and most experienced BASE jumpers to get me started, the ones who not only have been doing it for quite a while, but also come highly recommended by their peers. But I'm silly like that. Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

Hmm, the only thing I remember on that dive is thinking, "Wow! We're orbiting and having a blast with...wait, what's that bumping my ear?" And then with the thunder and the seeing stars. It was less than a beautiful thing. Yes, shortening that closing loop. That's what needed to be done. I actually flew that rig this weekend with a Fusion in it and it was just fine. It was the pack volume. The pressure on the pin was perfect, so I felt safe. Lesson learned, though. I'm moving on to an ACTUAL freefly friendly rig...maybe a Dolphin? (not really) Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

Wait! you've seen a preemie? When?? Where?? And did this "genius" have several people warn him over the course of his time with his rig that it would be a good idea to NOT freefly in it? Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

I'm in no position to offer advice on this (just had my first BASE jump yesterday), but I will say that as someone who has WANTED to BASE for a long while, I waited until I honestly thought I was ready, and then made sure I went with someone who not only knew what they were doing, but who could make sure I wouldn't screw up and hurt myself or burn that site. I would venture to say that anyone who has the least bit of common sense and/or one iota of intelligence would seek out the experienced, long time BASE jumpers and work with them to make sure BASE jumping doesn't go the way of the Dodo or turn land owners against jumpers in general. I'd be willing to bet at least SOME of these land/tower owners talk, and bad business for them is bad business for BASE jumpers. I guess for some, humility is over-ridden by less rational emotions and thought processes. I'll certainly BASE again, but only with people I trust from their experience, knowledge and skill. Otherwise, I'm just tattooing a possible statistic on my caracass. Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

I went from making a comfortable amount of money in Washington state, to making less than half of that here in NC. The financial math isn't difficult to use when coming to a conclusion about my job. But, it pays (most of) the bills. Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

It's funny, but I have a video of one of my first sitfly attempts, and it's almost exactly what you just described. From what I was told, as well as how many experienced freeflyers laughingly commiserated with me, not to mention watching newer (than me) freeflyers, just about everyone goes through almost exactly what you did. Edited to add: Oh, and get used to exiting the aircraft and backflying off the hill. That was one of the hardest things for me to get used to. I kept trying to strong-arm everything and force the sit early. Being relaxed and sure of what you need to do is more than just a little important. Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

Looks good. Hopefully when I make my first TRUE headdown jump, I'll make it seem as effortless as your picture makes yours seem. Every time I try to transition to headdown, I'm raight back in my sit before I know it. Sounds like it's time for another coach jump for me. Good work on yours.

Thanks, my friend. I'm okay. I was a bit shaken up, understandably, but other than a stiff back for a few days, I am doing fine. If I don't have something by the time we leave, I'll just wait my turn once we get there. We just bought our TGV tickets from France into Switzerland. More updates soon. Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

I'm not sure if I'll have my new rig by the time we make our trip to Switzerland, so I may need to rent gear. Obviously that will be dependent on how many students you have and other factors. I'll try to have my rig before then, but it may not happen. My current one is up for sale after a premature deployment in sit. Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28 "I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.