Ron

Amazing work they do huh? That is FANTASTIC!!! That is great..... I am very happy to see these. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

peep this: http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=496056#496056 And do a search...it will give you reading for hours. Talk to a rigger you trust. PA had a web search engine that would tel you if yours has been fixed or had issues at all. Id rather just have a PD..I have had 6 rides on a 113, and it still has yet to blow up...And it swoops well "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Yep, but for me. I would rather have the sposored folks, test jumpers, and the new gear guys risk it. I'm in skydiving for the long haul...Dead sucks. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

See it could have been a problem..And if you had waited a few mths..It would not have been an issue. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Yeah, but I was not the FIRST to have any of them. Yes, but there were issues...Some were safety issues. 100% agree...But since my PD113 has no issues..I'll just keep it instead of getting an Amigo. Right now there is no problem with a CYPRES that is so bad that it would warent me getting an untried, un "real world" tested Vigil. Let me know how that thing looks at inside. Then and after a few mths or real world time I would think about it. But many good ideas killed folks...... "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Yes, but when the CYPRES came out it was torn apart as well... Id rather have folks taking about it than ignoring the possible issues. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Heres one. http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=615286#615286 Here is another Hell here is one from you...An altemeter that resets itself is a safety issue. Hell, just read that whole thread and it screams why you should not be the first with the new toys. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

peep this: http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=66387#66387 and this http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=86023#86023 There were some issues,, and the "fix" was bullshit. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

There have been issues with the 3 rings... Yes, but due to the fact that the MR has been around...We know the issues that they can have...No one did when they first came out. I doubt they would have sold as well if people knew they had those issues. And MOST people that skydive are not going to go and do the research like you and I both do....I for one could not have made a call on the ASTRAS algorithm. And just look at the Neptune threads...People were ordering them sight unseen. And they had issues didn't they? I could spend the same amount on the Protrack...And while its not as flashy, and not as cool..It has proven itself. In two years I bet it WILL be as good if not better than the Protrak...Or it will be off the market. And I know several folks that ordered the Katana, and have never even SEEN one fly. I bet the folks that bought the first Novas, and original Crossfires wish they had waited. There is a balance...But most folks can't make the kinds of calls that some can. Hell, Im lucky. I live in one of the skydiving mecas of the world. Some guy in Arkansas does not have the research tools I have. And lets look at the risk of getting the cool new toy over waiting. You could get the cool new toy and your buddies think you are cool as hell...then it kills you. or You can wait, and not be cool but be safer. I think the choice is very clear. Would you like to be the first guy killed by a new AAD? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I can tell the difference between the two...And trust me there is one. I just lost 16 pounds...I can tell under canopy. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Ladies and gentelmen...a Dem for you. I don't want a "real" Job. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

the best thing Kerry can do if it is true is admit it...Not try to cover it up. The only real issue I had about the whole Monicagate stuff was Clinton lied about it... If he had said yep, opps, sorry. I would still think he is a slime ball....But at least he didn't lie under oath about it. There would have been lots of pissed off folks, but no criminal charges. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Yes it does..and if you have 100 jumps and are buying a Katana...I sugest you call her right now

Right....And I never pull low. If you don't plan on jumping it....Why buy it? You plan on waiting 400 more jumps to jump it? You ahve been jumping one year and have 100 jumps....So in 400 more jumps and 4 years you will then pull it out of the bag? Makes no sense to me...By the time you are ready to jump that canopy....It will be an old design. Agin why own it if it will: A. Kill you. B. Be outdated before you can safley jump it... Im done here. I STILL think you are trolling. You will not listen, so feel free to do as you want...But you so fit into the risk profile. I hope you don't die....But I'd bet you will. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Damn....People think IM harsh, and direct... But I must say I agree and like it. Im gonna steal this part if its OK with you. If it were not for my March of Dimes sig line right now...this would be there "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

And if that "someday" is around jump # 300 .....You will still be in the "Danger Zone". I have 3,000 jumps and jump a 1.6 loaded Stiletto. I had over 700 jumps before I had a 1.6 load elliptical. If you plan on jumping that canopy any time soon...Get LOTS of canopy coaching. Before, and during...Understand that it WILL kill you even if you make a minor mistake. Hope you don't die. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

He will not wait, and like I said...No one ever plans on dying. So while he MIGHT (and thats a big might) be able to handle it if all things are perfect...The real world is not perfect...And he is fitting into the profile of the folks that get killed under canopy. The profile is: Around 250-500 jumps. Around a 1.5 wingload. Does not listen to advice and has been warned. So he fits perfectly in the recipie for DEATH. Then since he will not listen, I sugest he gets his afairs in order. Have him make a will, a living will and have him tell his family and friends that he loves them...The way he is going, one of these days he is NOT going to be comming back from the DZ. (And I still think you are trolling) "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Hoping that this is not a troll...(But I suspect it is) The problem is not the perfect day with the perfect winds and perfect spot... The problem is what happens if he finds himself in a less than ideal place and needs to make a choice...And he makes the wrong one. If he does make the wrong choice, or the right choice but to late under a canopy that is on the very high edge of his skills envelope...He could easily die. It is much safer to push the top edge on a canopy that is in your skill range, than be at the bottom of the min exceptable skill range of a higher performance canopy. Mistakes are less costly on a canopy that is in your skill range. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Yeah...Is just it seems like I am one of the few Voices of reason out there...And there is a sea of "It'll be fine" folks. Trust me, most folks that meet me don't think Im a BIG asshole...Maybe a little one though. I can live with that if it helps keep ONE person safe. Uh....yeah, sorry about that...But did you learn anything? Did it make you think? Someone gets me!!!!!.....I love you. And this is what it is all about....About helping children. Question...Since many premature births have other lasting effects...Is Zoe in the wheelchair due to that? She is pretty as hell, and I am glad that things worked out. Just like I am on safety issues...I am a zelot about this. While I may not be able to save a guy from getting killed under canopy..I CAN do something to help girls like Zoe. (God, I sound like one of these guys on the telethons. What the hell happened to me?) Uh....Watch your wingloading!!!!...yeah..Wingload. Ok I feel better. Ron "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

then that would be alot...Stick around...I might need you in 8 mths. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Bill, did you just call me inexperienced???? Thats like a personal attack right? I just don't want to pay to jump a Nova in a reflex with a Micro Raven and an Astra. Its called saftey over having the shinny new toys. And like I said it MY opinion...Feel free to be the first kid on the block with the new toy. Just accept that it could kill you. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Bill, I trust your opinion.... If you look at what I wrote... The key there being I would not buy ...As in I am not going to be the first on the block to run out and pay for a new toy. I have been the first on the block with a new toy...but I didn't pay for it. There have been WAY to many "great ideas" that were not. Nova....A great canopy right? Astra...Gonna change the market remember? Original CrossFire....Except the ones PA made. Micro Raven.....Well who does not want a reserve that will blow up? And a current one the Neptune....I don't want to pay for a product that is not ready for release. Some do, and thats fine...I personally don't mind being a test jumper...(I have done it) But I like to KNOW I'm a test jumper...If I have to buy the gear, I am not going to buy the newest thing till it has been proven. There are two exceptions to my rule...One is RW, and the other PD....But they have both had issues...If I remember RW built a few Skyhooks wrong correct? Well I don't want to be one of the guys that gets one of those. I don't mind being a test jumper...When I know I am a test jumper. If I have to buy the gear...I'll buy the proven design...Not the new thing. Its an idea I got from Niklas G. my old Frost teammate. I have talked to you several times...you really do know your stuff...But I am not going to pay to be a betta tester. Others with a more "adventurous" spirit can be free to pay for products that might not be ready, and might flat out be dangerous. Like I said, think Nova. Call me a fuddy duddy...But I think saftey over having the shinny new toys. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

John...I AKSED for english, and you give me 5 x 10^-36 .... Thanks a lot, I don't take my math class until Oct....Now I'll have to wait 8 mths to know what the hell this means. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Flat first is better. The ONLY way to make FF first safe is to allow a really large gap between FF to Flat. That can cause a go around.....As long as the DZ does not care...then its cool. Two passes are safer than one. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Oh yeah..PROVE it.