Ron

How can you steal something someone does not have? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

And yet here it is. And yet here one is. Oh lookie..more. But remember there were no WMD's in Iraq....At least SH said there were none....I guess you can get these things at K-Mart right? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Or SH could hide it really good...It was his back yard. Funny though that its a WMD in a country that didn't have any. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

You don't use booties when doing a diamond track. I tend to agree with the 1:1 for a GOOD tracker. (Not everyone has the skill, or the body to pull that good of a track). "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

All I know is that the law was followed in both cases. Don't like the law? change it. That is the wonderful thing about Democracy...You don't like the Electoral process? Get enough people to want it changed, ask and see what happens. As it stands now, but Bush's election, and the MLK street issue were both handled legally. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Tell them. You are not competing against them anyway...You are competing against a clock...If they are faster, then you were slower. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Arching only does so much...You can greatly improve your range by adding lead to bring you into the normal fall rate in a comfertable body position. Also a hard acrh will limit your ability to perform some moves. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Nope....With basic skydiving weight does not matter much at all. Just arch and work on having your legs even. A good drill to to is to lay on your stomach like you are in freefall. Put your toes on the wall so they are even. and push against the wall some. This will get you used to having your legs even. Now when it comes to RW...Yes, you will have some issues. Anyone outside of the "norm" will. You most likley will have to wear lead...Not a big issue really. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Well sorry...I guess I read it from your posts...Just like you thought I was making Irene out to be a scoundrel. Like I said I would love to talk local politics with you. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Agreed Disagree...That very socialism of you. Majority rules in a Democracy...right or wrong. I doubt you could have gotten over 51% of the population to vote for it. Democracy wins again. True, but it is the will of the majority of people...and Democracy is about letting the majority decide what happens...Not the few, just cause they want it. No, the most voices in unison win....However in this case the loadest voices did win. Last time I checked 6th still had MLK on it. True, but the same could be said against the first 100 name petition that started this mess. It should have been taken to at the very LEAST the people on the street that was going to be renamed....Just like the rules said. I resent the fact that you paint anyone that opposed letting 100 peoples voices out weigh 500 as a racist. for the record let me say my grief in English: I resent the fact that someone outside of the city limits could get others outside the city limits and get a street name changed without asking the other people even on that street what they wanted...I feel that even if it is not the whole cities buisness what the street was named, it IS the buisness of the people who own property there. I also resent the fact that after a majority wanted otherwise the minority threw the race card (now I will grant that for most it probably IS a race issue) but for me it is a simple majority rules issue. I also resent the fact that you claim anyone that does not support the naming of the street as MLK as a racist. And I resent the fact that you are claiming that the whole city is racist after an incorrectly done deed was put right according to the rules. I also find it funny that you, who will tell "black jokes" at the bar, will be the first to call anyone a racist. And then fixed...But by fixing it you think everyone is a racist. show me ONE place where I said anything about her other than: 1. She started a petition. 2. She does not live in the city limits. How does those two things have me making her out to be a scoundrel? Well the City Manager and the council could have done it it many ways...The way they chose to do it was illegal . And like I have said MANY times (But you seem to not want to read) That they could have fixed this problem by simply saying. "OK the NEXT street in Zhills that is made will be MLK." Done. As for MLK being a great man...I'll give you his message was great....But he was far from a great man. He cheated on his wife, plagerized his thesis...But this really has NOTHING to do about him...It is about a wrong that was corrected. Maybe...but the really great thing about a democracy..Is you get what you vote for. If bad things come from this issue...It will be what was asked for. It IS a shame that people like you can't see that it was illegal, and have to make this into a racist issue. (Like I have said...For some I am sure it is...But not for all) And you have a typical view...We should do what you want us to do, not what the majority wants. America was founded on each person having a vote...That can be both good and bad...But don't expect us to change it to make you happy...Its worked quite well so far..And if the system sucks so bad...Why are there so many people from other countries trying to come here? I think the solution that happened was fine by me...I think the COUNCIL screwed it all up. Irene did nothing wrong in ASKING...The council screwed up by saying OK without checking to see if it was legal first, or even asking the people who it would effect their opinion. I really doubt that....No one cared about Zhills before, they will forget and not care in a year or less. (Except the fanatics like you that keep bringing it up). Other than skydivers I really doubt people take vactions here to look at our springs, and cow fields. Maybe not the "best" in every case, but the one that this country was founded on. In this case what was "best" was what was legal. From the Declaration of Independance: Oh, its already happend...Yes I hated it. But so what? I acted like an adult and moved on. Ok, but you know what? Its what the MAJORITY wanted....If I like the action or not the majority still wins. Like I said before the council should have not jumped so quick to change the name...they should have checked to see if it was legal, then checked to see if the people who were directly affected cared. If it was not legal (Which it was not) or if the MAJORITY didn't want it (Which they didn't) Then the council could have just simply said "The next thing we do will be named MLK"....Done. Legal, simple, and fair. But please do let me know the negative results from this...Local politics does interest me. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

AND it could have been avoided in the first place by following the correct procedures...It's why there ARE procedures. They also could have looked to see if the people who were asking for the name change even LIVED in the city (Most didn't)...Why should someone who does not live in the city have any say about any city buisness? 2nd it could have been handled by saying "We can't rename 6th to MLK, but we CAN name the next street, school, library ect to MLK. Yes, the way they handled it was pretty stupid. However, I would back the 500 people who lived in the city that didn't want the name change any day over the 100 who didn't live in the city that wanted it....Its how democracy works. So in your opinion its more important to please people that will most likley never visit Zhills. Than make the people that live here happy? Simple thing... 1. Procedures were not followed. 2. More people who LIVED in Zhills wanted to keep the name the same than the people that didn't live in Zhills wanted it named MLK. 3. It was put up for vote very sneaky the first time, and many people who voted for it lost elections over it. And the second time it was changed back by all but one vote. The democratic process worked. Its not going to make everyone happy, but it did make the people directly involved happy. I think its a pretty stupid issue, handled really badly by a group of morons, while trying to please a bunch of cry babies. The simple fix was for the council to tell the 100 people "We will run through the procedues and if it passes we will change the name". If it didn't pass (And it's quite clear it would not have) then the council could name the next street MLK. I don't care about the name of the damn street....I do care that a minority of non residents tried to bypass the rules and get what they want even in the face of clear cut opposition. And the fact the the city council was so spineless as to allow it to happen to try and appear PC rather than follow the rules. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

A well thought out reply. I do think that there is more to their hatred of us than JUST religion. I do still think that it is the main calling. If you want to strike an enemy...You can hit him in many places. If they had attacked the Vatican....There would have been a much larger swell of hatred for them in countries that are Christian. Also name one religious symbol in the US that if they had destroyed would have had such a large impact on out lives. There is no religious building that they could have destroyed that would have: 1. Killed as many as they did with the WTC. 2. Been located in such a high population area, and area where the UN is but 3 miles away. 3. Destroying a church would not have done as much if any damage to our economy. 4. The WTC is know as one of the tallest and srongest buildings in the world. By taking that down they send a message that the mighty US can fall just like that building. 5. The WTC is known by everyone, was visited by thousands. I can't name one famous church other than the Vatican...And the Vatican is not on US soil. Its not that popular IN the US. A recent poll showed Bushes approval ratting lower than it has ever been. Not Sunni gathereings...Isam is divided into many factions. Some ARE peace loving...Others such as Sunnis are not. The Sunni's see the others as weak. Just like some Babtists don't like Catholics, or vise versa. Good point. 1. They hate the US for being immoral...Much more immoral than China. From OBL "Letter to America" There is plenty in there also of us supporting Israel and our taxes being used to attack them....It is this reason that they are also trying to hurt our economy. But the underlying base is religion. They hate us cause we support the israeli occupation of their HOLY Land. Not that we support them, but we help them keep the holy land. They hate the israeli's for that reason..And as it is said. "The friend of my enemy is my enemy"...So we are their enemies. And like I have said...It only takes one side to make something a religious war. But it was these reasons that they felt America was the best to attack. China does not support Israel, and by supporting Israel we are denying them access to their Holy land. It really does boil down to religion. Even if we don't fight in the name of any God (Which BTW they take issue to the fact we don't live by God's rules and make our own)...It is a religious war if they do attack for Allah. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

WOW...thats serious shit. Glad you didn't. I really hope that you feel life turn around for you. Just think of this..only a few people in the world have ever made a skydive..Much less almost 100. That is some accomplishment. A real, "no shit" big deal. Plus a PhD... Damn thats something. It's something I will probably never get. At times I wish I had done school not 3,000 jumps. So there are two VERY big things. Allow yourself to enjoy them. Good Luck with the defense.... "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

What are you asking for....Number of people on teams? In the US or the sport as a whole? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

If I remember correctly...Part of the lander stays on the Moon when they leave right? Well has anyone ever tried to find it on the surface of the moon with a telescope? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Thats why I had to start charging people...I try to help, and I get an argument...Hell kinda like here "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

If he likes Bush or not has no impact on where I get my information from. I readd ALL the information I can, not just the sides I agree with. Then you limit what you learn by your ignoring available information just cause you don't agree with it...Thats your loss. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Not aimed at anyone...Just thought I would post it. Here is the thing.... Nic was a dead man as soon as he was captured. He was Jewish and there was no way he was going to survive. Its war. People die. Nic or the people who became bodies burnt and hanging from a bridge...Are casualties of war. I do find it funny that we get all riled up by pictures of 9/11 or the video of a captive being beheaded...Don't you think they get as pissed at pictures of their dead? You know the difference? Its not that they are uncivilized...Its not that they are animals. It is simply that they encourage the pictures to be broadcast....Here in the states we censor our news...When was the last time you saw the planes flying into the twin towers? When was the last time that you saw people jumping to their deaths to avoid the flames? Papers are going to block Nic's head out when they print the pictures.... AlJeezera (SP?) does not do that...They show every graphic second of every body they can find...They wave it as a call to arms. Of course "average" people celibrate in the streets when our guys get killed...You would do the same if the Western world showed every US body that has been killed. If you could you would grab any Arab extremist you could get your hands on and you would kill him in the exact same fasion. That is human nature...Go read "Lord of the Flies". And expect much more before this is over...I don't think it will ever be over. 1. We go to war against these extremists.... a. We do our best not to kill innocent people...However it does happen. While doing so innocent people, and not so innocent people get killed. This just supports the Extremists explaniations of how we are evil...Hell, we killed Bob and his family. They begin to feel just like you did after 9/11. They join the fight against us...and they cycle continues. b. We NUKE them(Or any vicious killing spree)...Really a bad choice. While I can understand the use of the two bombs in Japan...And in that case I feel it did save many lives on both sides...You can't nuke a city and only kill the people that are against you....You would kill them all. And that would just give the US a really bad name in the World, opposition to the US would mount and the rosters of the terrorist's would overflow...The US can't fight the world. 2. We do nothing....We pull out of all middle eastern countires. Stop giving aid to Israel, and Israel goes back to the lines they had before 1968. a. Well we ignored them pretty much before 9/11...They still attacked us. They would wait some, but the attacks would come. They would see that we are weak and they would want more. It has been said that they want us to all convert to Islam. Well, thats not an option for the US. The real issue is a hatred for all things western..Not just that we have more money, not just that we live better lives...But the whole thing. The issue is that the leaders can encite the people very easily to hate us...Based on religion, and the images the media show them and the things they see everyday just backs those feelings up. In OBL "Letter to America" He says that the US is morally corrupt. He mentions things like we use our women and sex to sell...Well we do. He mentions how Clinton got a hummer in the oval office and we did nothing to him for it, and considered it no big deal. We make and use drugs and alcohol. It is very easy to use these kinds of things against us to "prove" we are corrupt and must be punished according to Islam Law. Due to this there will always have people willing to wage a religious war against us. Right now they are planning more giant attacks against the US. The thing is they are waiting. Right now the tide is turning in the world, and in the US to a distaste for this war. They know that will effect the elections in Nov, and they want Kerry in office. a. They also know that if they were to WMD an American city off the map that we would get sympathy from the world back...They don't want that. They want us to be seen as an Agressor. An attacker, not a defender. The world has largely forgotten 9/11, and is now focusing on what the US is doing...A Terror attack against the US would shift that focus back. b. If it looks like Kerry is not going to win...Expect another attack. Just like what happend in Spain. There might be an attack anyway just to make sure. It will be very close to the election, so that Bush does not have time to counter attack. I would almost say the attack would be in Florida. Many anaylists are saying the canidate that wins FL will win the election. If they don't attack before the election...They will after. They waited 8 years between WTC attacks. Conclusion: Like it or not we are screwed. We could not ignore them after 9/11 and any course of action was just going to give them more fuel for their propaganda machine to create new terroists. The ONLY course of action left: 1. Beef up our defenses. We will loose personal freedoms by doing this, but the other option is more attacks. 2. Remove support for Israel and make them fall back to pre 1968 boarders. 3. Recognize a Palistanian state. 4. Wipe out the leaders of any extreme faction. Surgical attacks with limited collateral damage. a. This is harder than you would think...We can't find them. b. Any deaths thay do happen just make them Martyrs and any innocent deaths just fuel the terrorits propaganda. And all this does is delay the issue. Its a religious war...they have made it one, and thats all it takes. If we gave them everything they want, they will still attack us to "convert" us, Just like the Christains tried to convert them, the American Indians...Ect. I'm not saying we should treat it as a religious war...but we do need to recognize that it is one from their perspective. Read Tea with Terroists http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry.asp?userid=ZYw1H3gN3K&isbn=0971448116&itm=1 Its a fiction book, but it provides some really interesting insite. Can't stomache the fact that its a ficton book? Hell, just read the Qur'an. http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry.asp?userid=ZYw1H3gN3K&isbn=0940368188&itm=1 "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I had a cutie GF that I had a deal with her...Coaching for Blow Jobs...She became a very good skydiver. Amen. And that is probably the best post on this entire subject. I would like to add...If you are getting free coaching, don't argue with the coach. Feel free to ask questions, but don't argue. I have many times experienced people who when I try to help them for free...Want to argue with me. Those same people when they are paying me seem to listen more. I really don't understand that. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

And all these ordinances that get overlooked hurt no one or even effected anyone. Changing the name of the street that someone owns a house effects all of the people on that street. Home prices went down due to the stigma of being on MLK. Ideal or not it did happen. These people were not a buisness..they were 100 people who most didn't even live in the City wanting to change the name of a street. 100 vs 500 is simple math for me. The correct answer would be to have a new street, a new park, or a new library after him. Not changing an already existing place and renaming it. That way no one would get upset. Agreed, but the people who were affected by the change do deserve a voice in the matter. If the people on the street voted for it that would be one thing, but most voted against it. It is their homes, and it is their street. I think its clear they didn't want it. Plus I don't think non city residents should have a call in the cities politics. Would you say that if it was your house that dropped in value? Well when you consider that this city was founded as a retirment community for UNION soldiers...I would hope that people would consider that the city was founded by people who fought to give blacks equal rights long before MLK was even alive. 500 vs 100 is still easy math...And this country was founded on the right for a persons voice to be heard. The people did speak, and it was shown what the majority wanted. The democratic system worked. Now, I don't see how the city is going to lose grants or tourism from this. For the first place the street still has the name MLK... As for Zhills being the seen as "backwards"...Well we already are, and I doubt this will have any real effect on that view..."Zephyrhills, Home of newly weds and nearly deads." Has been the unofficial moto of Zhills since I first lived here in 1980. That or they will rejoyce at the fact their homes didn't lose value. Where did you see the City loosing federal money? I have not seen that. Besides like I said before the simple answer was to name the next street, park, library, school, ect after MLK then there would have been no issue. The issue was with the people who live there having a change forced on them with out their voices being heard. The uneducated ones will, but the true fault is with the City for not doing the right thing in the first place. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Yes, thats why I included the date. Yes, The "Skyhook" is awesome, but not everyone jumps a Vector. So have you changed this view? Edit to ADD: The Skyhook is the ONLY RSL I would jump. However, the danger of a canopy collision and the possible cutaway and reserve wrap is still there. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

You are also not a Dr. And we have had one Dr. already check in with his thoughts. A DOCTOR gives you the same advice I give, but I'm discriminatory? I find it funny that people want depression to be treated like any other disease, but when I treat it like any other medical condition I'm discriminatory. I think that derpression IS a medical condition...That is WHY I treat it just like any other medical condition and would ask for a clearance from a Doctor. I got cleared to jump with my Diabeties....Why would you not get cleared to jump with a very powerful disease that has led people to such extremes as to end their own life? Did you look at the link I sent where people killed themselves in this sport? I have seen the crater left by one of those listed...I have seen the damaged done not only by his body hitting the gound, but also the damage done to those that saw it. And does not making sure they are safe to skydive also include taking into account any medical conditions that might limit or even ban a person? And yet I bet you can show me plenty of people that have lied. Its about saftey, and saftey of the sport. The waiver does little to protect the Instructor in the real world... It seems like everyone here takes this to heart...I have all these people who have been on or are on some form of medication to combat a disease claiming I am trying to "hold them back"... Nope, I am quite simply treating them as I would ANY person that has a medical condition. 1. The FAA will not allow a pilot to fly on SSRI's or almost any other anti-depression medication..There is a reason. 2. We have a Dr. telling us to make them get cleared first. 3. We have a DZM saying that they should get cleared first. Depression is a SERIOUS problem...Bad enough that some people KILL themselves over it.... Skydiving is a dangerous, high speed environment...If the student is not 100% mentally able to handle life and death choices in a matter of seconds. they should not be jumping. If this is a medical condition (Which I think most cases are) and it requires drugs (Which all drugs have side effects some known others not known and drugs effect each person differently). Why not get cleared by a Doctor before jumping? I really am done here...you want to continue this with me...Reread all my posts on this, and then if you still have questions or comments directed at me...send a PM. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Well my parents liked the name. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Go back to school. It never hurts.... And you know I just did. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

To some extent I agree..You think they would treat you any better? I also agree that they are better off then if SH was in charge. A group of soldiers got big heads and did some stupid shit...That happens..They should be punished. But I think that it is getting blown out of porpotion....Ever watch "Oz"? This shit happens in the US also. It's the nature of prisons....Think about any prison and you find abuse. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334