cloud9

Good question, I don't know if the bridge is owned by West Virginia or the federal government. But I do know a bureaucrat decides when where and if you can jump. If you jump on the wrong day you're a criminal.

http://sutherlandinstitute.org/news/2013/07/17/feds-broke-a-promise-to-utah-on-land-ownership/

Actually I’m a bit surprised all skydivers aren’t libertarians. First what is the Federal Government? It is a group of people hired by the citizens of the United States to act in stewardship of our country bound by the rule of law and the constitution. These stewards are paid for and given money in the form of taxation to pay for the work they do. We hire law makers to write laws, if they write laws we don’t like then we have a right to fire them and hire a different set of law makers. So the feds have not been good stewards of our land, in fact they have done a poor job. They have also been so careless with our money that they cannot in many cases afford to do what we hired them to do. So they started creating laws to get more money. Now they make laws on a whim and we’re expected to obey them. Example: Yellowstone a majestic beautiful place that you must pay money to go see. We already pay for it in the form of taxation. Yosemite the same thing and many other public lands. Here is just one problem with what they do. We do not hire the head of BLM so we can’t fire him/her for doing a bad job. He/she is not supposed to have the authority to write law, but they do it anyway. Example: It’s ok to hike, ride bicycles, camp, fish, and even mountain climb in Yosemite but base jumping is illegal. If you base jump there you will become a criminal subject to severe consequences. Why is that? Because some bureaucrat doesn’t like base jumping. Would you call that a real law? Would you call a base jumper on public land where everyone else has access a criminal? Here is a short list of criminal acts in Yosemite; During your visit to Yosemite, be aware that there are people who either intentionally or unknowingly harm park resources. Please contact a park official if you see any of the following illegal acts: • feeding or approaching wildlife • hunting animals • collecting reptiles and butterflies • collecting plants (including pine cones) • picking up archeological or historic items such as arrowheads • possession of metal detectors or using them to locate and collect historic objects • driving vehicles into sensitive meadows and off roadways • camping outside of designated campgrounds • using weapons Wow the heinous act of picking up a pine cone could cost you $5000 in fines and jail time. Your child catching a butterfly is a criminal. Possession of a metal detector; oh no lock his ass up for sure! Ask yourself why it is that the government owns over 80% of Nevada? Which by the way means the people own it. It’s time the states got their land back; Nevada should belong to the people of Nevada.

One question when you struggled with your new canopy was it an upsize? As for age I'm 60 and it definitely effects the body, but experience trumps that if it's not more demanding physically. I wish ole Dusty Dave would chime in because I still think there is an underlying problem that he may need to have looked at. Could make all the difference in the world. I know I had a bad landing that I can attribute to new glasses, first landing with bi-focals

Interesting dialog all valid points, but still with a pro rating it just doesn’t seem quite right to me. This man is obviously very accurate with his canopy flying. Although I admit I’ve never jumped a Spectre, I’ve jumped quite a few other canopies. I went from a 28 ft 7TU round to a P.C. to a Strato Star to modern designs. But in any case it seemed odd and that there may have been an underlying issue that needs to be addressed. Perhaps not I do realize anyone can break themselves on any given jump, I’ve been there too. But by his own admission he is having trouble flying the Spectre. Like I said no disrespect, I’m glad the article is there. I’m just trying to wrap my mind around it as I’m sure some of the younger jumpers are.

So I read the cover story of upsizing from a Triathlon 210 to a Spectre 230. The jumper is 66 yrs. old and has had a hip replacement, so far makes sense. Then I read that this jumper has over 2300 jumps and a pro rating. The jumper in question fly’s the Spectre so bad he ends up breaking himself. I’m really not trying to disrespect the jumper but surely there is more to this story right? I mean I just find it hard to believe that 2300 jumps and a pro rating can’t handle an upsize and very slight canopy design change. At 100 jumps I went from a Triathlon 175 to a Hornet 150 with no issues at all and I’m a long way from a prodigy. Perhaps eyesight or something else is involved here? I don’t know is it just me that think there must be more to the story? I really do think it may be eyesight; depth perception would make sense here.

Sounds to me like you have a chicken or the egg scenario going. However do you really think the sponsors push the athletes to extreme limits? I think reality is the extreme athletes push the limits and those are the ones the sponsors bring on. Death is not good for business, it's not what sponsors want. They want people that can do extraordinary things and live to tell about it.

Do a search for Hooknswoop he did quite a bit of research on this and reported actual jumps on here. Some really good info in his post.

Folks gear checks really are important, one may very well have saved my life. Back in about 2003 I had about 250 jumps and was visiting Spaceland. I was geared up and waiting on the plane when i noticed a jumper I didn't know was looking at me. He reached out and pulled hard on my chest strap and what do you know it came out. I had miss-routed the chest strap somehow and didn't realize it. I may have been fine then again I may have fallen out of my rig. I'm very thankful for an experienced jumper that was willing to make that gear check. As a result I always look at other people and over the years have found a few problems. Please look you may save a life. Please accept a gear check, I know that day I truly believed my chest strap was fine.

I don't remember where P.K. got those things. We were stationed at Camp LeJeune N.C. at the time. P.K. was a Navy corpsman VietNam vet. Had a steel plate in his head from a V.C. bullet and couldn't stay out in the sun for too long. He was a great rigger though.

Yep this looks like the right animal. I had a spinner and got one side of course, and then fought like hell to get the other. Luckily I was young and strong because I had to do a bit of a one armed pull up to get the pressure off the riser and get the release. I'm sure the adrenalin helped too. I knew I didn't want to have to do it again.

Ah yes Jerry it's starting to ring a bell now with the rocket fitting thing. They had two studs that fit on the riser and then two female fittings on the harness. The male snapped into the female fittings. Then there was a spring loaded cover you had to pull down, and lift up on a small bar to release the main. I had a bad spinner on the Strato Star due to the ropes and rings and then struggled like crazy to get the cut away. On a side note after this jump the releases went away and I also had a slider put on the Star

Thanks Jerry I got my hands on this one because the Apex was about to blow up. My rigger said jump it till it blows out and I'll fix it. Crazy times back then for sure. And as an old Marine I knew it was Knights and let it slip my mind, no disrespect to the Golden Knights intended.

I had a Golden Knights P.C. for a while back in 1975 here's one of my jumps on it.

This was back in either late 1975 or early 1976 I can't remember. I was jumping a Strato Star with a 24' humble belly mount. Note the big jump suit also if you look close I had this harness built. The rigger at the time P.K. Clifton in N.C. put those releases on. I think they were called Coker maybe cokener fittings but can't remember for sure. I had my first mal with them at jump 95 and had a very hard time with the cut away. I was under reserve around 700'. The rigger on the drop zone at the time sorry can't remember his name grounded my rig and then offered to fix it for free. So the Coker fittings went away.

Very interesting this is what I've found so that at a lower wing loading the same size canopy the cross braced canopy (I know people hate this description) but it feels bigger. Although it does fly just as fast and does dives longer. It doesn't seem to turn as quick or dive as hard at first it just seems to stay there longer. Like I said at the same wing loading around a 1.5 the Space feels more aggressive. At least to me anyway.

I think where this come in at least to me is; if you make a hard turn and dive with say a stiletto it will dive hard then recover and actually flare a bit. It will then surge and dive again. I know my Space will do the same thing it just takes longer. I find that the Xaos might go back to original flight but I haven't found that it will flare itself of course maybe I haven't had it in a dive long enough.

Don't know never jumped a tandem

I agree completely a small canopy can get you in trouble quick, I guess what I'm saying is if you jump an elliptical canopy at a 1.5 wing loading and you have the experience to be on that canopy then a Xaos-21 of the same size would probably surprise you. It would fly very similar, would have more bottom end, feel more solid and I think;... again I think;... would be an acceptable choice. So I wouldn’t ignore it based solely on the cross bracing.

This I think will surprise some, piss some off, and make others wonder if it’s true. So let me start with yes it’s true or at least my perception of the truth. I think there is a bias; that bias is that a crossbraced canopy should only be jumped by swoop gods and the rest of the common folk should just disregard the facts. So here are a few facts (perceptions) as I see them. I jump a Space 130 loaded at about a 1.5, I have a lot of jumps on this canopy (at lest to me) over 500 and really like it. I need to replace it so I was looking for a Cobalt 135 basically the same canopy. The Space/Cobalt opens great, fly’s great, feels very solid and has a tremendous amount of flare on bottom end. So what else have I jumped? Ok a Cobalt, Stiletto, Sabre2, Crossfire and Crossfire2, Nitro, Jonathon, Jedi, Hornet, and Heatwave, to name a few. I think the Space up to this point was the best canopy I’ve jumped. I am by no means a professional canopy pilot, nor even a great canopy flyer. I just enjoy my weekend jumps and have fun doing them. I do not swoop nor do I intend to swoop, I do sometimes fly a carving 90 degree turn but most often just fly straight in. So I saw an ad for a Xaos-21 135 and figured everything I heard about this canopy was good, especially the openings. The canopy was reasonable so I thought what the heck let’s give it a try. The results are as follows. Space 130 loaded at about 1.5 Vs. Xaos-21 135 loaded at about the same. First the Space turns faster and dives harder in a hard toggle turn. The Xaos turns a little slower and doesn’t dive as hard initially, The Space will recover and even flare some on its own, the Chaos doesn’t seem to want to do that, it stays in a steep decent not really a dive but a negative recovery. Bottom end on both canopies is great, but the Xaos has the Space and every other canopy I’ve jumped beat all to hell. I think this is the biggest difference between a crossbraced canopy and a typical 9 cell. Both seem to fly at about the same speed. On flare the distortion of the Xaos is much less than the Space so it stands to reason that there would be a more powerful flare. It also stands to reason that you could load the canopy a lot higher. The openings on both canopies are great, but I must confess the Xaos opens great better than I thought it would. I was surprised at how nice the openings were. So the Xoas all in all proved to be the better canopy for me, openings were great, flare was awesome, the rest was very similar to a Space/Cobalt. I will finish with this the Xaos vs. Space was very close, I felt like the Space at this wing loading felt a little more aggressive the the Xaos. I feel certain that at higher wing loadings that would change but at a 1.5 the Space seemed more responsive. This Xaos has been flown at a 1.4 wing loading a 1.5 wing loading and a 1.6 wing loading. I don’t know about before I got it. With all of that said I don’t see any reason why someone flying an elliptical canopy at these wing loading should fear flying a Xaos-21 I think for the most part they would be surprised that It doesn’t seem as aggressive as many canopies. The Stiletto turns much faster in my opinion. The cons of going to a crossbraced over a 9 cell elliptical? Well the crossbraced canopy packs bigger, it also cost more new, you will probably have to change the lines a little more frequent and you will have to put up with all the naysayers telling you, you shouldn’t be on the canopy. Is it ok to fly a Xaos at a 1.4 or 1.5 wing loading? Well according to Precision Aerodynamics it is, I don’t have a problem taking their word for it. Can they be landed straight in with out a speed increasing turn? Most definitely without any problem at all, in fact they still have more flare then any traditional 9 cell I’ve jumped. The pros of going to a crossbraced canopy, you may find one like I did cheaper than a non-crossbraced of similar performance. You will get more flare power out of the same size canopy, and it will start the flare much quicker with a small toggle bump. So all in all no reason not to go with a Xaos in lieu of a 9 cell elliptical canopy at a moderate wing loading. If you can find one rasonable and don’t mind the larger pack volume. So I know we will hear from some nay sayers however I think if you call Precision Aerodynamics you’ll hear the same thing I’m saying. Ok so in closing I’m not telling anyone to go buy and load up a crossbraced canopy. I’m also not talking about any crossbraced other than the Xaos-21. I/m also talking about if you jump an elliptical at a 1.5 wing loading you won’t find a lot of difference between the two. A 120 sq. ft. canopy fly’s about the same speed at the same wing loading, not matter if it’s a 7 cell, 9 cell or crossbraced. Honestly I wonder why a lot more people don’t fly them; they have more flare and bottom end then most canopies and are not any more aggressive than most ellipticals in normal flight. So let’s have some discussion on this subject, I’m very curious what others think. Oh for the profile lookers, mine hasn’t been updated since 2006 you can check with the mods on that if you are so compelled.

Wow! I have to learn sentence breaks and paragraphs someday. Thank goodness for spell checks.

We all have our moments, injecting a little humor proves you're not an ahole.... well maybe just this once But I must say excellent rebound!

Actually I think it’s a great question and it’s never too early to start learning. Now that being said the answer to your question is there are a great many choices in gear. There are numerous container systems, many canopy manufactures of many different style canopies and reserves. There are jump suits, altimeters, helmets, AAD’s and other gear. Then of course there is used or new to add to your confusion. So what’s an excited up and coming jumper to do? Well start reading and talking to people about what they jump and why. Find out the difference between a 7 cell and a 9 cell, between a square, tapered and elliptical canopy. Look at the containers, all of them are airworthy so find one that A fits you best or B you find esthetically pleasing. Watch video of FF and FS and see what might appeal to you. There is a lot of information out there about gear. There is a lot of information on this site about gear. As you do your research you will learn a lot about gear and skydiving in general. When the time comes to buy you’ll have a pretty good idea of what you want. Start with something safe and comfortable that you can use for a couple hundred jumps. Safe being the key work here, good luck and enjoy your research. My first rig won’t help you much it was a military surplus 28’ round with a 7TU mod for steering. My first modern rig was a reflex container with a 175 Triathlon and a Raven 218 reserve with an aad. I really enjoyed that for about 150 jumps then started looking again. There are threads on here about people’s first rig and why they bought it so do a search and read all you can.

Keith was a great guy and a great skydiver. I quit jumping in 1976 and started back in 2001 to say things had changed is an understatement. Keith helped me a lot with RW and learning to fly the new rigs. I had never jumped with a reserve on my back. I remember being invited on a 4 way and funneling the exit then going low. When we got down I thought well that's the last time I'll get invited with them. Instead I got a big smile, and "that was great fun you want to go again", I couldn't believe it; he coached me on what I did wrong and the next jump was much better. Keith was like that all the time, he will be missed much in the skydiving community and outside of it as well.

Blue Skies Semper Fi Marine!