nerdgirl

If you can find it; yes, please share it. Thanks. /Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying

Marc – would you suggest/cite/link to some of those research sources that I haven’t looked at previously? Seriously. What have you seen that I have missed? And where specifically do you see evidence that torture worked? You do realize that information obtained from KSM that being touted as having “prevented an attack on LA” was obtained (1) by the FBI agents using traditional interrogation before the CIA contractors arrived, and (2) supplemented by information recovered from a computer hard drive, yes? VR/Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying

Or how about another option: Mr Cheney takes responsibility for his role – tacit, complicit, &/or explicit – either individually or as representative of the administration in policy choices made? That is another *option*. Where are the calls for taking responsibility for one’s actions that one usually encounters in moral choices? Frankly, as I’ve written consistently for over a year, I see prosecution of Cheney, Yoo, Busbee, et al as not being in the long term interest of the US or US strategic interests. Advocate something akin to ‘truth & reconciliation’ type of process. And I still see no one better to lead such an effort than Sen McCain. Success of such a process does depend on willingness/ability of those responsible to accept responsibility and engage in, minimally, verbalizations of contrition. It might … in the short term, the metaphorical ‘open wound’ is likely to continue to fester. ***Wouldn’t it have been better to have just not done it in the first place?*** We didn’t need to do it. It was a policy choice that was made in a 'fog of war'. A policy choice made in the wake of the most serious attack on the US in the memory and lifespan of the majority of the citizen's of America. Well-intentioned people making *very* bad decisions. We also had an option of doing nothing in response to the attacks of 11 September 2001 – we didn’t pursue that option. Doing nothing is always a choice. We also had an option of deploying nuclear weapons – we didn’t pursue that policy option either. Anticipating the red herring: yes, it would have been *much* *much* *much* better if the attacks of 11 September 2001 never happened. And if a whole lot of other choices had or hadn’t been made. Thank God, Buddha, Jehovah, Shiva, Gaia, Mohammed, Isis, and/or any number of possible deities/religious figures one could invoke that my government isn’t the one is power (or failing/flailing) then or now in Afghanistan. This is about policy choices of our government. Ignorance of history, i.e., not being aware of the North Korean and Chinese Communist origin of the SERE program training inclusion of waterboarding as a technique used to elicit false confessions, should not be an excuse. It may be a mitigating factor on intent. Maybe ... And at the same time sometimes acknowledging and letting dumb things people do and poor choices people make go may be better in the long term. Is this one of those things? Or does “torture ha[ve] no place in America, and Americans have no reason to employ it”? These are the ethical and moral components of the issue … not the effectiveness or tactical ones. We should set the metaphorical bar high not lower ourselves. Among the many reasons, I love my nation is that I want to be “resolute in the knowledge that our nation remains a last bastion of what is right (or ought to be right) in the world.” Torture or whatever euphemism one wants to employ, ain’t right. VR/Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying

Bumped and quoted for Ion01, who cited the idea of negotiating with the Taliban as “This is just one of the many signs of where thinks are actually going. YES WE CAN.....destroy the great country the united states used to be.” (From my original post) Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying

I've hosted couch surfers. Generally had a lot of fun with it. Some are really cool. Some less so. Haven't had any experiences that I'd call bad, but I don't accept all requests. Just said "no" to a group of 5 people from Europe who wanted a place to stay for 5 days. Have a guy from Mississippi staying with me tomorrow night who needs go to the French consulate here. Haven't ever used the site to find a place to surf, altho' in the past have surfed friends' couches many times. /Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying

Could that be because you guys are old enough to remember the original series? Possibly, but I also have friends my age that were also fans of the original series that have literally attacked me for daring to say the new movie has flaws. I care ... and I wasn't born until after the original airing of tv series was concluded. And still looking forward to reading your analysis Quade.

Thanks for all the commentary here. Noticed some things that I likely wouldn't have otherwise. Thought it was a fun summer movie. Am still smiling at Spock getting the girl … and Kirk not. [channeling wanna-be-USC cinema school major, ... aka if you don’t like over-analysis, stop reading now ] In many ways, I thought it was true thematically to the original series (as opposed to the subsequent series.) I start from the perspective that film and television is more indicative of the time of their creation than anything else. The original series , while having occasional moments of social insight, was largely a western in space. Or … maybe because it was largely a western in space, it could offer those occasional moments of brilliance, i.e, slip in social commentary when the audience wasn’t expecting rather than metaphorically shoving/heavy handed preaching a message, e.g. last summer’s remake of Day the Earth Stood Still. Although what may have been subtle then seems awfully straightforward now, i.e., the episode with the warring alien races in which different sides of the faces are painted black & white. (And what was the social commentary/message of the Trouble with Tribbles? Precognition of Eric Drexler’s nanobot-grey-goo scenario, which itself is more sci-fantasy than science-fiction.) The latest film is a ‘buddy movie’ and a ‘coming of age story’ in space. Was disappointed in both the character of Scottie and the actor playing him. Bones had great lines. The attempt to make the villain multi-dimensional was weak (like most of the adversaries in the original tv series, imo). The Spock character(s) were the best imo. /Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying

Do you consider the embrace and enforcement of the rule of law to be a strength or a weakness? /Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying

Thanks for the discussion and additional information guys -- very much appreciated! My non-lawyer reading of the proposed legislation, H.R. 2159, The Denying Firearms and Explosives to Dangerous Terrorists Act of 2009 is that the substantive restrictions already exist. Largely legislation passed after the 1995 Oklahoma City bombing and 9-11. It's already illegal to give aid or comfort to known terrorists (as defined in the CFR not EOs or other executive or State documents - the Ron Paul bumper sticker list was from Missouri) including money, information, arms, or explosives. As you two have pointed out, the new component is permitting arbitrary intervention by the AG without having to prove sufficient cause. I don't get that latter piece on multiple grounds. Mostly the laws already exist. Enforce the ones that exist. Don't need new ones. /Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying

Me thinks you're right. Disagree w/r/t substance of challenge. Also disagree w/r/t argument style. Calling it trolling is also an ad hominem. If someone's challenge really is weak or invalid, pull apart the argument. Rather than going after the poster: play the ball not the player. If one asks questions in a climate change thread, one is "skeptical." Whereas, asking questions or challenging consensus in this thread is labelled trolling. As much as you all (general and non-specific) have the right to challenge in that topic, so does someone else here. VR/Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying

Excellent investigative journalism on Pakistani Taliban with specific emphasis on recruitment/indoctrination of young boys, including as suicide bombers; efforts to eliminate education for young girls; imposition of Sharia' (religious-based) law; efforts to undermine local civil-based law enforcement (e.g., decapitated police officer hung in town center w/sign indicating anyone who removes him will also be killed likewise); and instability of current government: PBS Frontline’s Pakistan: Children of the Taliban. Also effectively illustrative of how hard it is to win against an insurgency. Comment from the Frontline segment that most struck me ... because I see so much anti-intellectualism in the US today and voiced not infrequently here: “Because education is like a ray of light and I want that light.” 9-year old girl in Swat Valley whose school was destroyed by Pakistani Taliban. She gets it. VR/Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying

and its corollary: Dilbert economics. /Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying

Oh, you have no idea. Looking forward to reading your analysis.

Imo, like most things, it depends. The first time I dated a guy over 50, I was 27 or 28. He was talking about doing his first jump course at Fort Benning before I was born. That caused me – *me,* others may have different responses – to pause when I did the calculation. The fact that *contrary to what he’d told me initially* he really wasn’t divorced from his first wife was what ultimately caused a split. He did treat me _very_ well, but that fact didn’t obviate that he was still married. /Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying

Some of my thoughts – you may find something useful or toss them all out the metaphorical window. There’s a mix of just enough facts selected to fit a specific hypothesis to make it seem probable or to give the implicit conclusion and action an appearance of merit. The central premise cited that fertility rates correlate to erosion of culture is an interesting one. I don’t know if it’s true or not. I did chuckle that the video’s narrator notes “research shows” – research probably conducted by pointy headed liberal academic types – without any citation. It’s also correlation not necessarily causation. It might point to causation but it doesn’t necessarily mean that, even though the video strongly suggests that correlation. Illustrative example with respect to correlation: research has shown that rate of consumption of ice cream in New York City correlates positively with increased rate of homicides. Both occur in the summer. Ice cream isn’t causing homicide rates to increase seasonally. Assuming that the fertility rates cited are accurate, (I didn’t try to verify or disprove, but they sound reasonable to me), a lot of assumptions/premises have to come true – that may or may not be supported by fact, probability, or history – for the implied conclusion to be true. From a formal logic perspective, it’s a mix of base rate fallacy, appeal to probability, and suppressed correlatives. If one wants to see a counter-example of culture surviving while a minority look to Jews throughout much of Europe, from before Moorish Spain through the 1900s. I have no idea what the birth rate was; it varied, of course. Survival of a culture also depends on other things, e.g., death rate and infant mortality. It’s hypothesized that one reason Jews survived during times of oppression coupled with disease (like the plague) is that the death rate was lower due to certain practices (e.g., higher rate of bathing) that Christians at the time disfavored. There also are implied assumptions that (1) all current non-Muslims are practicing Judeo-Christians, and (2) none of the Muslims will be assimilated into mainstream European culture. American Muslims have integrated and assimilated, in general, much more than Continental European Muslims. While a minority of European Muslims overall, Islamic radicalization is a much larger problem in Europe relative to America. Cultural practices may also limit. For example, *secular* mainstream western culture has a much higher involvement of women. When half of a population is prohibited from working (contributing to GDP) due to cultural limitations in the most restrictive Islamic communities, that’s a major hurdle to overcome economically. Snopes on the video. VR/Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying

Really smart folks like historian/war studies scholar Martin von Crevald, playwright/former Czech President Vaclav Havel, and others have suggested that the end of the Westphalian-based nation-state system is near. Back to my belief that intelligence makes a real difference ... Hmmm ... guess that means, by that metric, that I'm a dummy - ... cause my neorealist self doesn't foresee nation-states as the dominant structure in the anarchic international system disappearing anytime soon. /Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying

Your observations in some way reflect my curiosity in bringing the question to SC. There are quite a few outspoken States rights advocates here. Relative prioritization is not implicit in that … but examples like you cite above open the door for less certain scenarios. /Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying

I think your response is worthy of its own thread. Intellectually provocaive & thread worthy.

You are saying that in standard cancer research, iridescent genes are inserted into patients' DNA so that doctors can see where the cancer is with a blacklight? I've never heard of that - maybe you can provide a link? I recently went to a talk in Trinity College Dublin where this kind of technology was being used to study the migration of cancerous cells through blood vessles. It was very interesting. Another good example (not necessarily the same research you heard but the general idea). /Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying

You are saying that in standard cancer research, iridescent genes are inserted into patients' DNA so that doctors can see where the cancer is with a blacklight? I've never heard of that - maybe you can provide a link? Here are a few links on GFP (one of the UV fluorescent proteins) cancer therapy and imaging. Very little "standard" cancer research involves direct experiments on humans. Experiments using cancerous cells in vitro, in a petri dish or cell culture, yes. Or experiments on animal models, which often start with mice. Human patients tend to be during and at the end of clinical trials (exceptions for things like treatments for small pox or nerve agents; animal models are acceptable all the way through trials). I'm most familiar with GFP and other flourescent tags or makers being used for imaging (determining where cancer are in the body &/or extent of spread) or in conjunction with therapy/delivery of chemotherapeutics to only target the cancerous cells and not affect the healthy cells. /Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying

The vast majority aren't. Um, maybe I missed the seriousness, but I thought he was (in jest) inquiring about National Guard units that were maintained by states governments. By default, I treat almost all questions as serious and legitimate. Some folks -- & not in any way to necessarily imply you -- may perceive that as silly or a weakness to exploit/mock. Sarcasm, while observed in nearly all cultures around the world, is also culturally or regionally specific ... and frequently difficult to discern or poorly executed in ASCII or html mark-up text. /Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying

end - I tend to give those things to individuals rather than concepts or associations I tend to give to both. I am loyal to individual friends, to colleagues, to bosses, and to the folks who work for me. I also have a strong sense of loyalty to the US Government & its institutions (Big "G") and the ideals of governence (little "g") described in the Declaration of Independence, the US Constitution, and the tradition of rule of law. Support and defend the Constitution rather than _any_ particular administration's or individual's interpretation of those documents. But isn't that pretty much what you said in post #15?

I think an individual's intelligence makes a real difference on this issue. I'm also curious to understand better the argument underlying the intelligence (or lack thereof) correlation. Smart people can make choices, do things, or come to conclusions with which I disagree, e.g., John Yoo. /Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying

The vast majority aren't. There have been a few self-styled militia groups or individuals who have affiliated with militias who have attempted or poorly executed terrorism. They're usually more accurately referred to as anti-government groups but sometimes get erroneously merged with militia groups, like the "Michigan Miltia." E.g., in 1991, the Minnesota Patroits Council obtained ricin (real stuff not just castor beans/castor bean mush) and planned to use it to kill a U.S. deputy marshal, local law enforcement officials, and IRS officials. Three or four of the members were convicted under the Biological Weapons Anti-Terrorism Act (BWAT). There are other examples; that's just the one I know best off the top of my head. /Marg Act as if everything you do matters, while laughing at yourself for thinking anything you do matters. Tibetan Buddhist saying