BobKnoss

Whatever. My point again is it tends to taint a book which might otherwise have merit. Too many DB Cooper books have been astral projections of one kind or another. Dont follow suit. Well, BLAST is an Anal Ejection of the Fifth Dimension, does that count, Georger?

A posthumous book of confession may be released which will explain everything. McCoy was a book writer. Tog indicated semi-true family legacy in the plan, I'm still thinking about a book review correcting all the errors in current books, except the really erroneous trash/crap like Blast and a few other left field bad dreams. THE TRUTH IS VERY OFTEN STRANGER THAN FICTION. IF IT IS TOTALLY UNBELIEVABLE, PERHAPS THAT WAS THE ORIGINAL INTENTION. ONCE THERE WAS ONE, NOW THERE ARE THREE, FIND MY WIFE AND YOU WILL FIND ME. ASK GEORGE TENET.

Just the facts, yellow striped badger dude! Just the facts. Not my making, not my words. That is what McCoy said on the phone. Truth in total, no fabrication. I think you might call it 'planned assassination', which is still legal in this country on some levels below the President, until you execute the plan, then it becomes 'attempted assassination', which is a crime. You are so keyed on details, why don't you see them when they apply to you? Jo references murders, not me. Wrong again, badger, Honey.

Well, you are a REAL SUCKER for bait aren't you. A Lawyer? How would you know - Lawyer, FBI, CIA, Government or Covert? Did I mention anyone's name?

I am sick of your crap, too! You are out in left field again. I don't know any lawyer "Feisty". Never met him. Don't care to. I will tell you this, however. Some people who you think you know are not who you think they are at all! BIG surprise!! You would never guess in a million years. That's CODE! Think about THAT one, smarty pants! Got you dancing on a string! Speak English, I might trade you.

You can't tell Henry Selick from Richard McCoy, now you can't tell KC from Rataczak. That picture is NOT in Tosaw's book. I have a personalized copy. Hint: Bill does not have dimples, but he does have long sideburns and irregular ears. Selick on the otherhand, looks NOTHING like McCoy at all. Neither does the fake dead guy in Mac's uniform. KC always seems to look like he just swallowed the canary. Rataczak always seems to look like someone farted. McCoy looked like a skinny Curt Warner back in the day. But none of you ever met him other than the guy with the "gold mine," who posts on here. That's code, Jo.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion about another's facts. You have opinions, not facts. Your opinions are biased. There NEVER has been a one-legged man in what I tell. Mac and Duane were not FBI, we looked at references to similar names, spelled differently as I recall, two b's. "I know of no one who was ever both FBI and CIA." ~~Richard Floyd McCoy, Jr. Not every discussion is hardcore fact carved in stone. We were investigating a possibility. Richard McCoy is not dead, you just believe he is dead. MKULTRA is an all-enclusive name that includes Bluebird, which is what Tina and I were subjected to, yes. Probably Duane as well. My story does not change, I keep looking for additional information, asking questions, probing. I have never TOLD the whole story. It is way too long to tell at one time. What happened happened, I can't change what I experienced, but we all can still learn more from others (when they tell the truth). Falsehoods are usually proven as such, eventually. I will help prove truth as I am able. I will not get feisty. There are still a few people I speak about whom I still wish to support, not submarine. There are forces opposed to each other in this conflict, young guys and old guys of differing mindsets. This is their battle, not mine. I'd like to see a compromise, like you hinted at recently, as we have discussed. Problem is a loose cannon.... JW. The mind of a scorned woman functions on a different wavelength. Like lightening from the clouds. Leaving a smelly green haze in the aftermath. I know, down deep you really love me, green ham that I am.

I heard NOTHING wrong! This man is a total lunatic. Bucket or pail they are both the same - that utensil into which the milk flowed after being extracted from the cow's tits! A milk Can is a different thing all together. That is a can with a lid that is use to transport the milk from the milk station to a central point. We did NOT have milking machines when I was on a farm and we milked by hand - we sold the farm in 1958. BK talks to the dead. McCoy is dead. BK did NOT know anything about a one legged man or Tommy Gunn - and I will assure you neither of the guys were McCoy! McCoy did NOT contact BK, but I think I know who likes to play with his mind. Feed his delusions and this crime will never be solved. I am tired of wasting my time and energy on this. Why don't we get "Feisty" about this. Is this CODE. You bet! BUT, guess what - bet BK knows what I am talking about. His TOG loves to play games with him and lives on BK's turf! Taking BK for the ride of his life. Jiberish. What you state is totally unfactual. Where do you come up with this jiberish? I never knew a one legged man, correcto!! Finally! The one legged guy is your fixation, not mine. There are a thousand Tommy Gunns, I may not have known yours, correcto! Mine WAS McCoy, I have film! McCoy was in regular contact, how do you know differently? Mentalist, now? Milk pail, milk can all the same to some people. He buried a milk pail with a lid. Why use an open bucket? Didn't happen. Not what McCoy said. Under a tree by the river, then he couldn't find the same tree again. That is what McCoy said. TOG doesn't play games with me because we don't speak. We don't email. We don't plan attacks on anyone. He pretends to be uninvolved and I support him. I have all the facts and have been corrected ONCE. Scott did not go back to sit beside Cooper and say. "So what's this about a bomb?" THAT is fabrication according to TOG. Fabrication, just like your opposition to the truth of my involvement with McCoy. You get nothing wrong???? At least HALF of what I present is interpreted wrong by you. Your batting average is 500! If your average with Sluggo, Georger, Jerry, 377, me, was the same with Duane, you have the credibility problem clearly in your vision. Things just don't always fit the facts as we know them. You are not the last word on this case, unfortunately. Doesn't work that way. The last word is going to be total fiction of the Government's choosing. I think you see that very clearly, right? None of us have any say on what that will be. We just slam our fists on the table and dream of vile things to do to BK because he has a commitment to expose what he knows. And that is different than what you heard, and is illogical to everyone else, so here we sit. Jiberish. I'm one voice in a blackout. Ignore me.

"Regina says she traced one IP that she believes belongs to Bob Knoss, using different usernames to make comments. If she denies this, I will post the email from her about it." I made one post on that rediculous site as I recall, to deny ownership of the bad posts. That one good post was REMOVED!! Tell you anything about objectives of the management? I put it on Blevins since that is where the references seem to always generate. Could be a lot of people, but since I KNOW my IP was NOT the source, that makes that story a lie, and that info came from you know who, the wannabe crap writer/cartoonist with too much time on his hands... Pretty basic cop work.

"I won't repeat How a bucket became a milk can as all of you know that story by heart, but NOT BK." Not a "bucket", it was a "pail", a MILK pail. You must have heard wrong again. You do that constantly, you know. We all keep telling you. A milk pail (can) buried under a tree by the river. That's what McCoy said. Maybe McCoy heard wrong, too. I know for certain that is what was told to me. I'm betting any confusion on this matter lies with the party with the history of getting it wrong. JT: Where did you get your information? "Uncle Mac?" Then you should have the same info I have.

"Now I am tired and lost touch of what I was trying to say." Hell's Bells! I'm fully alert and lost touch of what you were trying to say! Bk never knew Duane or McCoy, but he was THE snitch for something. From a person who never heard the story until twenty some years later? The way Mac explained it there was no "snitch". Karen relayed Mac's instructions to O'Hara about the bank. The whole escapade was staged in Mac's home town because he knew the area like the back of his hand. The local cop was Mac's friend and in on the plans to get information out of Walker. They got what they wanted, put the boys back in the slammer and had to eliminate a used up undercover character. Standard procedure. The King is dead, long live the King. Richard Floyd McCoy, Jr., officially dead, Captain Tommy Gunn ready for duty, new dude, got his job back, see George Tenet. Same SS number, still answered to "Mac." Captain Tommy Gunn lost his name, due to porno stars with the same name soon after, and David Polcek appeared (like George Peppard's character). (RFMjr2) He then later reappeared as R McCoy, same old Pentagon job, same old SS number, and died again around 2000 (retirement) of leg cancer, reappearing as another Richard McCoy (RFMjr3) which he uses in retirement, with some modification. NOW I'm a snitch. I told a government secret. The three lives of Richard Floyd McCoy, Jr., Infamous Agent.

Thank you for clarifying my thoughts. Without your help I wouldn't know WHAT i was thinking! Yes, I stand by all I said, but as I stated it in total, not twisted and exurped and burped. I proofed everything. You need to do the same. Just stating a different opinion does not make it different. My proof is the actual participants themselves who have confirmed the information to me. They will definitely not declare the same publicly, so no need to contradict what they say, even if they choose to say otherwise. At least the truth is out there as an optional series of events. Georger: You assume wrong, too. Bill Rataczak was the brains behind the Cooper Vane, if you want to spend any effort at all looking for truth! All you guys seem to do is act like magnets for the phony information. That is why I call you all the "COOPER CREW", because of your apparent objective to support and defend only the false information about the case. I have yet to see anyone other than Robert99 address anything valid. His study of a westerly shift in the flight path is consistent with the report I was given verbally by an unimpeachable witness. Second hand, but totally trustworthy.

"Then correct it, these are all YOUR "FACTS". None of them add up, they have all been shown to be incorrect and yet you persist." You have shown NONE of my comments to be incorrect. You have only voiced your own opinion. Since I was the one to personally witness what I offer, I definitely believe it, and can not be swayed by your opinions. Is that clear enough? Your understanding of the case is minimal and not sufficient to convince anyone of anything other than the ARMY position on case. I did appreciate your velocity comments, however. That's about it. Like Quade says, I have to learn to ignore you. I need to try harder.

Ask him, if he seems willing to answer, what all the false accusations have done to him and his family's reputation? Did he hurt his career,or post career life, in any way? Matt I doubt he is aware of Bobby's little game, another reason he is stuck on here, maybe it's time to blow this out into the public a little more so these guys can see what BK is saying about them! Knoss mention's in Skyjack that is was worried about a law suit, this was way before he has used so many names publically. Following the infamous D.B. Cooper skyjacking in 1971, aircraft makers created a device called a "Cooper Vane", that made it impossible to lower the rear stairs during flight. That's just one of many changes mandated by the Federal Aviation Administration over the years in response to increasing security problems. A year earlier, for example, in September 1970, Palestinians threatened to destroy four hijacked airplanes, two of them American. In response, President Nixon put "sky marshals" on select flights to deter hijackers. David Leach was one of the first sky marshals. He says back then, commercial flying was still a novelty. But sky marshals couldn't ride on every flight, and the hijackings didn't end. So in December 1972, the FAA gave the airlines one month to begin searching all passengers and their bags. Dennis O'Madigan, then Director of Security for Piedmont Airlines, says metal detectors known as magnetometers were rigged up from a device originally used by loggers. August 5, 1974, Nixon signed into law the Anti-Hijacking Act of 1974 Gray says, "small room." He was wrong there, it was the south side of a big room, with black curtains around the area. The rest is as I stated, yes. Bill's son, Jim confirmed that Bill was the designer of the Cooper Vane, although it is assigned to another inventor. It was invented before the Cooper hijacking. He has had a number of clever inventions. I'm getting really tired of these badgering comments. You are not being productive. Let's discuss something helpful? If you spent as much time checking out McCoy's Medallion, we'd be over that by now. But you have an agenda to "wipe me out", so you waste everyone's time. You have wasted more time on this forum that everyone else combined. Cut it out, please! You are not being fair to the others.

I am not suggesting any thing, just using actual. observed, science and fact. The Co-pilot had to be hard of hearing if I understand your current theory for the "suggested" stall. But as he is also "TOG" (Your claim remember?), it confuses me. So, is he a less than competent pilot and a world renowned parachute rigger? Matt Got it wrong again. I give up. You just twist everything intentionally to make me mad again. No, you are not correct in you assumptions of what I claim. Please stop trying to cram words in my mouth. I agree. You are confused. I don't care to try to unconfuse you again. You are a trouble maker for everyone.

Was this "tendency to split" before of after ripstop materials started being used in canopies? Also, "steerable by pulling on the front chords"? Did you have the parachute on backwards? Yes, you are an expert and I am not. I agree. I know nothing of which I speak when it comes to technical aviation stuff. But I do remember the basic content of what was discussed. I don't have to be a rocket scientist to relay basic information. I'm sure you can readily correct anything I may have to offer and put the right terms in play. Please accept my lack of 'higher' learning in this atmosphere. I'm a groundling.

How did you draw that flight? Sign up? Did you see any flares from the helicopters behind? Were the FBI guys polite? Did they inspect your briefcase? Had you ever flown that route before? Why didn't Scott go back to inspect the situation like the books says he should have? Where are Cooper's first notes to the cockpit? It seems this crime has played a major role in your life ever since 1971. Do you regret staying involved? Has it been a trying ordeal? How has it affected your family? How would you like to see the case resolved? Do you see a cause and effect relationship between Cooper and McCoy and President Nixon's Executive order for passenger boarding and baggage control? What is your favorite movie, "The High and the Mighty?" What is the name of the black and white movie made by two Minneapolis pilots in the mid 80's? If you know? How many service flights did you rack up in the Air Force? High altitude jumps? Do you still have your squadron jacket? Did you stay in touch with the guys? What is most memorable about your time in the Service? You had only one close call in your commercial flights, not of your making, so you have a perfect flight record? You were always there to stand up for your fellow pilots and lend a helping hand. Most people don't know that. You were a leader. Safety was a big issue about the time of Cooper, right? I have it by the grapevine that you were the one who came up with the Cooper Vane. Is that true? That is an amazing device. When did you come up with that? You had other inventions too, right? If you had everything to do over, what would you do differently?

OK. So it is obvious to you that parachutes have varying capacities for opening speeds. This is a wonderfully enlightening fact. So, if you were an experienced high altitude jump expert and familiar with emergency jet jumps, you think you could pick a parachute that would open successfully at the speeds Matt suggests?? I suggest that this is another mute point, since Duane survived the jump with only a stairway injury to the right leg. That injury had no causical effects from the parachute because he was trained to pull at ten seconds.

Recommended stall....Yes, I knew that was faulty, but I figured you would figure out what I was trying to say. The manufacturer's stated speed at which the airplane can no longer sustain flight. As I understood the conversation, flight 305 had slowed beyond this stated number before the co-pilot realized it. I thought it may have been 160 knots, but I am hazy in the exact number. I'm sure you understood. Jo, you make too many erroneous assumptions about me, like Sluggo_Monster said. A regular Duracell Bunny. Go with the flow. I'm not trying to destroy the Weber story, everyone else is. It's a forest and the trees thingie. You shoot yourself in the foot daily. Give it up! Let's move onward and upward and discuss something Jo likes, PLEASE? I remember a discussion about parachute canopies, but not their numbers. The ones the trainer liked were of an older variety, and had less tendency to split. I very clearly remember that. It was not really steerable, but you could pull on the front chords to get some control. It was a military parachute, all one color, dirty white like natural nylon color. The trainer had a red and white canopie that he jumped with. But that just causes problems here. Forget the red and white chute. Not important. Meyer: "Now everytime you post, I have to look at your mug. Can you send me a blowup of your post pic? I was thinking about putting a bullseye on it and sending it out to everyone on the forum to use for dart practice. Might even help alleviate frustration. What do you think. MeyerLouie " Reply: I accommodated your complaint. See attached.

"But, a sewn shut chute, tends not to work, exit speed would not matter." You will have to trust me on this one, Matt. The sewn shut bag was to insure no tampering. Duane knew to pull out the stitching! If not, Jerry would have found the money, bought a gold mine and become a millionaire. Hey! wait a minute! Hey, JR, how did you get the gold mine again?

I was thinking more of the time period in which the flight slowed down to try to get the guy in back to leave the plane. To the best of my knowledge, the only time the airliner slowed to below about 170 knots was just after takeoff in Seattle when they did so to help Cooper get the stairs down. My understanding was that the speed fell below the recommended stall speed before it was realized, no problems. Was that MPH or KTS? 170 was a number that sounds familiar from that conversation. I'm not sure, could have been 160, but I'd be surprised. The co-pilot would know. Drag strip parachutes open as high as 325 MPH in every run with a ton more weight to stop. How would that relate??

Bait, bait, bait, bait.

"Coop" as we called him was trained to pull on the count of ten seconds which was enough time from 170 kts to slow him down. The particular chute that was provided in the dummy pack (the good chute marked with the "X") was chosen by, packed by, and stitched shut by a very topnotch packer guy with significant jumpers respect. The chute did not fail, because Duane Weber lived through it. No 727 jumpers have EVER been killed attempting this jump. I do not know where TOG got the chute, but because it worked, it must have been OK. Huh? There have been hundreds of higher speed successful jumps. I think your point is proven mute.

"Sluggo_Monster Aug 9, 2009, 9:18 AM Post #12132 of 34355 (5012 views) Jo’s Perceptions When I see your post about things I have said, decisions I have made, and conversations we (you and I) have had, I realize that your perception is VERY different from mine. This casts doubt on all the other things you have told me. If I was starting over, looking into Duane’s past, I would be skeptical of everything you said in cases where you did not have evidence (like Pasternak’s research). Jo… you have a very interesting story when it comes to having been married to Duane. You have a LOT of evidence (mostly undisclosed) about what an unusual character Duane was. If I had time, I would research some of Duane’s past (like his Chemical and Biological Warfare experience at Camp Siebert in Gadsden, AL)* * and try to figure out some of the things he was “into”. But, alas I don’t have the time. You are a dear person, I (still) consider you my friend, I wish only good things for you. But, you have let the trolls, hucksters, devils, and just plain cruel SOBs of this world drive you to the brink of madness. This madness will cause you to drive away the people who want to help you the most. Don’t slide over the edge. I have posted here a dozen (or so) times; “Those that know, aren’t talking and those that are talking, don’t know.” Let me say that (to you specifically) in another way. SHUT UP! THE INVESTIGATION IS ONGOING, THE PEOPLE YOU BADGER CONSTANTLY (by berating their efforts) ARE SEEKING THE TRUTH. WHEN THE TIME COMES, YOU’LL KNOW WHAT THEY KNOW… NOT BEFORE!!" The above is a quotation from Sluggo a long time ago, word for word. It is absolutely amazing that I should have to repeat the EXACT SAME THING AGAIN AND AGAIN!!! You could be a reincarnated Rosanne Rosannadanna because you do THE EXACT SAME THING AGAIN AND AGAIN that Gilda Radner did to be funny. Only you are not funny.

The money from the hijack was written off by the insurance company as a "good investment." McCoy got his "paycheck" from his wife's lawsuit. Duane's checks were in the way of employment with the insurance company, although he never earned his way. Nobody else was paid for the Project except their normal employment as near as I know, so I see no payment avenues to pursue. The false claim of McCoy's death is common place with the undercover shift of a name change on an exposed or overused agent like McCoy. That false death is well documented by Brit Hume on Pasternak's PBS round table when Hume confirmed George Tenet verifying Richard McCoy as the only agent ever to get his job back. Look at the effort expended to investigate the Watergate break-in. The Norjak Project is just another Nixon Dirty Trick. Originally designed to be a union demonstration of pilot vulnerability and airline policy deficiencies, it was changed into a covert political football to help enact unpopular legislation by subsequent Presidential Executive Order. Not what was intended by the two creators of the concept, and a complete surprise to TOG. The effort to try this case is dumbfounding, and as Carr indicated, not FBI doable. As Nuttal says, it would have to be initiated by a State Attorney General from a state the plane flew over. My rights were violated by being interrogated under hypnosis without any defense. I was given a 4 year sentence as a threat to accept a suspension assignment to Norjak. THAT was illegal. The President, I am advised, can legally do what Nixon did, the crime was Cooper's alone, since the original plan was an approved demonstration returning the money. Nixon made it a crime, not our guys. I put Norjak on the same table as Watergate. Just another verse in the same poem. Where is the whistleblower foundation? Too big to handle. I just want to present it, not prove it. I'm not up to the task. If you want to handle the case, OK. I'll work with you.