Scrumpot

Yeah, when I began "L/O'ing" ...even just loosely last season, I was told: "HA! ...you've now made it your 'job' and yourself to be 'the target' -enjoy!" However, NOT necessarily! Hey, if it's gonna be more conducive to a dive's success for me to swoop, then I swoop! It's fun to finally be the one that (sometimes) actually makes the decisions as to that! [post hijack-mode now /off] Back to the original poster... trust us, we have ALL "been there", and paid our "dues". In a way (at least for me) it also brings back some fond memories. ...Don't sweat it. You'll get there. Ahhh.... Nostalgia. It just aint what it used to be! BLUE SKIES, -Grant coitus non circum - Moab Stone

Hey John, what do you mean by "stuck" in the base? ...I resemble that remark!! HA, HA, HA, HA! ...I just couldn't resist that! Seriously though, otherwise, right on the money response. ...Somebody new shows up on the DZ, I am ALWAYS happy to jump with 'em. ...And I will COMMIT to do so FIRST, ...BEFORE even asking. But just before getting together, manifesting and planning the dirt-dive, if I've never seen 'em before, I WILL ask. ...It's NOT an insult. It IS really the quick (as you say) down & dirty way to quickly assess what you are going to do. Now, if I had a 12-way group ready to go or something, and then the person says "23" or something like that ...I may turn around & divide the ealier 12-way up into 2 groups (or just bow MYSELF & the new-face out), then take the new face up on either a 2 or 3-way with someone else I know. If they say (like this initial poster) 150-somethin' (or the like) I still most likely will break down the group(s) and put them in the smaller one (WITH ME) to assess their skills. I will also ask MORE than just jump #'s at that point too. Like, what have they been doing recently? ...How current? ...How successful? And then, ...what (in all honesty) would THEY like to do? Normally this works out just fine, and they find their "level" that way and fit in pretty quickly! Also, ANYBODY not "willing" to do at least one or 2 jumps as an unkown, in what even just seems like it may be an "eval", and gets insulted, has just as big a problem themselves. I've said this before, and I practice it! If I walk up onto an unfamiliar dropzone where nobody there seems to know me (#1 ...then they have the problem ---only kiddding!) ...I am glad to go up, even on just a 2-way with whoever the local "mentor" (or what have you) may be. It's a 2-way street, and neither direction of that street should have a problem with this. I'm ALWAYS looking for MORE faces to have some fun with and join me! ...If your DZ is "uninviting" and unfriendly, feel free to come join me ANY TIME! Blue Skies, -Grant coitus non circum - Moab Stone

I actually merely "lurked" one of Scott's classes (for the FIRST time) myself personally back at something like 650-700 jumps. Yup. Me too! Ditto. Blue Skies, -Grant coitus non circum - Moab Stone

Beautiful! ...Thank you! ...And thank you for sharing in such an "easy to read" and follow fashion!! "Link #4?... NO!" ...PERFECT!!* *(edited to add... Hey Ron, is there an "echo" in here? ...Oops, somehow I did not see your post until just AFTER mine ) Blue Skies, -Grant coitus non circum - Moab Stone

He's still YOUNGER than me. I didn't start jumping until I was 36 though. Something that I think was mentioned elsewhere, that I now regret. Although maybe relative "maturity" is what has kept me alive? ...Especially during those early "bulletproof" indestructable stages That, and the combo of relative available equipment. If I had done anything even near what I did about 9 years ago now, under what I'd probably of been jumping, instead of the "radical" PD I even had as it was ...I probably would not even be around right now. ...And I had thought (at the time) that having to learn via 5 vertabrae compression fractures & some serious time-out/"bump" in my progression road, really sucked! coitus non circum - Moab Stone

Sheeeee...it! I've gotta be in the absolute MEGA-MINORITY then for sure. I didn't even bother getting my D-license even at all, until just last season. Just never cared to. I've never had (nor wanted) either an instructional ratting, or a rating either for that matter. coitus non circum - Moab Stone

My log book is MY record of my jumps, and the way I have always looked at it (since getting my "D" ...same as you), is that I will only get sig's in it, if it is a signature I either WANT, or feel is significant. Right now, I usually only seek out the signatures of some of the extremely LOW D #'s ...simply because our opportunity there; well ...it is what it is. And/or if it is either a statistically important or otherwise "landmark jump" ...I may then actually want (and get) everyone's signature who was on the jump (note... 50-ways and under ). If that "rule" or consideration really did get "changed" long ago, then you can add me too ...to being one who would be grossly out of "compliance" then as well. ...And no, I do not intend to change that no matter what. DZO doesn't want me jumping there without some other punks A# "verifying" I jumped when I said I did or what-have-you, that's fine. I don't need to jump there & can go somewhere else too. Personally though, I've never really had any "problem" (yet ...knock on wood) travelling anywhere. I usually have "enough" signatures too I guess, "close enough" I guess to when/where I've jumped last that it has never been a problem. Right now, I look at and consider my log books too, my own personal "autograph (and memory) book." Personally, I don't need (or WANT) it cluttered with a bunch of meaningless (to me) arbitrary and unknown sigs. ...But that's just me. Usually too, I think, a reasonably seasoned DZO can "smell" anything either funny (or not) going on. Heck ...if he/she even wants to come up with me on an "introduction/orientation/check" dive ...that's fine with me. -It's all good!

I dunno. ...You tell us! Sorry, just couldn't resiste that. Blue Skies, -Grant coitus non circum - Moab Stone

Be sure 1st too that you understand this is NOT for absolutely EVERY canopy and d-bag set up! ...What I mean by that is the bridal length (especially on SOME collapsable models) from canopy top attachment point to d-bag may not be conducive/accomodating to a psycho pack. It is for sure, the "easiest" way to manage a new zero-p canopy. However, do check 1st with someone who can recognize, and would KNOW whether or not your system will appropriately accomodate doing it. Having too short of an attachment length (so that the canopy is not going in the bag symmetrically in relation to its attachment point) I have heard ...no personal experience here ...so I am open to rebuttal as well BTW... ...Can cause you problem with inconsistent openings. Bottom line is I guess, ...do check with someone as well 1st, first hand, who can help you. No matter what you decide. -Grant coitus non circum - Moab Stone

Shhhhhh.... Sparky, now quit being "disparaging" and "condescending" with your observations like that! Was that called for? coitus non circum - Moab Stone

Must be a "generational thing"... Although in theory, it might be nice to think you can somehow "manage" the severity of your injuries in this fashion somehow; during almost any malfunction scenario in live-time actual practice, I certainly would not want to try! Imagine the thought process.... I'm at 1,500ft, then 1k... working through some sort of mal... am I going to be able to ACCURATELY judge: "okay, this one is only gonna break a few bones...." PULL SILVER! Versus: "Hmmmm.... feels like a wheelchair for life kinda scenario, SHIT I don't want that" ....PULL NOTHING - - - I'm "Goin' IN"! Sorry guys, but that one seems just a bit too absurd to me to just "leave alone". I'll fall short of someone else's post I've seen in here in the past, relative to "if you go in WITHOUT at least both your handles pulled" (hint: it involves excrement being deposited upon the deceased's body) but c'mon guys.... PLEASE! Okay now, call me crotchety and condescending... -Grant coitus non circum - Moab Stone

I think that if you look at this video closely, that is precisely what this jumper did. He made, at least what looks to me like one vigorous "pump" of his brakes/toggles (which did not clear it). However, I would submit that by the time he finished that, and if you examine the video accordingly, he was already WAY TOO LOW at that point to have successfuly cut the offending line(s). Looks to me that almost immediately after his 1st reactionary attempt at correcting this (after having basically HAND DEPLOYED his reserve too I might add!) by his one vigorous pump of the breaks, he BARELY even had enough time at that point to attempt a full flare (which he also did) and "hit". Agreed though, that given sufficient altitude, cutting the "clearly identifyable" offending line would have also been an appropriate course of action. However, for this specific incident, let's say he was even by some miracle, able to be that "lightning" quick (and accurate) with his hook knife. At that low to the ground, cutting the line also most likely would have caused the canopy to "surge" as the airfoil more rigidly re-formed. I think, that at least for this incidence, and as it has played out on video for us all to see, that this jumper did exactly, and EVERYTHING he possibly could, and fully "correctly" under the circumstances. We are all very fortunate as well to have the ability to examine this further now, as we all are, accordingly. ...(What I had called earlier "armchair quarterbacking" ) ...and for which now I'll take this opportunity again to publicly apologize, if that came off to ANYBODY as in any way "antagonistic". -Grant coitus non circum - Moab Stone

You must have gotten your "link" instead to work then? ...Because I got an error report that the file was too large to pass through your server from my send, unfortunately. I too would jump with Chris (well, not tandem maybe... but...) and would be honored to, ANY TIME!

WOW, that is some kind of hellacious "hang time" you've got there dude! Obviously, I know what you meant... but I just couldn't resist! Blue Skies, -Grant coitus non circum - Moab Stone

Makes sense now, and I can more clearly envision this. I had assumed that the landing tandem may have been the very last, from the previous load ...AND was on "final". In which case wouldn't establishing the landing pattern by the "preferred" and pre-stated (supposedly "understood") S-->N pattern been more correct to do? Seeing as apparently what you are saying is that the tandem was more "in the air" ...higher in the pattern, AND that there were 2 others following, this makes perfect sense. Thank you for clearing that up for me! Blue Skies, -Grant *(edited to add: Just playing this out, where even though it may seem "obvious" to you & I, with multiple load jumpers being potentially either in the air, or in the pattern, that it is something to consider/be aware of for those of us who do not normally, or are otherwise just naturally accustomed to jumping at a multiple-turbine DZ) -Thanks Bill for expanding for me upon your reply! coitus non circum - Moab Stone

If you were landing, as you say, either 1st or second from a 16-way Bill, also then aren't what you are saying is that the tandem ...right in FRONT of you, must have been from another (previous) load? So help me out here a bit. Knowing that it is Perris' policy on "no wind days" (or loads) to be landing from south-to-north (if landing on the grass), how did the pattern get "so confused" in the 1st place? ...And, is that (or should that be) really, a "good" practice? What I mean by that is, generally, the tandems are exiting much "longer" than the fun jumpers on any given load. And I have seen this, even at (or should I say especially at) Perris; that by the time the Tandems are landing, all the OTHER previous fun jumpers are already down. So they tend to "set their OWN" patterns, as it best suits uniquely them. Wasn't (in part) then, the "mistake" (and I am not casting aspersions here ...only trying to envision and understand) in part, in Dom's chosing to spiral in front of you, then choose to follow the Tandem's pattern, INSTEAD of setting up his own (and arguably more "correct" one) for your load? Granted the latter-down canopy pilot indeed regardless, went "against the grain", but just for matters of establishing CONSISTENT protocols, shouldn't also the "load leaders" decision (in this case apparently Dom) be addressed? Do I also follow all this correctly? I'm actually going to be out there myself within the next few weeks, and if I end up being one of the canopy pilots that is "1st down" from my load on a no-wind day, I do want to be sure that I am following the correct protocols, and avoid any need for any "talking to's" myself, for sure! THANKS! -Grant coitus non circum - Moab Stone

I have sent you a "Private Message", so if you would like to check your "message" link above, I have saved the video to disk, and would be happy to provide it to you in as an e-mail attachment, if you return my "PM". -Grant coitus non circum - Moab Stone

HERO'S: - Sandy Wambach ...for taking me under her considerate tutelage when I was but a wee fledgling. - Jerry Bird ...Did my 1st successful 4-way w/me (insisted on taking me up) when I had only 30 jumps or so. I think at the time he had like 9,000 & I didn't even have the 1st clue at the time as to who he even was. He just saw me standing there & said "hey kid ...ya wanna make a jump?" Quintessential JB! And as a Mentor, one of the quickest "forgotten", and I think still to this day most UNDER APPRECIATED codgers to ever give back to this sport (and I think he did, if you ACCEPTED it from him that is, and listened): - Martin Evans There are MANY others, but I have to say as far as pivotal impressioning and "shaping" of the jumper that I am today, those 3 are who in particular stand out to me. -Grant coitus non circum - Moab Stone

Where's Ron Schott when you REALLY need him (like here)? Ying, I would hasten only to point out that there is a whole "sect" (is that a pallatable term?) with a sizeable membership of highly religious (at least from my point of view ...I am NOT a member)Christian Skydivers, quite "active" and organized called the Christian Skydivers Association. You may want to check this link out: http://hometown.aol.com/christskyd/ I would think that they would take serious issue to what you say here. As not even a member of that group, I know that I even do. I have absolutely NO DEATH WISH, and my skydiving activities therefore by definition can in NO WAY that I see, be EVER deemed as suicide, or suicidal. I think you've got a pretty skewed point of view, for sure. No one ever said that the human body should hurtle itself down a river in a white-water raft either for instance. So would you also be saying that anybody who just happened to perish doing that activity in turn also therefore just committed suicide? -Grant coitus non circum - Moab Stone

Depending on experience levels, and perspectives, some people that I know feel that KEEPING one's handles during their EP's gives them greater "control". What I mean by that is, that if they have their handles, IN THEIR HANDS, and have pulled both, and are now stowing both into their jumpsuits or what-have-you, in THEIR MINDS this has ASSURED them that they HAVE fully pulled both, and they have therefore COMPLETED their EP's. Now, conversely on students, I have oft heard it taught to PULL, CLEAR (or "strip"), AND THROW as a means to ASSURING you have FULLY PULLED. So there you have it! ...Perhaps just another "perspective" for the devil's advocate? Blue Skies, -Grant coitus non circum - Moab Stone

In all fairness though Michael, wasn't that card for, and only IF you were looking to do "Exhibition Jumps"? Or are you saying that this card was necessary as well, in order to be just a plain old "fun jumper" (at the DZ) too, in California? New Jersey, just up until fairly recently had it's hands pretty solidly in similar regulation too, FWIW as I recall. -Grant coitus non circum - Moab Stone

"Attack"? I certainly did not see it as an "attack" nor was it intended as such. I'm sorry that it has been apparently taken that way, as is clear also by your last night's PM to me that I had not yet had a chance to get back to, before you have now even further "opened this up" in here. Had I read that PM in such time (just now) to have, and I quote (as you "suggest"): "get in here and edit it, and "tone it down"... I would have been HAPPY to Jason, seeing as how you have apparently taken my statements. But you know what? Not only is that little "edit" operation no longer apparently available to me here this morning to do so ...so I CAN'T; I now, even more than ever in further consideration, and seeing your response now in here instead, completely STAND by those statements! I would suggest you re-read them, and re-think your clearly emotional, and now out-of-line visceral reaction to them. However, if the greenies do feel as well that it was an "attack", I'm sure that I will hear about that, and my post can be deleted; as my understanding is that kind of stuff is not tolerated in here, which I fully support and will abide by. But where all this IS "out here" now, and YOU are further instigating it in here, let me have (or "take" where apparently need be) the opportunity to clarify... Although you have taken somehow apparently, my post as a personal attack, I will reitterate and assure you that it was not. I do indeed SINCERELY hope (just as I stated) that if you are ever faced with the similar (or even same) situation as this jumper in the video, in REAL LIFE YOURSELF, that you CAN handle it as well as you clearly THINK (and I do believe that you believe) you can. How is that an "attack"? Sorry, but again, I MEAN those words. To NOT TO, would be an ill will upon you, which I would think could rather be interpreted instead, much more easily THAT way as an "attack". Also, to sit and post-event review a VIDEO, from the comfort of one's own home (or office, or what-have-you) IS by it's very definition, "arm chair quarterbacking"! ...So again, please point out to me where that is an "attack"? Jason, I stand by my post, and it is my observation that you need to THINK, ...realistically, and honestly with yourself, that's all. I do, again SINCERELY hope that you can. Blue Skies, -Grant *(edited to correct for some of MY clearly un-called for, and then even further "provocational" retort, which is in no case called for in here, and to anyone who may have read it in the interim; I also now, do duly, and sincerely apologize) coitus non circum - Moab Stone

(emphasis added is mine)... That one was really funny Bill, and I LOVE this one!! "Big Boat of a 135"!!! Anecdotal story in support of this: Recently, I went travelling to a DZ where poeple don't know me. I jump a canopy designed around the original ("old" ) Icarus competition team color scheme (all neon/lime-green with bby -ahem purple "ribs"). Came down and did a side-by-side swoop landing with one of the local 250-300 jump skygod swoop wonders who was under his crossfire 109. He got about 1/2 the distance I did before chowing it in. Scared the shit out of me as I was slightly above & behind most of the time (right up until the point I blew by him that is ) & I could tell with all the top-skin bucking & twitching, he was having a heck of a time at it. ...But apparently all the "locals" thought he was pretty much "the hot ticket". Later in the packing loft, one of the complete newbs came up to me & asked me what I was jumping... and FX, or maybe a VX "HP" Canopy? Nope. Was my Safire. ...189! FWIW. -Grant coitus non circum - Moab Stone

Also, ...Drive-through liquor stores? ...Do they mean a "packy-run"? NOBODY, EVER seems to "get" that one! -Grant coitus non circum - Moab Stone

Yes, that's right, from THE VIDEO and the nice snug comfy-ness of your computer-chair, your couch or wherever it is you may be SITTING! HELLO... Talk about your "arm-chair quarterbacking"! ENTIRELY DIFFERENT STORY I'M SURE, LIVE-TIME and IN THE SITUATION! I sincerely hope that if you were ever faced with the same, you would do as well. ...Or as well as you so clearly percieve from the safety of behind your computer screen that you would! coitus non circum - Moab Stone