davelepka

I'm not sure if that will help with the problem in question, but it may. Your explaination is possible, but it seems to take a deliberate effort to get the braid to 'open up' manually, so I'm not 100% sold on your idea. As far as your problem with the line backing out of the fingertrap, you could try fingertrapping the steering line first, forming a loop at the bottom, then tying an overhand knot to secure it all. It may take a bit of trial and error to come up with the length from the cats eye to the bottom of the loop because you will reduce that length by tying the knot. More important than the lenght is that the left and right are even.

Recently I've noticed that the tip of the excess streeing line, after it has been fingertrapped into the lower steering line, will work its way out of the lower, mid-line. I've seen this on both Spectra and Vectran lines. The easy fix is to pull it out an inch or so, trim the line slightly, and pull in back into the lower. The trouble is that it can happen again, and you're reducing your excess for when you need to let your lowers out. I've seen this several times recently, but don't recall seeing beyond the last year or so. Any thoughts on why or how this happens? If so, any tips on prevention?

***The control range on toggles starts pretty high. ------------------------------------------------------- My impression was the opposite. Although, I only have four or five jumps on a 107. Anyone else? Comments?

Was this the first jump on this canopy? Was this the first reserve ride on that container? Have you considered jumping the canopy in an intentional cutaway rig to see if it happens again?

Next time, keep your left hand hooked on the rear edge of the door about mid-door, and your chest off of the plane. Your right hand can be either up on the floater bar, or just above your left on the door frame It seems if you are reaching up to the floater bar with your left hand, you are having to look over your left shoulder/arm to see the tandem, which can be akward. Also, with your chest against the plane, you can only get a profile shot of the tandem. Using the grips described above will let you lean out a foot, and shoot back in at the tandem in the door. The shot looks much nicer this way. Yeah it's windy out there, but nobody ever said video was easy.

A thread on the incidents forum indicates that a Cessna crashed into Lake Lido on June 20. Is the same crash? Seems odd, two planes in the same lake in less than 3 weeks. Maybe the report is wrong. Edit: Forget it. I'm a retard.

One point you may be missing, depending on your experience with sit suits, is that they are not designed to control the fall rate like an RW suit would, they are designed to facilitate an upright position without much balance or skill on the part of the jumper. A fair comparison to RW would be more along the lines of "Why dont we strap a drouge to RW students?". The drouge would hold them belly to earth regardless of thier actions. Of course, the drouge would have them falling slower than other non-drouge belly flyers, much like the sit suit will slow the fall rate of a freeflyer to the very slow end of the freefly spectrum (another reason they are not popular). The range of fall rate that a belly flyer can use, when compared to the range of a head up freeflyer is quite small. For this reason, belly flyers are suited up from day one in an appropriate suit (baggy, tight, whatever). This allows them to be relative to other jumpers (the whole point of RW). Freeflyers can work together at a wide variety of speeds, meaning that a big guy and a little girl can be relative even if both are dressed the same, thus no suits are required. That is not to say that a freefly suit isn't helpful in freeflying, but that usually comes down the line a bit.

***I am an aggresive pilot who consistently does 270's under a Xaos27 78ft. And my teammate has the same parachute same wingloading. In the incident report, you will see under fatality that his Xaos collapseed after a straight in approach. Are certain x-braces more sensitive to side winds or collapsing at low speeds. =================================== Do you really need an answer to your question? Both of your Xaos 27's are for sale. Soon it will be someone else's problem. Nice.

***If a freefly suit is baggy enough to slow a flier down to 95, it will be very problematic for that same flier in that suit to get to 140, belly-to-earth, cheststrap showing on a passenger in a Vector harness. ===================================== If you're wearing a freefly suit, and you need to do 140, freefly. The shot looks the same if the camera flier is belly to earth, or sit/back flying, so whats the difference (except that freeflying is more fun)?

Sorry. The post has been edited for clarification.

The first time it happened to me, I just opened the main and hoped for the best. It wasn't untill after it happened that I thought of what to do, which came in handy the next time it happened. The guy suggesting you release the other toggle in freefall is acting like a person under the influence of crack. Aside from being diffucult and time consuming in frefall, there is a good chance that the two toggles will tangle with each other before you can throw the PC. With one toggle out, if you can't grab it, there's a fair chance it will tangle with something (riser, slider lines, etc) on it's own.

Left toggle = hold toggle, open main, "fly" the opning with the free toggle to keep it going straight-ish. Right toggle = Try to hold in left hand in front of your head, repeat left toggle procedure. Can't get either toggle = Toss main pilot chute well away from the loose toggle, hope for the best, be ready to turn with the canopy to avoid line twists, and be prepared to release the other toggle or cutaway. I'd rather try to open the main than depoly the reserve past a loose toggle. I have had experience with this with several canopies in the 135 to 107 range back in the bad old days of velcro and freeflying. It's not fun, but I never had to cutaway the main either. The real answer is to get a solid rig that stays shut.

***he never tracked off, just dumped And so did you aparently --------------------------------------------------- After re-reading the posts, I've got to ask how the hell you came up with that conclusion?

***Vertical seperation doesn't do a bit of good if that 1000' if burned up with a mal. ================================ If the camera flyer sees the tandem slider is down, that elimiates any high speed mals. In the case of a low speed mal (tension knots, line breaks, etc) the TM will try to fix the problem (delaying a cutaway) or deciede to cutaway, inform the student, and request that they arch again (again delaying the cutaway). During these delays, the camera flyer has fallen 1000+ ft below the tandem, and deployed, burning up another (at least) 500 ft. Thats 1500 ft of separation. Add to this the forward speed of the canopy moving the camera flyer out from under the tandem, it hardly seems is if this would be a problem. BUT Camer flyers who don't roll over and film the entire opening need to track to avoid collisions. If you cannot confim that the canopy is out and infalted, you cannot confirm that you can safely deploy. A bag lock, streamer, or other high speed mal; if combined with a quick pull and opening from a camera flyer can result in a problem. ALTHOUGH After tracking, it is essential to locate the tandem, and stay out from under them. The forward speed of your canopy can quickly cancel out your tracking by flying you back under the tandem if you are not careful. The stories in the thread about tandems sniveling past camera flyers were clearly the result of trigger happy camera flyers. You have to take a test and pass a course to be a TM. Any jackass with a camera helmet can call themselves a cameraman,

***spent too long on the second and third quarters of my 360 ================================= The comments about stopping the trun were right on. Let up on the riser, go to 1/4 brakes, and complete enough turn with a small toggle input to avoid any obstacles. If you are doing 360's, and can determine which quater of the turn was the problems, you should be able to keep up your eyes open during your turn, and monitor your situation as the turn progresses. Just becasue you start a trun one way, doesn't mean you have to finish it that way.

Canopy #1 (test canopy) is attached to the under harness. It's deployed via a static line or direct bag. When you're done with the test canopy, cut it away, and use the standard rig as normal.

Why not spend $3.00 for a step up ring, use a screw on lens, and not hit anything? Works for me.

A USPA award won't help the problem you're addressing. When was the last time you overheard an RW load organizer ask a jumper "So, do you have your Falcon Award? Have you got your quadruple Eagle Badge thingy yet?". Probably never hear dthat, but I'm sure you've heard, "Are you comfortable in that exit position? Can you back into your slot on the second point?". It's up to you to investigate into a new-to-you jumper a little more than assuming nice gear and a high jump numbers makes the flyer. Ask tough questions about abilites and skills, and design a dive around them, provided you have the skills to control the dive if the plan goes astray (meaning you can get out of the other guys way). If you cannot control a dive, and think the other guy cannot as well, maybe you need to pass, and do a solo, or locate another possible partner. I've done video for AFF jumps where the AFF I did things I would never expect a rated individual to do. Even if there was a freefly rating, and a jumper had it, you need to do several jumps with them before 'trusting' that they will perform as needed.

I did mention that doing some RW is a good idea. However, even if you can convicne the freefly wannabe's to learn RW, I doubt they would invest more than 100 or 150 jumps, which doesn't qualify you to geek tandems, or become an AFF I. As long as being an AFF I continues to be the best way to make money in freefall (tandems aren't really freefall, with the drouge and all) there will always be those who will take the time to learn to belly fly for the rating. In truth, an experienced freeflyer should be able to pick up RW much quicker than a starting from scratch AFF grad. What might take the grad 500 jumps to prep for the course (as well as qualify), a freeflyer with 500 freeflies could probably prep for the course in under 200.

***As long as you have come to the understanding that my WL had little if anything to do with this situation. Do try to keep up with the thread if you are going to reply, it would be greatly appreciated. ----------------------------------------------------- As others have pointed out, your WL does have an effect on evrerything you do under canopy. My point has always been that this situation should be an idicator to you that shit does happen under canopy, and your inexperience is a direct contributor to the amount of shit. Instead of looking back, and being glad nothing happened, why not look ahead, and do something to prevent what is most likely going to happen. Do try to keep up with reality if you are going to skydive, it would be greatly appreciated.

If I'm not mistaken, one of YOUR chosen headings for this thread is 'Decisions'. My post was outlining several bad decisions you made. The first was being that close to another canopy in the pattern. The only excuse for this is if your DZ was droping multiple turbine loads on paralel jump runs ala Wolrd freefall Conevention. Was that the case? Planning 2000 ft earlier would have had you taking steps not to converge on that langing area at the same time as other canopies, or at least only at the same time as jumpers you have flown with 100's of times before, and know their patterns and behaviors. Your next mistake was using your front risers in any way to avoid accidents. Front risers make things happen faster. Do you really think that a last minute change in plan, down in the pattern on final is the place to be speeding things up? Your brakes are ALWAYS the better choice when changing plans close to the ground. The fact that powerlines were invloved, and a freeway is another inidcator poor decision making. Don't want to land in power lines or on a freeway? DON"T FLY OVER THEM. You should have learned that in canopy control 101. Your last poor decision was selecting your WL. Your two previous errors show that you are not immune to the rookie mistakes that have injured or killed many jumpers in the last few years. Yes, your WL didn't contribute much to these incidents (and having two in one weekend should be a wake up call), but if you read my post, I stated that an overly aggressive WL will make accidents worse. Lucky for you, there was no actual accident this weekend. There's always next weekend though, keep at it.

Not to get off topic, but I will, aren't you the same guy who had his WL questioned in reference to your Spectre 150 demo (rhetorical question). These are prime examples of bad desicion making as a result of in-experience. This is how accidents happen. Not listening to others who question your WL is how accidents get worse.

***My only comment is that just because it is possible [to freefly early in your skydiving career] doesn't mean that everyone is wise to follow that progression. As you point out, it takes a lot more awareness, a lot more thought, and a good dose of caution. [sterotype to follow] Unfortunately, a sizable number of those that are anxious to get to freeflying early are those that don't follow much advice offered to them. ------------------------------------------------------- I look at it this way, there are different ways to make a first jump. Tandem is for the one timers, or those too slow or stupid to jump on thier own. Staic line is a cool way to make a solo jump, without too much effort. AFF is for those who want to learn to skydive, not just try it out. It takes more effort, thought, and dedication, but it's possible. For someone dedicated to learn how to freefly, it's like the AFF program; involved and ambitious, but with a dedicated student, possible and rewarding. I do agree however, and I echoed this in my post, that most young freeflyers, by the very nature of being a freeflyer, are not big on rules or limitations of any kind. Freeflying is like the punk rock of skydiving. Everyone wants to be the Sex Pistols right out of the gate, when it would be smarter and more productive to spend some time as Green Day.

There seem to be a few posts about this, so I thought I'd toss another one in. THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH FREEFLYING STRAIGHT OFF OF AFF. YOU NEVER HAVE TO BELLY FLY AGIN EXCEPT FOR TRACKING AND PULL TIME. There, I said it. Now to explain it. There are considerations to keep in mind if you want to go freeflying right from the start (which I'll list below). The trick is that following these considerations is essential to safety, but seem to be contrary to what the new freeflyers want to do. 1. You have to jump alone (or with a HIGHLY experienced freeflyer, as in 1000+ freefly jumps) unitl you have mastered some basic skills. If you cannot maintain a heading, you cannot maintain visual contact with other jumpers, and this is a safery risk. If you cannot effectively transition into a controlled track, you won't be able to break off. If you cannot hold a position, you won't be able to maintain a fallrate, again, thats bad. So unitl you can hold a heading, maintain a fallrate, and transition to an effective and controlled track, you need to do solos. THIS IS NOT OPTIONAL AND THERE CANNOT BE EXCEPTIONS. The problem with #1- Nobody wants to do solos all the time, and not everyone has access to a qualified coach/mentor to jump with. The idea 'Well, a no pressure two way for just the sunset load would be OK' is wrong, but the new freeflyer will do just that. This is where a hundered or so RW jumps would give some added awareness in freefall, and MAYBE make that sunset load OK. 2. You must learn to sit before HD, even on a solo. The horizontal speeds you can hit on your head if you are sliding back or forward is enough to make the exit separation meaningless. You can easily slide yourself over or under the previous or next group, and that sucks. Being able to sit (whcih means hold a heading) will allow you to ensure that you are facing perpendicular to the jump run, where you can transition to your head, hold it for 5 sec., return to the sit, 180, and do it again. Without the skills in the sit, it is impossible to regulate your movement around the sky while trying to fly on your head. Addtionally, once you have graduted to two ways in your sit, YOU NEED TO STAY OFF YOUR HEAD IN A TWO WAY UNTIL YOU CAN HOLD A HEADING, FALL RATE, AND TRACK OFF SAFELY. HD JUMPS ARE BACK TO SOLO STATUS. Problems with #2- Ego. Once graduating to the two way status, the progeression will feed the ego of the young freeflyer, encouraging them to make exceptions the rules. No matter how well a two way sit is going, if you haven't met the requirements on your head, IT'S NOT OK TO TRANSITION TO YOUR HEAD, EVEN FOR A MINUTE. RW will not really help this area too much, but again extra airtime will only improve your awareness and help your learning. 3. Once you have achieved two way status in a sit or on your head, YOU ARE A LONG WAY FROM THREE WAY STATUS. The third person will make the safety in the dive five times (at least) more difficult to maintain. You cannot keep you eye on two people at the same time, no matter how hard you try. The speeds of freeflying, and the corking that goes with them, make visual contact essential. You need to demonstrate conrtol and dicipline though many two ways before moving up to a three way. Even then, all memebers of the jump need to be at this level, and should have two ways together before. Anything beyond a three way has the same considerations. All of the jumpers need to be good at smaller ways, and have done smaller ways with each other. Problems with #3- Again, ego. Overestimating your ability, or the dangers invloved with a third jumper. 10 OR 20 TWO WAYS DOES NOT A THREE WAY JUMPER MAKE. This is getting deep into a freefly learning progression, so RW is getting further away, but more time in freefall, regardless of the body postition is always helpful. OVERALL PROBLEMS- People who want to freefly are typically young, aggressive jumpers, looking to set themselves apart from the older folks. This type of person isn't likely to follow the above guidelines with any degree of consistancy. Freefly is cool, and fast and aggressive and pretty bitchin', but it takes time to be bitchin', and much like the downsizing problem with canopies, everyones in a big fuckin' rush to be a star. Learing to freefly safely and being in a rush don't mix (unless you have buckets of money and hire a world champion for a coach). As an extension of the big rush, jumping a camera, no matter how small, has no place in a learning progression. If you are learning to freefly, do that first (as in 500 jumps) then try a camera. Camera flying is a skill in itesf, and needs to learned by iteslf, away from other learning. Also, your skills freeflying are not related to your canopy skills. Many good freeflyers are good swoopers (again the young aggressive jumpers) but freeflying skill does not mean that 400 jumps is a good time for a x-braced canopy, or any other canopy much over a 1.3 WL. Don't confuse one skill set with the other. The solid ground in the landing area may confuse your femurs with a mid-day snack. Of course you need safe gear and good altitude awareness, but that's a universal requirement for skydiving. Freeflying does require a better conatiner than RW, but if you're still jumping a non-freefly container, you need more help than I can give. So, yes, you can freefly with 20 jumps. You need to stay in your own airspace, and need to progress slowly and carefully, but you will not catch fire, or explode if you freefly with low jump numbers. There is more to think about, and factors to consider, NONE OF WHICH ARE "OPTIONAL", but it is possible. RW offers an easier intro to the world of fun jumps, and you can never have too much time in the sky, but if freeflying is your bag, progress carefully. As a side note, keep up on the RW jumps. It's embarrasing to have 500+ jumps, and not be able to dock on a ten way belly round for your buddies 1000th jump. I've seen it happen, and it aint pretty.

***A good canopy pilot wont end my life while I'm making my conservative, stick with the pattern, straight in approach. NICE