Lucky...

Im sorry i just thought it might be inline with your other beliefs Rest assured, I'm not particularly liberal. I think government should be very small, especially the federal government, and freedom as unrestrained as reasonably possible. If there's a funnier word to see misspelled, I don't know what it is. Blues, Dave HEY GET IN LINE!!!!!! Kallend, Amazon, and Andy 908 already have the right to comment on my spelling insteed of my facts. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>..........comment on my spelling insteed of my facts I'm sorry, I must have missed the factual portion of the show, what facts and citations did you present?

Im sorry i just thought it might be inline with your other beliefs Rest assured, I'm not particularly liberal. I think government should be very small, especially the federal government, and freedom as unrestrained as reasonably possible. If there's a funnier word to see misspelled, I don't know what it is. Blues, Dave Perhaps the term, "commen sence;" guess who laid that one down for us?

So to you, the deterrent value is worth executing some innocents? Our system is not perfect (like you) but it does the best it can. So someone somewhere may have been killed that was not guilty, but shit happens. I 100% believe in the DP! So someone somewhere may have been killed that was not guilty, + but shit happens. = John Deere agrees with killing innocent people. How sweet the ignorant liberals are!!!!!!!! What ever you say!!! As long as the child molesting,perversts are not close to my house! STILL DIDN'T ANSWER ME: So someone somewhere may have been killed that was not guilty, + but shit happens. = John Deere agrees with killing innocent people. How sweet the ignorant liberals are!!!!!!!! What ever you say!!! OK, so my political affiliation/ideology addresses your desire to see innocent people killed exactly how?

So to you, the deterrent value is worth executing some innocents? Our system is not perfect (like you) but it does the best it can. So someone somewhere may have been killed that was not guilty, but shit happens. I 100% believe in the DP! So someone somewhere may have been killed that was not guilty, + but shit happens. = John Deere agrees with killing innocent people. How sweet the ignorant liberals are!!!!!!!! What ever you say!!! As long as the child molesting,perversts are not close to my house! And yu think child mollestors are liberals? How about Larry Craig the staunch Idaho Republican, shitter stall cock seeking seantor? Tap a little tap for me...... Be real, I don't think there is a political demographic for pedos.

AS Ronnie Ray Gun once said.. "There you go again" I guess in your mind 90% of this country is liberal.. that must really fuck with your head man Right, 90% liberal, yet 5 of the last 7 presidential terms were served by neo-con garbage.

Yea, "someone somewhere" -- I think I see where you're coming from. Then please present some cases where inocent people where put to death. I am not questioning that it happen, but you act as if it is a regular happening. Please tell me if i am wrong. http://www.innocenceproject.org/ And here are 218 exonerations, some from death row. http://www.innocenceproject.org/know/Browse-Profiles.php As for cases where we can PROVE (to me that is an unrealistic word so I use, "support" or, "evidence"), they are nonexistent since the gov doesn't allow us to appeal case where the convicted has been executed, they call it moot. Let's see, 218 exonerations, just over 1,000 executions since 1976 Gregg V Georgia and the reinstatement of the DP, that's basically 1 in 6 errors. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>I am not questioning that it happen, but you act as if it is a regular happening. Yea, I agree, what's 1 state-sanctioned murder here or there? I mean really, you fag-loving liberals, if we get it right 5 of 6 times then suck it up. We're not perfect unlike you liberals, we kill a few innocent people here and there but we're real fucking sorry, ok, there, we apologized so it's all good...... now back to killing 1 in 6.

So to you, the deterrent value is worth executing some innocents? Our system is not perfect (like you) but it does the best it can. So someone somewhere may have been killed that was not guilty, but shit happens. I 100% believe in the DP! So someone somewhere may have been killed that was not guilty, + but shit happens. = John Deere agrees with killing innocent people.

Do you have any proof that the death penalty acts as a deterrent? I won't hold my breath ... The DP doesn't work as a deterent because: 1) It only affects the margin between life w/o parole and death, a very slim margin. 2) DP is only for 1st degree murder, requiring forthought, so we must assume that a person about to commit premeditated murder is of the frame of mind where they are weighing consequence, an unlikely thought process. The exception to this would be felony murder cases, still the same process of weighing consequence is unlikely. 3) Most people don;t need deterring for crimes of moral turpitude, others cannot be deterred no matter what.

As has been said, having criminals in for life has the advantage that at least SOME of an innocent's life could be salvaged. Chalk up one great reason to ban the DP. Do you feel that the collateral damage we tolerate today is worth continuing the DP? I do not. To all you winers out there. The DP deters ignorant criminals from following the same foot steps as the dead guy! If you dont like our laws in Texas, then PLEASE dont come Deterrence theory is nothing more than a facade to pretend that harsher punnishment works. If you don't think so, explain why the rate of recitivism is so high.

I seem to remember reading recently that, at least in most states, evidence is sealed upon completion of the execution. This dramatically reduces the odds of showing where states have executed the wrong person. I don't know if this is true or not, but I'm inclined to believe it. Blues, Dave Great point. I guess the evidence is sealed anyway, since all you can ever see are the case filings, but a judge can unseal what they have to/want to. But I’ve asked the question endlessly; why can’t a family appeal a case after execution? The SCOTUS has constantly rejected posthumous cases as being moot for obvious reasons. But the rub here is that a prosecutor can appeal a criminal case where the defendant was acquitted and cannot be retried with or w/o appeal, but for procedural reasons not the particular case outcome itself. But a person’s family or estate cannot appeal a posthumous DP case? Why? Because the gov is afraid that the people will realize we have killed innocent people? Every corrupt gov defends itself, if even by illegal means. Well, they must have heard me, because about 2 years ago the SCOTUS, for the first time, cherry-picked a posthumous DP case and reaffirmed it. Therefore, we must not execute innocent people, ever. However they did give posthumous exoneration to a case in the 50’s: a black woman was accused of killing a white man, she had a white male attorney, white male judge and an all white male jury. She was executed in short order. It would have been difficult to bring evidence and witnesses back, but they didn’t even review the case, just exonerate here which really isn’t justice and ignores the question as to whether we execute innocent people. At the end of the day, we can rest assured that the gov and all proponents that are honest realize we do kill innocent people with our perfect system and have decided that it’s a fair trade-off. Really contradictory; we’re going to kill people, innocent or guilty, to dissuade people from killing other innocent people. Most of what the US does make as much sense; virtually match the world dollar-for-dollar in military spending, yet deny most citizens true medical care.

Nope.. not trying to appease the stupid fuckers who THRIVE on thier bloodlust for the ultimate revenge... in thier minds it is at least. To me the DP is a realease from their fucked up existence. I want to prolong that existence for as long as one could ever hope for. As I said before.. if some fucknugget feels they can prey on people I want them to know that no matter how badass they think they are.. that this is ALWAYS someone more badass than themselves. In the case of rapists and pedophiles.. I dont think there is a dark enough hole that we can throw them into that truely makes up for their crimes. Letting them off easy by putting them on death row....and getting around to killing them in 20 years is stupid. Agreed...... I just don't advocate anal-rape, or any assualt in prison. What the gov allowed to happen to Dahmer was criminal, even if it was a good thing. We can't logically clean the streets while we allow/advocate crime in prison.

Clearly our government is not a "thou", since it beleives it has the right to execute. It also belived it had the right to snatch Noriega and detain people in G. Bay, Cuba, which it did not have. Perhaps that explains the hate people have for the US, invoking powers it does not have.

As far as the death penalty. I think it should only be used when there is indisputable evidence (apprehended while committing crime, confession, etc...). Thus, severely limiting the possibility of executing an innocent individual. Yea, that would be a start, but there is still that circular argument of more careful - still making errors - more careful - etc... as well as the discretion of who decides what is indisputable, not to mention the slippery slope and emotion of dangling pictures of the dead. The bottom line is that if we execute, we will make errors, so do we punish the scum or protect the few innocent. Amazing the countries that have decided their ways, the USSR quit n the 70's, we ramped things up then and call them the axis of evil..... and let's not even talk about healthcare..... how long will it take before Americans figure it out?

Read the story again - he confessed. Thus, there is no flaw in this case. The death penalty was fully justified. Where is your concern for justice for the victims? Look at those innocent faces in the attached photo. Then imagine the horror they endured being beaten, raped and strangled to death. Tell me that these two innocent little girls don't deserve this justice. And that's the strategy of the DP, dangle pictures of the dead to invoke emotion. I don't need to see pictures of dead kids to feel the pain. I voted in this poll that this POS deserved it, considering his acts and the wording of the poll, how could anyone vote he didn't? Am I gald we killed him, paving the way for innocent people to be executed? No. I never hear about the people accidentally murdered by the state being metioned by DP advocates, just victims of crimes. It really undermines your argument when you don't refer to them, just ignore as if it hasn't happened. Whereas DP opponents constantly mention both the victims of crimes and the victims of the overzealous DP system.

I'm probably more educated than you, but this is not a contest of education, nor should it become an ad mominem, it should be an argument weighing the good of the DP by ridding us of people that need to be gone versus the bad of killing innocent people. I find in the corner of the innocent.

Ok, you believe that only a few innocent people get convicted. Ok, you don't believe in the death penalty because of the few innocent people that you believe get convicted. Wait, you care that the few innocent people that you believe are convicted don't receive the death penalty but you don't care that they are raped on a daily basis? PS: I also find it interesting that you condemn others for advocating (or using) torture while advocating torture (being raped on a daily basis) yourself ... way to go! >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Ok, you believe that only a few innocent people get convicted. What's a few innocent people here or there, right? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Ok, you don't believe in the death penalty because of the few innocent people that you believe get convicted. What's a few innocent people here or there, right? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Wait, you care that the few innocent people that you believe are convicted don't receive the death penalty but you don't care that they are raped on a daily basis? PS: I also find it interesting that you condemn others for advocating (or using) torture while advocating torture (being raped on a daily basis) yourself ... way to go! I agree with you here, denouncing the DP while advocating anal rape..... truth is she is trying to appease the pro-DP guys by assuring them these monsters will be ass raped. I say we do away with DP and prison ass-raping. EVERY sociaety will have their fucked up people, we just have to deal wit it and the sadness they bring with their fucked up acts.

GO .. by all means and take the place of the innocent man who is convicted of murder for a crime he really did not commit.. and sit on Death Row for 20 years waiting to be executed for that crime. On the other hand.. I do believe this guy was guilty of the crime... I would rather him spend 60 years or so contemplating his crimes in Federal Pound Him in the ASS Prison... where he gets more meaningfull punishment on a daily basis. It's funny to watch Christians infight. SOme want to play God and decode who lives and dies, others advocate rape and sodomy in prison...... ever wonder why us secular types are turned off to Christianty?

THat's playing God, right? SHouldn't we let this God character do this, as it is alos a sin to play God, right? Also, isn't that Old Testament hate a retribution that you refer? Not New Testament.

But no address to the innocent people imprisoned or executed?

*sigh* If you would bother to read your own constitution (Article VI) you would know that this is about receiving due process under US law. If you don't want to dig it up just read kallend's post above. You may not like it, but the fact remains that any treaty entered into by the US becomes federal law overruling state laws and constitutions. I personally don't think any counsel would have changed the outcome of this case one bit but that is another matter. Ths US Const is rubber anyway. Like most laws they are selectiviely followed. Kinda the way it is and teh way it's written. That's why when I hear this flowery BS about best nation on earth, seeking truth, justice and liberty for everyone, etc I kinda puke. Not that other nations don;t do the same shit, just that we are in this denial that we do it too.

SWEET... that way we can murder inncocent people at a faster rate too!!!! NICE

Do you want all murderers to be forgiven and released from prison? Is so, I make a motion that they be sent to YOUR home town. Yea really............. hey, I have an idea...... let's lock him away for the rest of his life w/o parole. Does it have to be excution or freedom? That's a ridiculous argument. BTW, I voted that he did deserve what he got, as the poll was leading to that respect. How can any person who does what he did not deserve that? Am I glad we proliferate death at all costs; No. As for American Christianty, it stinks and is fraught with killing, startvation, oppresion, etc....

Hmmm your branch of christianity sure seems to be lacking in so many of the christlike virtues.... like foregiveness...humility....etc. What's this got to do with Christianity? Or any religion? It is about extermination of predatory murderous scum-of-the-Earth beings. AT the cost of the ocassional innocent person. Civilized nations have realized the circular argument - we'll be real careful - but we can still make errors - we'll be more careful - but we can still make errors - we'll be more careful - we can still make errors - .......... This argument has led ciivilized nations to stop this practice. Retribution on the lives of innocent people is a bad deal for civilized nations. We just quite executing juveniles - horray for us (rolls eyes)

Hmmm your branch of christianity sure seems to be lacking in so many of the christlike virtues.... like foregiveness...humility....etc. Not really, Old Testament retoribution was quite prolifice and is still referenced. Christianity is not nice.