FallingOsh

The same as those who protested Bush's expenses defending a price tage 2-3 times higher. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

No.. they stayed and overthrew the corrupt and inept right wing junta. ...and immediately started appointing their own corrupt group of geniuses... -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

Nah this is what happens when the people are happy with the person they have elected as opposed to being terribly unsure about celebrating a debacle after the appointment of a president by the Supreme Court. The complaints from the left had nothing to with public opinion of Bush. It was a crticism for wasting money. The Associated Press moved a story that asked, "With that kind of money, what could you buy?" The answer, the wire service said: "200 armored Humvees ... vaccinations and preventive health care for 22 million children ... and a down payment on the nation's deficit." -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

Because it IS a fact. They are your prisoners and Israel's actions in Gaza violate international law. Just because Hamas breaks similar laws doesn't mean that it's ok for Israel to do the same, or worse. And the only reason that Israel is allowed to break international laws with no consequences is because of us. Then who allows Hamas to break the laws? If someone, or some country, had stopped the rockets then Israel wouldn't have gone in. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

I'm specifically referring to the ongoing debate between Hawking and Penrose. I don't understand all of their theories and models, I just read what articles are written in the discussion. I find it all fascinating. My point in this isn't to call science evil or really even wrong. My point is that people 'believe' (or don't believe), for lack of a better word, even without understanding. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

What a bunch of vague rubbish and BS conclusions. I can see why you are so eager to discredit real science. You need to stay away from logic. I have no desire to discredit science. I'm just saying that it does not explain nearly as much as you think it does. Even proven theories contradict one another. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

The more you learn and dig, the more unbelievable and contradictory it gets. The which is correct, SR or quantum mechanics? -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

.16 seconds on Google. This was the first return. U.S. Center for World Mission estimated in 1997 that the percentage of humans who regard themselves as Christians rose from 33.7% in 1970 to 33.9% in 1996. 2 Its total number of adherents is growing at about 2.3% annually. This is approximately equal to the growth rate of the world's population. Islam is growing faster: about 2.9% and is thus increasing its market share. What, did you cherry pick that one...most of your cite says Christianity is in decline. This cite is a long collections at attempts to measure, but with no great degree of certainty. The cite says the % of world share for Christians is in decline meaning that other religions are on the rise. Even in the part I pasted says Islam is growing faster. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

Now that's funny, right there. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

So how do you know what to believe? Have you asked for a hint? Would you believe it if ou saw it or just write it off as coincidence? Disagreement does not equal hate. What millions of people are you referring to? Millions of people do not hate or kill each other in the name of religion. Those firing rockets into Israel are relatively few compared to the number of Muslims in the world. The majority of the Iranian public does not agree with the PM's hateful words. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but billions of people in the world are religious today. A very, very small percentage take to the extreme of killing those with whom they disagree. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

Fear of change in what? Science hasn't done anything to prove God doesn't exist. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

What on earth makes you think it's a choice? One cannot simply choose to believe that which is unbelieveable. It's a choice to believe or not. How is that confusing? We've spent the past few pages discussing how science is often just as unbelievable. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

Explain gravity. Is it the gravitron across 11 dimensions? Is it created by the curviture of space-time? How does it work in quantum mechanics? No shit, gravity exists. How you explain its existence is the part we're discussing. That's why I said it's up to you to believe he was who he said he was. If you're asking my personal beliefs; he was God's son and made up the trinity. I'm not Catholic. I don't believe the Pope is God's representative and I don't believe in confessing my sins to anyone other than God. You're right that Christians will debate the details. All Christians believe the same base. Christ was son of God and died for our sins. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

The underlying reality of science is that it changes constantly. Believing the newest theory is the correct explanation is up to you. The underlying reality of Christianity is that Jesus did exist. Believing he was who he said he was is up to you. (The usual caveat: the existence of one does not disprove the other) -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

And you won't? You give people so much shit (and rightfully so, sometimes) for blaming everything on Clinton but holding Obama accountable is just a conservative ploy? -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

So Obama is going to correct the problem of socialization? wow. that's a new one. i hope he does. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

That's an incredibly simplistic way of describing current theories. Again going back to SR and quantum mechanics, they pass tests individually but fail together. Which one is valid? Which one is invalid? It's a big ass complicated house of cards that is now moving into multiple dimensions to try and explain it. Maybe we will, maybe we won't. My point remains that science changes on a daily basis and it's cool to read about. Believing the truth of the day doesn't make it right or valid. And that brings me back to the same point that both of us seem to agree upon. The existence of science does not mean there is no God. Science is indeed a way for us to try and explain our world. The more we dig, the more we realize we don't know. Those who claim to only believe in verifiable scientific data, imo, ignore the ever changing ideas and contradictory theories. I don't think science is evil or a way to slowly rid the world of religion. I enjoy the sciences and reading theories. I just don't believe it really explains our existence or how things truly work in the universe. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

.16 seconds on Google. This was the first return. U.S. Center for World Mission estimated in 1997 that the percentage of humans who regard themselves as Christians rose from 33.7% in 1970 to 33.9% in 1996. 2 Its total number of adherents is growing at about 2.3% annually. This is approximately equal to the growth rate of the world's population. Islam is growing faster: about 2.9% and is thus increasing its market share. By unimportant you mean other's beliefs are tolerated more or a person's faith isn't as big of a player in elected officials. (I would also argue that point seeing as how much religion and faith-based values were discussed in the Presidential election.) That doesn't mean religion itself is actually less important to the population. It definitely doesn't mean there are less religious people in the country today. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

True, people tend to believe what their parents believed. If everyone slowly becomes atheist then who is teaching our kids? Not quite that easy. The issues of SR and quatum mechanics illustrate that nicely. Says who? I think it's healthy to question, research, and understand my beliefs. What proof are you seeking? You won't be sent to hell for being too intelligent. There's no sin for being smart or researching the world around us. There's nothing that says science can't exist. The punishment comes from not believing. If you choose not to believe then that's your right as a free-willed person. You're equating a thirst for knowledge with not being a believer. If you want learn everything you can then go for it. I certainly try to. Again, that has nothing to with being a believer. What kind of proof would it take? Some people do crazy ass shit in the name of religion. The key there is that it's people. A person can shoot up a hospital and claim it was because God wanted him to. That doesn't mean it was God's will. Not all Christians hate Catholics. Not all muslims hate Jews. The fanatics carrying out murderous acts in the name of religion hate each other. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

Are you sure of this? I know very few people who attend church on Sundays. Actually, the number of people engaging in religious practices is decreasing. If it weren't for the population explosion going on in certain very religious places - - it would be dropping like a rock. Contrary to what Speakers Corner would have you to believe, religion is not going away. The percentage of believers even in non-population exploding areas has been constant or increasing for decades. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

No we don't. There's theories and inferences. Get with the times. Read up on current findings. We have now been able to image other solar systems in all stages of development - including the first visual images of planets. You do not even need to go as far as the very stuffy reading of journals and annals. Just pick up Astronomy magazine, the more current edition the better because we are discovering shit at an amazing pace. 3 or 4 years ago the experts were saying we'd be visualizing exo-planets in another decade or 2. Even the experts underestimate the constantly increasing pace of change. We're probably scant years (maybe months) away from hard confirmation of atmospheres around other planets that could support life as we know it. Imagine the impact to the communal human psyche when we first confirm an Earth like planet. A place with lots of water, similar atmosphere, moderate temperatures, seasons, (and no Starbucks). I hope I get to witness it. Meanwhile we will still have people insisting WE are God's chosen children, the center of the universe, blah, blah, blah. . . . I have no problem with science. I just find it amusing that you believe whatever the current issue of Astronomy magazie tells you is the truth. What is true today wasn't true years ago and won't be true a few years from now. You call theories proof of our creation and existance. I call them theories. I call my belief in creationism the truth. My proof is that I pray for help and help arrives. You call it cooincidence. We're not going to convince each other that one way is right over the other. My claim still stands that science is not proof there is no God. The existence of God does not mean science can't explain some things. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

Are you sure of this? I know very few people who attend church on Sundays. I know very few people who scuba dive. Doesn't mean they don't exist. Several studies show that both Christian and Islam believers grow at a rate of about 2.5-3% per year. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

No we don't. There's theories and inferences. No we don't. And actually, the Bible says he created us in his image. There's no mention of creating us from dust in Genesis. That doesn't mean God doesn't exist. The first chapter of Genesis says all the creatures in the sea and air were created first. Then the land creatures. Then humans. Maybe evolution played a great role in that. Maybe it didn't. Evolution's existence is not mutally exclusive from God's existence. Science doesn't explain away God. The percentage of religious people in the world does not decrease each year, even with the advent of new theories. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

If you walked up and said, "Hi. I'm ChickenSandwich and I'd like to make a few jumps," then we'd say, "Nice to meet ya. Get on the plane." If you walked up and said, "Hi. I'm a gay man and would like you to accept me and my sexuality on this dropzone," we'd probably think you're weird for announcing your preference. My point is, like Diablo, who cares? If you want to be gay then be gay. I don't see a point in announcing it and I definitely don't see a point in getting offended when people make jokes that may pertain to your race/sex/political party/sexual orientation. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.

I don't start new threads so I figured this article would fit in here. Two well placed sources confirmed to FOX News that Israel last year made "various requests" for U.S. assistance with a planned Israeli air strike on Iran's nuclear program. Israel's plan, however, was scuttled when the United States rebuffed Israel in its request to fly through Iraqi airspace, according to a New York Times report on a covert U.S. program. The Times story, published Saturday, cites unnamed American and foreign officials in reporting that President Bush also turned away an Israeli request for bunker-busting bombs for use in its planned attack on the Iranian nuclear complex. The president then revealed to the Israelis that he already had authorized a covert U.S. effort to sabotage Iran's nuclear capabilities, the Times reports. Pretty interesting, imo. ---------------------------------------------------------- In the interest of SC partisanship, I find this last line funny. Maybe I'm just reading it wrong. "It's yet another example," said one source, "of the Bush administration morphing into the Obama administration before Obama was elected." Sounds like a fancy worded excuse for Obama carrying on Bush policy. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life.