freethefly

Gotta add this one to the "uninformed statement list". Do a search on the Origin of HIV. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

http://www.africa-union.org/root/au/conferences/past/2006/may/summit/summit.htm Every 30 seconds a child dies from malaria in Africa and 90% of the half billion malaria cases recorded annual occur in Africa. Malaria and poverty interact in a vicious circle and recent evidence shows that there is a link between malaria and HIV. For instance, malaria infection during pregnancy may increase the risk of mother-to-child transmission of HIV. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

Health-AIDS-malaria: Malaria risk linked to AIDS infection Agence France-Presse - September 21, 2000 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- PARIS, Sept 21 (AFP) - People with HIV may be twice as likely to catch malaria compared to people who do not have the AIDS virus, according to the first research to confirm a link between the two diseases. The finding is bad news for parts of southern Africa where AIDS incidence is surging and the malaria mosquito endemic, say the doctors, reporting their work in Saturday's issue of The Lancet. The researchers monitored 484 people who visited a rural clinic in Uganda from 1990 and 1998, where their temperature was taken and blood monitored for any malaria parasites and for a count of CD4 cells -- the white blood cells that are unleashed by the immune system in response to an invader. Malaria infection was found among 11.8 percent of individuals with the AIDS virus, compared with 6.3 percent among people who were HIV-negative. The risk of malaria rose exponentially as the CD4 count fell among worsening AIDS patients. The researchers were led by James Whitworth of the Uganda Virus Research Institute in Entebbe, the Ugandan capital. They call for an intensive effort to research the interaction between malaria and HIV -- how the AIDS virus' attack on the body's immune system can also lessen resistance to malaria. Knowledge of a link can also help drug designers, giving them an insight into the mechanism of immune response. In the meantime, the team says, the findings amount to an alarm call for southern Africa, where in some parts the human immunodeficiency virus (HIV) has already infected around a third of the population. There are "profound implications for public health" given that people with HIV are also found to be substantially at risk from malaria, they say. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

To bad these scumbags don't have an annual convention... "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- In Reply To -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Years of misinformation is the main culprit. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Been goose stepping with Jerry Falwell, have you? The laws of nature dictates that humans procreate therefore humans must have sex. We also find it extremely pleasurable. Not every act of copulation is meant to procreate. People like sex. Hell, how many time have you beat your meat? That is a sex act. Do you consider your self immoral? Does Falwell know about this? You know, Roid, if we went by YOUR law, we would quickly die out of existence. Not sure why you seem to hate the fact that people have sex. Can't help it if you have a hatred for women. Myself, I love women and when the time comes I'll go in armed with the information needed to make the right desicion concerning her safety and mine. Education with the right information is the only way to curb the spread. Cultures around the globe veiw sex differently from one another but the one common factor is that they all find pleasure in it. Your advise to simply keep it in your pants is far from wise. It is ignorant to suggest this as the only answers to the tribesmen in Africa or to the farming villages of India (their harsh existence dictates that they must constantly keep the baby factory open so as not to dwindle in numbers and die out. Life spans in some regions of the world is extremely short, even without AIDS) as well as to the teenagers in the classrooms of the far more advanced nations. Roid, you want wise advise? Click the link and get educated. http://www.avert.org/ The globale statistics for 2005 are posted there. Just follow the links in the menu bar. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

The humans have been having casual sex since day one on this planet and will continue to have casual sex all the way up to when the sun envelopes the earth. Nothing will change that fact. Years of misinformation is the main culprit. Africans were told by their leaders that eating potatoes will cure AIDS. They were told that having sex with virgins will cure AIDS. They were given information that actually help to spread the illness. Here in the US, teenagers (1 out 5 will have sex by the age of 15 and most will be active before the age of 20) in the mass majority of schools are not taught the importance of safe sex and the importance of using a condom. Instead, abstaining is taught. It does not work. Teens are curious about life and sex is a major part of life. To only preach a no sex syllabus has done far more damage than preaching safe sex. If the world had not dragged its feet starting 25 years ago and had preached a well rounded syllabus this epidemic may have been contained. Roid can say all he wants about keeping it in the pants. He has failed to realize that sex is a natural function within the human condition and that all the preaching of abstaining will do nothing but distract from the reality that people have sex and that it is personal responsibility and the knowledge that will curb the spread. Abstinence is great, but there is a need for education beyond just saying "no". http://www.advocatesforyouth.org/index.htm Advocates both, abstinence and safe sex. People, show this site to your teens. Give them info needed that will protect them when the time comes where they are faced with the desicion of having sex. Nothing but the facts. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- In Reply To -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I'm alive and wish to live like eachday is the last. If by chance I meet someone and she just wants sex, no strings attached, hell yes, I am taking it. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Again, who made you the morals police. 1. I am not spreading HIV 2. I will only date HIVpoz women 3. I use condoms and advocate safe sex 4. I try my best to educate people Like I said, I am still alive and plan to be alive for years to come. You live your life locked in a box. I choose to live outside the box. You say you have not touched a women since 1990, just because you do not like women does not make everyone else immoral. If by chance I meet the right woman, I'll settle down. You're implying that I am immoral and engage in "bad behavior" because I like women? Appearantly you did not fully understand what I wrote and took what I wrote out of context to embellish your opinion. You should rethink this statement. I believe I read in another post that you were a christian. If so, I highly doubt it. For some reason I envision you in a room that has been turned into a shrine for Jerry Falwell. By chance, are you a member of the Moral Majority? Would you feel the same way if a family member contracted HIV from a one night stand? I have a feeling that you would. Most likely you did not follow my link to the CDC. It is your choice to know the facts. Do what you want. Stay in your box. I am done with you. And now for something really funny!!!!! Click the attachment "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

Saw the video and, I must admit, I am SHOCKED!!! Where's the close ups! Bad video should be a crime. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

And because of this you think others should follow in your footsteps on the road of moral living? Who made you the morals police? I have been without since 02 and not by choice. No poz women that I know of in this area. I'm sure there is but they seem to be not very open. Wish they were, gurantee I'd be all over them. Sorry if that offends your sense of morality but I place pussy high on the list of things I like. The last girlfriend was also poz and yes we used protection so not to re-infect. You can place yourself in exile if that is how you wish to live. I'm alive and wish to live like eachday is the last. If by chance I meet someone and she just wants sex, no strings attached, hell yes, I am taking it. I am human and I am a man who does not live as if I am in prison and I certianly will not put myself in exile. I really have to refrain on this one. No you do not need to know the medical jargon, but you do need to know the basic facts about HIV/AIDS before you can make an intelligent statement. Click the link and educate yourself and try and see past your preconcieved misconception. http://www.cdc.gov/hiv/resources/factsheets/index.htm I post these things so that maybe people will learn from it. There is far more info available today than there was 11 years ago when I contracted HIV. At the time I have never heard of HIV. I heard of AIDS, but thought it was only gay people who got it. Knowing what I know now I see how uninformed I was. I hear people say that they could NEVER contract the virus. Hmmm, with the amount of info that is available I find such statement to be foolish. Hope you learn something. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

http://www.sundayherald.com/print56107 She sounds innocent to me. It is really sad that this has happened to all involved and it shows the extreme level of pressure that the soldiers are under. It is understandable that a unit could commit such acts out of anger for losing one of their own and after months upon months of attacks. Anyone would get fed up with it. But, it does not give an excuse for going on a rampage, if in fact that is what happened. Sadly it is looking more and more like it did. If it bears out that this is true, it only puts other troops in even greater danger as the Iraqi population turn further against the coalition and slip to the side of the insurgents. It is bad for the troops as well as the Iraqi people. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

And, I assume, you believe that the rest of us are unworthy of medical care because of "a lifestyle of bad behavior"? Your statement is beyond insensitive. It is downright ignorant beyond reproach. What?, you're not human? You have no desire? People will have sex regardless. It is only human to do so. To say "keep it in your pants" is the answer is irresponsible and does nothing to curb the advancement of a disease that, sooner or later, will, in some form, touch each and every person on this planet. Whether it is you yourself, a family member or a close friend, AIDS will creep into your life. For whatever reason anyone person wants a cure is no business of yours. You honestly believe that people with HIV/AIDS only want a cure to continue "a lifestyle of bad behavor"? That is amongst the most ignorant statements I have read. I won't write what I really think of that statement out of fear that I would be banned from posting. I often post articles concerning AIDS and AIDS prevention in the hope that at least one person will think before they have unprotected sex and do the right thing and use a condom. I am positive that there are people here who also use needles and just maybe they will think about the risk they are putting themselves in. I only wish that more information was available in the early 90's as I may not be in the position I am in now. Again, your statement is ignorant and insinsitive beyond reproach. No one is asking for pity. Who are you to determine "foolishness"? The only foolishness is people with the mindset that most people deserve AIDS as your statements imply. My impression of you is that you know absolutely nothing on the subject of AIDS/HIV and its prevention. You would do yourself a great service to read up on the subject before you give any advice on prevention, otherwise you should steer clear of the subject if you have no real input other than your ignorance on the subject. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

There is ample proof that this did (sadly) in fact happen. The were foolish enough to take pictures and video. I am not convicting them, they are convicting themselves. There are outside observers who witnessed the killings. Children have recounted the event that took place. Other soldiers have come forward. It does not look good for the triggermen and those who tried to cover it up. Of the thousands who are doing good it is the few who do wrong that keeps everything in reverse. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

The Iraqi people knew the value of not "toeing the line" under Saddam. Fuck up, pay the price. It was their law and it worked. The US had no business changing that. Bush can say all he wants about how oppressive Saddam was and it makes no sense, seeing that the US has the world largest prison population (and growing daily), the most draconian laws, a love for the death penalty, secret operations to extract private personal information on its citizens to be used against them for any reason, and the list can go on forever. In a way, living under the Federal government is far worst than under Saddams rule. At least under Saddam they knew where they stood. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

Good reason to pull out and put Saddam back in power. He may be a tyrant but at least the country was intact and the people safe. This war and its reason for being is as insane as the man who started it. And now with Iran, Saddam would had been the best allied to have. Given his hatred for Iran. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

Any soldier who purposely kills an innocent civilian should be tried and punished by the courts of the country in which the murder took place. Just by being a soldier should not give them any protection from the law. Soldier is just a word and nothing more. If these men and women kill an innocent person then they are nothing more than a murderer hiding behind the word soldier. They do a great disservice to the men and women who stand proudly in front of the word soldier and do the right thing by not commiting acts of murder. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

It is this kind of mindset that shows that we are not there for a good purpose (were we ever?) but solely to flex a muscle and to kill anyone who disagrees with the current administration. Exactly what good would killing every human within a 20 sq. mile radius do. Hell, the majority of Iraqis hate Americans already, why not just get them all onboard against the US. The US needs to start backing out of Iraq. The bloodshed would, most likely, trickle down and eventually stop in short time after the US leaves. Let them rule themselves and take care of themselves. US forces are the cause of the majority of grief in Iraq today. If they were not there, these things would not be happening. Instead of a dwindle down in troop force the government is sending more and more cases like Haditha are sure to follow. The US has damaged its reputation beyond repair. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

***Where did i mention that it was good or just to invade Iraq? Or made any claims about Bush's lies?Quote You didn't, but if the US fails to follow the rules to the letter then the US is far more guilty than those who completely ignore the rules. The US attacked Iraq, they did not attack us, nor did they in any way provoke us. By invading, killing the people and completely destroying what they had makes the US the greater evil. Nothing good has been accomplished. Nothing. I am so sick and tired of hearing people say that we need to revenge the deaths of our fallen soilders. So this is what is has become - a blood bath not to promote peace and democracy but to get revenge for a dead soilder who would not had died if not for the lies and bravado of an out of control madman, George W. Bush. Is this "war" worth killing thousands more to get revenge for a soilder who died for nothing? Is it worth the deaths of thousands of men, women and children to defend the lies and the cover ups of an administration whose sole goal is millitary rule in the middle east. It is appearant that this administration believes so. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

Iraq to probe US massacre claims The official US version differs widely from that of locals and the media Iraq will investigate allegations that US marines carried out a massacre of civilians in Haditha in November, the country's prime minister has said. Nouri Maliki told Reuters news agency there was "a limit to the acceptable excuses" for civilian casualties. The Pentagon is close to ending its own inquiries into the deaths, initially attributed to a clash with militants. Observers say the incident could deal a more serious blow to US standing than the Abu Ghraib scandal. It is not justifiable that a family is killed because someone is fighting terrorists Nouri Maliki Iraqi prime minister According to initial US military reports, 15 civilians and eight insurgents died after a bomb killed a marine in Haditha, a militant stronghold in Anbar Province. The civilians were "victims of a wrong operation", Mr Maliki said in a separate interview with the BBC. "It is not justifiable that a family is killed because someone is fighting terrorists." Speaking to Reuters, he said his government was worried by "the increase in 'mistakes'" and would ask "for answers not only about Haditha but about any operation... in which killing happened by mistake". "We will hold those who did it responsible," he added. The BBC's Justin Webb reports from Washington that enough material has now been leaked to the US media about events in Haditha to suggest to many Americans that allegations of a massacre are very serious and may well be true. 'Cold blood' US investigators are looking at both the actual events in Haditha on 19 November and an alleged cover-up by troops. Haditha has seen regular deadly attacks on US troops The military said at the time that the civilians were killed as a result of either the bomb or a gun battle which erupted afterwards, in which the militants were reportedly killed. But reports from Iraqi witnesses and in the US media allege that marines went on a rampage. According to the Wall St Journal, there is evidence that marines killed civilians, including women and children, without provocation. Several marines are likely to be charged with murder and others with attempting to cover up the incident, the newspaper said, quoting civilian and military officials close to the investigations. One of the marines in Haditha that day, Lance Cpl Roel Ryan Briones of Hanford, California, told the Los Angeles Times he had taken photos and carried bodies out of homes as part of a clean-up crew: "They ranged from little babies to adult males and females. I'll never be able to get that out of my head. I can still smell the blood." Caution plea John Murtha, a Democratic Congressman and former marine, has said he believes civilians in Haditha were murdered and the incident was covered up. "They killed innocent civilians in cold blood and that's what the report is going to tell," he said. "It is as bad as Abu Ghraib, if not worse," he told CNN television. Gen Peter Pace, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and chief military adviser to the US president, said on Monday it would be premature for him to judge the outcome of the investigations. "If the allegations as they are being portrayed in the newspapers turn out to be valid, then of course there'll be charges," he said. "We'll get to the bottom of the investigation and take the appropriate action." The more that is revealed the worst it looks. Other reports show that this is not an isolated incident and that civilians are often targets. Going into Iraq is the worst thing the US has ever done in the ENTIRE history of the US. This "war" has created even more hatred towards the US. We are NOT viewed as "liberators" but as war-mongering bullies who will stop at nothing to force others to kneel and kiss the feet of the US government. The US has shown that it is not a peace loving country but a country bent on forcing it's war loving ideology on others. Haditha and all the other deaths by the hands of the US soilders and by the hands of insurgents would not have came about if not for the misguided leadership (what leadership?) of the US. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

You have to be able to get the drugs first before this can happen. They don't give this stuff away. I had an undetectable v/l and a cd4 over 900 in 2002 untill my insurance ran out and they took away my meds. Today I have a v/l over 30,000 and a cd4 in the 300 range. Medicare pays for very little and I cannot afford to pay for treatment out of my pocket. Medications are extremely expensive and way out of reach for many who are infected. The pharmacutical corporations would rather see people die than lower the cost of meds. But hey, that's the American way, cash is king and human life takes a backseat to profits. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

These are the people who have attached the stigma to this illness and have further the spread of it by not seeing it as an illness but as a punishment from their "God". GWB's administration push "christian values" (whatever in hell those are) as the way to end the spread of HIV. "Christian values" are dangerous and irresponsible when it comes to ending a deadly threat to the worlds population. GWB has halted a good portion of funding for condoms and safe sex education and funneled that money into christian groups who do nothing at all and are not qualified to handle a threat that only education and science can halt. Christian conservatives are just as responsible for the spread of HIV (I believe even more so) than those who are actually infected as they have failed to believe in the reality that people will have sex no matter how hard they shove their bible down the throats of the worlds population. Education and science is the one and only answer to ending AIDS. The christian front has done zero to stop the spread and has only created more ignorance and hate towards those infected. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

AIDS Toll May Reach 100 Million in Africa 06/03/2006 Associated Press/AP Online JOHANNESBURG, South Africa - It began quietly, when a statistical anomaly pointed to a mysterious syndrome that attacked the immune systems of gay men in California. No one imagined 25 years ago that AIDS would become the deadliest epidemic in history. Since June 5, 1981, HIV, the virus that causes AIDS, has killed more than 25 million people, infected 40 million others and left a legacy of unspeakable loss, hardship, fear and despair. Its spread was hastened by ignorance, prejudice, denial and the freedoms of the sexual revolution. Along the way from oddity to pandemic, AIDS changed they way people live and love. Slowed but unchecked, the epidemic's relentless march has established footholds in the world's most populous countries. Advances in medicine and prevention that have made the disease manageable in the developed world haven't reach the rest. In the worst case, sub-Saharan Africa, it has been devastating. And the next 25 years of AIDS promise to be deadlier than the first. AIDS could kill 31 million people in India and 18 million in China by 2025, according to projections by U.N. population researchers. By then in Africa, where AIDS likely began and where the virus has wrought the most devastation, researchers said the toll could reach 100 million. "It is the worst and deadliest epidemic that humankind has ever experienced," Mark Stirling, the director of East and Southern Africa for UNAIDS, said in an interview. More effective medicines, better access to treatment and improved prevention in the last few years have started to lower the grim projections. But even if new infections stopped immediately, additional African deaths alone would exceed 40 million, Stirling said. "We will be grappling with AIDS for the next 10, 20, 30, 50 years," he said. Efforts to find an effective vaccine have failed dismally, so far. The International AIDS Vaccine Initiative says 30 are being tested in small-scale trials. More money and more efforts are being poured into prevention campaigns but the efforts are uneven. Success varies widely from region to region, country to country. Still, science offers some promise. In highly developed countries, cocktails of powerful antiretroviral drugs have largely altered the AIDS prognosis from certain death to a manageable chronic illness. There is great hope that current AIDS drugs might prevent high-risk people from becoming infected. One of these, tenofovir, is being tested in several countries. Plans are to test it as well with a second drug, emtricitabine or FTC. But nothing can be stated with certainty until clinical trials are complete, said Anthony Fauci, a leading AIDS researcher and infectious diseases chief at the U.S. National Institutes of Health. And then there is the risk that treatment will create a resistant strain or, as some critics claim, cause people to lower their guard and have more unprotected sex. Medicine offers less hope in the developing world where most victims are desperately poor with little or no access to the medical care needed to administer and monitor AIDS drugs. Globally, just 1 in 5 HIV patients get the drugs they need, according to a recent report by UNAIDS, the body leading the worldwide battle against the disease. Stirling said that despite the advances, the toll over the next 25 years will go far beyond the 34 million thought to have died from the Black Death in 14th century Europe or the 20 to 40 million who perished in the 1918 Spanish flu epidemic. Almost two-thirds of those infected with HIV live in sub-Saharan Africa where poverty, ignorance and negligent political leadership extended the epidemic's reach and hindered efforts to contain it. In South Africa, the president once questioned the link between HIV and AIDS and the health minister urged use of garlic and the African potato to fight AIDS, instead of effective treatments. AIDS is the leading cause of death in Africa, which has accounted for nearly half of all global AIDS deaths. The epidemic is still growing and its peak could be a decade or more away. In at least seven countries, the U.N. estimates that AIDS has reduced life expectancy to 40 years or less. In Botswana, which has the world's highest infection rate, a child born today can expect to live less than 30 years. "Particularly in southern Africa, we may have to apply a new notion, and that is of `underdeveloping' nations. These are nations which, because of the AIDS epidemic, are going backwards," Peter Piot, the director of UNAIDS, said in a speech in Washington in March. Later, at a meeting in Abuja, Nigeria, last month, Piot cited encouraging news including a sharp fall in new infections in some African countries. There also has been an eightfold increase in the number of Africans benefiting from antiretroviral treatment, he said. But, he warned, "the crisis of AIDS continues and is getting worse and any slackening of our efforts would jeopardize the hard-won gains of each and every one of us." Besides the personal suffering of the infected and their families, the epidemic already has had devastating consequences for African education systems, industry, agriculture and economies in general. The impact is magnified because AIDS weakens and kills many young adults, people in their most productive years. So many farmers and farmworkers have died of AIDS that the U.N. has invented the term "new variant famine." It means that because of AIDS, the continent will experience persistent famine for generations instead of the usual cycles of hunger tied to variable weather. Africa's misery hangs like a sword over Asia, Eastern Europe and the Caribbean. Researchers don't expect the infection rates to rival those in Africa. But Asia's population is so big that even low infection rates could easily translate into tens of millions of deaths. Although fewer than 1 percent of its people are infected, India has topped South Africa as the country with the most infections, 5.7 million to 5.5 million, according to UNAIDS. The astonishing numbers have grown from a humble beginning. Nobody knows for sure when or where, but the AIDS epidemic is thought to have begun in the primeval forests of West Africa when a virus lurking in the blood of a monkey or a chimpanzee made the leap from one species to another, infecting a hunter. Researchers have found HIV in a blood sample collected in 1959 from a man in Kinshasa, Congo. Genetic analysis of his blood suggested the HIV infection stemmed from a single virus in the late 1940s or early 1950s. For decades at least, the early human infections went unnoticed on a continent where life routinely is harsh, short and cheap. Then, on June 5, 1981, the Centers for Disease Control in Atlanta reported five young actively homosexual men in Los Angeles had a new, mysterious and as yet unnamed illness that attacked the immune system and caused a type of pneumonia. A month later, it reported an odd surge among homosexual men in the number of cases of Karposi Sarcoma, a rare cancer now linked to AIDS. In the early days of the epidemic, just the mention of AIDS elicited snickers and jokes. Few saw it as a major threat. It was the "Gay Plague," and for some, divine retribution for a lifestyle Christian fundamentalists and other conservatives consider deviant and sinful. When heterosexuals began to contract the disease through blood transfusions and other medical procedures, they were often portrayed as "innocent" victims of a disease spread by the immoral and licentious behavior of others. The initial reactions and prejudices associated with AIDS slowed the early response to the epidemic and limited the funding. Too much time, money and effort was spent on the wrong priorities, Stirling aid. "Over the last 25 years, the one real weakness was the search for the magic bullet. There is no quick and simple fix," he said. "But with the recent successes we are starting to see the end of epidemic." "There is evidence to suggest we are at the tipping point," said Stirling. The pace of change over the last couple of years suggests the number of new infections can be reduced by 50 to 60 percent by 2020 - if the momentum continues. "It is surely possible, it is doable," Stirling said. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

And the blame for these things? George W. Bush. Great job, Georgie. The death of all these people would not have come about if this administration had not invaded a country that poised no threat and then completely destroyed the country, all the while not one person responsible for 9-11 has been brought to justice. What a shame it is to live under the shadow of such a decietful government. What a shame it is that so many are placed in such difficult situations under the assumption that they are fighting terrorism. I feel sorry for the soilders who are pushed physically and mentaly to commit such acts as to blowing the brains out of children due to the stress they are under. I feel even worst for the poor people of Iraq that this administration has purposely put in the worst possible situation. Some people will never see the colossal blunders of this administration. What a shame. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

I suspect that the one who cares most is the law firm that hopes to make millions. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

Not sure about heaven, hell or reincarnation but... what happens after death ain't pretty... Date: Mon Apr 25 11:11:24 2005 Posted By: Michael Weaver, Staff, Biology/Microbiology, Merck & Co., Inc. Area of science: General Biology ID: 1114126694.Gb -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: Hello Robert. As a microbiologist I find your question fascinating, mainly because my favorite little microbes play a large part in what happens to a human body after death. Some people might find it disgusting, but if you look at it from the level of the microbes, insects, and other animals involved it is just a normal part of life. Be prepared anyway because this isn't going to be pretty. First of all let's look at what happens to the human body at the time of death and soon after. At the very moment of death the heart stops beating and the lungs stop breathing. This means that the cells in the body will no longer receive blood and oxygen. Since the blood is no longer being pumped through the body it will drain from the blood vessels at the top of the body and collect in the blood vessels on the lower part of the body. The upper part of the body will become pale and the lower part of the body will become dark. If the person is lying on their back, the front of their body and face will be very pale or even grey while their back will be much darker and look almost like it is bruised. This is called lividity or liver mortis and is one of the first things that a scientist will look at to try to determine when someone died and if they were moved after death. At this point most of the cells in the body are still not dead. While the brain cells die in the first few minutes after the heart stops, muscle cells can live for several hours and skin and bone cells can stay alive for days! How is this possible? Well, the cells use a different type of respiration than when the heart and lungs were working. While the person was alive the cells used aerobic respiration (with oxygen), but after death the cells continue to survive using what is called anaerobic respiration (without oxygen). However, one of the by-products of anaerobic respiration is lactic acid. Lactic acid eventually builds up and causes the muscles to stiffen. This is the same thing that happens to a person's legs when they run a long distance. The heart and lungs can't keep up with the demand so the leg muscles start to use anaerobic respiration. In a living person this lactic acid will eventually be cleared out by the circulatory system, but in a dead body this isn't possible so the entire body stiffens. This is called rigor mortis. Rigor mortis usually starts about 3 hours after death and lasts 36 hours. Eventually all of the cells die and the body can no longer fight of bacteria. The cells' own enzymes and the enzymes of bacteria begin to cause the body to decompose and the muscles lose their stiffness. Like liver mortis, rigor mortis is another tool that scientists can use to determine the time of death. OK. Now comes the actual process of decomposition, or breakdown and decay of the body. Decomposition can be broken down into 5 steps: 1. Initial decay 2. Putrefaction 3. Black putrefaction 4. Butyric putrefaction 5. Dry decay Let's look at each of these steps in more detail. Step 1: Initial decay Initial decay occurs from 0 to 3 days after death. Although the body appears fresh from the outside, many things are going on inside the body to contribute to the process of decomposition. The bacteria that are normally inside the intestines of a living person begin to feed on the contents of the intestine and the intestine itself. Eventually these bacteria break out into the body cavity and start to digest other organs. Since the intestine is no longer intact, the body's digestive enzymes, which were kept safely inside the intestine and stomach, leak out and spread through the body helping to break down more organs and tissues. At the same time, enzymes inside individual cells leak out and digest the cell and its connections with other cells. Let's not forget about the insects! From the moment of death flies are attracted to the smell of the decomposing body. Without the normal defenses of a living body, these flies are able to lay their eggs around wounds and other body openings (mouth, nose, eyes. etc.). Within 24 hours most of these eggs hatch and the larvae, or maggots, move into the body to feed on the dead tissue. Step 2: Putrefaction Putrefaction occurs from 4 to 10 days after death. As the bacteria are breaking down the tissues and cells they are also producing a lot of gas. These gases include hydrogen sulfide, methane, cadaverine, and putrescine. All of these gases really stink, but insects love the smell. More and more flies start to show up along with beetles and mites. The gases also cause the body to inflate forcing more fluids out of the cells and blood vessels and into the body cavity. This provides even more food for the bacteria and a nice warm living space for the maggots. Step 3: Black putrefaction This stage occurs from 10 to 20 days after death. The bloated body eventually collapses and the flesh has gotten creamy (like cottage cheese). The exposed parts of the body have turned black and the body really begins to stink. A lot of the fluids have now leaked out of the body into the soil attracting more insects and mites. These insects and mites will eventually consume most of the flesh on the body. Bacteria are still at work also, and will consume the flesh if there are no insects around. The temperature of the body also increases due to all of the insect activity. Step 4: Butyric fermentation Butyric fermentation occurs from 20 to 50 days after death. All of the remaining flesh on the body is removed during this time and the body starts to dry out. It has a "cheesy" smell caused by butyric acid. This smell attracts a bunch of new organisms to the body. Mold starts to grow on the part of the body that is touching the ground and a lot of beetles show up. Since the body is beginning to dry out maggots are no longer able to eat the tough flesh. Beetles, however, are able to chew through this tough material such as skin and ligaments. Step 5: Dry decay This stage occurs from 50 to 365 days after death. The body is now dry and decays very slowly. Tineid moths and bacteria eventually eat the person's hair, leaving nothing but bones. As long as there are no large animals around to carry them away, the bones can remain almost indefinitely. That brings us to the end of the decomposition process. Most of these steps depend a lot on the climate. Temperature and moisture and the presence of insects will affect how long this whole process takes. Decomposition will occur much faster in the summer than in the winter and also will take longer in a body that is buried than a body that is left exposed on the ground. References: ?Anderson, G.S. 2000. Minimum and maximum development rates of some forensically important Calliphoridae (Diptera). Journal of Forensic Sciences. 45: 824-832. ?Bornemissza, G.F. 1957. An analysis of arthropod succession in carrion and the effect of its decomposition on the soil fauna. Australian Journal of Zoology. 5: 1-12. ?Fuller, M.E. 1934. The insect inhabitants of carrion: a study in animal ecology. Council for Scientific and Industrial Research. Bulletin No. 82. 63 pp. ?Kamal, A.S. 1958. Comparative study of thirteen species of sarcosaprophagous Calliphoridae and Sarcophagidae (Diptera) I. Bionomics. Annals of the Entomological Society of America. 51: 261-270. ?Morovic-Budak, A. 1965. Experiences in the process of putrefaction in corpses buried in earth. Medicine, Science and the Law 5: 40-43. ?Rodriguez, WC. and Bass, WM. (1985). Decomposition of buried bodies and methods that may aid in their location. Journal of Forensic Sciences 30: 836-852. ?Spennemann, D.H.R and Franke, B. 1995. Decomposition of buried human bodies and associated death scene materials on coral atolls in the tropical Pacific. Journal of Forensic Science. 40: 356-367. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young

Skydiving is abit like russian roulette... you can win and win and win and then BANG... game over. It is impossible to know the exact date and time of when you will die (unless you're on death row and out of appeals). May has been an awfully bad month with the loss of so many of our kind. Not one "knew" they were going to die, but, I'm sure, "knew" that that jump "could" be their last and, unfortunately, was. Know each jump could be your last and take every precaution to make it not so. Know your gear, practice your EP's, stay aware, keep your head on a swivel while under canopy, be safe, have fun. "...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young