steve1

It's the 1000 jumps that's important, not the badge. Besides, it's not as if the black beret has ever been unique to the Rangers. I don't mean to beat a dead horse to death. I'll make a few more comments and then I'll shut up and get off of here. Maybe Roger's rangers did have a black beret a couple hundred years ago. But then again they were disbanded a couple hundred years ago. The point of all this is that a beret that meant something to an elite force (that was still active) was given to everyone in that same branch of the service. Why didn't some General decide to give the green beret to everyone in the army? It would have been just as stupid. Contrary to popular opinion, there are people in the world who take pride in their accomplishments and even serving in the military. No, I'm not saying that takes a fancy hat or badge or an award to be shown off to others. It doesn't matter if Rangers or Special Forces wore underware on their heads. Before long there would be people trying to copy them to look cool. I also know that when someone does accomplishes something there are tons of people willing to drag them down to build themselves up. You see this all the time in life. I've heard people say they didn't want to be on a 300 way attempt because there was too much waiting around involved. Or that it was boring etc. The truth is, they probably never would have been picked in the first place to be on that attempt. Sure Rangers and Special Forces wear a beret and patches that maybe other troops don't. That doesn't mean they wear them to show off I'm sure their are lot's of people (who may have never accomplished much of anything) who would like to explain it otherwise...Steve1

I do agree with this. There's lot's of other people in the military who I have great respect for and they aren't issued any special head gear at all. Navy Seals are a good example. I doubt if I could have ever gotten through their training. I've always looked up to people in the Marine Corps. Again they don't have any special head gear. Probably the service people I look up to most are those who have risked it all in combat. I can only imagine how hard that would be. Yes, I was Special Forces qualified, had tons of pride in the beret I wore, but I was also in the National Guard, which I didn't take much pride in at all. It was during the Vietnam Era and not many guardsmen were activated. I know lot's of people who have risked it all many times in combat. To me this stands for a lot more than any fancy hat that someone earns in training. I do remember Roberts Rangers. No, I'm not quite that old. But if I remember right, Special Forces based many of their ideas on Special Warfare on this group....Steve1

Kallend, I really question some of the facts you stated earlier. From the sounds of things everyone and their dog was issued a beret long before Special Forces and the Rangers were. You stated that airborne troops were the first in the army to be issued berets. That just isn't true. I was jump qualified in 1970. We were all giving a slit type cap that had a crest on the right front of it (of a glider and parachute). It was the same cap given to para-troops during W.W.II. That was 1970, quite a while after Special Forces and Rangers were given their berets. I see nothing wrong with airborne troops wearing the maroon colored beret. They earned it, and it's not stealing someone else's beret. As far as tankers and other folks in the army wearing berets I never saw a one during the early 70's. Things seemed to change radically in about 75. I remember walking into a P.X. back then, and I felt like I had landed in the land of Ozz. There were all these different caps representing who knows what. There was even a few who had a type of cowboy hat. I think they may have been helicopter pilots. I'm sure this was a great recruiting idea...If you sign your life away we'll give you a really cool uniform. I remember back in those days, when I was a lot younger and dumber, I almost enlisted in the Marine Corps. One reason was because they had a cooler looking fatigue hat than the army's baseball cap. The green beret and black beret are very similiar in color. The green beret is also very dark in color and both have a flash on the front. In Special Forces the flash represents the group, that soldier is assigned to. I was not ranger qualified so I guess I don't know much about their flash. Shaving a beret must be something new. I never heard of that. Nor did anyone tear the liners out that I knew. We did get them wet and shape them though, (back in the good old days). At any rate it just bothers me to see a new recruit all duded up like a green beret or ranger. And yes, I know this isn't a new change. I'm just having a hard time adapting. I don't know if I ever will..."Just get used to it!" No, berets aren't made out of kevlar. They don't need to be. Contrary to what you see on T.V., they aren't worn into combat. Maybe I am hung up on symbols. Again this is my perspective on things. Wearing a beret in the Army once meant something. Now it doesn't. I guess I shouldn't let the phonyness in some people and things bother me so much. There's plenty of it out there. This is one of the flaws of my character that I struggle with a lot....Steve1

When they say that Hornets were once cheap they weren't kidding. I got mine for right at $425.00 new from South Africa, with no import fee and about $50.00 more for freight. This was a few years ago. I sure wish I would have bought another one. It openned hard at first but the opennings have since tamed down to a snivel since I started psycho packing. I'd recommend it to anyone....Steve1

I think you may be missing the point on this, so I thought I'd add a few lines. I guess my point is that I respect people who have accomplished things in life. There's people who have worked their rear off to earn something, and it just bothers me when the standards are lowered to where everyone gets one. In the military it might be a patch or medal or even a beret. I'm not saying that the only way that some people can feel good is to show off what they have earned. This example might fit. Suppose a person spends years and years of dedication and discipline and finally earns a degree to practice medicine. I'm sure that person would look at their diploma or license hanging on the wall as a source of pride. Or even feel good when someone called them Doctor. But say for whatever reason, the standards were suddenly changed and everyone who now buys a box of Cracker Jacks can have that same diploma or license. All you have to do is spend 50 cents and open the box and now everyone will call you Doctor. This is kind of how it feels to me. Life isn't fair, but this still smells like bullshit to me....Steve1

30 years ago, in the Army, the only people that I can recall who wore a beret were Special Forces(Green berets)and Rangers (black beret, now tan). Both are elite units that take great determination and hard work to earn the right to wear their beret. Now everywhere you look everyone in the army is wearing the ranger's black beret, even new recruits. Am I the only one that has an issue with this? To me it's like seeing a 300 way patch on a 20 jump wonder....Steve1

Whoops! Here's the picture...

Here's a picture of old Dad (a few years ago). They say that pictures are worth a thousand words. This shows what a gun means to me....Steve1

Here's some more pictures of girls and guns. Warning! These are graphic pictures. I'm sure the only reason they shoot a gun is to feel powerful....Steve1

One of the bigger mistakes that I've made was selling my old P.C. and super pro harness and container. I loved that rig. Maybe part of me is still stuck in the 70's too, but then again nobody's perfect. I get a kick out of jumping old gear. I made a P.C. jump last summer. Stood it up at a boogie. Not bad for a fat old fart. It had been 25 years since I was under a para-commander and it felt great. I'd like to jump a t-10 again if I could find one that was modified. A 9-TU T-10 isn't too bad to jump if you have a good spot and a big field. I've stood up a lot of them back in the good old days. A 28' round might be okay for a water jump. My dream rig, would be an old B-12 container with shot and a half cape wells. A mark 1 P.C. or Papillion, and a belly reserve with a modified 26-coni in it. I know this probably seems like a death rig to some, but I'd have tons of fun with it. Right now about the only old gear I own is a pair of French jump boots and a motorcycle helmet....Steve1

Darkwing, I heard some people talking about this, last year, at Lost Prairie. Someone said it happened at Polson, Mt. I still remember the day it happened and hearing about it on the radio, but I don't know much. One guy said they were caught in a small canyon and that they couldn't climb out and hit a hill. Do you know any of the details? I'll bet Rozzo was glad he wasn't on board. I know of another pilot who was killed near Polson in the 60's. He went to buzz a party on the lake, caught a wing tip on the water, and died. Luckily he was alone...Steve1

My Dad used to fly co-pilot for Johnson's Flying Service during the latter 40's when he was just a kid. They flew a tri-motor in to pick up a group of smokejumpers who were returning from a fire in Idaho. The Pilot's name was "Slim". Most all of the smoke jumpers on that flight were Conscientious Objectors. These fellows refused to fight in World War II, but could escape the draft by becoming Smoke Jumpers. Everyone thought it was strange that Slim had on board some ice cold watermellon for these tired jumpers. And old Slim even seemed to be smiling as they ate it. On the flight back to Missoula they hit a lot of rough air. After all it was a hot day. It wasn't long before all the jumpers were barfing their guts out. And then he wouldn't let them deplane until they had cleaned up all the puke out of his jump ship. Slim was a nice guy, as long as you were on his side!...Steve1

I know the Mission Mountain Wood Band from Montana was killed in a twin Beech. I didn't know it was Rozzo's Beech....Steve1

I'd get another opinion. I don't know much about that condition. Is there a chance it may improve over time? Sometimes Doctors are overly careful about what could happen. I know the doctors told Dan Brodsky Chenfeld that he would never jump again because of his broken neck. He says it hurts him every day but he still jumps. Some canopies and packing methods might help slow your openings, but then again one slammer opening might be the end of you. So I suppose this is a personal decison you will have to make. It certainly isn't worth dieing over....Steve1

This is off the subject, (but what the heck). A lot of people don't like loggers, and logging. Growing up in Western Montana most everyone I knew either worked in the woods or in a saw mill. Now loggers are becoming extinct in that area. There aren't many timber sales left to be found there. Scott's post got me thinking. I'll bet most people don't have a clue how rough and tough you need to be a logger. Your up every morning around 4:00 a.m. The job is often 80 miles away, and you might be traveling on icy roads all the way there and back. When you get there you might be working up to your waist in snow all day. And it's all work. Falling timber is probably the roughest of all. And this has to be one of the most hazardous professions anywhere. I've had five good friends who were killed falling timber. Two were hit by snags. One died when the wind blew a big spruce over in Alaska. One when a tree barber-chaired and he couldn't get out of the way in time. And the last one was Jake. He was an old rodeo buddy of mine who was somehow smashed by a big tree just a couple years ago. And then there are people I've known who were severely injured or crippled for life. I could go on and on. Not many folks have what it takes to be a timber faller. You can make a lot of money as a sawyer, but there's also a lot of skill involved to the job. If you can't put a lot of wood on the ground you may go broke, because you get paid by how much you can cut in a day. You need to work fast, but yet keep yourself from getting killed. I fell timber for ten years and still felt like I was learning something new almost every day. I'd like to say that I am still rough and tough enough to still work as a faller, but I know that isn't the case. I've worked too many years now at a cushy desk job. But I still have tons of respect for those who make their living falling the big stuff....Steve1

Kelly, I think you did well. "When in doubt, whip it out!"...has always stuck in my mind. By the way, have you got your reserve repacked yet, and are you coming up this weekend? I hope to make a two dayer out of it, if the weather holds, and I don't have another flat tire...Steve1

We have Hutterite colonies in Central Montana. They are big spenders in the local stores. They aren't too hard to cater to though because they own the latest pickup trucks and farm machinery. Most everything else in their colonies is old time. Interesting people. Maybe they have the right idea. I wouldn't mind living a simpler life like they have....but then again, that might not include skydiving, drinking, swearing, and wild women so maybe I better rethink that one. At one time I used to own a Clydesdale horse. I used to order tack such as collars and harness from the Amish people back East. That was one of the few places you could order that kind of thing new....Steve1

I agree with this. What good does flag burning do? It certainly isn't convincing the opposition they are right about anything. They can burn all the flags they want in Iraq. All it is doing his hardening their foes to fight all the harder against them. If anything this flag burning is convincing Americans who are sitting on the fence who the enemy really is. The beheadings often have the same affect. It makes American Forces feel like their cause is just and correct in killing more of the insurgents. As far as what was stated earlier in another person's post about blind patriotism, I don't agree with that. Just because you are patriotic, respect our flag, and respect what our country stands for does not mean you are being a blind patriot willing to follow our government into anything. I have seen some people who might fit that mold, but they are a small part of the voters (in my opinion). Most patriotic people I know are able to think for themselves and vote for the best politician on election day. But then again following the 9/11 tragedy it seems a lot of people were thinking emotionally rather than rationally, including many of our politicians. I feel like I love my country, but distrust it's leadership....Steve1

This story might apply to this discussion. I posted it once before in the History and Trivia place, but a lot of people may not have seen it. It's a true story. I hope I am remembering it as it was told to me. Mack Bledsoe is the father of Drew Bledsoe (the famous quarterback). Anyhow this story has been told many times by Mack. He is a retired teacher who now works as an inspirational speaker. Mack worked at a High School in Washington state. One day a janitor in his school died. This janitor was respected by all who were in that school, and it was decided to have the funeral proceedings in the school gym. It was a surprise, by most, to find that the janitor was also a war hero. He never talked about this part of his life. So, at his funeral his casket was draped with an American flag, and there was an honor guard, and all the ceremony that goes along with a military type funeral. Several times the proceedings were interrupted by kids horsing around and showing disrespect for this man, the flag, and all the ceremony that went with the funeral. At first Mack was very irate with these kids. Then he got to thinking...The reason the kids might show disrespect is because they have not been taught why it is important to have respect for our flag. So, he took it upon himself to make this part of the classes he taught at school. So this is the story Mack told his students. Mack's Dad and his best friend enlisted, at a young age, in the Army Air Corps shortly after World War II started. They were natural pilots, and graduated at the top of their class. Later they were assigned to the same squadron in England and started flying missions together over Germany. One day over Germany they were attacked by multiple German fighters. A terrible dog fight insued. Mack's Dad had a fighter on his tail, but his best friend came in to help him out. As things turned out, his friend's plane was hit bad, and he had to bail out. He cleared the plane okay, but his parachute streamered out above him. The streamer pulled him upright, but wouldn't clear itself. This doomed pilot soon realized that he was falling to his death and there was nothing he could do to save himself. Mack's Dad put his plane into a dive and spiraled down as he best friend was falling toward the earth. At one time he came very close to his friend, and through the tears could see his friends face. He also noticed that he was pointing at something. He looked again and could see clearly that his friend was pointing at the American flag that was on the shoulder of his flight suit. And then his friend impacted the earth and died. For many people the American flag is a hell of a lot more than just a silly symbol....Steve1

How can you say that to bear our flag means nothing? I'm wrong then, it contemporarily represents classism, Fascism, Imperialism and a few other ideologies. It didn't always represent that, but it has represented those things for a while now. . Since when did our flag come to represent Fascism, Classism, and Imperialism. Isn't this your own twisted view of things. Sure our country is far from perfect. I don't agree with the current war either. I don't think we should have ever gone over to Iraq. But when I look at our flag I see a lot more than what a few dip stick politicians have on their plate at the moment. Can't you see anything good that our country stands for? I was brought up saying the pledge of allegence in school. I saluted the flag with pride every day while serving in the military. We still say the pledge every morning in the school I work in. To me it represents all the good that our country stands for. Call me a self-righteous "son-of-a-bitch" if you like. I just don't understand how a person can dwell and ruminate on what's wrong with our country and completely overlook all the good that is also here. I'm not condoning violence, but if some slime ball gets their teeth nocked out while burning our flag, I guess I don't have much simpathy for him. Sure it's their right to burn it, but they can also accept the risks that go along with it....Steve1

And that's why "they" do it - it pisses off guys like you. Nothing wrong with guys like you, just that you are sensitive to it and they know it - so they do it. It is wholly just a silly symbol. With that I mean the flag as well as falg burning. The flag represents 50 states and the original 13 colonies. To burn it means nothing. To bear it means nothing. I would rather spend my time trying to improve the elements that make it what it is than to try to save fabric. As for flag burning, isn't it covered by the 1st via expression? I would never own or burn a flag, but I support the right to do either or both. I'm sorry, but the American flag is not just a silly symbol to most Americans. Sure, it does piss me off when I see idiots burning it. I'm just wondering what in life would tick you off if burning our flag doesn't. How can you say that to bear our flag means nothing? Maybe I was raised differently than you, but frankly I just don't understand your perspective on this....Steve1

I'm not an ultra right-wing, or flag waving kind of guy, but I still have tons of respect for those who have fought and died for our country. To me that is what our flag represents. In my book, burning the American Flag is a really low life thing, that only a slime ball could do. I don't care when or where it's entirely wrong.....Steve1

Possums have to be one of the ugliest critters out there. I haven't been around them much. There's none here in Montana, but I have seen a lot of dead ones on the roads in Oregon. I didn't know they were such vicious little fellers. I brought some deep fried wild turkey to school yesterday for all the staff. It did look more than a little gross. The leg bones were sticking out and it sure didn't look like turkey. Everyone kept asking me, "What it it?", "What is it?" I told them it was deep fried possum that I had found out on the road last week, and that it tastes just like chicken. Everyone must have been hungry because there's little left today. Jethrow Bodene was my hero growing up....Steve1

At Lost Prairie, two summers ago, there was a guy who had two out. I can't recall what configuration they were in, but he cut his main away when he was low to the ground. Then his reserve partially collapsed. They hauled him away in an ambulance. I'm not sure how badly he was hurt....Did anyone else see this? I'd like to know more about this particular situation, and how it could have been prevented....Steve1

Mostly stupidity. We had twenty-way go a little low. Then I tracked too far after my dytter went off. Then I had a snivelly opening, and then my cypress fired. Something I won't do again....Steve1