Guru312

I can't speak for ALL flares because there are too many types and configurations but accidental ignition is almost impossible except by extreme physical pressure, fire or extreme heat, The flare system I co-invented made the WW II Very pistol obsolete for many reasons, not the least of which being compact size, portability and ease of use. Our device, with seven cartridges, fit easily into the sleeve pocket of flight coveralls. They are now referred to by the military designation: Illumination Signal Kit Mk 79 Mod 0. In the unlikely event that DB did carry flares I seriously doubt it was a Very pistol with multiple carts. I agree with 377 that he didn't use a fuzee either. If old DB was carrying a flare system, it was probably mine. No, wait, that doesn't read correctly, don't forget I am not DB Cooper. See my flare system: http://www.aicommand.com/SURVIV_7.jpg The picture is from a U. S. Navy aircrew manual. I've received some wonderful emails over the years from Viet Nam vets who were saved by using our Survival 7 flares. Unfortunately, I've received many more comments from guys who loved to shoot them off on the 4th of July or when they were drunk and just raising hell. I would love to discover that DB was using our system. Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

From the old thread: http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=3079951;search_string=signal%20flare;#3079951 Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

I suggest that you recognize that skydiving represents freedom. Skydiving also represents personal responsibility. Archaic and anti-freedom drug laws from all over the world are stripping us of our right to alter our minds in what ever way we choose...be it drugs or jumping out of an airplane. No nation, no state, no city and no other individual has the right to tell me what I can do with my own mind. Drugs and skydiving are personal choice issues. I personally choose jumping out of airplanes and doing drugs, illicit or not. Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

Pointed away from D B Cooper. Not back, just passing through when my name is mentioned. Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

My fascination is this: CQ DX ET Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

As you know, I spoke with the president of the company making the bank bags who said that they didn't have records as far back as the Cooper-era. My discussion with him was focused on the possibility of the bag/money staying contained for an extended time. He thought it possible for the bag to stay intact in water or out in the elements of nature for years. The weave/knit of the bag fabric is meant to endure rough treatment. He thought it would take a very long time for the bag to degrade to the point of allowing the money to 'escape'. Personally, I don't see why the type of bag--zippered or not, open or not--is important. Wasn't it reported by the FA that Cooper was seen tying the bag closed? Someone, Snow, Safe or Sluggo, computed bag and money volume. My thought is that ample room/material existed to fold some of the bag before wrapping/tying with suspension line. The money in the money bag is the whole reason for the effort. I think Cooper focused on tying the bag well with the line. He created a secure package capable of protecting the money for years. The bag finally split open...rotting or ripped by debris...and depositing the packets. Tying the bag with line would be the easiest part of his caper. Certainly *much* easier than tying the bag to the harness in a way to keep it secured to himself during the turbulence of exit and opening shock. If there ever was opening shock. Think Occam's Razor. You guys are making it way too complex. He secured the bag closed for long-term protection from the elements but was unable to tie it securely to the harness because doing so--supporting the bulkiness and weight of the bundle while cinching and tying knots-- would be very difficult or impossible. I doubt that anyone could tie a package to their harness/body unaided such that the bag would stay attached during exit/opening. Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

Check out the recently started "Steve Snyder" thread here in SH&T. Click on the SnyderArticle link. You'll note that Steve made his first jump in moccasins. Clearly, he was DB Cooper. He knew he could jump wearing the shoes that he did. We are all wrong thinking that the shoes he is reported to have worn was a dumb idea. Maybe Steve started ParaFlight with money he didn't bury at Tina Bar. Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

That's what we used. I spent lots of jumps trying to grab a broomstick wrapped with cloth tire tape. For many jumps we never even saw each other. We had no clue. Time was '61 or '62. I can't find my older log books! Steve and I spoke often because we both invented stuff. He helped me quite a bit. He never held it against me...at least openly to my face...for opening a competing DZ 60 miles from his. I introduced my daughter to him at the Wilmington, DE airport about two weeks before his fatal accident. I'm glad she had the chance to shake hands with one of the true pioneers of this sport. We always got together to talk about inventing at MEPA meets. A really smart--and cutting scarcastic guy. I liked him a whole bunch. Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

Wow, that's a surprise to me. I flew at Pelicanland for about 3 years. Tom was one of my favorite people. Does anyone know the facts regarding this? He was one of the more mature and sane people jumping at Pelicanland. I'm so sorry to read this...obviously many years after the fact. A great guy. Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

I never jumped a 727 but watching that vid makes me want to some day. Thanks Sky, watching that video makes my periodic checking of this out-of-control DB thread worth it. The video shows the sheer joy and fun we have jumping out of perfectly good airplanes. And how could you not love the FAs. Thanks! Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

Believe it or not, I put this thread here in the General Skydiving section of DZ.com because of what I emboldened, above. Or, more correctly, I didn't put it in The Bonfire because of what I highlighted. From my perspective, what ever makes us want to jump out of airplanes may have a genetic component which, in itself, may have a connection to habits, compulsions and dietary desires. Thanks for everyone who commented. From the statistically small response, compared to reads of the thread, I surmise that most jumpers don't use hot sauce, pepper and similar in the way that Terry and I do. I guess I see jumping out of airplanes--and parachuting in general--in a broader sense than the thread police do... I'll pay closer attention next time. Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

I had breakfast with an old jumper friend last week. Some of you on the East Coast may know him. Terry Crowe is his name but most folks know him as TC. He's been jumping since the mid 60s when he was in UDT 21. He worked for Steve Snyder at ParaFlite for years, was an AFF instructor at Cross Keys, NJ, and jumped quite a bit at Pelicanland and Chambersburg. I mention the above because of something we both did at breakfast which seems to be connected to jumping...somehow. We covered our eggs with black pepper. I mean covered to the point that they were black with black pepper granules. Terry has the habit of taking off the pepper shaker so he can get more on faster. I shake it on the normal way. He said taking the top off and pouring it on is easier and faster...and it doesn't make everyone around sneeze. We talked about the many other jumpers we knew who covered their food with pepper, hot peppers or other spices like hot sauce. All of which we do. I get extra hot peppers when I buy a sub so I can snack on the peppers alone after the sub is gone. I'm sure other people put hot on food but I've never seen anyone but other jumpers do it. I haven't done any survey but nearly all my jumper friends do the same, but maybe not to the extreme Terry and I do. How about you folks? Do you have a craving hot and spicy stuff? Have you noticed other jumpers doing it? Do any of you have similar, strange, eating habits? It must be our D4DR genes...or something similar. Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

Ahem...you haven't really lived until you've shot downwind accuracy under a 28ft 7-TU and a watermelon sticking you in the gut. After getting my I-rating and opening my own DZ I didn't have time to log all my jumps. I'm sure my numbers are 500 more than what I posted here but I can only 'account' for about 900 from logs. It isn't a matter of integrity or veracity with most old farts. it's just easier to not log jumps than have to look for a logbook, a pen and a pair of glasses. Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

Me too!! I started sport jumping in 1960 with the XVIII ABN SPC at Bragg. The Army team was jumping that hot canopy 7TU. I made a bunch of jumps on a T-slot and 5-LL. And then, finally, they let me jump what the Army team was jumping: a 7TU. My heart rate went all the way up to 100. What a great collection of gear! thanks for sharing that. The rigs brought back lots of memories. The Thunderbow being the weirdest. I have about 25 jumps on one of them. I remember it being a very strange pack job. Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

I don't but I can say this... I'm an entrepreneur. I think up ways to keep from having a real job. I've started 6-7 totally different businesses. In the mid-60s to mid-70s I was a DZO on weekends and ran other businesses during the week. I never made money as a DZO compared to the other things I've done. I was a DZO most of all because I love the jumping, the people and the skydiver attitude. [Even today, I have difficulty really relating to a none jumper.] But being a DZO is VERY hard work. If you have partners and investment capital--which I didn't--the burdens can be shared. My point: you have to love skydiving and you have to love operating a business. When everyone has gone home you need to deal with the cash, the deposits, the orders, the returns, the hassles. It is a very big challenge and damned frustrating being a DZO. Look at my jump numbers. I should have 3-4000+ jumps instead of less than a 1000. I instructed, packed, jumpmastered, flew, raked the peas and carried out the trash. If you aren't ready to do everything, pick a discipline within the sport and get good at that. Unfortunately, being the guy who is responsible for everything happening has to not do a lot of things...like drink too much beer or chase too much skirt. If you aren't ready to do anything and everything...like one responder who told of the toilet experience...you don't want to be a DZO. The one thing I enjoyed more than being a DZO was being a jump pilot. I had all the benefits of the people and the atmosphere of a DZ without any of the hassle. SkyDiverDriver is the ultimate job on the DZ. IMHO. Bottom line: I'll take flying jumpers over any company I've owned...and being a DZO as second. Matter of fact, I'd almost do it just to make expenses only...I loved the life that much. I'd say figure out how to do it...and go for it! Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

For a number of reasons I haven't jumped in over 20 years. My 16 year old daughter, Rebecca, can't wait to jump so my plan is to get current so I can jump when she does. In anticipation of us jumping I took her to a DZ about an hour from us to look around. The thing that surprised the me most about the sport today is how many people pay other people to pack their parachute. Back in "my day" the only person who packed another's rig was a rigger who packed the reserves. [I have to admit I packed my own reserve a dozen or so times before getting a rigger's ticket.] EVERYONE packed their own rigs when I started. Matter of fact, passing a packing test was a prerequisite for making the first jump. Today, it seems to my old-school brain, the yuppies have taken the "purpose" out of the sport. I always used skydiving as a metaphor for life: We have to pack our own parachute; we have to be totally responsible for ourselves and our actions. Not anymore, it seems. It's something else. I haven't hung around the "new" DZ often enough "to get" what's going on today. What ever it is on the DZ seems to be pervading society in general: No personal responsibility; blame the other guy; get him to bail me out...of what ever. The other thing I couldn't get my mind around is the number of tandem jumps being made. WAY more tandems than FJC jumps. WTF is that all about??!! The sport no longer exemplifies my existential "putting your own life in your own hands" perspective. I must really be getting old. It sure ain't like back in my day. Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

Although I made a vow to my self to no longer contribute to this way-off topic thread, I feel compelled to comment because it may shed some light on the whole "negative proof" mess. Particularly compelled because of my good and righteous screen name being used here. The nerve of you, Sluggo, so slyly getting me to comment. I understand Sluggo's "proving a negative" concept, and I agree with the near impossibility of doing so. But... given the contentious nature of the debate I doubt some of you would accept ANY proof... negative or a positive. I think there is one circumstance where a negative can be proven. Suppose I posted a copy of a sworn and certified affidavit which says: "I, Guru312, am the notorious hijacker known as D B Cooper." Would that be enough proof that I WAS DB? Would I be tried and convicted of the crime based on my affidavit and my of admission guilt? I doubt it. Would Jo be willing to accept my admission of guilt...and that Duane wasn't DB? I doubt it. Suppose I posted a copy of a sworn and certified affidavit which says: "I, Guru312, was not the notorious hijacker known as D B Cooper." Would that be enough proof that I WAS NOT DB? I doubt it. In other words, what kind of proof will be enough for everyone? There could be enough proof to prove a negative: If a body is found, in a harness with a reserve tied to the harness containing a few "DB Dollars" in the reserve, then we can say something about who wasn't DB. Finding a body tells us only that I wasn't DB, Jo's Duane wasn't and all the rest who post here were not DB.[This is assuming that Duane died under the circumstances that Jo has outlined here.] So, to me, finding a body with DB Dollars and a rig with the appropriate serial number, is the only way to prove that negative. That is: Guru312 wasn't DB and Duane wasn't DB. Now, stop taking my name in vain so I can go back to thinking about that dark and stormy night in November. I have an anniversary fast approaching. Plus, my daughter's birthday is coming up and I want to buy a new car for her...sort of like a birthday gift with a grinning smiley face surrounded by parachutes. Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

Your peas are nothing like South Jersey peas. I don't know what that stuff is in your pit but it doesn't look like a pea gravel nor does it look like anything that would be moved easily by an outstretched toe, foot and leg. It looks very "packable" and not fun to land in. Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

The DZ I owned was in Southern New Jersey which is famous for sand and gravel. When I started the DZ I wanted to have a pea gravel pit. I went to a friend who was an engineer at one of the local sand/gravel companies. When I explained the purpose of the pit he suggested a design with a much deeper middle section than out toward the edges. He suggested a size of gravel which was smaller and rounder than any of the pits I had jumped into during MEPA meets. The size and shape was different than any pea gravel pit on the East coast. Another thing he recommended was mentioned up-thread and that was "double washed" gravel which made it very clean. The trouble with the design was walking in the gravel was almost impossible: you'd sink in over your ankles. It was a great landing area for doing downwind accuracy on a 28' cheapo or a PC. When we hosted MEPA meets the judges were worn out after a day in my pit. They'd continually complain, but the accuracy freaks totally loved it. Lots of people came to my DZ to practice accuracy because the more rounded and slightly smaller stones were more forgiving. Added after reading: The biggest problem with our pit was it had to be raked much more often because the peas were so "fluid". Actually, the raking got to be a bit of a pain in the ass it had to be done so often. Those were the days... Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

Me too. He was one of my favorite people; I always searched for Joe at Herd Boogies or at meets... WAY back when people jumped out of airplanes with the purpose of putting their foot on a disc at the center of a pit full of pebbles. I can't remember Joe doing accuracy, tho, actually now that I think of it. I can't pull the other guys name from my memory. I know him but can't put a name with his face. Who is that? Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

Jeesh, guys, how many times do I have to tell you? I am not D B Cooper. I may have been at one time but I am not now. Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

In the late '60s when I was a DZO, I had an 'older' guy approach me and ask, "I've made a few jumps what do I need to do to jump here? I asked if he had a log book. He told me he did and that he was on 10 second delays. He said he had a bunch of static line jumps but didn't have a logbook for them. I told him to get his log book to show me and put on his jump coveralls. When he came over to me with his log book and dressed in some coveralls I looked him over and saw an 82nd Airborne patch on his shoulder and cloth military wings sewn onto the left front. I did a double take when I looked at the wings: there were four combat stars on the wings. I told him that I had been in the 82nd but I was curious where he bought the jump wings. He got an attitude very fast! I countered with something like, "...I'm not a fool. There can't be too many guys with four combat jumps. Are you saying you actually made four combat jumps?" He rattled off Normandy, Salerno, Nijmegen and Algeria and then said, "There aren't very many of us left." At that point, I believed him. We spent many hours over many beers listening to him tell jump stories and combat stories. He wouldn't talk about any of it until he had a few beers. We became very good friends. I taught two of his sons to jump. And, unfortunately, attended his funeral after he died of cancer. What an amazing guy he was. I'm talking about Walt Santman for those of you on the East coast and maybe jumped at United PC. Walt was one of the finest people I've ever known. RIP. Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

That kind of comment is the reason I hang around here. It reminds me of all the sick minds I jumped with over the years. Thanks for that. I remember trying a baton pass a few dozen times. We almost never saw each other in freefall let alone passing a piece of broom handle to another person. I thought it was a pretty big deal when we finally did it. Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

Jim, It never ceases to amaze me how you sum things up so succinctly and with humor. Usually, you can do it in a few words; here, you did it in a few sentences. Reading Jo's comments were usually difficult, often scattered and wandering, but her passion and drive was always there. Her passion to answer the question why her ex-husband claimed he was DB is refreshing...even if she is more than a bit grating sometimes. She's dedicated and passionate. Don't we all have that for the skydiving that we love? She had the unlucky fortune of being thrown into a bunch of the most egotistical, monomaniacal people on the planet: skydivers. From dinosauer skygods to fifty jump wonders she took lots and lots of nasty personal hits. I agree with Jim: We should all be so lucky that we have her passion for a cause--other than jumping out of a perfectly good airplane!--when we get to be her age. I mean, when *you-all* get to be her age, I'm already older than she is. Guru312 I am not DB Cooper

I went through jump school at Bragg in March of 1960. I can't remember what I jumped from in school but I know I had a half dozen or more C-119 jumps. A very fun plane to jump. Some guys were lucky to make tailgate jumps from the C-119 with the clam shell doors off. That would have been fun. We also jumped C-123 and C-130 aircraft. I was lucky to be in during an aircraft transition time. I had to wait until civilian jumping to jump a C-47 but then it was a DC-3. People ask me that question all the time. The only good thing about getting old is that my stories keep getting better with each telling. Guru312 I am not DB Cooper