Ron

Then what the hell was this?: Ya kinda did. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Nope....just answering your question. The point is that people still don't listen. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

One day I don't have to pay to cover the partner..The next I do. Thats how I would have to treat them differently. Its just an issue that should be looked at. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Oh like that would happen. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Uh...you kinda DID. I don't take it personal...Its an issue you feel strongly about and I have the luxury to not be effected by it. No, Im making assumtions based off of what my gay friends and I talk about. I try not to listen to media or preachers. Yep, just like my sister had a kid without being married...Im not stupid, I know how kids are made. And I'll be honest Im not sure how I feel about gay couples and kids...I have said I think it would be better than the kids being in "homes"....But I do have issues with it. Understandable. I have the ability to look at it without the strong emotion. And like I said Im not sure. Is that fair for me to say, or do I have to agree with you? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Most companies offer health coverage to married couples. Right now they don't have to do that for Gay couples. If gay couples have the same rights, and Im a "Man of God" and think that Homosexuality is wrong...Then by Law I could. 1. Get rid of all dependent health coverage. 2. Cover gay partners. So it would effect me and any employees I have. And you never answered my questions about roommates or ex lovers that just live together now...Are they entitled to the same rights? Right now its not an issue is it...? If it passes then it is. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I would have to pay more to cover the "Partner". Most companies pay a larger portion than the Employee. That would effect employers. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I still think Marriage is about religion....Some of the benefits can be given without it being called marriage. So has Kerry. Will you admit Kerry does the same thing...Here is a hint..they are both in politics...They ALL lie. If I thought that I DID attach the links then its not a lie. You missed part of the second grade. If I say the rig is good to go and I think it is...Its not a lie. It's only a LIE if I KNEW it was not ready. I still have not seen you PROVE it. BTW that was so funny I had to cut and paste the whole thing.... I tell ya what get me PROOF he lied and he KNEW there were NO WMD's in Iraq....And I'll agree and even help to impeach him. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

You are the master of spin. You say Bush lied aboiut IRAQ...But you can't PROVE it. John you are getting pretty sad being all emotional. I expect FACTS form you. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I don't have first hand exp...but I do have gay friends. So you know how to BE gay...big deal I know about the issues just like anyone else. I don't have to suck dick to understand the issues. Drop the emotional side of it. Ok my post was that they can't fuck and have kids. You got all bent out of shape about it...Its a FACT. I assume you mean ARE NOT. And all I have to say about that is DUH! Its a free country, and I'll talk about it as much as I like. And when it comes time to VOTE on it...I'll speak up again. I don't have an issue with gay people. Its people like you that make it so people do have issues. Militant Gays in peoples faces demanding rights. You will have equal rights....Its goning to take time..jumping in my face and telling me to "button it" is not going to speed it up one little bit. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I own a small company. I have a gay female working for me...Her partner then would have to be covered under my insurance...That will cost me more money. The cost of health insurance is rising quickly...Some companies are having to drop having coverage cause its so expensive. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Any Kerry changes his mind on how he thinks as soon as the wind shifts. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

OK..Bob and Steve can't go fuck each other and have a kid from it. Sally and Suzie can't either. If Bob and Sally fuck..Guess what? It's not being gay now is it? In case you need some help HOMO sexual means SAME. So two guys can't fuck and create a kid. Questions? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Yes and no. If they permit gays to be "Married" for lack of a better word. Then that means that I HAVE to treat them as a normal couple. And that would be making me do things for them that my religious beliefs (If I had any) say is wrong to allow. So when do you cut it off? What about friends that live together but never dated? Should they get the same breaks? Should I have to put them on my health insurance rider? What about just roommates? If you and I shared a house could we claim a deduction on taxes? Marriage was started as the union under God. Then there came financial benefits to it given by the government. I personally think the right thing to do is remove the benefits given under law...But then that pushes many folks out without healthcare. So its a hard call. I don't think they should be allowed to be married...Not because I think its wrong (thats a religious issue), but because it pushes other issues up (Economic issues). If I could make it so Gay couples could just claim the Tax break that would be ok with me. Allow them to collect SS and such, ok with me. But to make companies put "partners" on health plans in my opinion is wrong. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Refills of WHAT? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Well...It worked. now Congress can work it out. And you know how good they do things Are they entitled to the same rights? I don't know. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I mean they would have to adopt as in they can't have sex and pop out a kid. And Im not sure they should be allowed to adopt anyway. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Well it is actually DEFINING a word..And I think it is over kill. But who else is gonna do it? And how else can they do it? Are the other options exhausted? It seems with some States saying it s OK, that it needed to be brought up, and settled once and for now....Like how I said that??? Chances are it will change anyway. But just cause it will change does not mean we should not deal with it now. While I might think its over kill...Something needed to be done. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I don't know. I'm not sure how I feel with them adopting either. I don't think being gay is normal...And I don't want a child to grow up thinking it is. However, I would rather have a child in a caring couples care than foster care. I think Homosexuality is wrong...But I also don't think its the goverments business. So you have to ask. Is marriage a religion issue, or politics? I think in the case of religion then the churches should make that call. As for politics, then the government should make that call. I lean to religion on this one. So I would have to say Gays can't marry. Now if the government wants to have some legal agreement LIKE marrage its more complicated. Do they get the same rights as a "normal" relationship? Tax breaks? Allowed to be included in health plans? Considered in death benefits? Allowed to adopt? To be honest I'm leaning to allowing gay unions (And silly you thought I was right wing). But not calling it a marriage...Since marriage is in the scope of religion. Issues with allowing gay unions. If they wanted kids they would HAVE to adopt...That takes kids out of foster situations, and in some cases out of my pocket. And thats good.... You would have to deal with the whole "gay is normal" thing...Which I don't think it is. But homosexuality is not going away. They could add each other to health care...And thats a big issue these days...So it could be good there. However, then you would jump into companies rights...Lets say I have a very religious company...Now you could come along and tell me I HAD to support gay unions? Thats infringing on my rights. I support gay people to do as they please. However they should not MAKE me do anything. Just like I don't think I should have to be MADE to do shit for a black guy, or a female. Affirmitive action is a load of crap. Be the best qualified canidate, and you should get the job. So the first thing you have to do is decide WHY they want to get married...If its just to get the tax breaks...Then its the goverments right to say.... If its to have a union under god...Its the churches. Sorry for the ramble...But its not an easy issue if you get away from the emotions. Edit to ADD....Im not gay so Happythoughts stop calling me "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Come on...Be honest it was funny right? I was proud of it...I'd hate to think I was off. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

You don't have to be married to have kids. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Hey, I was just talking politics. I was even on good behavior (for me). Sorry if you took me asking young Benny about his value meals seemed out of line. I just wanted to point out how its easy to think you have more info..But in truth I'd trust the guy with the hookups to have better knowledge than the press. And come on..The Value meal thing was funny. Just to put this thread back on track, and off of Bush.. Kerry is a twit. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

You don't see many ads for the Ford Escort... You see tons for the Mustang. Sex and High perfomance sells. (High performance sex even more so) You don't see adds with an ugly person jumping into a Honda Civic. You see a hottie jumping into a Corvette. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

And they still can. The states can still create legal bindings for same sex couples if they like. He is proposing that it can't be called a "marrage" The proposal is defining a word...I think its stupid, but then again most of the nation does not think gays should be allowed to be "Married". BTW Kerry opposes gay marrage as well. http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/11/19/elec04.prez.dems.gay.marriage/ And thats the same thing Bush is saying. Ya got me..I guess we should just pack up and leave IRAQ like it is..Of course then we will have to go back in a few years. Oh, but we DID fight and win a war. On this all you have shown is he THOUGHT there were WMD's...You still have shown no PROOF he KNEW there were none. But that doe snot keep you from lying and saying he lied. Has he lied? Yep I am sure he has. Did he lie about WMD's in IRAQ..You can't prove he did. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Doable? Yes. Smart? No. It just takes a minor mistake to make it fatal. And there are plenty of body bags filled with guys that thought they could handle it. No one thinks they will screw up and get killed. Everyone thinks they can handle the situation. If everyone can handle the sistuation...Then why do so many folks die? OK, but it takes only ONE tiny mistake to kill you. I find it very hard to believe that someone with 100 jumps has gotten enough experience to be able to say that he knows what he needs to know. Its only 100 jumps..that means 100 landings. No amount of instruction can replace experience. If it could then Chris could sit and talk with me for a few hours and I would get my Multi Engine Rating from the FAA. While I CAN learn on the ground..I have to DO IT to really learn it. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334