olemisscub

What's fascinating to me is that if they DID get the DZ wrong (let's say it was between BG and BP), how many potential leads and stories have we missed out on? What tips and information might have been revealed if agents were canvassing homes in the Battle Ground area instead of La Center? Imagine a scenario where a gas station clerk in Orchards allowed an oddly acting man to use the phone that night, but opted against reporting it because the FBI’s focus was on an area ten miles away. Stuff like that. Interesting to speculate what we may have missed.

Attacking the flight path is absolutely ludicrous given the evidence, but there is some wiggle room on the DZ regarding the whole oscillations vs. pressure bump issue/possible conflation, etc. Some of us interpret the same data you have differently and that shouldn't be a problem. Orchards is as far south as I'm comfortable placing his jump and I believe the farthest south you are willing to go is Battle Ground (don't let me misquote you there), and that's ok to disagree. None of us here are mouth breathers and we have all reached certain conclusions based on our independent research and interpretations of the evidence that exists. It goes back to the agenda discussion. I have no agenda whatsoever regarding Cooper's DZ. If the way I interpreted the data led me to the conclusion that he jumped over La Center or whether it led me to believe he jumped over Orchards, then so what? Why would I care? Why should anyone have a motive regarding his DZ? This is why I've never really understood why people have so vehemently argued about his DZ. It's not something that will help us find Cooper. It's merely intellectual case knowledge. It's arguing for the sake of arguing. We'll never know precisely when he left the aircraft so it has never struck me as something worth fighting over. If I reached the conclusion that he jumped over Brush Prairie and you say he jumped over La Center, so be it. What does it matter, ya know? Arguing flight path is a different issue. Promoting an alternative flight path DOES have consequences. I wish that Eric had placed the same effort with the media that he just displayed about Tena Bar and WFP along the actual flight path. I'm guessing 99.9% of Clark County residents who know anything about Cooper think he jumped near Ariel, which is understandable. Now, if they see Eric on TV talking about Cooper landing near TB, they may be convinced that Cooper jumped over in that area. If people living in Vancouver up to Battle Ground knew that Cooper actually jumped in their neck of the woods, then who knows, maybe someone would be motivated to go hiking through the woods of their backyard and just happen to find something. Eric does an excellent job of keeping the story alive with the media. That exposure is very beneficial for the case because as long as it's still in the public eye then someone might happen to remember something about a great uncle, etc., and come forward. Placing so much focus on Tena Bar doesn't help, sadly.

A pharmacy? Little too big for that, no? Tina said it was the size of a department store bag for a shirt.

Sent Detlor the 302 of the Heisson store and he says he has no memory of that. Bummer.

I've always found it interesting that Cooper wasn't noted smoking after they landed. Maybe he lit up once Tina was in the cockpit, but he seemingly goes a couple of hours without smoking between approx. 5:45 and approx. 7:45 fun trivia: Mac kept having to bum cigarettes from his hostage passengers throughout his hijacking.

Again, I'm with you. The survival rations angle certainly fits a man in his situation at that moment.

I agree. Paper certainly not. Rubber bands likely not.

One of my dumb theories is that Cooper hitchhiked with someone, much like McCoy did. Whenever he got to his location, Cooper, already showing that he could be generous with money (Tina), tossed the guy a bundle or left it in the car for him. Guy drives off and is thoroughly confused. At some point he hears about the hijacking on the radio and panics, since he is now an accessory to a capital crime, and tosses the money into the brush as he's driving near Caterpillar Island. It sits in the brush until the 72 flood pushes it a mile or so north and deposits it on TB.

I'm with you on this. Although I'm not sure if he was hustling as much as we think. He had no idea of knowing that the pressure bump would betray him. He may have been thinking that there was no possible way they'd know where he jumped, so maybe he didn't rush. However, it's still natural instinct to just get the hell out of Dodge as soon as you can. I don't believe Heisson was Cooper, but it would still be nice to have confirmation that it WASN'T Cooper.

I’ll email Detlor about it. Maybe he remembers.

Another from Broer. This one from 1965. I like the dude with the briefcase staring out the window. Cool visual.

Courtesy of Chris Broer. Gate L42 in Dec 71. Coop was L54

Coffelt:Rackstraw Vault: Cooper TV documentaries

There is a 9 year gap in the chain of custody with the TB money. I don’t think Cooper’s DZ within the accepted flight path makes a difference unless it puts him over the Columbia, which it cannot.

Cinnamon Toast Crunch

Speak for yourself. I could give a shit where Cooper jumped. It makes no difference to me. I have no agenda when I discuss flight path or DZ. These topics really don’t interest me, so my conclusions are based solely on how I interpret the evidence.

So what is my angle here? Do I have a DZ agenda?

And you claiming that they were already trying to reverse engineer time data to precisely determine the DZ while sitting at the Reno Airport sounds far more improbable than what seems quite obvious to the rest of us, which is that Rat was asked about approximately WHERE all of this happened that he was just talking about. Do you honestly believe that Campbell wouldn’t have asked where they were when the pressure bump occurred? Of course he did. And that’s the answer. If it was saying what you think it says then it would have been attached to the previous paragraph.

Rat said the 25 miles N of Portland stuff much later. At the time that he was talking to Campbell he was speaking generally. As I said, in the grand scheme of 3 1/2 hours flying time from Seattle to Reno, all of Clark County could be considered "suburbs of Portland". From their perspective they were only a few minutes north of Portland proper i.e. "suburbs" or "immediate vicinity". I think that term is too vague to make much of it since it's relative to being in a jet airliner. If you were in a car you wouldn't call La Center a suburb of Portland but from 10,000 feet up traveling 200mph, it's a bit different.

Again, agree to disagree I guess. It just seems like in the grand scheme of that interview that Rataczak is talking about WHEN the bump occurred (note that he gives no location data in that paragraph) and so then Campbell goes "Ok, so WHERE were you when this occurred?" The paragraph breaks matter.

I am intellectually able to read it both ways. I can read it as that paragraph being about Cooper's jump and I can read it as if it was about the Soderlind call. I see what you're suggesting, but I don't feel it passes muster. Grammatically it's very wonky and the grammar is why I tend to think it's about Cooper's jump, among other reasons. If it was about the Soderlind call then they should have just put it at the end of that paragraph instead of starting a new paragraph. Additionally, Rataczak wouldn't need to give a general statement about their location with regard to the call time because he just got done saying "the exact time will be in the company log." So it's unnecessary for him to speak about where they were when they made the call to Soderlind since he just stated that it will have a known timestamp. With respect, I don't think you're "reading the room" accurately when it comes to that interview and what info Campbell was trying to obtain. Why would Campbell care where they were when they made the call to Soderlind when he just found out that it was timestamped? Much more reasonable to assume that he asked a new question: "do you remember where you were when this bump occurred?" Can you really see him asking "do you remember where you were when you made the call to your company office?" I mean, that would be sorta burying the lede, no? Campbell would not have been interested in trying to do some calculation to figure out his precise jump location at that point, but trying to figure out the rough location of the jump. With these 302's being transcriptions of handwritten notes, that paragraph break signifies a new thought or a new question. Paragraph breaks exist for a reason. If Rat had still been describing the call to Soderlind then it would have been part of the previous paragraph. Instead, I think it's very, very reasonable to assume that Campbell asked them where they were when the bump occurred. I just think you may be overthinking this one. I honesty don't think that paragraph tells us too much anyways. In the grand scheme of a 3 and a half hour flight from Seattle to Reno, I think the entirety of Clark County could be construed to mean "suburbs or immediate vicinity thereof" of Portland.

FOIA's are very tricky and require precise wording to get what you need. It's not uncommon to file 3 or 4 FOIA's before getting the exact wording right. Also, if you think the FBI is stonewalling you or anyone else about the freaking ATC radio transcripts, then I'd recommend taking a deep breath and coming back to reality because that is simply bananas. Again, what are you expecting to find? A quote from Rataczak saying "Heads up folks, we're about to drunk drive off V-23 and do our own thing for a little while."

Just in case you were wondering where he stands on the WFP, he posted this last week.

Lol I’m not upset in the least. I’m just amused at how expertly you deflect actual questions.

How convenient for your argument.