obelixtim

Work is the curse of the drinking man....... My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Aircraft are C206s. Standard jump altitude is 12500. Bring your own rig. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

This is what is meant by "nanny state". Skydiving is an adult sport. Adults should be informed of the risks and then make their own decisions. There is no need of a "committee". Your working group would not be able to show a clear line at 55. or 50, or 60. Because there is not one. People are individuals, not averages. Exactly. Do any other countries have this rule? Either British 55 year olds are somehow worse than 55 year olds from other nations, or BPA is out of step with the norm. It doesn't seem to be an issue elsewhere. I suspect one of the delegates did have an isolated incident with an older trainee, and made such a big thing of it that the others followed his line of reasoning...like sheep. Baaaaaaaa!!! Nope, you're wrong, they took advice from the BPA medical advisor and data collected over a number of years, here is an extract from the STC minutes regarding age limits: "The Working Group had recommended that the following age restrictions should remain: a. 16 years old. Minimum age for parachuting. This should remain as it is based on the individual’s capacity to make decisions. It is commonly accepted in law that persons under the age of sixteen are not capable of making the types of decisions that would be required to parachute safely. b. 16 - 17 years old. Requires parental/guardian consent. This should remain for the above (a) reasons as not all sixteen to eighteen year olds have that capacity. c. 55 years old. The maximum age for anyone to start ‘solo’ parachuting. This had already been discussed by STC. It was decided to keep this restriction as it was adopted following a number of fatal accidents involving students who were over that age when they were trained. d. 40 years old. Above this age all parachutists require a Doctor’s certificate. Solo students and experienced jumpers should remain unchanged, with a review to be carried out once the new Tandem Student medicals been running for a number of months. This will prove the system whilst without increasing risk as Tandem Students are fully under the control of a qualified instructor throughout their descent." I suspect Obelixtim, you either have an axe to grind with the BPA, or are blindly criticizing us for making safety decisions which you either don't agree with, or don't understand. First of all, I have spent a great part of my skydiving career as an instructor examiner, and have spent a lot of time training jumpmasters and instructors, and developing training courses that specifically focus on safety, equipment and training. I have also personally trained and jumped more than 10000 first time jumpers, and have never killed any of them (touch wood). Also, I've acted as chief investigator of several fatal accidents. I think I know a bit about safety and training. Not just talking out of my arse. I have sat in (anonymously) on several first jump training sessions at different DZs in the UK, and have to say the standard of instruction I have witnessed has left me shaking my head at the sheer incompetence I witnessed. (I've also attended first jump training in the US, Australia, Germany, Holland and Spain) I did not go there with an axe to grind, I was simply interested in observing how it was done. If older students are or have been at risk in the past, perhaps it has something to do with the standard of training and equipment they are given. ( How long ago did some British DZs give up using round canopies?) In that case I can completely understand why an age restriction is in place. Put there by the very people with a vested interest in covering their arses when it comes to their own incompetence and laziness when it comes to providing good training. Blaming the restriction on CAA is just nonsense. I remember when a CAA medical expert in NZ proposed a rule change which would require on board oxygen for every flight above 10000 ft, regardless of the time spent above that level. When we challenged that proposal, pointing out that it would be out of step with every other countries aviation regulation regarding this, they quickly backed off and dropped the proposal. CAA don't own the sky, and need to be challenged on occasion. One thing they continue to prove time and again, is they know nothing about skydiving, and would like us to quietly vanish from the skies. I guess in NZ we are not so keen on tugging the forelock and kowtowing to authority. And yes, I do have an axe to grind with BPA. Its an old boys club who enjoy their "status" as big fish in a small pool. I think they do huge damage to the sport, perhaps unwittingly. They could be so much better. My experience with them over many years, and lots of different situations has been overwhelmingly negative. The ex military types are the worst. I will always call out bad practice, wherever it occurs. And I've seen it with the BPA more than anywhere else in the world. I think they are a joke. And I make no apologies for that. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Allen_Ward My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

They would have done that for sure... Like planning the exit point for a cross country, take the wind speed and direction at different altitudes (we were able to do that at 1000 ft increments based on weather balloon data), and plot them on a map, then take the mean speed and direction from that to fix an exit point. From 25 grand you could get a lot of FF drift. I'd be surprised if the wind was 7 knots all the way to altitude. Even exiting right over the top via a GPS spot, I'm sure they would have calculated the wind conditions all the way up pretty precisely. On the last cross country jump I planned, opening at 12 grand: With winds ranging from 15 knots at ground level to 60 knots at 12000 ft, and winds coming from varying directions all the way to altitude, an exit at 12 grand and 12 miles from the DZ saw 5 jumpers out of 6 land right on the target. The other jumper deviated from the plan, went off on his own, and landed about a mile away. As it turned out we could have gone another couple of miles upwind. Of course canopies are going to be influenced by the wind more than someone in FF, but the same principles apply. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

This is what is meant by "nanny state". Skydiving is an adult sport. Adults should be informed of the risks and then make their own decisions. There is no need of a "committee". Your working group would not be able to show a clear line at 55. or 50, or 60. Because there is not one. People are individuals, not averages. Exactly. Do any other countries have this rule? Either British 55 year olds are somehow worse than 55 year olds from other nations, or BPA is out of step with the norm. It doesn't seem to be an issue elsewhere. I suspect one of the delegates did have an isolated incident with an older trainee, and made such a big thing of it that the others followed his line of reasoning...like sheep. Baaaaaaaa!!! My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

A lot of that should be done in the first jump training course. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

WTF!!! My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

It would not be quite that easy. CAA may comply, but the Royal Areo Club probably would not admit the new organization as a member. This matters because it is through the Aero Club that BPA gets FAI privileges. This means that any licenses issues by the new organization would not be internationally recognized FAI documents. Although other countries could choose to honour them anyway. That is why BPA is so smug. They think they are untouchable. That attitude can, and should be challenged. I don't see why the RAC could deny a new organisation if they comply with all the CAA requirements. They could also affiliate themselves with an offshore organisation like USPA. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

The thing is, they have never been challenged. All it needs is an alternative organisation to apply for permission to conduct parachute jumps, and CAA would be obliged to comply. There is no legal reason why that could not happen, things are as they are simply because that's the way it has always been. It needs to happen, and the dead wood needs to be cleared away, for the benefit of everyone who wants to enjoy skydiving in the UK. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Classic BPA. Epitomises everything I have been saying. Lets disqualify a whole demographic, "in case something might happen". The group of 20, who were all over 70 when I trained them (without doctors certificates btw) were no more dangerous than any other group I trained over the years. The BPA haven't evolved from the days of students jumping round parachutes. A perfect example of the negative approach the BPA takes. Charged with promoting skydiving, they find ways to stop people doing so. You also have to get a doctors certificate if you are over 40 and want to start jumping. That rule was abolished in NZ back in the late 70s, with no adverse effects. People are adults, who can make responsible decisions about themselves. BPA, a nanny organisation treating people like children, because they are unwilling to allow people to take personal responsibility for themselves, and lacking the personnel with the balls to take responsibility for others. Any other country have these rules? My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

And welcome to the politics of skydiving 64rky as practised by the BPA....another major reason why people leave the sport. Fixxxed it for ya...... My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Once upon a time getting an A licence meant you were competent enough to look after yourself, and were ready to learn new skills. Newer jumpers were guided through their careers by the more experienced. At no extra cost, because the experienced jumpers had already benefitted themselves from a similar system, and new jumpers would add to the pool of jumpers available for their own jumping. A positive cycle that everyone benefitted from. There weren't more incidents or accidents back then. I don't see why it is now necessary to have a whole new raft of requirements "in the interests of safety" that have to be paid for before people can begin to have fun. A cancer on the sport. If people who get their A licence aren't basically competent, that tells me that their instructors have failed to do their job properly, after charging a lot of money for it. And that's not good enough. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

And there is your problem. Try taking some positive and permanent action. Look, there are plenty of good quality British skydivers out there. I've met and jumped with lots of them. A few rotten apples stink up the whole system though. And they wield the power. Over many years, a recurring and common theme is the closed shop mentality that permeates and affects the British scene. That comes from so many different individuals of differing experience levels that its definitely a long term problem for the UK. I have personally witnessed disgraceful behaviour from senior jumpers towards others on several different British DZs. Students walking off the DZ in tears. However BPA has an endemic problem, that goes back many many years, rooted, I believe, back when the people who set up BPA were all ex military and brought that mindset to the table, and it has never gone changed. "Our way or the highway" Very typical old boys club attitude. They have no interest in change. My "vitriolic" attitude comes from what I've witnessed and the many people I've spoken to who are totally disillusioned with the way things are done. Too many for too long to be one off bitching. If I have an agenda against BPA its because I believe skydiving deserves much better than what BPA dishes up. I've spent my skydiving life making skydiving, easy, accessible, affordable, and fun. That's not what I see when I look at the way jumping is run in the UK. Don't shoot the messenger. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

That doesn't mean everything is all sweetness and light in the UK jumping scene. Far from it. The very fact that a number of different people have displayed reservations indicate that. You don't see these kind of comments about any other country. Why might that be? I've been involved with skydiving for over 40 years now...the BPA stands out long term for its "unique" style. And people do bitch a bit about other organisations, but that doesn't make BPA "right". So why then add another obstacle to someone who already has a USPA A licence? Just the incompetent ones who act like tin gods and treat lower experienced jumpers as some sort of irritant. Its a long standing problem, if it wasn't, why would a specific strategy be necessary. People WANT to jump and want to stay. They are driven away. Bringing in a "consultant" sounds like typical corporate spin, spouted loudly before zero change. If BPA were doing their job properly, retention would be automatic. Err, gee, why didn't I think of that! Get BPA to think about it. They need to be shaken out of their comfortable incompetence. The whole organisation needs a proper ISO 9000 type audit, as do the DZs. Otherwise nothing will change. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

That doesn't mean everything is all sweetness and light in the UK jumping scene. Far from it. The very fact that a number of different people have displayed reservations indicate that. You don't see these kind of comments about any other country. Why might that be? The BPA itself is the problem. Case in point this FS1 rule. No other place has such a rule, hence the perception that the BPA make skydiving as difficult as possible. Nitpicky nonsense that has no reason to be if the instructors do their jobs properly in the first place. I personally know of 30 or 40 people who have trained and jump outside of the UK because they have been made to feel unwelcome at DZs in the UK. Maybe the annual jump numbers would be 370,000 or 470,000 if it was easier to jump there. Think about that. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

As the old saying goes.... "If you want to make a small fortune out of skydiving, start with a large fortune".... My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

This problem is not limited to tandem gear. Good on you for asking your rigger or more experienced colleagues to show you what can happen. Keep doing it. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Barnstormers at airshows. The Russians had military jumpers before the war, but it was the Germans who showed what they could do. The Brits and Americans followed their lead, although the Fallschirmjager were not used again as parachute troops after they were savaged on Crete. Before WW2 the only western military personnel who had anything to do with parachutes would have been pilots and aircrew. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Then there was the attempt to give a chicken the longest flight by a chicken. Tossed out the door at 3 grand, but as soon as he hit the prop blast instinctively spread his wings. Prop blast was too strong and the wings did the hand clap behind him. Chicken spiraled to earth....Should have released him from under canopy.... Also the theory that a mouse could survive a freefall from altitude, but no one could ever find one afterwards to verify the truth or otherwise of that..... My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

As others have said, spend the time strengthening wvwrything and practising landing. Be careful when you do return, that you don't favour your injured leg at the expense of the other. I've seen several people return from a leg injury, then injure the other one because they focussed too much on protecting the old injury. A good PLF will deal with any issues. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

I've packed a lot of C9s and undiapered roundies over the years, but I've never seen that. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Lions led by donkeys. There are probably thousands more who don't, but of course you'll never know that, because they vote with their feet. I'm only saying what I've seen over 40 years. And I'm talking about the BPA specifically. Not British jumpers in general. What do you think would happen if another entity was approved to conduct skydiving in the UK in opposition to the BPA? It needs to happen, and there is no reason it couldn't be done. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Yawn..... I live in London. Spend a lot of time in Spain. Instructors there I talk to, seem to agree with me. People go to Spain to jump when its made too difficult to jump in the UK. And meet lots of others who tell the same story. As do lots of UK citizens I've trained outside the UK. I've been watching the BPA for 40 years now. Yet to be impressed. And I've been to more than a few DZs in the UK and seen the incompetance first hand. It stands out compared to other countries I've jumped in. Denial is not a river in Africa. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Don't bother with jumping in the UK. It is the mission of the old boys club who run jumping there to make skydiving as difficult as possible. They will put as many obstacles as possible in your way to stop you enjoying yourself, as well as extracting as much cash from you as they can. For skydiving its the most negative place in the world. Go to Spain. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....