BruceSmith

Eagle Scout huh? That impresses me a lot Airtwardo, and I am not being sarcastic. I was Second Class, a fitting rank for 377. We lower ranked Scouts comforted ourselves by concluding that the Eagles were dorks, ass kissers and mama's boys... but in our hearts we knew they had the right stuff and would likely do far better than we would in the great life beyond Boy Scouts. My scoutmaster, dismayed by my lack of ambition to rise in rank, lectured me sternly about my wasted potential for "leadership" but I really didn't want to lead anybody. He didn't get it. I had no CEO ambitions. Eagle Scout still shows up on resume's and it gets attention. Congrats. Any other Eagle Scouts here? 377 A Star Scout, here. Not chasing the 21 merit badges for Eagle was my first act of defiance to the golden world of corporate success... ahem. Boy Scouts saved my life - or at least got me through adolesence - my monthly camp-outs were cherished, and my ten days at Philmont Scout Ranch was transformative. I still sign letters with the "Zia" star sign. Spent six summers working for the scouts, too, and my camp ranger, Johnnie Jones, was like a second father - I even sent him a father's day card, once.

I received this same generic speech last Dec. 2010 when asking questions of the Wisconsin US Marshal concerning my father's fugitive from justice warrant and his history. since it is open, even though not active - it would not be appropriate to comment on my fathers case Quote Maybe that's my Chapter 27: "Those anointed by the FBI and granted a private audience, and those who are not - and why" That said, there is a part of me that is sympathetic to the Bureau. Imagine all of us who post here trooping up to Seattle and demanding to pore through the case files.... Neverthless, the inequalities are real and sometimes vicious. Will I have to sort through the list of literary agents who will only represent writers who have FBI access? Or will the crowd-sourcing that has worked so well for me and the DZ continue and we'll create a whole new publishing realm? But Vicki's dilemma may trump all. What must it be like to have LE stonewall your inquiries about one's own father? Whew. That kind of pain is hard to imagine, and is probably doubled because they might not know anything even if they wanted to share.

Great idea, Three-Seven-Seven. Genius mind at work! As I pondered your request, I began wondering if Norm could be Danny - but no! DBC was already on the plane and Norm was still at work and then putting his parachutes in a taxi... Whew. I spoke with Norm last night and he is shopping around for a rigger that he likes who is not Cossified. He said he should have one by the end of the week. Boy, if there is one place in the world that would have esoteric metals and aluminum drill shards, I bet it would be Norman's place. As for Tom K and his crew - defintely a major shout-out to them for their huge contribution to the Cooper case. I was reading their report until 1 am-ish and started getting confused, so I went to bed. I'm a little hazy on some details, such as the clay levels at Tina's Bar and what the nitty-gritty is on the data and conclusions regarding the money find. So, I'm still reading and digesting it all. I have an email into Tom asking for an interview for the Mountain News. Not heard back, though. I also called Ayn Dietrich at the FBI, today. She confirmed that Tom and the Citizen Research Team was given access to the evidence recently (August 2011 by Tom's account), but she would not comment on their findings. She invoked a new DOJ policy that claims the DBC case - since it is open, even though not active - it would not be appropriate for her to comment on any aspect of the investigation.

Is it possible that Bruce Smith, or someone else, could talk Hayden into popping that Pioneer chute just to get the canopy information? It's in the works. Stand-by.

I liked Geoff's book however and I enjoyed meeting him. 377 I like Geoff, too. It's just that sometimes I get the urge to throw my beer at him and that can get messy when I'm talking to him on the phone...or leaving another message.....

Bruce, Cooper specified that the landing gear would be left down and that the flaps would be set at 15 degrees before taking off from Seattle. The NWA aircraft performance group told the crew to fly at 170 Knots Indicated Airspeed to maximize the airliner's range (i.e., most miles per gallon of fuel). At the 10,000 foot altitude, with the temperature and sea level presssure corrections plugged in, that 170 Knots Indicated Airspeed becomes about 195 Knots True Airspeed. Expressed in MPH, the 195 KTAS is about 225 MPH True Airspeed. After reaching 10,000 feet altitude, the airliner tried to maintain exactly 170 KIAS for the remainder of the flight to Reno. Bruce, I think you are somehow reading Knots (which is one nautical mile per hour) as Kilometers per hour. Thank you, Robert, for your clarifications. I accept them and will make the necessary corrections. I appreciate your contributions. Thanks, again.

For those of you attending Ariel this year, it's time you researched that book and if anything catches your eye, you should take a piece of paper and write down questions for Gray. He was the one who got a look at all the files, and it's important that certain questions be directed his way. He will be happy to answer, I'm sure. Quote I'm not, Robert. In my experience, getting answers out of Geoffrey is akin to root canal. That said, I am grateful for every one that he has provided.

Nevertheless...if a print matches one of the ones on the plane, or if DNA cannot be excluded from the samples on the tie, it would be a stronger link than anything we've seen yet. Yup.

QuoteBruce, Please let me amplify on a couple of matters. At the time Cooper jumped, the airliner was in steady level flight at 10,000 feet and had a true airspeed of about 225 MPH. Quote Okay, Robert, I'll recheck my notes, but I've read in numerous places, if I can rememebr accurately, that 305 was going no faster than 200 km/hr, which would put it about 175 mph, no?

Quote Actually, 377, the FBI is not confident that the DNA is Cooper's. Carr was quite specific on that point in our one conversation. Also, the fingerprints are suspect. SAC Calame says they are worthless, and Larry said the Bureau had no assurance that any of the 60 prints was DBC.

GUYS! The Vortex is strong. Please be careful.

Greetings All, I have received many questions about Earl Cossey, Norman Hayden and the parachutes, and I've taken them - along with the copious facts and perspectives shared - to come up with a sizeable addendum to the Mountain News article on the parachute issue. You can go to the Mountain News, as clicky-linked a few posts back, and read the piece replete with the addendum, or simply peruse the addendum posted below in full: **************************** Parachutes Cossey snippet, 10.26.11 Seeking answers, the Mountain News has spoken several times with both Mr. Cossey and Mr. Hayden. Mr. Cossey emphatically claims that the two back parachutes in question are his. Cossey described the two chutes as being different, and specifically stated that the chute DB Cooper actually selected was a military, sage-green nylon, 28-foot round canopy that was placed inside a container known as an NB 8, which is a designation for a Navy Backpack pilot’s emergency rig. Apparently, navy pilots did not wear emergency reserve, “front,” chutes and only relied on the one, main chute if they had to bail out. Cossey said that the second chute, the one not chosen by Cooper, was known as a “Pioneer” because the container was manufactured by a firm named Pioneer, and had been designed for use by acrobatic pilots. As such, it had padded shoulder and leg straps and also contained a “sleeve” over the canopy that would deploy first and thus slow down the opening of the main chute and therefore lessen the shock when it did fully open. On multiple occasions, Cossey has characterized the NB 8 rig as a “broken-down VW” and the not-taken parachute rig as a “Cadillac.” In addition, Cossey has referred to the second parachute as a “sports chute,” explaining that he does so because the Pioneer container was of a type that often housed parachutes that could be steered in a modern fashion, whereas the 28-foot canopy in the NB 8 - possibly a military surplus C-9 round canopy - had no capacity for steering. This somewhat off-hand expression by Cossey, referring to the not-used parachute as a “sport chute,” may have resulted in sowing some confusion into the investigation. In the 1971 era there were sports chutes available, including a popular round canopy called a Paracommander. As sporty and steerable as they were back in the day, Paracommanders are now superseded by today’s rectangular dual-surface, ram-air parachutes that are eminently steerable and can be flared, such that the landings are usually on target and as gentle as stepping off a bus. As a result, this advanced level of parachute technology distorts the image of the actual 1971-era sports chute capabilities in the mind of some Cooper investigators and journalists. Nevertheless, Cooper-era Paracommanders did offer a measure of true steer-ablity. They had numerous vent openings cut into the panels to give the canopy forward motion and they could be given directionality by using steering lines that selectively closed certain vents to rotate the canopy. The forward motion combined with the ability to rotate the canopy allowed it to be maneuvered much like a glider. It has been widely assumed, particularly in the media and among some investigators that Cooper’s not-used “sport” chute was a Paracommander, and thus arguably a better choice for jumping over forested mountainous terrain since it could be steered into a clear area for landing. Nevertheless, Cooper-era Paracommanders offered a measure of true steer-ablity. They had numerous vent openings cut into the panels to give the canopy forward motion and they could be given directionality by using steering lines that selectively closed certain vents to rotate the canopy. The forward motion combined with the ability to rotate the canopy allowed it to be maneuvered much like a glider. It appears that it has been widely assumed, particularly in the media and among some investigators that Cooper’s not-used “sport” chute was a Paracommander, and thus arguably a better choice for jumping over forested mountainous terrain since it could be steered into a clear area for landing. However, in our last conversation on this subject a couple of weeks ago, Cossey stated definitively that the not-used parachute was not a Paracommander and was simply a round military chute designed for pilots. Further, Mr. Cossey has never told me the size of the canopy on the not-taken parachute, and whether it is a 26-foot conical as the FBI claims, has not been clarified to my knowledge. In addition, Cossey, who owned and operated a parachute supply company and also packed parachutes professionally - including the ones he says went to Cooper - told me that he had made a modification to the NB 8 rig for reasons he did not elaborate upon, simply saying that he had altered the location of the ripcord. Because of this ripcord modification and the nature of the sleeveless parachute Cossey said the 28-foot round military canopy contained within the NB 8 was hard to deploy, and it delivered a harsher opening than would be experienced by a jumper using the other rig. For these reasons he concluded that Cooper chose an inferior parachute in comparison to the one he left behind on the airplane. Since DB Cooper did not select the so-called superior parachute, Cossey feels that Cooper was not a highly skilled parachutist, an attitude that is now embraced by the FBI. It is not known how much influence Mr. Cossey’s views had on the FBI, but Cossey freely voices his opinions about DB Cooper. “He didn’t make it,” Cossey said, which is the perspective generally voiced by the FBI. “By not choosing the sports chute, DB Cooper showed his limited knowledge of skydiving,” Cossey continued. Cossey cites Cooper’s inexperience and the hard-pull from the ripcord as leading to Cooper being a “no-pull,” which concluded with Cooper cratering somewhere in the woods of southwestern Washington state. “I don’t believe he pulled the ripcord,” Cossey told me in 2009. However, Cossey’s comparative assessment of these parachutes is not shared by all skydivers, most notably a jumper known as “377,” who is found on the parachuting website called “DropZone.” 377 says that if the NB 8 contained a 28-foot C-9 type canopy, which is designed to withstand high-speed jet ejection openings, it would have been an optimum choice for an exit from a 727. If the rig not taken had a 26-foot Navy conical canopy, it too, would have been able to withstand a high-speed opening. However, if the canopy in the Pioneer rig was a commercial type rather than military one, then it might have been designed for opening speeds below 150 mph, which would be significantly lower than Flight 305’s estimated speed of 170-180 mph. Unless Cooper read the packing cards he wouldn't know what canopies were packed in the NB 8 and Pioneer rigs. Since a commercial unit such as the Pioneer might have a commercial low-speed emergency canopy packed inside, the military NB 8 would have been the better choice as it was more likely to have a military canopy packed inside, such as the C-9. In speaking with 377, who started jumping in 1968 and is still active, he said he had jumped all three types of canopies, the 28-foot C-9, the 26-foot Navy conical, and a number of 26-28-foot, low-speed commercial canopies. His personal choice for the Cooper jump would have been the C-9, but the Navy conical would have been a very close second if it was available and identifiable. 377 also said that many C-9s and Navy conicals had been modified before 1971 with a system called a "four-line release," which allowed military aircrew - and sport jumpers using them as reserves - to release four key suspension lines after opening, which would give a moderate forward speed to the canopy and allow steering by pulling on marked suspension lines or using differential riser pulls. 377 ended our conversation by stating, "I'm not saying I know more than Cossey - after all he is an experienced FAA-licensed rigger and I am not - but I think given the situation and the limited amount of information Cooper may have had about the Pioneer rig and its contents, he chose the right rig for the jump when he put on the NB 8." Whether the NB 8 had a C-9 inside remains for Mr. Cossey to tell us, or the FBI, but so far this information has not been made available publicly. Along those lines, the transport of the parachutes to Sea-Tac airport is also murky, and it has been widely reported that Cossey put them in a taxi and they went first to Boeing Field in Renton, and then on to Sea-Tac by private car. Why the chutes made such a circuitous route to the hijacking has not been explained in sources that are generally available, and recent attempts to clarify this matter with Mr. Cossey have been unsuccessful. (Note: I first contacted Earl Cossey, who prefers being called “Coss,” in March, 2009. At that time, I was new to the DB Cooper story and I called Coss to learn more about his famous parachutes and to discuss the then-hot topic of the Amboy, WA parachute that was widely rumored to be DB Cooper’s getaway rig. However, I apparently misunderstood or misinterpreted some of what Coss told me. As a result, I have grossly mis-represented his perspective – and the facts - on how sporty the not-used chute actually is. I also mis-characterized other related issues, such as Coss placing the Cooper chute into a smaller, NB 6 container although that action has been attributed to Mr. Cossey by the former FBI Cooper case agent, Larry Carr. In addition, I have incorrectly described the Cooper chute as one used by Coss for his own personal recreational skydiving. I profoundly apologize to Coss for these inaccuracies, and I hope that our once-robust professional relationship may be restored in the near future.) As for the controversy, Coss states definitively that he owned the two parachutes and says that he has never heard of Norman Hayden, apparently not recalling when he signed the rigging card for Norman in May, 1971. However, that transaction may have occurred with no direct contact between the two men. Continuing, when I told Coss that Mr. Hayden is claiming ownership of the two back parachutes, Cossey replied, “He’s full of s**t.” Further, when I informed Coss that FBI documents indicate that Mr. Hayden is the owner of the parachutes, the rigger retorted, “Well, Northwest Airlines paid me for the chutes; so that should tell ya something!” As for what Norman Hayden has to say on the subject, I traveled to see him at his shop in Kent, Washington, on Monday, October 24, 2011, and upon the advice of many in the skydiving world I invited Bruce Thun to accompany me.

Quote I'm all ears, G. (Smile).

Quote Here's a synopsis of what I have learned, Robert, and a couple questions: 1. Cossey says he gave NWO an NB 8 with a 28-foot military round, sage-green ripstop, etc canopy. Plus a Pioneer of unknown size, with a modified ripcord and an undisclosed canopy inside that has a sleeve. This latter rig is the "not-taken" unit. 2. Hayden's rig that he has possession of is clearly a Pioneer, containing most likely a 26-foot round miitary chute inside. He says he had two identical chutes, so Cooper's rig was a Pioneer with a 26-foot conical also. So, are you asking if Hayden's Pioneer is also an NB 6, or that he should have an NB 6 if he has the not- taken rig? Here's where I need to ask a question: Did Pioneer make NB 6s? If it did, would it be called a Pioneer or an NB 6? The same quesetion goes for NB 8s, too, I suppose. Did Pioneer make NB 8s? One moniker is a manufacturing name; the other is a military designation. Can both names refer to the same rig? Conversely, if a NB 6 and a Pioneer alway identify different kinds of harnesses, they could then be stuffed with the same type of canopy, right? So both could have a 26-foot, Steinthals, let's say, or a navy conical, or in the case of NB -8s, C-9s, too. Not sure what you're asking, Robert, if anything in particular, or just seeking clarity about what we've found and who is saying what, which is why I'm responding.

Isnt there a reference somewhere to "trouble getting the chutes" ? In the Transcripts - havent looked ? Tosaw and Sluggo identified one (serie) of calls that were made? Maybe there were several calls, calls that crossed without all parties knowing ...? Multiple calls > multiple chutes. How would the parties called even know other parties had been contacted, yet each responded? How would a SAC writing later even know the full-accurate history; he wouldnt. I dont think the FBI was training its people on parachute types then! (or shovel manufactirers either). If all of that adds up to bungling ????? Cossey has his facts. Hayden has his. SAC has his. Aunt Mable has hers. All facts may be true, each in their own histories ? Nobody may be lying? The whole thing may be the 'whole truth' ? Quote I agree.

The story is up, with plenty of pictures of the rig and Norman Hayden. http://themountainnewswa.net/2011/10/25/db-cooper-case-heats-up-again-with-controversy-over-parachutes/ Yes, I know it's lacking the clicky stuff, but I've been writing for the past nine hours, and now is not a good time to learn how to do it...maybe a DZ friend can enhance.

Not always. In the 1980's I went for a grueling acro ride (those negative Gs are nauseating) in a Great Lakes biplane. The passenger chute rig was an older surplus harness/container and the pilots rig was a much more recent commercial rig with padded straps etc. Quote Cool story, Three-Seven- Seven, but I do have more information about Norman Hayden's purchasing habits. Barry, who sold him an airplane, was insistent in telling me that Norman always went "first-class" when buying stuff, and that was quite evident in his selection of aricraft and acro gear. Now, Norman doesn't remember where, when or who he bought the parachutes from - it could be Cossey, or not - but Barry is convinced that Norman would have shopped for the best gear at the best price, and would have found it by buying two identical chutes. That said, if he bought used chutes, why, or how, could they be identical? That would be unusual in my opinion, unless he bought them from a retiring acro pilot who had bought the parachutes when they were brand new, etc. Reading the tea-leaves a little further here, Norman is the kind of guy who would cherish the sublime simplicity of identical parachutes and the value that would afford in an emergency. One more thing. After copious - and good-natured - coaching from Hangdiver on the finer points of parachute rigging, the rig I saw yesterday had a left-sided in-board pull, meaning that the rip chord handle was mounted on the left shoulder strap facing inward toward the sternum-chest area of the skydiver. (How'd I do Hangdiver????)

I'll have more on this story in the days to come, plus pictures; they will all be posted on the Mountain News - WA. In the meantime: Parachutes, report on Norman Hayden meeting, October 24, 2011 This is a brief post on my trip to see Norman Hayden and his parachute that allegedly went for a ride from Sea-Tac to Reno about 40 years ago. I traveled in the company of Bruce Thun, manager of Pierce County Airport in Puyallup, WA. Mr. Hayden was very gracious and generous with his time, and he showed us the parachute straight away. However, in the course of the afternoon, he seemed to downplay the importance of his chute and his role in the Cooper story, although he maintains a Cooper file filled with newspaper clippings. The rig was comparable to what is listed as Chute #1 in the FBI "parachute" document, p.227. The container was "tan, soft cotton," although it looked more like a more rugged duck-cloth fabric. It appeared very much like worn-in Carhartt jacket material. The canopy was identified on the rigging card as a white, 26-foot conical, rip-stop, and Norman was able to peel a couple inches of the canopy out of the container and it did look like white rip-stop nylon. However, the container looked old, like WWII vintage, even though the manufacturing label said September 1957. I didn’t see any “wear marks,” as suggested in the FBI docs. Although the bag looked old the harness material looked new, and I didn't see any special padding on them. There was a rectangular foam pad, covered in grayish-blue nylon that looked like a little pillow and was located in the middle part of the harness, as if it was padding to make the rig more comfortable for an acrobatic pilot to wear. The container was a Pioneer, type 226. I saw no Steinthal markings of any kind for the canopy, as FBI Cooper case agent Larry Carr has suggested. The first signature on the rigging card was EJ Cossey, certification number 1579638, and dated May 21, 1971. The chute was re-packed twice after return from the FBI – 1982 and 1984. Norman has never used it to jump with. He is strictly a “precision acrobatic pilot.” He loves flying, and has restored many planes, apparently. Plus, his shop is filled with dozens of large scale model RC planes, which is a retirement hobby, he told us. However, Norman was unable to provide any authenticating documents for the parachute. In addition, I spoke with Barry Halstad of Pacific Aviation, which was located at Boeing Field in 1971. I spoke with Mr. Halstad after my retune home from Norman, and Barry called me upon the suggestions of Norman. The two gentlemen seem to be good friends, and Barry joked quite a bit about Norman. Barry is the guy who was the go-between Norman and NWO operations, probably the George Harrison that is identified in the FBI docs, although both Barry and Norman do not recall the name. Halstad said that NWO called him directly about 3-5 pm in the afternoon of Nov 24 because Pacific Aviation sold acrobatic aircraft and the folks at Sea-Tac knew that he would have back chutes for these planes. FAA regs require acro pilots to have a chute for themselves and one for a passenger. Both Barry and Norm stated that it was routine that the chutes used in acro planes would be identical rigs. Barry said that he told the NWO guy that he did have chutes, but that all of them were cone-shaped seat packs, not back packs. However, he informed NWO that a recent customer of his, Norman, who had just bought a Decathlon acrobatic craft from Barry, had also recently purchased two back pack parachutes and had them at his shop in Kent. Barry says he called Norman after the NWO guy hung up, and alerted him to prepare the back chutes for transport to NWO via taxi. Barry thinks he may have also called the taxi and made other transportation arrangements with the NWO guy, but he is unsure of this. Barry has never heard of Earl Cossey, and had no idea that there was ever any controversy about Norman owning the two back pack parachutes that went on board 305. Norman wasn’t 100% sure where the taxi went, nor is Barry. The FBI docs say that Norman had told the FBI that it had gone to Boeing Flight Service, Seattle, but that meant nothing to either gentleman when I asked about it. Norman told me that all he remembers is that he put the two chutes in the taxi, gave him the address that the NWO ops guy gave him, and a receipt book for the NWO guy to sign. Norman says the cabbie retuned with the receipt book sign, but Norman says he doesn’t know where it might be at this time. In addition, Norman says that he never spoke directly with anyone from the FBI. Further, Norman continued to claim that as far as he knows both back chutes were identical. He seemed a bit dismayed and wistful about bureaucratic in-accuracies when I read aloud the FBI description of the two back pack parachutes and their many differences. However, Barry openly wonders if the FBI received four back pack parachutes that day – two from Norman that were identical, and two from Earl Cossey that were not. As a result, my next phone call is to find George Harrison of NWO, now Delta Airlines. When Norman put the parachute on, a big smile broke out across his face and he said, “Hey, now that feels good.” He is 79 years old, and when he was wearing the chute he clowned around for us. It appears that he lives by himself in a small apartment in his shop, and Norman seems to be financially stable. He has several late-model vehicles parked in the shop, which is a sprawling 20,000 sq feet and clean-as-a-whistle. Norman is a very interesting guy. He is a genius-engineer and machinist. His shop is filled with beautifully restored or original miniature engines, including a unique replica of a working Sterling heat engine, designed in 1820. Uncannily; it works on the pressure differentials between hot and cool air in a chamber that is heated by a little flame. Norm has built several miniatures of them that work flawlessly. I had traveled to Norman’s shop in the company of Bruce Thun, the manager of Pierce County Airport in Puyallup, WA, also know by its original name, Thun Field, named after Bruce’s father, John. Traveling with Bruce Thun was a complete joy, and his personal knowledge of the Cooper story and its local players was fascinating. In the 1971 era, Bruce was a jump plane pilot, and knew of Earl Cossey, who had a superb reputation as a skilled skydiver. Further, in his duties as the manager of Thun Field, he was part of the National Geographic documentary filming in December 2008 at Thun Field, which featured local authors Ron and Pat Forman and focused on the Barb Dayton angle. During this intensive shoot, Earl Cossey was on site and Bruce met him. In addition, Norman Hayden rented a hangar for a considerable period of time at Thun Field as well, apparently during the 1980s. Bruce Thun told me that in 1971 there were three main skydiving field in western Washington – Issaquah Sky Sports, which is east of Seattle; a spot in Snohomish County north of Seattle; and Thun Field, which is located in central Pierce County, about 25 miles southeast of Tacoma, and about 35 miles away from Mt Rainier, which can be see in its full glory on clear days to the southeast.

Galen has asked me to post the following information about Janet and Ariel. “I talked with ‘Janet’ and she is ready to come to Ariel to meet with Ralph Himmelsbach if he will be able to attend the 40th anniversary (with or without Jerry Thomas). Janet is all of about 5'2", but tough as nails.............as is her current LE officer husband. They will be flying in from the Mid-west. If RH cannot attend, we will invite him to meet with us at any coffee shop of his choosing between Portland and Woodburn, along the I-5 route. I also stay in close contact with Alice Hancock and ‘Andy' Anderson, and will extend invites to them, too. Who knows, I might send Tina Mucklow a written invite requesting that she and Alice come together. Alice indicated she would do this."

If 34 ft is true, that's an odd size, perhaps a cargo chute. The mil surplus canopies I am familiar with that were used in jumping are: 24 ft round ripstop Army paratrooper reserve 24 ft round twill old Army paratrooper reserve 26 ft conical ripstop Navy Conical, in NB6 28 ft round ripstop C9 crew rigs, ejection seats, etc 35 ft round ripstop T10 Army paratrooper use I don't recall any 34 ft mil person carrying canopies. Riggers and old jumpers chime in. Ever hear of a military 34 ft canopy used in emergency rigs? 377 Quote Yes, Cossey said it was a cargo chute. Shall we put this one on the list? Where is it and who's got it? Let's measure it. Get a fabric sample. Bring it to Ariel and have a group dance with it!...oh, I'm getting carried away again. Okay, deep breath, pausing after an edit. I have a scribble in the corner of one of the pages of my Cossey-related notes from the March 2009 era - concerning the Amboy chute that says the parachute most likely belonged to a skydiver with one leg out of Texas named Clyde Seufford (spelling?). He lost one leg in Vietnam in combat, and was skydiving in Washington and relying on his one good leg to do the job, which broke when he landed hard in Amboy. I think somebody made a post here on the DZ about this, and might have posted a link to a Seattle Post-Intelligencer story that gave the details. That story says Clyde lived in Chicota, Texas and moved back there from the PNW about 20 years ago. He abandoned the chute after he landed and crawled to safety, got help, and was whisked away, to the VA to recover I would imagine. Something about "white berries" on a PI blog? 2008??? That's what I've got.

Did you talk with Cossey about the Amboy canopy? 377 Quote Yes, in March 2009, when it was hot stuff. Coss, as he prefers to be called, was concise - the Amboy chute was not Cooper's. Coss said that the Amboy chute was 34-feet in diameter - too big for the back chutes, and similarly for the reserve that also went out the door (presumably) with Cooper. In addition, the Amboy chute was silk, whereas Cooper's chutes were nylon.

Former Cooper case agent Larry Carr seems to have planted some of the seeds of confusion that now surrounds the multiple issues enveloping the “back parachutes” investigation, or at least has added weight to possible myths once-deemed truthful and common knowledge. He also posted commentary on the DZ that cast some of Mr. Cossey’s actions in a questionable light, namely, why did Coss modify a pilot’s emergency rig to make it tougher to deploy? To begin, Carr posted some of the misleading back parachute information on the DZ in early June, 2008. First he refers to Earl Cossey as providing the parachutes and having them at his home on November 24, 1971, indicating possession. This leads to the question of whether Carr had read the documents that Gray has now brought to light. “The NB6 and the Pioneer were Cossey's chutes, he had them at his house; they weren't at Seattle Skysports.” http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=3238357;#3238357 http://www.dropzone.com/...ost=3238357;#3238357 The second issue is the “stuffing” of a 28-foot canopy into a NB 6 container. Apparently, I was not alone in thinking that Mr. Cossey had done just that, and perhaps my confusion on this matter stems from what Mr. Carr said on the DZ, even though these posts predate my arrival in Cooper World by several months: “I asked Cossey why he packed a 28-foot canopy in the NB6 and he just shrugged. Kind of like, ‘it was my chute, I did it because I can.’ I like that guy, I could have talked to him all day but he grew tired of me in about an hour. " http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=3238357;#3238357 http://www.dropzone.com/...ost=3238357;#3238357 Carr also confirms some of the modifications that Cossey says he performed on the rig that Cooper used, which are inexplicable and unexplained; namely, Cossey seems to have modified a pilot’s emergency rig and made it tougher to deploy. Besides the super-stuffed bag, Carr seems to confirm that Cossey also moved the rip chord from its customary position on the left and placed it on the right. In addition to the new location - which might confuse a jumper in an emergency - the modification required Cooper to use an unusual two-stage maneuver to deploy the parachute – first pulling the rip chord out and then thrusting the rip chord upwards. Carr posted (June 13, 2008): "Back to the NB6, Cossey modified the chute, we know that from the 28' canopy. And when we spoke he said he placed the handle under the right armpit. The motion he showed me was that Cooper would have had to hook his right thumb in the handle and push straight out, like a bench press motion. Once fully extended, he would have had to rotate his fully extended arm up over his head. Does this make sense? Or did he just demonstrate right handed and he really meant left? " http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=3239298;#3239298 http://www.dropzone.com/...ost=3239298;#3239298 377 also posted on the DZ a few moments after Carr, and his analysis of Cossey’s alleged modifications are quite simple: “28 ft canopy in an non extended NB6 container, VERY weird ripcord handle location modification…was Cossey planning to have an ex-wife jump with this?” On a personal note, I would like to thank 377 and Snow for helping me climb (crawl) back into the saddle today after my journalistic melt-down of the past 36 hours. Particularly Snow, who helped with all the clicky stuff, and capturing the pertinent flakes of Carr-quotes from the blizzard of DZ commentary. And thanks to Georger for providing a few words of motivation for me to re-visit DZ World, June 2008, circa pages 90-120. It's a Force 10 Storm out there, folks. BTW: Bruce Thun confessed to me when we were making travel arrangements that he falls asleep at night thinking about the Cooper case. That makes me smile, We should have a good time driving up the West Valley Highway tomorrow to see Norman.

I owe Earl Cossey an apology. On October 17, 2011, I wrote a piece that was posted on the DropZone that charged Mr. Cossey with lying about his role in providing two back parachutes to authorities for the DB Cooper case. But much to my dismay, I can’t prove the accusation, and so, I apologize for impugning Mr. Cossey’s reputation, and for mudding the waters of the DB Cooper investigation. The truth is I don’t know the truth about Mr. Cossey, the parachutes, or Norman George Hayden, who also claims to have owned the two back parachutes and of providing them to the FBI. I first interviewed Mr. Cossey on March 12, 2009, by phone, and I have come to learn in the past few days that my accounts of that conversation are wildly at odds with what I wrote in my interview field notes taken when I spoke with Mr. Cossey originally, and also with what he has re-confirmed to me in a follow-up interview last week on October 17. Since 2009, I have written extensively that Cossey told me the following narrative, now known to be incorrect: one, that Cooper used a parachute that was a 28-foot round canopy stuffed into a NB 6 container rather than the customary NB 8, thus making for difficult deployment. In addition, I had also said that Mr. Cossey had used this rig as his own personal recreational parachute. However, as the ownership controversy has emerged I have combed through my notes to refresh my memory on Mr. Cossey’s perspective. I have been astonished to discover that I can not find a single mention of a stuffing into an NB 6 or the recreational use – or any other personal usage by Cossey – of this parachute. I am stunned, and I certainly apologize to Mr. Cossey for this error. When I wrote the above narrative I thought I was telling the story as Mr. Cossey had told it to me. I did not intentionally distort his account; and yet, I can’t back it up. I am perplexed as how I could get the story so wrong. Nevertheless, it appears that I did. For what it is worth, here is what Cossey told me in 2009 and what I put in my field notes: DB Cooper jumped with a sage-green, 28-foot nylon canopy packed into a NB 8 container. Cossey further stated to me that he didn’t know how the NB 6 story got started, which is, apparently, a reference to the perspective offered by Larry Carr that Cooper used an NB 6. That said, my efforts to clarify these issues with Mr. Cossey last week may have added to the confusion. When we spoke on Oct 17, Mr. Cossey may have misunderstood my question, and I in turn may have mis-understood his answer, when I asked him to clear-up the issue of a 28-foot canopy stuffed into an NB 6 bag. Initially, I had thought Cossey had re-confirmed that the Cooper rig was a super-stuffed NB 6, when he said, “that’s pretty much accurate.” It was only after further re-questioning that full clarity emerged, and Mr. Cossey emphatically stated that the Cooper rig was a 28-footer in an NB 8 sack, and that he, Cossey, had never used the parachute -or the second back chute delivered to the feds - as his own personal parachute. “I have a third parachute for that,” he told me last week. I will be mailing a copy of this apology to Mr. Cossey, and I am beginning the process of converting my various posts on the matter to be more aligned with what I can support with my notes and with what I now know more fully is Mr. Cossey’s perspective. Along these lines, I travel to Mr. Hayden’s shop tomorrow to meet the man who claims ownership of the two back chutes that ended up on Flight 305. Further, it is my understanding that I will be able to inspect the second, “not-used” parachute. Controversy continues to haunt this aspect of the case, however, as Hayden says that he had to sue the FBI for the return of this chute; but Galen Cook tells me that the second parachute is in the Cooper evidentiary collection at the Seattle FBI office. Hence, I will be taking copious pictures of the chute, and asking Mr. Hayden for its authentication, such as the legal documents he used to retrieve it. Further, I will be traveling with Bruce Thun, who will act as my observer. Even though Bruce says he is not an expert parachutist, I have asked him to accompany me for several reasons. First, the interview requires a witness. Secondly, through his role as manager of Thun Field in Puyallup, WA, Bruce knows both Norman Hayden and Earl Cossey. Lastly, Geoffrey Gray has sent me an email confirming that the document he used as his source to support his announcement of Norman Hayden as owner comes from the FBI, and that it is pages 226-228 of a Cooper case summary file. However, the mystery continues as this document describes the two back chutes as being different – one a 28-foot “military” parachute and the other a 26-foot “(c)ivilian, luxury type,” yet when I first spoke with Mr. Hayden he told me the two chutes were identical and both were military rigs.

Bruce just to be explicit: Recall Ckret did interview Cossey. Ckret posted the basics of his interview here, so do a search and if you dont find it I will dredge it up for you. Just so you know Larry did interview Cossey, which I assume you already know ..... to say it again ... good luck. I've just combed through the DZ's June 2008 period, and Ckret shared a lot of info about Cossey and the chutes. Very interesting reading, and it refreshed a lot of my memory about Cossey, especially all the hard-pull stuff he told me concerning the rip chord and its placement. Larry buys Cossey's description of a "good" parachute and a not-so-good chute. The good one was a steerable sport chute and the other was a basic military round. That's what Cossey told me in 2009, but that changed a bit when I called a few days ago. Then, Cossey indicated to me that the "good" chute wasn't a sport chute, and was better because of other factors. Hayden says his two chutes were identical. We will soon know more about all of that. Also, the tone of Larry's posts was remarkably good-natured. That's not the Larry I knew. He was exceptionaly argumentative with me in our one phone call and he denied all other requests for an interview with me. That said, he did stay on the phone with me for an extended period of time - at least twenty minutes, and I am grateful. Thanks, Larry, if you're reading. G, I read from pages 98 to about 112. Should I explore more, or have I gotten the bulk of the information available here. It's 1:15 am and I think I'm done for the night. BTW: It's my understanding that GG hs taken down all the links to his documentation on this issue.

OK, as an example, assume I packed parachutes. Some of my purportedly packed parachutes are used in an unusual extortion and aircraft hijacking. The FBI comes to see me. As in, Federal Bureau of Investigation. Likely people in a foul mood, carrying .38 S&W revolvers. I am basically a bystander, and I have no reason to tell the FBI anything other than the truth and exactly what I know in answer to their questions. I am guilty of nothing, except possibly being an idiot. Unless someone can demonstrate that Mr. Cossey is some sort of pathological liar, or an idiot, I will assume he told the FBI factual answers to their questions. How he has played it over the past 40 years may be different, but I would go with his original statements. Quote Okay, fair enough. So, what are his original statements? I'm not trying to be coy here; I've only been on the Hunt since August 2008, so I'm new. I don't know what Cossey's original statements were. I only know what he has told me in the past two-three years, and they don't jive with others are telling me.