BruceSmith

Bruce, in your work on this case so far, with all the interviews you have done, have you picked up any anecdotes about the weather (in the V23 corridor) that afternoon and evening? Especially anything you would trust from reputable sources? Thanks, G. Quote I've spoken at length with Meyer Louie and the commentary he has shared here on the DZ is identical to what he told me. Also, I heard the older woman at the symposium who was impressed also with the gusty nature of the weather that night. Both folks tell corroborating stories. Both were in the I-5 corridor in and around Portland that night and buffeted by strong winds and lots of rain. Their accounts simply do not match what we're getting from official meteorological sources. Yes, the weather - especially the wind - intensifies dramatically in the Gorge, aka The Columbia Gorge, which funnels the Columbia River, but they are reporting strong winds and heavy rain in lands comparable to those where Cooper jumped. The famous Columbia Gorge begins a bit east of the Washougal area, and my best estimate of this westernmost end of the Gorge is that it begins about 20 miles east of Portland and the I-5. If you're looking on a map, Mt. Hood is on the Oregon side of the river and Mt Adams on the WA side and they form the backbone of the Gorge, which ends about 60 miles east as the Cascade Mountains peter-out as one approaches the lands of the Yakima Reservation in Washington. Winds in the Gorge are always extreme; I would say 20-30 mph on average on a nice summer's day. As a result, the Columbia near The Dalles, Oregon (pronounced Dahls) is a world-renown windsurfing area. In addition, after the symposium I spoke extensively with Dona Elliott at the Ariel Tavern on the subject of the weather and the ground search in the vicinity of Ariel during the days immediately following the skyjacking. Dona summed up the weather of November 24, 1971 very simply: “It was terrible!” Not only was it windy, but Dona said that it was also cold, and she estimated that the snow level fell to about 1,500 feet, which is pretty low. Normal mid-winter snow levels generally do not fall below 2,000. Supporting that, the pix that Geoff Gray showed from chief case agent Charlie Farrell’s collection indicated lots of snow-filled fields and clear-cuts, presumably at lower elevations. This landscape appeared to be rolling hills and seemed to visually support the perspective offered by Tom Kaye that Cooper’s LZ, which was centered in Ariel, was mostly rolling hills with open wood lots and agricultural fields, along with about 10% dense forests. Little or none of it was mountainous, densely forested wilderness area. My best estimate is that the pictures were taken east of Ariel where the hills approach 2-3,000 feet. Nevertheless, there is some steep and rugged terrain in this area, such as the mountains that immediately surround Lake Merwin, which may top 5,000 feet. Supporting Dona, Geoff also writes that federal ground searches were called off in the days just Cooper’s jump because the snow was too deep to negotiate. Not sure how deep, or where the FBI was tromping, but Geoff displayed the FBI’s documents that sounded convincing. Lastly, Meyer told me that the weather that night was so rough that ever since he has used it as a personal gauge for intense weather. “’Is it as bad as was that night?’” is what I say when I see a bad storm,” Meyer told me. Meyer lives close to me and we met for an Italian dinner during the week after the Portland symposium. “So far, I’ve never seen a storm to surpass what I saw that night. Some storms have come close or matched it – but none have been worse.”

Quote Sounds great. Let's do it.

So not even Bruce is clear what's the truth is. I'd offer up yet one more scenario to add to Bruce's list of possibilities. Way back when, Hayden got a repack from Cossey, has a signature on a packing card for a parachute similar to the ones described and has confabulated the story in his mind over the years to insert himself into the narrative. Certainly wouldn't be the first such case of confabulation we've seen in this thread. Question for Bruce. In the article; What "larger Cooper case file" is that? Quote Geoffrey Gray is the source of this information on Norman Hayden and the FBI documents. It is my understanding from what Geoff and others told me that there are several massive "sub-files" on the Cooper case. One such sub-file contains these three pages on the parachutes delivered to Cooper.

I love it! BTW: I'll be leaving Cooper World for two weeks to see family Back East. If you like Christmas stories, I'm posting a slew on the Mountain News: http://themountainnewswa.net/2011/12/19/going-back-home-for-christmas/ On the 30th I'm heading to San Francisco and spending a few days hunting up Sheridan Peterson at the behest and support of ol' 377. Merry Christmas to all. Plus, I'll be lighting candles on the 28th to celebrate Chanukah, too. So, Gude Yontiv, as well!

I still can't see someone as smart as Marla lieing about what the FBI told her. That would almost surely blow up before her book release and kill its market appeal. She is too smart to do that. I'm staying tuned. Her romantic misadventures don't have anything to do with Norjack. To my amazement she even took that matter head on with no dodges. I felt sympathy for her. Imagine if some infidelity or dishonesty of yours got plastered all over the Internet. Herman Cain could have taken a lesson from Marla. She didn't lie, dodge or make excuses. Quote I disagree with your view, 377, that Marla didn't "dodge." She has blocked me at every turn in the past two weeks in my efforts to learn more about her and her family. To whit: she threatened me with a law suit if I contacted Santore. She didn't return phone calls or emails in a timely manner regarding the wackiness coming out her cop, Detective Dorney nor restore the communnication link with Santa Claus, and dropped the ball about Gracie. Here at the DZ she dug in her heels and on numerous occaisons said she wouldn't provide info or contact information. Add in her snarkiness and one had to be strong-willed to maintain a dialogue with Miss M and ask a few questions about Norjak. As for me, she didn't answer a single question I posed here, such as LD's height, with any precision. Further, the key FBI contact of hers is still un-identified, and I appreciate his dilemma of protecting himself from restless triggermen while being the lynchpin in an enormously public and controversial case. Nevertheless, his contributions must be made known, for it speaks volumes about the FBI's investigation of Norjak. They ignore Marla and Dorney in 2010 but grab the bait when it's a G-man pitching? Yeesch. Is that what Vicki W needs? Not a cute red dress but an SA in her back pocket? Lastly, in her Big Confession, Marla left out a lot of names and dates. Yes, it was juicy, but the damn thing is - it's still woefully incomplete. To me, she admitted just enough to abate the wolves nipping at her heels and then made a grand splash as she headed for the exit. Bottom Line, she is most reluctant to discuss issues that impact her credibility. Worse, she does not seem to have developed any substantive appreciation for corroboration, facts and details. Worst, she has not provided any access to her brother Dave, or her sister, who were in the house on The Day and presumably heard all the family stories afterwards. Dave was 7 or so years old, okay, but I'd sure like to hear what he has to say. So far, all my efforts to contact him have gone to naught. As for the FBI, can you imagine what true deception is going on if Marla is telling the truth and she's been set-up by Curtis? Holy Guacamole, Batman!!!

I'd like to share some thoughts on Marla's departure, especially the focus we placed on her marriages and divorces, and other personal behaviors. I think Marla brought the scrutiny upon herself. She forcefully shut down other forms of inquiry, saying repeatedly that she didn't have to tell us this or that. Further, she never provided basic data, such as LD's height, weight, eye color, etc in a documented fashion. At best, she provided anecdotal material. In short, all Marla provided - and all she insisted on sharing - was her story. As a result, we only had one avenue of investigation left to pursue - her personal credibility. As we dug deeper, more concerns and doubts came up, so things intensified and even a buddy from Oklahoma eventually joined the fray. For me, I'm not concerned, primarily, about Marla's book deal or what her motivation is to tell this story. Rather, I am more concerend about the FBI and why they allow Marla to be Marla. How does this serve the FBI? What agenda does it further? To me, that is the most important question.

...interesting way you are choosing to do it... most people who look at themselves that way don't choose to hurt others on their path. Despite my most earnest intentions to be a force for good in the world, I find that I still cause a lot of havoc. But, I also have come to realize that I am just one partner in this dance. I say it's the balance of outcomes and impacts as one moves towards their goal that we need to keep our eye on. However, it's often sloppy and messy, like the soldier who must kill in order to protect that which he loves. To do nothing, or very little, in the hopes of not distrubing anyone is not a very worthy option, in my view. To be a bold investigator is a worthy endeavor, and I fully accept responsibility for all the pain I inflict. Orange, what would you like me to do with Tina? Leave her alone? To me that is unacceptible and only serves those who have made her the rageful woman she has become. I seriously doubt that her anger is rooted in annoyance with too many pesky reporters asking too many mundane questions. If it was, I wouldn't have had eleven doors slammed in my face and shunned twice by nuns in a convent. In my professional judgment, something bigger is going on than media overwhelm.

That's your excuse for invading the privacy of someone who has made it clear they want to be left alone? Someone who never went looking for "fame"? Yes, that's my "excuse." And shame, well, I do not subscribe to it because shame, blame and guilt are exceptionally dangerous. They can defeat the most vigorous warrior. Rather, I accept that I learn from all things that I do. I find it more useful to consider myself a divine being on a path to God, as is everyone else. I leave shame for those who need to control or manipulate others, or wish to be subservient.

Bruce, some of your work has been interesting. But, at least for me, your "rules of conduct" will forever be tainted by the tabloid article, complete with paparazzi photos, that you published on Tina. Quote That's the problem with disappearing for 30 years - people want to see you, especially if you're the primary witness in one of the top ten crime mysteries in America. So, Orange; where does DB C rank internationally? The bigger issue - and certainly more serious - is how to conduct the stories that involve exceptionally sensitive topics and people. Galen and I spent close to two years trying unsuccessfully to find a way to speak with Tina and to learn what had happened to her. From my point of view, Tina is not a whole and happy person, because people who do are not enraged recluses and do not have families that slam doors, lie, deceive and mis-direct folks who are curious and concerned. Further, are some paparazzi more honorable than others? I feel I possess a measure of honor in the type of pictures I displayed. The only photos I posted were side and three-quarter shots; no close-ups or head shots, and no discernible items in the background, such as license plate numbers. This was done intentionally. My concern for Tina was expressed to all the journalists I spoke with who wanted the pix and story, and we all kept Tina's actual name and exact address out of publicaiton - globally, as far as I know. I am proud of that, and proud of my brethren and sistren in media. As for interest, the Mountain News reached 100,000 hits today. Now, 40,000 of those came from the Tina interview and pix pieces, so the interest is clearly massive. That said, I do have mixed feelings about posting Tina's pix. I wish things were more clear. I wish Tina would talk. I wish I had her complete approval. I wish Tina was a different kind of celebrity - and I wish her a peace far beyond her cute-as-a-button backyard and a chilled glass of Chablis. But that's a good place to start.

Yeah but I'm in the doghouse...again! Don't take MY comments as an attack Bruce, they're not meant to be...,more of a 'heads up' in regard to how your coming across and perhaps to question the wisdom of the tack you were using. *** That's how I took your comments, Air-T. A tad harsh, but I accept. It is worthwhile knowing just how people take my postings. Woof! Is there room in the Dog House? (Remember, I'm channeling my innner Border Collie these days. We could have a party!!! Tequila? Toast Marla? Heck, she might join us!)

Airt, I happen to agree with you, even though I think Im on good terms with Bruce. Quote You are, G.

Next came John. Bruce found his name and posted it for the world to see. Quote I learned this man's name from Marla's Facebook page, where it was prominently displayed. I didn't know he was a husband or an ex until Marla told me. I posted it here to help shed some light on recent discussions. Goodbye, Marla. Via con Dios.

A review of my journalistic rules of conduct seems to be in order, today. First, everything you say to me via phone or in person is always deemed to be on record and available for publication unless you specifically request otherwise. You may ask for “off the record” after the fact while the conversation is still on-going, but please don’t make a habit of it. If you would like to review what I have written about what I heard you say, you are always welcome to ask for and receive a draft copy. You may review it for accuracy, but nothing else. You may request compositional changes, as I am always happy to listen to how you feel about what I have written, but I make no promises of making the attitudinal changes you might request. If you ask for a draft, I expect to have your corrections/suggestions back the next day. 24 hours max unless we make other arrangements. You may correct/challenge me over perceived inaccuracies at any time, even after publication, and I will review the offending material with you in depth as time allows. I have written about many of you on the dropzone and have offended, I guess, most of you at some point. I acknowledge that I am often aggressive, persistent and insistent. I make no apologies, but I do understand that I can make your life a tad difficult. I take copious notes, but as we have all learned, sometimes that is not enough. I refrain from using tape recorders because they generally interfere with building a substantive rapport, preventing us from having the quality of discussion that I, for one, desire. Along those lines, I do acknowledge that I possess “selective hearing.” Following from that, my notes can be a selective transcript. I admit this can be problematic, and so, after the recent spate of complaints of my misquoting folks I will refrain from my heavy application of quotation marks and the dramatic zippiness that is created by such usage. In its place I will consider phrasing statements in a more generalized manner. Unlike Danny Boy, I do not hold grudges, but if your behavior has been atrocious I will ask for an acknowledgment of at least hurting my feelings. I forgive as I am forgiven. Lastly, I offer you my pledge to be a journalist who strives for impecciblity, telling you a story that is interesting, fair-minded, and helps elevate our perspective to a loftier degree.

Blevins and B. Smith as well as many of the people here have their pet theories to defend, ... Quote I have no pet theory to defend. If I seem to be displaying one, please let me know.

Regarding Marla and SJSmith’s claims about her multiple marriages, etc. Here’s what I know of Marla’s marriages, and I got this from her directly in one of our many phone calls on Dec 9. Marla told me that John A. Santore was an ex-husband, and I am assuming that’s Jr. She also told me that she had three adult sons, and that when she divorced their father she gave him full custody of the kids, claiming that she worked 60 hours per week and he only 20. She characterized the father as “heroic” for taking on the parenting of the lads. She didn’t identify the man, but I assume it is a fellow named Brian, as the son that I tried to contact, which is the contact that made Marla furious at me, is on Facebook and describes the above individual as his father, and the son uses the same last name.

Aside from the statute of limitations having expired long ago, the family members have a perfect defense: Nobody really believed the skyjack story. They saw no hard evidence connecting Dewey and LD to the crime. LD was known to lie about many things including having an MD brother who treated him in the past. Lost of dysfunctional families humor known liars, like the war hero that never was in the military, the guy with the advanced degree who was a college dropout, etc. They just dont rock the boat. Enough of the strong arm stuff about family criminal culpability Bruce. It is only tangentially relevant and is a moot point at this late date. We are probing the accuracy and truthfulness of an adult's memory of what she claims to have witnessed at age 8. That's the main issue. Quote I agree completely with the priorities that you have described, Three-Seven-Seven. That's said, I don't want the family's responsibilities to justice to be discounted or dismissed. Border Collie is good. Woof.

Are you serious? Quote Yes, I am. And here's why. Marla has exposed her family to these investigations and I am following up. That's just the way it is. Marla has identified this cousin on a public forum; hence, the cousin is fair game for inquiry. Also, Marla has also told extensive stories about her family in public, such as at the syposium in Portland and they were most unflattering in the extreme, Plus, she named the individuals. So, again, I am following up in kind. In my view, Marla has changed her tune since Portland, and where she was once open and sharing she is now drawing battle lines by threatening law suits, using unacceptible language in professional discussions, and declaring certain indivudals off- limits to inquiry. Further, her list of acceptible family members with which to discuss this case seems to be shortening as the days go by. Remember, if Marla is telling the truth, then her family may be guilty of aiding and abetting a felony, interfering with a federal investigation, and conducting a cover-up for 38 years. I respect Marla and her story so mightily that I feel compelled to ask the questions I do. Under these conditions personal privacy becomes secondary. The real question becomes how to investigate the Cooper Clan in a way that is sensitive, fair-minded and leaves as many nerve fibers in place as possible for all of us. For me, the challenge is to be clear, pesistent and consistent - and not be a bully in the process of persuing justice.

I have a cousin who remembers the comics and their name. Don't expect me to provide you with his name you.... Quote Why don't you want us to talk with this cousin, Marla?

LD's fingerprints are missing from his military record. Quote Welcome to the DZ, Marla. You have LD's military record? Can you post it or tell us the pertinent details? Time of service, type of duty, physical characteristics, etc.? Thanks. Also, can you tell us about Curtis Eng? What's he like? Besides groaning about Blevs, what else does he groan about? Or laugh? Do you meet him in person or on the phone? How often would you say you've talked with him? When was the first time you spoke with him? Does he ever talk about the case in general terms? The political and cultural hub-bub surrounding DBC? Do you ever see Ayn? Does she sit in? What's she like? Thanks **************** Oops. Did I erase some formatting with my post?

Welcome to the DZ. So, can you tell us about Curtis Eng? What's he like? Besides groaning about Blevs, what else does he groan about? Or laugh? Do you meet him in person or on the phone? How often would you say you've talked with him? When was the first time you spoke with him? Does he ever talk about the case in general terms? The political and cultural hub-bub surrounding DBC? Do you ever see Ayn? Does she sit in? What's she like? Thanks.

Is that highlighted statement true? Some planes can set flaps at any angle between zero and max deflection. Don't have my manuals with me. 377 Quote That's what Rataczak told me. Perhaps I should ask for confirmation from Everett Johnson, the 727 pilot with World Airways that Sailshaw and I had lunch with about three months ago. Also, I believe that Bill told me that there was a pre-setting for 15 degrees. I'll check my notes at some point to confirm.

I just posted a report on my research into Dewey's employment at Boeing. Black ice now covers all approach lanes.... http://themountainnewswa.wordpress.com/2011/12/15/db-cooper-boeing-clams-up-on-employment-record-of-skyjacking-suspect/#more-4349

I am on the top of the dean's list! Actually, I've learned to see nuns in a whole new light since I started reading the DZ...it all started a long time ago in a hallway far, far away when I began a revolt against Mother Michaeline for giving homework on the weekends...

Quote Will there be, um...nuns teaching at the school?

Which makes me wonder why Marla hasn't showed up on DZ. Do any of you seers and wizards know why she hasn't? Quote Good question. It suggests that Miss M doesn't need us, nor the information we can provide. Further, M seems to have what she needs presently - her Facebook page. I encourage the curious to go visit her on Fb as she is currently letting her Inner Cougar run with luscious impunity. http://www.facebook.com/#!/marla.cooper?sk=wall BTW: I love being thought of as a wizard. Ahhhhh. Thank you.