livendive

great answer - a bit deep for mocking the masses today are we? Really? I must be having one of those million monkeys + million typewriters kind of daze. Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

Any idea what the super cool features are that requires such computing power? It seems to me that many programs grow and change and demand more power for no reason other than to glad hand others in the industry. Then again, I think WP5.1 was more user-friendly than the latest incarnation of Word. Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

I'd venture that regret is, at least in many instances, an unsatisfiable desire to change what one has already done. Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

I think the issue with Douva is NOT that there exists a safety net (read: contingiency plan) for people in poor economic conditions. The issue is the (originally stated) idea that people should plan on the safety net as as their primary means of health care coverage, instead of as a backup option. That is NOT what it was designed for. The whole idea that it's there, therefore don't even try to find a way to get your own coverage is very distasteful to almost everyone. I agree with that perspective, just not as vehemently as when I first entered this conversation. I've come around to thinking it's more of an ethical issue than financial. If they find insurance that they can afford, their contribution is going to be minimal and the brunt of any catastrophic costs will be born by everyone else regardless. It's just a matter of who's going to initially assume the debt, the hospital or the insurance company. Either way it will eventually be spread out and covered by others. I still think those people should pay their part just like the rest of us, but when they can't, you and I are going to be picking up their tab whether they have insurance or not. Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

With a low tolerance for financial risk, finding affordable health insurance and avoiding high physical risk activities in the interim would probably be a bit more sensible. Blues, Dave That's great in theory, Dave, but where do you draw the line? If skydiving is too physical, what about snow skiing? What about playing pickup basketball games? What about roller skating with your kids? Who are we to say how active a lifestyle people with lower incomes should be allowed to lead? On the one hand, I'm not going to dictate what level of risk they should be allowed to expose themselves to. What I think they shouldn't do is intentionally expose everyone else to that risk just because they don't have the ability to deal with the consequences of their decision. On the other hand, I just crossed over to your side of this debate, albeit for a somewhat different reason than has been stated here. Thinking about the economics of this, the only additional financial burden the people being discussed pose to society is the cost of their premiums, not the losses. If they were insured, their provider would pay the catastrophic losses and pass them on to their other customers. If they were not insured, the hospital would absorb the catastrophic losses and pass them on to other patients/insurance companies. Either way, everybody else pays, it's just matter of how they get there. Bottom line - if someone gets injured beyond their ability to pay, the rest of society is going to pick up the tab one way or another. Edit to add: I still think such people should be responsible for the cost of their premiums. If they end up massively injured and have to file for bankrupcy, there should be a residual debt that survives in which they pay some reasonable amount for that cost. Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

With a low tolerance for financial risk, finding affordable health insurance and avoiding high physical risk activities in the interim would probably be a bit more sensible. Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

Honestly, I though the overall goals were to tie Saddam's hands and prevent him from developing WMDs, so as to keep him from being any further threat to his neighbors. What were the additional objectives that were not being realized? Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

I reject your assertion of dishonesty. The purpose of the sanctions was not to put WMD programs on hold for as long as close scrutiny is enforced by inspectors. The purpose was to ensure that Iraq would not restart them when the Hans Blix left. Hans Blix was not satisfied with Iraqi compliance, was he? I understand he didn't support invasion as a response, but SH completely refused to comply with the cease agreement in many ways. The sanctions were only accomplishing a very short term objective. As Mark said in the original post, the problem was "Saddam had all his WMD scientists and technicians ready", i.e. they were still alive and in Iraq. The sanctions were working. He had no operating WMD programs. To get the longer term results you speak of, what would we have had to do, wait for everyone to die? Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

You're kidding, right? While their name may not appear on my bill, their costs most certainly do. Yes, there is a slight increase in your medical bills and/or insurance premiums. Again, that's the way the system works. Other people aren't required to have their lives ruined simply because the other option costs you a few dollars more than you would otherwise pay. The alternative to having their life ruined is to pay a few dollars more every month/year in order to keep me from having to pick up the tab. If they make a conscious choice to not pay those premiums, they should no longer have the option of passing the consequences of that decision on to me. That said, I'd wouldn't mind there being a basic healthcare plan offered to low-income people on a sliding scale with the balance of the costs picked up by myself and others who can afford it, be that through taxes or as a condition of running a health insurance company. Speaker's corner anyone? Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

You're kidding, right? While their name may not appear on my bill, their costs most certainly do. Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

And when they explore those other options, they'll be passing their bills onto others who weren't skydiving without insurance. That's being irresponsible. Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

That's the smartest paragraph in this discussion. Insurance is a gamble, and the providers are the house. Though they might lose their ass on one individual, they structure their rates such that they're going to make money off of most people. Gambling in this game is all about acceptable risk exposure. Some people go to Vegas willing to risk several thousand dollars, some people only a hundred. The casino will likely make money off of both. Some people only carry catastrophic medical coverage, others carry low deductibles and stay inside an HMO network. The insurers will likely make money off of both of them. The uninsured are the only people guaranteed not to make money for insurers, but they're also the ones exposed to massive risk. I don't feel particularly sorry for a guy who loses his house because he mortgaged it on a trip to Vegas, and I don't feel particularly sorry for someone who racks up 6 figure medical bills while skydiving uninsured. If they're a friend, I might help them out anyhow, because we forgive our friends their mistakes. A stranger...well, he shouldn't have gambled so heavily. Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

no babe...that would be you sha How about "sperm ashtray"? Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

I specifically pointed out that Mark's post said in one paragraph that the sanctions needed to be ended in order for WMD programs to be restarted, and in another it said "The sanctions were working" was a myth. That's dishonesty. In another thread on here you're talking about how word's meanings are important. Please explain how the statement "Iraq is in a state of civil war" is a myth. I'll help you out with a definition. Civil war is "A war between factions or regions of the same country" or "A state of hostility or conflict between elements within an organization" The second "myth"/debunking doesn't even make sense. "The 2003 Invasion was Illegal. Only according to some in the UN." If it's only according to some in the UN, it's not really a myth, is it? And if it's according to more than some in the UN, than the debunking doesn't work. Overthrowing Saddam only helped Iran. That's a top ten myth? Really? There's thousands of people out there propogating this? The Invasion Was a Failure. Saddam's police state was overthrown and a democracy established, which was the objective of the operation. On the one hand, this invasion was about WMDs, or it was at least sold as such, and we all know it. To state otherwise is to be dishonest. On the other hand, if the objective was already accomplished, why the fuck is Bush sending in *more* troops? It's a myth that the invasion help al Queda? al Queda was not hiding in Iraq, thus invading Iraq simply committed our troops to a task other than chasing down al Queda. Additionally, our continued occupation has made a shitload more terrorists than it has killed. How many car-bombings were going on in Iraq before we got there? How many suicide bombings? How many people killed as a result of such terrorism attacks? So we quit chasing down al Queda and moved into a country that wasn't particularly prone to terrorism problems, and once there made many more friends for al Queda than they previously had (the enemy of my enemy is my friend and all that). Letting them off the hook and giving them many more allies sounds like helping them to me. 8-Iraqis Were Better Off Under Saddam. Most Iraqis disagree. Check election results and opinion polls. Reporters tend to ask Iraqi Sunni Arabs this question, but they were the only ones who benefited from Saddams rule. Have you asked all the dead Iraqis and their families? The 3.7 million refugees? I can't find it now, but last week I read an article that said 90% of Iraqis consider Americans there to be "occupiers" rather than "liberators". Sure, I can't cite it, but neither did the author who picked the word "most" above. Is there any substantiation at all for the debunking of this supposed "myth"? What question on the ballot gave election results that show Iraqis were not better off under Saddam? I bet there was no such question. This entire thing is so subjective as to be absurd, and the debunking is supposition at best. Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

What the fuck are you talking about? And leave my ass out of it! Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

Hey, not everyone can be a babe magnet. Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

So it's nothing but chicks judging both the men's contest and the women's?! Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

With the work I do, I'd hope I'd prepared to easily handle such a situation. There was another story on that page that was pretty interesting (but also very sad). A couple prepares their young children for mom's impending death Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

That's a pretty broad brush there. I work at skydiving on the weekends...that doesn't mean I'm too lazy to work during the week, nor does it mean I should go somewhere where I can work all week. I agree that I'm NOT a full-time skydiver, and I don't want to be. That's beside the point though. I think there's one detail we might be missing in this discussion. Will the average privately purchased medical insurance policy pay for treatment of injuries sustained while on the job? I'm thinking the insurers might try to deny the claim and tell an instructor to take it up with L&I. I know when I've been injured, my insurance company sends me a questionnaire that very specifically asks whether it was a work-related incident. Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

The toilet was not invented for the sole purpose of transporting your cum to a woman... Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

I was driving through western Montana a couple weeks ago and saw a moose on the side of the road. He made as if he was going to dart in front of me when I didn't have the traction to stop in time, but then moved back towards the woods. Got my heart pounding! I'm accustomed to seeing lots of deer (only hit one) and elk, but it was immediately very clear that hitting a moose would take damage and risk of injury to a whole new level. Those things are HUGE! His ass was pointed towards me as I went by, and I'd estimate it's height as being about 3/4 of the way up the windows of my pickup. Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

Well in that case, let's just break out the Babel fish and be done with it. Edit to add: How's the neck doing? Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

Actually no, I watched Beetlejuice, and am thus currently considering the possibility of an afterlife. Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

It consists of totally dishonest misrepresentations, skewed irrationally to appeal to emotions, and is not even worthy of a point by point response. Billvon still hit a couple of them though, so see those. Also, if the WMD programs were shut down to lack of money, doesn't that mean the sanctions were working? Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)

??? I'm more agnostic than atheistic, but I can imagine a higher power without thinking of it as a deity. I am a "higher power" compared to the mice living in my shed, but that doesn't make me a god. I think of them as pretty simple creatures, hope they don't get too destructive (or I'll have to "smite them"), and they can't possibly understand my actions, but that doesn't mean I created them or expect them to worship me. Beings get progessively more complex in our ecosystem, and though we've not yet identified any "higher" than us, it would be arrogant in the extreme to presume we are the ultimate beings. Those above us are simply more complex than we can comprehend, just like you and I are beyond the understanding of those mice. That progression of increasing complexity makes them no more gods than it does us. Blues, Dave "I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!" (drink Mountain Dew)