carmenc

While I disagree with much of his politics, Leon Panetta is probably the most honest person in government service. His personal integrity (and ethics) are light years above Nancy Pelosi's. That's true, but Panetta was not present during the briefings, nor does he have any way of knowing the accuracy of the reports he quoted. I don't like Pelosi and if she resigned it would please me, but it's not Panetta's credibility against hers, it the credibility of the people who wrote the reports against hers, and torturers have no credibility in my book.

"Righties" like the latest Republican presidential nominee? Funny, I kept hearing how he was too moderate for the righties in the GOP.

How about waterboarding? Righties tell us it's not torture, and the rich would dislike it every bit as much as the poor.

To be precise, Obama turned this over to the courts. Had he really believed in this position, he would have signed an executive order saying the same. Being the limp spine political animal he is (and seeking re-election) he gave up his executive power so as to seem to be “fair”. In essence, he is a wimp. He has no guts and cares only about the polls and his “popularity. He could give a shit less about the troops. Your opinion has no value, because if Obama declared that the Sun rose in the east this morning you'd find fault.

And he's exactly the kind of person I'd put up against the wall first when the revolution comes. Not that I disagree with what he said in your quoted material, but he sure said a lot of other crap I don't agree with. For instance, this gem; I'll let you Google that one. And . . . just how did he make HIS (tax free) money anyway? Oh yeah, bilking it out of little old ladies. So you agree with this quote? I have no idea who HE is. Dont mater in this post Really? I disagree with you. Anyway, he seems to be against inheriting wealth. Only those who work for it are worthy.

It would be a big deal to me if she decided to run for President. It is one of the reasons I wouldn't vote for her. So... do you believe in checks and balances? Do you think that she would be able to overturn a Supreme Court ruling? If President she will have the power to nominate SC justices. So does Pres. Obama. And the concerns that others have about his appointments are just as valid as yours would have been had McCain been elected (and do note... McCain was the one running for President; not Palin) But when anyone considers questioning his selections, then they become either "racist" or "Anti-American" or some other attack. Would Pres Obama make his SC appts based on a single item issue? VERY UNLIKELY. Same probably could have been said for McCain. But since he wasn't elected, and since Palin was never in a position to nominate one at all... I think many are just trying to slander her cuz it's just a popular thing to do. Of course her opinion on this is important. It illustrates very clearly how extreme her position is compared to the American mainstream. See.... here, you're just proving my point. No-one has denied Palin's right to hold any opinion she wishes. How Americans view her opinions is up to them. Her stated position to deny abortions to victims of rape and incest illustrates to many of us that she is not a person we wish to see in the White House. OK?

ONE hot summer’s day a Fox was strolling through an orchard till he came to a bunch of Grapes just ripening on a vine which had been trained over a lofty branch. “Just the things to quench my thirst,” quoth he. Drawing back a few paces, he took a run and a jump, and just missed the bunch. Turning round again with a One, Two, Three, he jumped up, but with no greater success. Again and again he tried after the tempting morsel, but at last had to give it up, and walked away with his nose in the air, saying: “I am sure they are sour.” If he was a working fox he might have been clever and dragged something towards the grapes and reached higher. Your story is useless and further demonstrates your blind loyalty to the Democratic party. The story is over 2,000 years old and demonstrates wisdom that clearly eludes you. www.umass.edu/aesop/fable.php?n=10

I wonder what the "boy racers" will buy now.

Generally speaking, when an industry pays a group of scientists to conduct a study, the people doing the paying will see what they want to see in the reports. That is not the case here, is it? I think that, on average, scientists are considerably more ethical than businessmen or politicians. That's EXACTLY what happened. The scientists made a report showing it had an effect and the people that paid for it read it a different way so it would agree with their world view. I was under the impression that they simply ignored it.

Generally speaking, when an industry pays a group of scientists to conduct a study, the people doing the paying will see what they want to see in the reports. That is not the case here, is it? I think that, on average, scientists are considerably more ethical than businessmen or politicians.

"It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not understanding it!", Upton Sinclair

hmmm looks like the tree huggers have it all wrong So, using CFC's destroyed the ozone but saves our planet from overheating. what a conundrum "It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not understanding it!", Upton Sinclair Don't you work for a power company?

I'm not sure how you define "righties;" there have, however, been a number of individual conservatives and conservative-identified organizations who have opposed torture, including waterboarding and other euphemisms for torture. E.g., 5 Reasons Torture Is Always Wrong: And why there should be no exceptions Stand Up and Be Counted The Conservative Case Against Torture Torture and moral bankruptcy More on Torture On Bush's torture policies Opposition to torture has long been a uniting, non-partisan issue across America. It's been one of the many things that makes America great! It's been a key part of President Reagan’s invocation John Winthrop’s vision for America to be that “shining city on a hill.” /Marg I do not like the position that indicates I support torture. I clearly do not but, there is a raging debate of what exactly torture is. I do not think waterboarding is. I think bambo under your nails is......... "Following World War II war crime trials were convened. The Japanese were tried and convicted and hung for war crimes committed against American POWs. Among those charges for which they were convicted was waterboarding." Sen. John McCain, November 29, 2007, in St. Petersburg, Florida.

White collar crooks generally make blue collar ones look like rank amateurs in the amount they steal - think Madoff, think Ken Lay. Not only that, white collar crooks usually get minimal sentences and sent to minimum security "country club" prisons.

How is receiving a classified briefing a culpable offense? What would they be charged with?

How do you propose to stop gun homicides without disarming law-abiding sane citizens? ??? So you reckon that disarming LAW ABIDING, SANE citizens is the only way to stop gun homicides?

And there would have been even more if those people had not been armed to defend themselves. John, you missed his fallacy. Remember that he counts the people defending themselves as committing homicide, and the criminals they kill as "homicide victims." Have you bothered to check the rate of unjustifiable homicide in the USA? According to the FBI there were over 10,500 murders and non-negligent manslaughters committed with guns in 2007 (last year for which complete data are available). . That works out to 29/day on average, or over 500 since the beginning of April. That EXCLUDES self defense and justifiable homicides So his number of 400 was an underestimate, not a fallacy. Facts can be so irritating, can't they?

And another nutter with a gun: www.presstelegram.com/news/ci_12170353

Some good news: www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/04/09/AR2009040902497.html

Can you provide a link to any post where someone said that you personally should not own a firearm? Or are you just trolling?

I know history. Is the NBER wrong, then (according to you)?

www.reuters.com/article/worldNews/idUSTRE53668720090407

That's the 5th mass shooting spree by a nutter in the last month. Clearly the present laws are working well The NRA must be well pleased with itself.

"That other guy did it too!" is a ridiculous justification. I'm pretty tired of hearing it from the Obama administration, and from lots of people here. That was not a justification, it was pointing out the absurdity/hypocrisy of downwardspiral's comment. I haven't heard any such thing from the Obama administration on this issue.

Better than coming across like a moron, though. www.president-bush.com/moroncontrov.html