Michele

Morning, Jakee Which didn't answer my question. And that question was So do you think it's a cultural issue or a religious issue? Wow, thanks. It's been a very long time since someone called me naive. Sorry, though, you're incorrect. I'm not naive. Perhaps you missed the point. Micro said it pretty well; if the choice is there (and it is; condoms are available) and someone chooses to not avail themselves of protection, then they might encounter STDs and unwanted pregnancies. Your position that all people are sheep, and not able to learn, grasp, and employ a potentially lifesaving device negates the reality of things. I'll not call you naive, nor anything else; rather, I'll just point out that personal choices are key. It is my belief that when I go to a church, I will be exposed to their faith. When I go to a government health offical, I will be exposed to their positions, as well. It then becomes my responsibility to make a decision, and to employ that decision. Personal responsibility. Personal accountability. Personal choice. Pretty clear to me. And that is your opinion. Again, I ask you...is monogamy/abstinence taught in the church? Yes. Is birth control available? Yes. Are the governments in question advocating the use of "junk science" as well? Yes. Is it personal responsibility/choice in question? Yes. IOW, if one adheres to the church's basic position - faithful to the spouse once married (on both sides), and abstinence until marriage - the chances of an unwanted pregancy prior to marriage is nil. So is the chance of an STD, prior to and consequent to marriage, if one follows the teaching of the church. If one adheres to the teaching of the governments and avails themselves of the use of condoms, then again, the risk of STDs and unwanted pregnancies goes way down. Doesn't eradicate them completely, but reduces them quite a bit. If accurate info is provided, and a person doesn't adhere to it, then whose fault does that become? Blaming a church for teaching what they believe in is simply wrong. Maybe it's naive, but that's the way I see things. Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

Getting ready for school, stressing about school, worrying about a class for school...and yeah, filling the tank and going for a drive in my 'vert!!! Too damned much fun. Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

Christel, did your husband's passing make your child ignore reality? Did you immediately remove all photos of him, so the child could "face reality?" Or did you, as I suspect, talk with your child and help them get to a better place with their father's death. As you got there, too...because that's what being a good parent means; you help your child through the hard times. That's all they're doing with the flat daddies and mommies. Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

Agreed wholeheartedly. But the question arises now...should it be the church who teaches that, or should it be the educational system? The government? Whose responsibility is it to teach that abstinence is best, but here's condoms/bc so you can live to see thirty. I don't believe it's the church's responsibility; they teach faith and religion. They teach what they believe. If they don't believe that condom usage is appropriate to teach, they're just not going to do that. So who is responsible for the teaching? Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

(Not directed at Max...just using his quote) They ran a story on "flat daddies and mommies" today on one of the early shows on MSNBC. They had a mother and a 6 year old girl talking about the flat daddy the little one has. From her perspective, it's a good thing. She knows it's not the same thing as Daddy, but it brings her a sense of family and comfort, of continuation and of love. How the hell can that be anything other than good?? A 6 year old still sleeps with a teddy bear. This is nothing more than a teddy bear that's full size and looks like Daddy or Mommy. No reason on this planet that a child should be deprived of something which brings them comfort at an age like that. Separation is tough, and deployment is harder than just separation. Let the kids do what they need to do to continue to feel as good as they can while in the uncertain world of military deployment. Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

Well, if you keep them in the plastic bag, they won't be "live" for very long. Then you'll have to figure out how to pluck them and eviscerate them, too. Are you sure your neighbor likes you? Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

I stand corrected. Thanks. Not too bad for a non-catholic, hey? Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

That was a great vid, thanks for posting! I doubt I could do much better (did I hear the pilot say *450 knots!!!!*), but it was great to watch. Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

You're welcome, Wendy. And I wish all children were wanted, loved, and cherished by their parents, too. Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

Jakee, as I said, I don't speak for the church. Do you think that's a cultural issue or a religious issue? IOW, does the church promulgate extramarital sex, or is it a cultural issue? If you trace the issue to it's roots, that's where the solution can be found. Time and again, people blame a religious organization for preaching their beliefs. That's what they do! Religious organizations of all ilk say what they believe is the "right" thing, and the "correct" thing according to their faith. To hold a religious organization responsible when they preach/teach their position which goes against what you personally believe is, imho, fallacious and irresponsible. Orthodox Jews don't eat pork or shellfish (bottom feeders). There are valid reasons for this (frankly, valid for when they were written, some 3 thousand years ago; not quite so valid nowadays). Should we rail against the orthodoxy and scream at them for an outdated rule which was instated so people didn't die? No, and even those who refrain from eating pork and shellfish or keep kosher nowadays are respected. Religion teaches religion. Public health officials teach public health. When a church teaches it's doctrine, it needs to be seen as that doctrine, and not held responsible for things which are not criminal (i.e. pedophilia in the RC church is still a crime; however, I don't believe they teach a doctrine of molestation...so that's a poor example). If a country was run by the catholic church, I'd expect to see religious teaching involved in the government (ala Rome). A good example of a religiously run government is Iran (see Darius' argument for dress codes...it's religious in nature, and implemented by a government run by a religous group). However, I am unaware of any catholic run government in Africa; holding the church responsible for anything other than the teaching of their own religion in a country they don't govern is, imho, a misplacement of responsibility. To ask an entire religious organization (whatever it may be) to not teach what they sincerely believe in is a violation of freedom of religion, in my opinion. As long as it's not a criminal endeavor (ala Jim Jones, or those in other religions which teach blowing up themselves and taking 10 others with them, which is murder), then their ability to teach what they believe in is what separates them from another religious organization. Keeping the separation between religious teaching and government responsibility is paramount for both to operate effectively. I honestly can't fault the catholic church for teaching what they believe in. I can, and do, fault those public health officials who do nothing to help the situation, and who, in fact, encourage false remedies and ignorantly espouse causative cures (i.e. sex with a virgin will cleanse the carrier of an STD). Frankly, the governments have fallen down on the job, and to blame a church for that is misplaced. Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

I'm not catholic, so please don't take my word as the church's position. But as it was explained to me, when I asked similar questions, it has to do with the idea that premarital sex is not a wise choice, and the availability of avoidance of consequences of premarital sex is made much easier by the use of contraceptives (including condoms). In other words, if one does not engage in pre-marital sex, one will not have to face the consequences of sexually transmitted disease or pregnancy (or both). If one already has premarital sex, it is often the case that "this one time" won't matter, and unprotected sex will occur. We all know that it happens; it's a rare event that someone can stand up and swear that they've never had unprotected sex and be truthful. So the only real way to avoid the consequences is to not engage in pre-marital sexual activity. To give someone a (false) sense of security while using condoms (i.e. they break, are used incorrectly, et cetera), a person might believe that there is no risk to sexual activity. The urging of the use of condoms presumes sexual activity, whereas abstinence is advocated by the church, and so the use of condoms is frowned upon as it "provides" an easier decision to have premarital sex if the consequences are "avoided." Additionally, the church believes that the sexual union between husband and wife is sacred; a gift of bodies uniting and bringing great pleasure while also providing an opportunity for conception. To refuse that part of the gift of sex (conception) by using contraception is throwing a gift back into God's face, as it were. Specifically in Africa, I think, the church believes the use of condoms encourages promiscuity, and promiscuity tends to expose a person to a wide array of stds and pregnancy. Do I agree with this position? No. But then again, I can see their point and understand their view. They are not the government there, and they are not the Drs there. Theirs is a religious perspective, and I'm not even sure if they are a predominant religion in Africa (perhaps some parts, but I doubt all, or even the majority, of Africa is catholic). What I'd like to see happen is education about AIDs, and how to stop it's rapid, horrific advances. That will come down to the local level, I think, and it will also include some of the leaders who currently advocate sex with virgins, olive oils, bark from a specific tree, and whatnot as preventative and curative measures. The lack of education, imho, is what causes the greatest grief, and that education is not the responsibility of the catholic church. Rather, it's the responsibility of the government(s) to educate their citizenry, and that is not happening in any real, tangible sense of the word. Anyway, like I said, I'm not a theologian, and not a member of the catholic church. Please don't rely on my word as if I were speaking for them; I'm just trying to share what I understand of why the church advocates abstinence rather than sexual activity in a purely sociological sense. Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

I just hope no-one dies before all this is settled and over... After checking both on line and via telephone with the school to verify that the single class I need is open (anatomy), yesterday I run over the hill to the other campus, in traffic, to sign the admissions form I submitted on line. Standing in line for over an hour is yucky, but whatever. After standing in line and scribbling my name in one single place, I get sent over to the registration line. That's also at least an hour long, and there's no vending machines with water in them available. So I stand there, parched, stressed, and hot... I finally make it to the front of the line, ask to be registered for the class, and am informed that it is closed. Has been closed since, oh, July. I feel sweat start to form on my brow. My eyes are crossing, and my stress level just jumped high enough to induce a stroke. July. So I inform them that their website has *all* anatomy classes open. That whatever class that is still open I'll take, and rearrange my schedule to accomodate it. I'm calmly informed that they've *all* been closed since July. Sweat is pouring off me now, and I can feel my pulse jiving to it's own beat. I wonder if I'll explode right there at the counter, or be able to forestall it until I'm in my car. I ask them to go onto their own website and verify that it says they're still open. The nice lady does, and agrees with me: according to the website, all the classes are still open. When I ask why, the nice lady tells me that she doesn't know, as all the classes are closed. She shows me her screen, and sure enough, all classes are in red - indicating they're full. I ask to speak with a supervisor, figuring that there must be a hitch in the webbie's git-along. Explaining the problem to him, he nods understandingly. He really does understand...he's sympathetic and nice. Then he tells me "well, there are 32 seats in all. We close the class when it gets to 27, so we can save some seats for those who need it." So I explain to him I'm one of those who need it, and he says "you don't fit the criteria." "What criteria?" I ask...and he says "that's confidential." I nearly pass out. My eyes are crossing. I am having a really hard time talking without saying things like "you mf'ing bastard" and "I'll destroy your landscaping, all the expensive plants first," or "I'll bring beer to class and not share!" Instead, I ask him what he thinks is the best solution to my situation. He kindly says "not too many options available for you," and explains my only recourse is to go to the class, be there on the first day, and hope that someone drops out, doesn't show, or decides the coursework will be too hard. I look at him, hair standing on end. "So you mean, go and beg?" "Well, beg and hope" he chuckles. My hair is crawling. My toes are curling. I am lifting on the balls of my feet, a sure sign I'm ready to fight. I thank him through tightly pressed lips (Mama taught me politeness). I am sure I'm snarling, and I can only hope the lips curling back off my teeth will be mistaken for a smile. He cheerfully says "you're welcome, and good luck." I flee. At least I can drive with my top down. Getting back on the road was a relief, even though it was now bumper to bumper traffic. My radio is blaring, and Phil Collins' "Can you feel it coming in the air tonight" is playing. Terribly appropos. So, next Tuesday will find me begging. I figure if I bring a six-pack of beer, and offer to take him for a ride in my car, I might have a chance of getting in. If I don't get this class, it will mean another semester, and about $12,000 (school costs plus living expenses for 6 months). And yes, I've looked all over for this class elsewhere, and no joy. At least their websites show it closed. WLAC's webbie still shows them open...waiting for those students who fit the mysterious criteria. God in Heaven above...I sure hope I make it through. And that everyone lives. Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

I can't drive my car to it's potential...and doubt I ever will. I'm too aware of other idiots on the street/highway, and because my s2000 is so small, I worry that other cars don't see me. However, I have taken it to my own personal level (significantly less than that car can perform at), and there was nothing I could do to make it slide, over/understeer, or loose traction. Mulholland at 55 mph (sometimes at 60), and still couldn't get it to do anything other than hold onto the street and beg for more. And yes, I'm one of those weenies who will pull over the moment a cop turns on his lights. I usually don't get a ticket, either. It's been YEARS since I got cited, but I get pulled over about 3x a year. No chase for me. Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

Hey, wait a minute. Muenkel brought it up as an example of potential violations of the guy card rules, and I was just saying that in some circumstances, that's not a real violation, and a guy can keep his card in spite of helping his child out of a "sticky" situation. And I'll agree with both you and Muenkel - my Pop's the BOMB!!! For many reasons, too many to count. Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

I was 15. Caught without supplies. I made my Dad go buy stuff for me. I explained I couldn't leave the house exactly right then, and so he went and got some stuff for me. He's finally forgotten it...but I haven't. I still feel bad for that. But no-one can take Pop's guy card away; he fought in WWII in Burma/China/India. That automatically dispenses a nonrevocable guy card. Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

Really? The guy who's handling my files (that I have to get more paperwork to in a few minutes...) told me that all the grants have likely been given out, and that it will take 6-8 weeks once the paperwork is complete to recieve any loans. He did tell me that one of them was "guaranteed" but couldn't tell me the amount. I've done some research, and found some info, but I don't know the formula they use to determine amount, so I have no idea how much I'll be borrowing...only that it's gonna be a while before I see any of it. So I am stocking up on cat food for my herd and Ramen noodles for me. Lisa, I'm registered over at Fastweb, and have been submitting applications for scholarships several times a week (I figure you have to have a plan; my plan is three new scholarship applications per week). I haven't heard from anyone, so dunno if I'm going about it the right way, but I *am* trying. Maybe I'll get something soon... Sigh. All this stuff is just overcomplicated. There's about 100 things I can fix to make it more streamlined, but since I don't run the school system, I can't do anything but march along with all the other ants towards the honey pot. I gotta go march off to the financial aid office...there should be about 100 people sitting there along with me. I guess I'll take a book. Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

No kidding. Actually, I'm far more concerned about the Winter Intersession (chemistry in 5 weeks...) than I am about the Spring...but that's 'cause it comes first. Come Spring, I'm gonna be a whole lot grayer, I think. Yes, and I might. I've got a tentative "deadline" (self imposed...I'm old!!) to get the underclass work done ASAP, and that's the way things are falling right now. I'm trying to keep Summer sessions for stupid stuff like PE, and the upper level english they want me to take. I tried to do that, too. For me, this semester, PoliSci balances the rest of the classes. Winter Intersession is balanced with Speech (why, oh why!!! are they making me take that? It's the dumbest class I know of!), and English is balancing out the Spring semester (english is easy for me). 'Kay, so I'm not so good at balancing. But I did make the effort. Besides, if I think that far ahead, I'll get overwhelmed, and lay in bed instead of going to school. This whole "growing up" stuff is hard! No wonder I didn't do it for so long. Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

I most certainly don't see him as the victim; I see the whole situation as a powerplay that overextended Cruise's hand. I see it as a studio deciding that a stable member is more liability than cash cow. And I see it as the culmination of quite a few years of bizarre, unacceptable behavior. The combination of all of that was the end of the road for him at Paramount. I don't think he's a victim, unless you mean he's a victim of his own ego, his own eccentricities, and his own behavior. Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

Thanks, Jaye. I just finished researching textbook costs. For the 4 classes (and two labs) that I am taking this semester, the cost is somewhere near $600. That's 2/3 of my rent! This whole running back and forth to Financial Aid (going there in a little bit this morning, too...) and getting all that done, and then finding out it will be probably 6-8 weeks before I get any financial help means that I get to scrimp and live on Ramen noodles...oh well. So I'm back to the main campus, and then over the hill to the other campus to make sure I'm admitted and registered properly, then register for Anatomy. I was going to buy the Anatomy text today, but...it's $160 plus a lab book. So I have to wait until I start class next week to get the book. I wanted to get a headstart on things, but it doesn't look like that will happen. Meh. It could be worse, I guess...I'll muddle through as best I can, and then get to the coursework and get good grades. To Kris and Jaye - I will look at what the transfer school needs, and see what I can find out. I called this morning, but no appointments are being made until October (their students come first, understandably). So I won't know anything there for about 6 weeks, either. Such is life, I suppose... Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

If I recall correctly, a guy named DZBone, who is such a dear, was my first "friend" here. 'Course, Da Bytch was there too, and HH...I think it was my third post that I wrote about my AFF cutaway, and from that post, I made tons and tons of friends, all who reached out and helped me get back into the sky and worked diligently to help me get my fear under control. Sudsy and I were on the same plane a few times for AFF, too...but I met him in real life before he started posting. Quade made a point to come find me shortly after, and sat with me explaining, in detail, why birds don't crash, and comparing it to canopy flight. That one lesson taught me so much about how to handle landing (although I still crash regularly) and showed me a side to skydiving that I wasn't really aware of 'til then - the camraderie and the willingness to help new kids. Then there was Sinister69 and a few others, who've since left the sport. They hold a fond place in my heart, as well. Over the years, I've met some amazing and wonderful people including, but not limited to, Sparky, Micro/Sinker, Muenkel, Nightengale, and ever so many others. These are people I know I can count on when the chips are down, and who hopefully realize that they can count on me for the same. And there are still SSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO many people I want to meet. 'Til then, we'll just trade posts and pm's... Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

Jaden, thanks for that note. I will - and am - following my heart. It's just a very strange road towards it, you know? LOL! Kris, thanks for the advice. I'll make it a point to run out to the Uni I am thinking about, and checking into their programs. I still think that upper level maths are in my future...I'm just not that lucky. So I'd better be good, you know? Thanks for the encouragement, everyone. Tomorrow, I have to go to the other campus, drop some paperwork off for financial aid, go to the bookstore at both places, and if I have any time left, try to remember to call Bozo... Someone remind me to call him, all right? Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

Tomorrow, then. So forgive me already!! Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

Forgive me. Let me get dinner in my belly, and I'll call. I'm sooooooooo sorry. Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

I am breathing...and thanks for the vibes, cheesy. Chaos, you're much farther along than I am...haven't you gotten used to all this? LOL. The beaurocratic bullshit abounds. I just want a road map; take this here, that there, and this over there at this time...I'll go and do the coursework, but this planning takes it right out of me. Blah. And it all has to get settled by next Monday, when school starts. As if that's going to happen. Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~

I had the bright idea over the summer to go back to school. I'm not happy with my life, my career is dead-ended, and so it's time for a change. I reinstate myself over at the local community college. Plan out a heavy but great schedule. Register on-line for all my classes, and think "phew, that's done..." But no. Their computer crashes, so all my classes are lost. I do everything I can to get the schedule reconfigured, but apparently lots of people had the stupid crash wipe out their stuff, and were re-registering at the same time. Now, all that I can get is about 1/3 of what I had at the times I want. The alternative is take the less desireable times for the necessary classes. Well, fine, I'll suck it up, and take classes every evening for 5 months. And all day on Saturday. It's only for 5 months, I can do anything for 5 months. But it's going to suck leaving school at 11 pm... Whatever. So I go in for my financial aid appointment. They hand me tons of paperwork, including the request for an explanation for why I left college in 1984. The answer is I was stupid and influenced by some not-so-upright citizens, I was 19, and I thought that playing was more important. The guy tells me "that's not going to fly. Re-submit it with a better reason..." so of course that's put me way behind on getting financial aid. And now they want me to see a counselor specifically to fill out some paperwork. The same day, I run over to the counseling office for some informal information. I find out I don't have to take upper level math (oh thank you God!!!), my high school chemistry will count towards the pre-requisites needed, they'll accept CLEP scores, and my AP english counts towards fulfilling the english requirements in college. YAYAYAYAY! Great news!!! Bad news is that I have to take Bio 3 before I take Anatomy, and I can't take Physiology before I complete Anatomy. I turned in the paperwork to financial aid last week. They have me schedule a sit down appointment with a counselor, and we set it for today. While there, I go ahead and ask if I can't take Bio 3 and Anatomy concurrent, rather than as a pre-requisite. No, I'm informed, they want it in that order for a reason. However, the counselor I'm talking to suggests that I look at other campuses in the city college system, because some of them allow Anatomy without a pre-req. Fine. So I research, locate, and submit an application to another campus, for the express reason of taking Anatomy concurrent. Today, sitting with the counselor, he informs me that while I can indeed take Anatomy over at the other campus, and yes, there is no pre-requisites there and they will honor it over here, I have to take both English 101 as well as Chemistry. Add to the wonderful news that I have to take upper class maths, and I nearly slid off the chair. When I told him that the other person said I didn't, he informed me they were wrong. But I have the paper showing what I need, I say. Show me, says he. He reviews it, and agrees with himself; the other person is wrong, and he's not sure why I got the paper saying differently. So now, my class load for the next year goes like this: Biology 3 (4 units) Math 115 (math for dummies...I'll fit in perfectly!) (5 units) Political Science (3 units) Anatomy (at the other campus) 4 units Winter Intersession: Chemistry (4 units) Speech 101 (3 units...sigh...) Spring '07 Microbiology (4 units) Physiology (4 units) Math 125 (5 units) Psych 41 (3 units) English 101 (on-line, 3 units) Summer Session 1 Unknown (at least one math)(working towards completion of pre-req's) Summer Session 2 Unknown (working towards completion of pre-req's) All this so I can be ready to transfer to Cal State system in the Fall. I *thought* it was a good idea...but everything is so confused, and so scattered, that I'm not sure I'm on the right track anymore. When two counselors give diametrically opposed information, and financial aid is needing all this paperwork, I'm thinking a career change to McDonald's would be an option. Sigh. I'm frustrated oodles and tons. Just thought I'd vent. I wish they'd get their story straight, and get me the accurate info. I'd like to know - really, really know- what I'm doing. I don't mind doing the work (although the maths and chemistry will kick my patootie hard...), but I really mind not knowing what the heck I'm supposed to do. And if they're in the same system, why is there a pre-requisite for Anatomy at one campus but not at another? Same syllabus, same units, same everything....it's just silly. Silly, I tell ya. And frustrating. ARRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH! At least I can go to class with my car, and enjoy the commute. Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~