peregrinerose

I think I know where we're talking past each other then... "Good" does not mean "Perfect". Say the student does 3PP, maybe misses the first one and I guide the hand for that one, but the student gets the next two without help. It wasn't flawless, but it was good, and 'good' is what I would write in the log book. Does the student learn anything from me nit picking about a slightly off first touch when the remaining 2 were fine? No... that's the whole point of a practice pull. To me 'good' means that the skill at hand was done reasonably well, not necessarily perfectly, but well enough to be safe, for the instructors to know what's going on, and for it to be acceptable even if done the exact same way on the next skydive. It might be something worked on with later jumps, but I'm not going to harp missing a practice touch, for example, when the student de-arched the entire skydive.... there are priorities. Fix the big problems first, fine tune later. Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

He doesn't even need to invest in a rake, he was already offered a job at the DZ that he turned down Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

You aren't shooting yourself in the foot

You are very quick to crucify other instructors (and/or the student) without having been there for the jump or talking with the instructors in question. I've been a doctor and skydiving instructor long enough to know that people seldom recall things accurately when they are trying to absorb a whole lot of information in a comparitively short time. More than once I've heard butchered accounts of what was actually said/done... not because the person intends to be misleading, but that's honestly how they recall it. That's just how the brain can work sometimes, especially when clouded by adrenaline and pain/embarrassment. I've seen instructors spend 2 hours with a student in a debrief only to have the student come back the next day and tell me that the instructor didn't debrief them much... even though I was on the DZ and saw it happen. Someday it will be you in the other instructors' shoes... some student will warp something that you said/did in training, it happens to all of us. And you'll have a student that honestly believes their account is accurate. Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

I know you don't have anything against the DZ, but that's how your first post came across Go get a job, even if it's flipping burgers or greeting at walmart. I've never been more than a few days unemployed... there's no reason to be. And I spent 4 months working drive thru at McD's when I couldn't find anything better at the time. Any money is better than none, and a little humility in a low wage job isn't a bad thing to experience for any person. Hang in there, save the pennies, and I really am looking forward to our next jump together!!!!

He IS at a DZ that has IAD

Hi Alex, We do miss seeing you at the DZ. When you were offered the manifest job, it was to try to give you a bit of a hand up in the sport.... we really try to take care of our own and do what we can to make those dreams reality. That is the place that the offer came from. My former DZOs knew that I was 'between jobs' briefly (as in a week) many years ago, so offered me a job as packer to help finance my skydiving dreams, and I jumped at the chance (and given that at the time it would take me over an hour to pack a sport main, I was also making much less than minimum). I was willing to do whatever it took to be around skydiving and learn the sport, even if on the ground. I understand your scorn of being on the ground at the DZ... I used to have that attitude too when I was still a whuffo and my husband would spend all day at the DZ, even if it was raining, snowing, etc. I never 'got it'. But with time on a DZ, you'll come to understand that you learn far more on the ground than you will in actual freefall time. Every instructor at Kutztown loves to teach. You'll learn about aircraft, gear and gear maintanance, probably a bit about packing, about landing patterns, about problems and how to prevent and fix them.... there's a lot more to skydiving than just a bit of freefall time. Your goal of striving to maintain a balance between work/skydiving/family/etc is a good one.... I wish I had understood how important that balance is to achieve early on. Took me a couple of years to figure it out, so you're already ahead of me there

Do you have any background in education at all? The 'good' comments coupled with points to work on for the next jump are basic educational techniques, not unique to skydiving. Learning, particularly skydiving, is very psychological in nature. Students who go up learning from their mistakes rather than beating themselves up for the mistakes perform better on their next skydive... they are more relaxed and that is SO important to body position and success of the skydive. None of us are advocating telling a student they are great whether they are or not... all of us are saying that we point out all of the things that were done well (and almost all students have some facet of the skydive that went well) so they have something to focus on and be proud of. We also tell them the things that need to be worked on... better arch, better altitude awareness, etc and often I'll give exercises to practice at home before the next jump. It's not about getting students to return... they will or they won't. I want to be on a SAFE skydive with my students, not have the holy shit scared out of me in freefall, and if helping my students relax, focus on the good, fix the bad, and not get too hard on themselves keeps us both safer in the sky and promotes learning, how is that a bad thing? If you don't like the system, go get an AFF rating and do your own thing. Lotsa luck with that. You'll learn very quickly that your philosophy is not conducive to a learning environment. Here's an example for you... I have a student who's spin problem is completely in her head.... as soon as she's nervous, she spins. How do I know it's nerves? I accentally let go of her too soon a couple of jumps ago, before she did her practice touches. I didn't re dock as she was stable and didn't need me. She was flawless until that moment she realized she was let go... that's when she started turning and had a hell of a time stopping the turn... it's all on video too. Mindset truly does matter. Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

Agreed... I go through every part of the skydive and right 'good' before everything that was done reasonably well. Before the things that needed help, I'll find a way to say what I need to without bashing the student (my personal favorite is 'instructor assisted exit, for those students that count but then don't actually exit

Good point... that's also a possibility

Wow, I hate that phrase above. Really glosses over the fact that the student is responsible for their own skydive and sends a really unsafe message to them. I have only failed one level 1 student.... fetal the majority of the skydive, no practice touches, tried to pull at the right alti, but wasn't even close to the hackey and wouldn't let me guide his hand, I pulled for him. He beat himself up a lot, but came back a couple of weeks later for a stellar level 1. He was really proud of himself (rightfully so) and understood completely why he needed to repeat the level. All I expect a student to do on a level 1 is maintain alti awareness and pull at the appropriate altitude (with or without help guiding the hand). Nothing else. If they can't handle those two very important skills, they need to repeat the level until the skill is mastered. Do you really consider that 'everything right'? There are no free rides with me. Ever. I may not be the most experienced AFF instructor out there, and I still have a whole lot to learn, but I won't compromise my students' learning process with a 'free ride'. Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

I agree with this completely. I feel there should be a drinking age of some number outside the home, but I also believe that parents should be allowed to introduce alcohol in a reasonable manner in the home. I had my first taste of beer when I was 7 or so, when my dad would let me have a sip of his if we were outside working. He also made wine, so I had my first wine at 9 or 10. A neighbor gave me a bottle of blackberry wine for my very own when I was a teenager, and my parents let me drink it, a bit at a time when they were home. As a result, alcohol was just another beverage to me, nothing special, nothing to go all nuts about. When I turned 21, I bought some just because I could, but didn't even get a buzz at that time, I had a hard lemonade or something... one drink all night. Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

Great post Nick.... and I agree totally with the above line. And have to add that instructors also had a much easier time of it before there were forums like this. I have a LOT of gray hair from students reading far too much online, thinking too much, having warped priorities, and thinking they know far more than they really do. Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

LOL! I hit browse, and never hit 'upload attachement' Duh. Will do it when I get home. Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

Relax

Please please please reconsider your words here. Think back to your FJC.... 'who is responsible for your skydive?' The answer to that is YOU, not your instructors.... Instructors, RSLs, AADs... all are back up systems, not the primary. The moment you leave that aircraft, if you do nothing, you will die. There is no safety net of immunity on a level 1 just because it's a first AFF jump, a level 1 can die just as easily as a level 2. Re-read your SIM, it very clearly states that the AFF level 1 (Cat A) needs to pull. It's one of the learning objectives, it's part of the dive flow. The original poster: 1. Did not know his altitude, yet did not pull (remember pull priorities, he violated them) 2. He did not respond to a pull signal given by his instructors. 3. He did not pull at all These are big problems. It's not about bashing a student. If it was a log book I was filling out, it would read very positively... for example 'good climbout and count, stable body position, responded to early hand signals. Reported trouble seeing altimeter, missed pull signal, instructor deployed. Good canopy control, good pattern, flared a bit high for butt landing. Next jump, work on alti awarness, hand signal response, and PLF, repeat level 1, recommend doing level 1 and 2 in one day soon!' It's overall a very positive log book entry, with three aspects to work on for the next skydive. Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

Getting her to 'act right'? Damn, that's harsh. You can only change yourself and communicate with her. If you aren't looking at your own actions in the marriage and communicating well with her, you are just as much of the problem as she is. Have you considered marriage counselling? If your first instinct is to bail out rather than putting a lot of effort into saving your marriage, you're being a little hasty.... and that speaks volumes regarding your character. Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

To me 'deploy with assistance' means the instructor might help guide the hand, not the instructor pulls for the student. If a student is clearly altitude aware and tries to pull themselves but misses the hackey and I end up pulling for them because of that, I may pass them on a level 1 (but only a level 1, nothing else), but if the student makes no effort to pull themselves, they will repeat the level. If they are not altitude aware while their only real freefall task is altitude awareness, I want them to gain that skill before adding the skills of turning/forward motion. Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

Here's another one of Reid, just after being inducted as a Pelt Head. Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

At what point did you get the vertigo? I agree with everyone else to see a doc, but at the same time, tandem harnesses do fit differently than sport rigs, and some students get dizzy, nauseous, etc from the blood pooling in their legs and away from their brain.. happens under canopy or on landing. Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

Do you understand the irony in saying your life is all about school yet making spelling and grammatical errors and saying you won't make it into grad school? Your energy might be somewhat misplaced and you're not being totally honest with yourself. Spend a little time figuring yourself out

I like to pull around 3. Occasionally if I'm reserve side AFF I, it's a shade under that, but not much, depends on if there's video or not as to how much extra I'll need to track. I did lurk a tandem last week and pulled at 2200 The video guy and I did a nice little 2 way after the tandem pulled and we broke at 3500. But that's not something I make a habit of. I can only think of one other jump I pulled that low... AFF student with a pilot chute in tow that I fixed for him before going away. Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

This is pure laziness on your part and a total cop-out. You will never learn how to pack and do it well unless you get off your ass and do it. Yes, it will be frustrating at first. Yes, it may take you 2 hours to get the damn slippery fucker in the bag at first. But how do you honestly expect to know your gear and learn how to pack if you don't do it? I started working as a packer almost as soon as I learned to pack. My first pack jobs were ugly as shit and it would take me 30 mins to pack even an easier F111 main, but after 20 pack jobs, I got a little quicker and more neat. After 100 pack jobs I was much neater and could pack just about anything thrown at me. Now I can pack even a slippery brand new ZP canopy just as adeptly as a beat old one. My suggestion would be to quit making excuses and start putting a little effort toward knowing every aspect of this sport (ie your gear and how to maintain it) not just the freefall/canopy end of it. Pay a packer if you need to during the day, but take that last jump of every day and pack it yourself. Do it at the DZ with an instructor, packer, or rigger watching you and giving you pointers. Buy them a beer to say 'thanks', and then every day during the week, pack your rig one time. Just once. You may be up til 2am punching walls in frustration (not that I would know anything about that.... ) but you will improve very quickly. Or you can just whine about not being able to pack on here. Whichever. Your choice. Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

We just got back from the best vacation ever... Stayed at Davis' country cabins in Hammond NY. For $500/week we got a boat and HUGE cabin on the lake, for another $150 we got a motor and all the gas we could use. It's 1/2 hr to the thousand islands region too, which is more touristy and upscale. Not so beachy, but definitely water, and there's nothing as relaxing as taking a nap on a boat with a fishing pole in hand, not giving a shit if you catch anything or not

I've known Abbey for 3 years and respect her quite a bit.... she's one of the most good natured people I've met in this sport, and definitely not a shit-stirring, back-stabbing, misleading person at all. I trust her word and her ethics completely. Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda