Kamkisky

Are you sure it goes back/back/fronts? I feel like I’ve seen back/fronts/back before. The singular and plural are interesting here, last “chute.” As is the tense “when she returned” then “she saw he had.”

This quote always gets to me. Cooper complains about no D-rings on the first back chute. Yet, he doesn’t wait for the second back chute before popping open his only working reserve. So much for bitching about d-rings. He didn’t even know if he’d be given d-rings before he destroys his only real reserve.

After watching this video clip to many times, three thoughts come to mind: 1) Didn’t he cut several cords? He didn’t have a single piece that’s 80 feet, right? If he had multiple sections I’d want more than one end tied to me. I’d want two ends from the bag tied to my body. I’m an old farm kid, you tie something down in back of the truck with two points of failure (minimum), not one. 2) I would not tie it the way you have. The bag is tied east to west. I’d want some wraps going north to south too. I’d be worried about racking. Which is what it sounds like happened with McCoy. 3) Maybe it’s the angle of the video and/or my total lack of parachuting knowledge but I’d be tempted to sit on the block and tie it to myself through the straps at your waist (both sides) and around my upper thighs like the harness. A butt bag if you will. Of course I’d be one of the skyjackers drinking heavily.

I’ve wondered why he didn’t take the other back chute and convert it into a larger version of the knapsack worn backwards. I’m guessing it’s too big. We do know he had two + other options. He had the dummy chute container and the contents. And he had the briefcase. Perhaps he split the money up. I know the dummy could not attach to D-rings but he has plenty of cordage and knows that bag is designed to jump. A briefcase is also a better shape to wrap in cordage than the money bag. The money bag could be argued as the thinnest and worst shape bag option he had.

AI says the average length of the cord from the drop bag to the harness was 15-20ft. How many rows is that in a 727? 4-5? There’s no evidence Cooper was ever even that far forward in the plane. The math just doesn’t math. The military expert scoffs at the idea. I think I’m close to done on this one…there was a money bag that was dragging, there was not a drag bag. If I’m Cooper and I’m going to be opening the stairs and operating in a plane under those conditions tying the bag to myself in some way first makes sense. Tina was scared of being sucked out and the pilots agreed and offered for Anderson to come back and tie her to a base, if Cooper wasn’t thinking the money and he could be sucked out the back before he surely had the thought crossed his mind after that episode. Tie the bag to himself and get the stairs open. The two steps he needed before being able to escape. It makes sense he prioritized those immediately after take off.

I was being a tad flippant. The point I was trying to make is, if we knew Cooper created an impromptu drag bag with missing/mismatched parts and it worked…that rules out all but a small group of bad ass parachutists and cargo riggers. The average Joe suspect is out. Basically, if we knew he created a drag bag the pool of suspects goes from millions to a few dozen to a few hundred. If Cooper bet his money and life on an improvised drag bag, he’s clearly an expert at the top of his game not just a guy who was a paratrooper 20 years earlier.

These are two opposite ends. If he didn’t realize those were bailout rigs he isn’t going to be confident enough in his ability to slap together a drag bag from mismatch/missing parts. He can’t know little about skydiving and be a genius at it. I think this is one of those myths that has been spun from a nugget of truth. Tina likely did say it was dragging behind him. That’s doesn’t mean he created a drag bag in the parachuting sense. If you risked your life for this pile of cash why would you do anything but strap it to your body as tight as possible? If he was worried about weight he could have asked for larger denominations. There are no style points here, you pick the option that is the most straightforward and has the best chance for success. Zero percent chance an impromptu drag bag is better odds of success than strapping to your waist. Imagine being under canopy (if the bag was still there) and then pulling the knots to drop it and hoping you rig works? He’d have to trust his money and his life to the knots he almost certainly had never used for this purpose…unless the theory is impromptu drag bags are something this guy has done many times before. If Cooper made a drag bag then Cooper and Braden likely knew each other.

This is where I’m at. Darren had a parachuting military guy on, Mike I think, who scoffed at the idea of a drag bag. They didn’t much go into it unfortunately but I think his point was a drag bag and a free fall don’t mix like a drag bag and a static line jump. I don’t see how Cooper makes one that’s even functional given the shape of the bags he had and the lack of release buckles. He’d have to tie knots that could work as a release and trust his life on those knots. If he could make one that functioned, he’s a cargo rigger and/or elite military parachutist damn near guaranteed.

Drag bag. Here are my issues with this idea (based on my very limited knowledge of WW2 drag bags): 1) 20 something years later Cooper remembers enough about one to jimmy rig it with his life on the line? 2) The military bags were supplied equipment. Guys didn’t jimmy rig them even back even then. 3) The military one were attached to the leg via quick release buckles behind the knee and by the ankle. Cooper didn’t have quick release buckles. 4) The length of cord is problematic. Tina says she could see the bag moving behind him, in a small plane. The military bags have cords much longer than that. 5) The military bags attach to the harness (D-rings?). Tina says it was tied to his waist. 6) The military bags were canvas and designed to fit the leg. Cooper didn’t have that shaped bag. 7) The military bags didn’t even work well. D-day had a lot of guys lose the bag when their chute opened. 8) Cooper’s bag would have required a lot of loose cord be accessible to deploy somehow, the tangle with the chute factor goes up. 9) Did any of the copycats use a drag bag? Im not a parachute expert but it seems far simpler and more reliable to tie the money to his waist and take the extra weight on landing. Crafting a homemade drag bag seems like a bad idea.

I think getting the stairs to work is likely more about expectations than not being able to work a simple lever. Cooper had just walked up the fully descended stairs. I think it’s reasonable to assume he thought the stairs would fully deploy. I’d think the stairs were fully hydraulic and not gravity going down. So Cooper uses the lever but the stairs don’t go all the way down so he thinks something is wrong and we get the whole interphone episode. Eventually he figures out his weight is going to be enough for him to exit and everything “is good now.”

What I’m suggesting is a plausible plan. You are saying he jumped “ad-hoc,” that is without a plan. That’s the definition of luck. Idiot might be strong and not totally accurate, a better word is scared/panicked. Your story relies on Cooper accepting a change in destination he didn’t have to accept, and that he could not work a lever he was showed how to use (and Ryan just posted has instructions next to it). We both have theories, no one has the ability to prove it.

You don't know if he knows the area well. - three data points: Tacoma/McChord/he just flew over the area. You don't know if he could see the ground. - two data points: the pilots could see the ground/it wasn’t a raging storm, it was a typical PNW November night. You fail to understand that he was delayed having trouble with the stairs. - not applicable. He has only one way out so of course he wants it open and makes efforts to do so. He got it open in time to jump the first city lights. You assume he saw the lights and knew it was BG. -three data points: we have a pilot from the area who was flying in 1971 who says BG are the first city lights coming south/the pilots could see the lights/by going south it’s repeatable to know the first city lights after darkness are BG. You assume he knew the path beforehand. -one data point: he only ever ask for or negotiated or accepted any direction except south You have a theory too. It’s Cooper as idiot jumping at random and who just got lucky. The nice part about that theory is it doesn’t require evidence…it’s just an assumption.

He takes off and SeaTac and sounding area disappears behind them… Darkness = bad. That’s the forest land. That means wait. City lights after darkness = good. That’s the farm lands north of Portland. That means jump. The farm lands of Southern Washington are the region. I’ll flip to my analogy… City lights of Central Valley = good. Jump. Darkness of Sierra Nevada’s = bad. Death. The Central Valley is the region. No special powers required. And the circle you just provided aligns perfectly with jumping when he see the first city lights of BG.

You use predetermined. The argument isn’t he jumped to an exact location. The argument is he jumped into a region. To achieve that all he needed was the plane to fly south at 10k feet, the stairs to open and to know the region. That’s it. It’s not a magic trick. It’s not hard to conceptualize. It’s repeatable. I could do this (but I’m not jumping out of a damn plane unless it’s on fire). I could take off from any of SF/Oakland/San Jose and fly to anywhere as long as it’s east (Salt Lake/Denver/St. Louis/NY/etc/etc…we could pick different cities at the last minute, whatever), because I know Northern California I could land in the Central Valley on flat farmland. I could do it every time from any Bay Area airport. I would only need the plane to fly at 10k feet, to go east and the stairs to be open. He jumped the lights of a region he knew.

Nice. It illuminates from the edge of the dark forest. From the time he says everything is good now (8:05) till the time he jumps (8:11-13)...what would be his view? At first pass it looks to me like he'd catch the beacon off to the side/passing by and BG is about 20 miles ahead. 6-8 minutes. 3 miles per hour.

This article proves *the authorities at the time considered Cooper jumped lights.* I'm at the point of falling to see a counter argument. The pilots could see lights. The authorities thought he may have jumped lights. It makes the most sense to jump lights. He has I-5. He may have had this red beacon. He would have the counter experience of the darkness of the forest north of the Lewis River. He'd have the lights of BG after the darkness. He'd have the lights of Vancouver/Portland ahead. He'd know the time of flight. He knew Tacoma from the air. He knew McChord from the ground. He knew the plane was going south out of Seattle. He had flown over this part of southern Washington just hours earlier. Mac jumped the lights too. Cooper jumped the lights and had a solid idea of where he landed based on I-5 and the BG lights. He knew if he was north or south of BG. He'd know if he was east or west too. I'm close to done on this one...someone tell me why he didn't jump the lights?

The Oregonian - November 27, 1971 That search zone is a lot closer to the modern consensus than I believed was the case in 71. I thought they were searching just north of BG. Here they are south of Orchards. And there's a quote saying they were searching at "other possible drop areas further south." Anyone got anything on this red beacon? Also, what was the original drop zone? Did I just have it wrong thinking it was further north than the southern edge shown in this drawing?

The final score on the boarding: Flo - second to last has some secondary evidence in support of her statement. Gregory - he thought he was last to board and was likely the third from the end. He just didn’t notice Cooper or Bill Mitchell come in after him and take seats further back. Bill Mitchell - he likely wasn’t with the terminal group and runs to catch the flight after calling his folks after getting a standby ticket. He doesn’t notice Cooper boarding because Cooper boards before him. Dan Cooper - he intentionally boards last of the terminal group. He wanted to be last, Bill just ruins that by calling home and running late. Michael Cooper - seems to be conflating things 50 years on.

Fun with AI. Hilariously the combo of Hahneman and comp A actually looks more plausible.

That’s good secondary evidence.

Is there any other evidence besides the one statement by Flo that indicates Cooper boarded second to last? Or is that it?

That’s not what it says… On November 24, 1971, Mrs. HANCOCK stated that the individual who hijacked Northwest Airlines Flight #305, Boeing 727, initially boarded the aircraft in Portland Oregon, and at the time he boarded the aircraft he was: carrying a briefcase which measured about 12 inches by 18 inches and was dark brown or black in color.

Then we have this from Bill’s, which doesn’t even make sense - The subject boarded after MITCHELL left Portland, Oregon.

You're in the two oblivious and one fabulist camp. Ok. I’m not claiming one side here yet. How does Alice know nuanced measurements of his briefcase as he is boarding? Was she back there?

It’s a small plane. A group of people walked out of the terminal at the same time. Four grownups in back of the plane. These guys are close enough to spit at each other. I get he wasn’t the highjacker yet but he was in their immediate space. And that argument goes both ways, Dan wasn’t the highjacker when Flo claims he wasn’t noticeable yet noticed and noted his boarding order. We either dismiss two accounts as being oblivious and a third as a fabulist or we question the accuracy of the fourth. Those seem to be the options.