Liemberg

Don't see anything wrong with it as long as everybody remembers that what seems to be cute late at night in the bar after a few drinks might turn out to be a bit of a disappointment when viewed by day with a slight hangover... (Duckin', hidin' - now where did I leave my asbestos pants...?) "Whoever in discussion adduces authority uses not intellect but memory." - Leonardo da Vinci A thousand words...

I would like to see pictures of that setup - if possible "Whoever in discussion adduces authority uses not intellect but memory." - Leonardo da Vinci A thousand words...

They don't in the first instance. However, should you find yourself under TWO open canopies it would be nice to know if you have a normal rig, if there is an RSL, how it is constructed and supposed to work, if you jump with an SOS-system and if so, what type, etcetera before you decide on a course of action. Due to the limitations of the medium, all we can do here is confuse you - enlightenment is to be found at your own DZ with your instructor/rigger and one or more parachutes at hand...

[rant mode on] I urgently suggest you discuss this with your instructor(s) for - from what I gather here - you are jumping while believing in a few misconceptions about your equipment. As long as all goes well you might get away with that, but if it doesn't, your lack of knowledge might bite you... PLEASE do not try to educate yourself on the BASICS of how the 'parachute system' works through the internet but have it explained to you AGAIN by someone (a rigger preferably) who knows what he's talking about in a hangar with a student parachute system at hand. They are NOT always and everywhere constructed in the same manner so while what you say ('pull silver and the main disappears anyway') might be true with some systems, it might be false on other systems... And don't nod sheepishly saying that you understand when in fact you don't ASK THINK ASK AGAIN THINK AGAIN [/rant mode off] "Whoever in discussion adduces authority uses not intellect but memory." - Leonardo da Vinci A thousand words...

Well... I still own a private rig and I'm not scared to jump alone, but nowadays I always feel a bit naked when there's no one upfront...

Because some students (if not most of them) enter the sport without a clear perception of the risks involved and have trouble to stay focused at the ultimate goal (which is to land in one piece in a state that enables you to repeat the skydive should you desire to do so...) The sheer volume of the information you get when you enter a first jump course makes this 'focussing' hard, since you are engaging in a whole new activity. Face it, a lot of the stuff we teach is NOT about this 'ultimate goal' - like when you have a group in your first jump course, take them into the hangar and tell them not to step on the lines of the parachute, how to obtain a rig and what to do when manifesting. There's a complete new 'lingo' to learn, and also 'how to blend in with other skydivers'... A lot of people have a hard time to 'wrap up' the course into keywords like 'arch' (on exit) 'pull' (when it is time to deploy a parachute) and 'wing level + unobstructed lane' when it is about time to land... What people often do in an environment they don't understand is resort to 'magic' - and make no mistake about this: conquering dangers (denial if you will) through 'magic' is as old as humanity... Years and years ago I overheard a static line student who was so impressed with her 'larger-than-life' instructor she was convinced that if 'her parachute didn't open', our hero would jump after her and come to her aid... My bet is she never told her hero what magical powers she attributed to him and without questioning the actual course HE gave it is safe to say she had not understood what he could do and what he COULD NOT do... Yet, with the described mindset, she already made 7 static-line jumps... Sooo, nothing wrong with a reality-check when you start a course though the choice of words would not be mine; I tell them they are 'effectivly dead' when they drop from altitudes higher than 10 meters without an open parachute. Seems to do the trick. "Whoever in discussion adduces authority uses not intellect but memory." - Leonardo da Vinci A thousand words...

Deuce, You seem like a nice guy and the quote above illustrates that. Me, I'm a grumpy anti-social. Therefore, I worry about MY problems and insist that camerafliers worry about their own. Just as you can "dress for succes" with a baggy suit for you and a tight suit for the passenger (and this is even more important as the passengers outweigh you or have long arms and legs) so can the cameraflier. If he wants to work for me and get paid, I'll LEND him one of my leadvests if he perceives that fallingspeed of the tandempair becomes a problem. But I'm not gonna accept things like baggy suits on the bigger tandempassenger so that the camera can keep up. If he cant it is time to polish up his sitflying or standup techniques. Other than that, if you end up belly to earth under a drogue? I'm not realy in the position to cast the first stone since about a 1000 or so tandemjumps ago I ended up with a droguebridle between my legs and had to go for silver... (you live and learn...) Just my $0,02... "Whoever in discussion adduces authority uses not intellect but memory." - Leonardo da Vinci A thousand words...

Who cares about cheating the student? O well, wait, lets see - WE ARE PLANNING TO END UP UNDER THE SAME PARACHUTE Then again, I have jumped in shorts and T-shirt, but always with pax that were also in shorts and T-shirt. On the picture it is obvious that if THIS pax is gonna be 'uncooperative' the TI WILL be hosed, dressed the way he is. He's got almost nothing on his legs and nothing on his arms, she's is not only big, but also wearing a complete jumpsuit - can you say drag? Not one of the smartest moves, giving your passenger a larger and more effective controlsurface than yourself... IMHO if you are going to take up just about every person who walks in the door pays his dues and signs the waiver you'd better operate in a way that you can *guarantee* an open main parachute regardless if the passenger does or does not do as told. For - in case there's a TI who didn't know - sometimes they dont do what they are told. Anybody can steer the boat in a calm sea... The picture that started the thread (passenger with knees up throughout the freefall) shows something that may be a bit more work and it may spoil the video but other than that its no biggie; deploying your drogue on your back is. "Whoever in discussion adduces authority uses not intellect but memory." - Leonardo da Vinci A thousand words...

Kelpdivers example pictures of "good video" give the skydivers perspective which is totally different from the tandempassengers perspective. (" Hey, LOOK, that's ME - Skydiving!!!") on both pictures you either cant see that there is someone upfront or cannot make out who it is... My handcam GUARANTEES close up shots. Moreover: the first picture would lead me to have a serious talk with the cameraflyer ("If you pull that stunt once more, you are FIRED! - you have NO BUSINESS up there! Didn't you know that at a place I will not mention the camerflyers newton sight cut through the drogue, deflating it and resulting in a malfunction? Didn't you know that already TWICE cameraflyers have collided with deploying tandemparachutes with deadly results?") Lack off image stabilization is indeed a weakness of the bullet cam, but I have found that it is not all the time necessary to have your camerahand on the vibrating toggle (so what if all those spectacular turns are always to the right?). You'd be surprised what a good editor does when the superfluous and shaky stuff is edited out and the best is put on DVD with music - the endproduct sells. You guys may not want to buy it, but my customers do! PS: The cable goes from under the alti through the altimeterstrap inside my sleeve - its route is almost identical to where the remote shutter cable of my still camera used to go when I jumped with one, many moons ago... "Whoever in discussion adduces authority uses not intellect but memory." - Leonardo da Vinci A thousand words...

The "extra crap" strapped to my hands is a "bullet cam" underneath my altimeter. It weighs 200 grams, is 72mm long and has a diameter of 21mm. Though it is a distraction (and therefore the camera should start 'roling' BEFORE the hook-up) in freefall and under canopy it is a non-issue... Edited to say that I put the camera on a scale - The actual camera on the hand weighs 50 grams, the rest of the 200 grams are cables and battery holder... "Whoever in discussion adduces authority uses not intellect but memory." - Leonardo da Vinci A thousand words...

Somehow I fail to see why an economic issue should be discussed in an instructors forum - other than providing all the 'working class heroes of the sky' an opportunity to bitch and moan a bit...

In this day and age?

It OUGHT TO BE OBVIOUS! ... Of course, 'the mind narrows a bit' in high stress situations like this one, but 'your main starts diving for no apparent reason and is now in front of you in stead of above - what do you think has happened?' should be part of ANY first jump course where students jump with AAD's... If the student doesn't react because he doesn't remember that part of the training it is understandable, but it could be argued that 'more training prior to the jump' is needed. If he doesn't react because nobody told him about this possibility?... "Whoever in discussion adduces authority uses not intellect but memory." - Leonardo da Vinci A thousand words...

It is perfectly OK! A friend of mine jumps a really, really BIG canopy, loaded less than one... He never flares on landing but always comes in at 'half brakes' with one leg stretched out and the other lifted up He's got some 6000 jumps. He won the dutch nationals several times in his discipline of choice which is (you guessed it) precision...

Does this mean you still have feelings for me RhondaLea? Lucky Me, especially if you are wearing that black leather set from Victoria's Secret!... (chorus: "Strike dear mistress, and cure his heart...") "Whoever in discussion adduces authority uses not intellect but memory." - Leonardo da Vinci A thousand words...

OMG!!! My guess is you guys have a secret handshake as well... Just know that my sollicitor is going to send a sealed envelope to the authorities in charge in case of my untimely "accidental" death... You'll all be exposed! "Whoever in discussion adduces authority uses not intellect but memory." - Leonardo da Vinci A thousand words...

Sooo, you are cleanin' up your act? Excellent!

Seems to be a function of 'chosen weapon' (canopy), passenger weight and windspeed... Is there a mathematician in the audience?

Next thing you are going to tell me that you can breath through your skin... Easily... Occasionally I still have exits that don't go as planned ('taking a few more steps without my crutch' i.e. throwing the drogue after 8 or 9 seconds in stead of the usual 3) The jerk that this 'small chute' gives me then is already quite discernible... "Whoever in discussion adduces authority uses not intellect but memory." - Leonardo da Vinci A thousand words...

That's what they led you to believe... Actually the drogue is the freefall equivalent of crutches. Maybe you didn't notice but a lot of these tandem"masters" are in fact elderly ("has been") skydivers who have trouble remaining stable in freefall. With the drogue trailing behind them they manage to keep the whole thing in a "belly to earth" configuration... "Whoever in discussion adduces authority uses not intellect but memory." - Leonardo da Vinci A thousand words...

One in every 8 static line students?

Lighten up please.

So it is safe enough for someone else's kid yet to dangerous for your own? "Whoever in discussion adduces authority uses not intellect but memory." - Leonardo da Vinci A thousand words...

Here I think the trick lies in getting close to someone while keeping your distance.... Easier said than done since you were not taking chastity vows when you signed on as 'professional meathauler (tm)' and at some point they have to 'sit on your lap' so to speak. A 'first name basis relationship' comes natural, you'll be 'saving their life' and chances are they get very emotional during/ right after the experience. My simple rule: "I don't mind hugs and kisses but I WILL NEVER TAKE THE INITIATIVE!!!" Modest and sober yet friendly ought to do the trick... (Which doesn't mean I'm not enjoying some tandemjumps more than others...

"I don't want you anywhere NEAR me!!!" "You got that?" Anyway, it all seems to be 'situational' - with the above attitude succesful Canopy Formation seems out of the question but I have been under a twist and saw a guy "clear his ears, polish his goggles and stow his slider" as he soared less than 2 meters over the top of my canopy from opposite direction. A 2 engine Fokker F27 that has just dropped 35+ skydivers also seems mighty big and fast if it passes under you @ less than 30 meters... "Whoever in discussion adduces authority uses not intellect but memory." - Leonardo da Vinci A thousand words...