Ron

If you add an AAD as a true backup...Then you are clearly not dependant...Also your hundereds of jumps without one shows that as well. My beef is people who do more dangerous stuff since they have one.....They are more dangerous. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Yep. Nope. But only doing that jump if you have a CYPRES does indicate that you are dependant on the AAD. It also shows that while you see the dive in question as dangerous, you are willing to risk that danger by depending on a device....And that using your brain will allow you to avoid using an AAD.. And not going on a dive that you feel you need an AAD IS safer than just going with it since you have one. Where did I say I was? Who is taking the higher risk: The guy that will not do a jump he sees as dangerous, or the guy that will since he has an AAD? they would be "safer" if they didn't do the jump instead of just straping an AAD on. Sure. But the SAFEST Instructors will only do jumps they feel safe on, and then ADD a helmet and an AAD. They will not go with a questionable jump just because they have a helmet and AAD. Look this is really simple. We have statements that some will not jump on certain jumps without an AAD...But will with one. They state that the risk is to great without an AAD. Do you think an AAD makes a skydive safer? It does not. It only reduces the chance of the ONE WEARING IT from dying...And even then not 100%. The others on the questionable jump AAD are risked greater due to you going. If you go on a jump that you don't feel safe just cause you have an AAD...you ARE DEPENDANT...thats not a question, it is a matter of logic. Debate it all you want. If you allow yourself to do more dangerous jumps because you have an AAD you ARE dependant. You are also not SAFER from accident. In fact, but going on more dangerous jumps that you would normally do...You are in MORE danger of an accident. Use your brain to decide what is a safe jump basied on not having an AAD...THEN add one to make the jump safer. ADDING an AAD does not reduce the risk of a jump. It just means that you MIGHT survive...The risk of an ACCIDENT MAY IN FACT BE HIGHER. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Id ask Brian Johnson...He has a program that does all of that already, and he has a laptop that he uses already. Why reinvent the wheel? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

How do you know the difference? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

agreed. Not true. If one will do jumps that he considers to dangerous to do without an AAD with one then he is doing something more dangerous than he should be doing. And the one that will do the jump since he has the CYPRES might want to think that he is jumping into a more dangerous situation and he STILL may not survive it...so if the risk is so great, maybe he should just not do the jump at all. AH, here is the kicker...your not. But by going on more dangerous jumps since you have a CYPRES you are in more danger than the guy that will not go o those jumps because he thinks they are more dangerous....Even if he does not have a CYPRES. allowing yourself to do "dumber things" cause you have an AAD is dangerous. You are also risking others lives. Lets say you and I are coaching FF (Not that I could, but lets just say).... We both have two EXACT students. I have an AAD, but I don't want to do the jump since the student seems dangerous to me. You do the jump since you have an AAD. Same thing happens to you that would have happend to me. The student corks and hits you....You survive the jump due to having an AAD, the student does not. Who is the safest? You for having an AAD, or me for not doing the jump? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

We agree 100% This, And this, Seem to contradict each other. Why wear an AAD unless you think it will save you in a bad situation? Kinda fits in the "Do you add an AAD to remove the chance of something bad happening" statement. But at any rate if true then it is clear you are not....But you must admit that some are, and they are dangerous. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

If you allow yourself to do the jump because you have an AAD...It sure does. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I'll admit it....I'd do her. I think she is stupid, but I have fucked a lot less hot women before. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Look if I think a dive is too dangerous to do without an AAD....I think it should not be done at all. If you think that it is too dangerous to do without an AAD, but will do it with one...I think that is bad. I think that the safest thing you can do is to only jump on dives that you feel are safe, and then ADD an AAD to make them safer. Do you add an AAD to remove the chance of something bad happening, or do you use an AAD to allow you to feel safe going outside your normal boundries? Would you drive more reckless if you had a Volvo? Or would you drive the same? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

OK they reduce the risk of Violent death FOR THEM. They DO NOT reduce the CHANCE OF AN ACCIDENT...In fact they increase the chance of an accident by doing things they think is unsafe without an AAD. They would be MUCH safer to aviod the dangerous situation in the first place, then ADD an AAD as a true backup, not as a way to increase the chances of an accident and using the AAD to increase the chance of surviving. Do you see that by going on dives you would normally think as too dangerous with out an AAD, that doing them with an AAD might increase your chance of SURVIVING, but it in fact can INCREASE the danger of an accident happening. And since we all can agree that even having an AAD does not mean you will OK in the event of an accident that by using one to go into more dangerous situations is not good. You actually can increase the chances of an accident happening instead of not doing the dangerous jumps. If you allow yourself to dive faster, longer since you have an AAD...I hope everyone on that dive has one since if you hit them...you might be fine, but they may still be killed by your confidence. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I never said he should do it...I said he should ask himself that question. OK cool. Does not bother me....I still think that if you think the jump too dangerous to do...Then it should be too dangerous even with an AAD. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Hook answered for me. I AGREE with tandems needing an AAD. When I do a Tandem I have someones life in my hands. Not just my own. As for students....Well, I think its a good idea. I wish we didn't tell them about the AAD till after they get a license. That right there would help prevent people from depending on them. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

No, he only has to prove it to himself, and that can be done by simply asking the question "Would I do this jump if my AAD was not operational?" And answering it honestly. We have proof that some use an AAD to allow them to participate in more dangerous actions. 13% of skydivers said they would limit they type of jump they do depending on an AAD being present. http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=1614903#1614903 We have skydivers that have stated that they see certain jumps to be too dangerous without an AAD, but will do those same jumps if they have one: So jumping with a newbie FF is to dangerous to do without an AAD....But it is OK to do with an AAD? This person is doing what they KNOW to be more dangerous things, things that they would NOT do without an AAD, just because they have one. Doing more dangerous things just because you have a backup is like driving reckless because you have airbags....Not very smart. It is this very attitude that is bad. Adding an AAD increases your chance of survival, but it does not reduce the risk of accidents at all. The smartest attitude is to use your brain (The best saftey device) to avoid accidents. Put it this way....If a jumper will use an AAD to allow them to go past their personal risk threshold...You have a person that is not sure of what they are doing....You had better hope that EVERYONE that jumps with them when they are "pushing the limit" has an AAD...Cause while the dependant person may feel "safe" since they have an AAD...that person is still a risk, maybe even a HIGHER risk to everyone else since they are clearly opperating outside of their comfort range but doing it anyway since they have an AAD. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

FAR's require them...USPA requires them for students. You are not dependent unless YOU require them. If you require an AAD to make a jump I personally would rethink making the jump at all. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Plus he got to bang Britney. "Ops, I did it again." "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Find me one post where he says something good about the US military. Find me one post where he says something good about US politics. ONE. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Do you know if the soldiers involved with this video went to trial? If so, do you know the outcome? This was covered here before. http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=1091865#1091865 It started with a video alot like this one...Except it was proven to be BS. This video might be the same. Also I amswered this type of thing once before. I also covered this quite a bit here So, do you know anything about this second video, other than the 10 second clip? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

If that is the whole story...Which I doubt then it is unjustified. This was covered on here several mths ago. Several reports had other issues that are not covered in your 10 second clip. If that went down just as shown on that edited video...Which you must admit was edited to make the US look bad...Then they are quilty. And should be punished. However since the US has put a soldier in prison for shooting a wounded insurgent that was trapped in a burning car.....I tend to trust the US version of events over the insurgents version. So, using your logic. Since the insurgents do it....are you saying the US is justifed as well. I tend to think that a heavely publicized video that the parties involved in the video went to trial over it....Why do you not say anything about that? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

On an AFF jump I can help a student in freefall, in the French program they can help the student....(If they can get to them), in the Air Force program once the student goes....All you can do is watch. Since in the AF program the Instructor cannot stabalize or pull for the studet it is more like the S/L program than AFF or the french method. See in the french method it seems that they let the student do a freefly launch, but the Instructor still has to be there to help. In the AF program the Student has no help after exit. They also do not have an Instructor to help in freefall. And that is the difference. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Or you could waste valuable time and die trying. Any idea how many people have died trying to "fix" something? At 120 MPH and with a large planet shapped object moving at you on an intercept course....It is not the time to try in air rigging. Again, you know how many people have died trying to do in air rigging? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I think its not bunk. I think it is the first step of self defense. It will not always work, but it is a good idea to avoid bad places. If you are the type that would go down a dark alley just because you are armed....I think you are trusting the weapon to much. See use your brain to avoid situations where you need the gun. Then add the gun as a backup for when you can't avoid the problem. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

180 from center works ALL the time, for any sized dive. Don't over think it. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

UH, if I remember you were almost mugged at an ATM. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Iraqi's have used IED to kill when they are wounded. The only joke here is your hatred for the US and desire to make the US out to be evil at every opportunity. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

did not see it. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334