promise5

Wait!!! Are you implying I'm a fat a**??? No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

Pot bellied And her name was lily!! No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

But that brings up the issue again of what the perpetrator was able to plea down to instead of what the actual offense was. No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

Though you know I'm generally on the same page on you in this thread, this does feel like a burden on the student that is more a discouragement to jump than a viable solution. As Ryoder notes, at the busy DZs you get your TI pretty late in the game. He or she may be doing back to backs and there can be last minute changes as the DZ is just trying to keep the machine running on weekends. There's also the other problem....our industry isn't exactly transparent on deficiencies around plane maintenance, or even the weather (sure it's nice - come on down and commit your money!, [then we'll see if the winds die down[). If a woman (yeah, slightly sexist presumption) wants a guarantee on this, she probably should ask for a female TI. Which isn't a 100% guarantee either, and she may be in a shock when she sees how cozy a PAC or a C206 is. People aren't trying to grope you - their hand has to go somewhere. Not just the hands but feet. Crud I felt bad for my TI he was sitting rather uncomfortably on my foot and then when I tried to help out and adjust my foot uuummm yeah. It was better to leave it where it was. No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

I don't have a personal agenda against any one person,even though some may think I do. I choose to bring this topic to SC and accept any consequences/repercussions of doing so. I don't take a popular stand and that's ok. I don't hold it against anyone if they take the opposite stand I do. I'll still support and advocate for this. But as a whole I don't think they should be allowed to be TI's. Across the board, until a better solution come along. No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

Holy crap NO!!!! I may be a blonde but I'm really not that stupid. I'm just being very careful. I don't want to be accused of targeting individuals or DZ's. This isn't a witch hunt. No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

No not laziness or as an ego defense mechanism. I honestly didn't even think of it until it was brought to my attention. Maybe I was naive in my thinking that such a person wouldn't be a TI,I really don't know. But I also think that the person that has committed such crimes and been convicted should lose privileges, which being a TI is. I know it's an unpopular opinion but that's fine I don't mind having an unpopular opinion. No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

Very true. But that's where as I've said before with the policy of not allowing them to be certified you're covered. It's not perfect but it's the best we got. I'll add I am SO thankful for others that are advocating for this that can make much better arguments then I have. Not sure if someone that has committed a sex offense could be defined as responsible. I am not talking about peering in public. I'm not on a witch hunt here or targeting anyone personally. I just believe in this and also in the fact that the very best should represent this sport to the public. Though I'm sure people will take exception to my saying that. Maybe there's such a shortage of TI that even sex offenders are needed. But I don't think that's the case. There is something that I do strongly disagree with and that's targeting a DZ publicly that might have one on staff. I think in that case gather the facts and take it up with the owner/board of the DZ but I also think that they should in a respectful manner notify the USPA and possibly the airport owners/ board. Crap, I'll get slammed for that too. But, I don't agree in publicly targeting the DZ itself and others that work or jump there. Like others have said they may or may not know. But my personal opinion: If you know someone has assaulted and raped someone or molested a child and your fine with working with them and or jumping with them then I find that kinda disgusting. But that's how I feel. I do wonder how much they could over look something like that if a family member was assaulted in this manner. But that's my very unpopular opinion I'm sure. No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

In that study did they take it in to account that sex offenses are one of the most unreported crimes? Also, the ones that were released I to states that they did not have to register in that state did they have to be on the national registry ? No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

I disagree. Yes there are flaws with the system but like ice said many times it's the best we have. Do I think it's all about better lawyers no I don't but does that play a part yes it does. I'm not sorry I believe that someone that HAS molested a child or assaulted and raped a person should not have the privilege of being a TI. No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

I'll add thus has been a great discussion and I think for the most part everyone's been respectful of each other. I know I've tried many of your patience in other threads but I appreciate how open everyone's been and patient!! No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

No disrespect but I've seen the opposite. Plea bargains made to lesser charges that don't even come close to what actually happened. When you start advocating for something you begin to hear and see horrendous stories. That being said. I will say that before I would use a case as an example I would make VERY sure I knew the facts the true facts about the case I was using. I'm saying that's what I do and I'm not implying AT ALL that anyone on here is doing the opposite. No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

But how many so called "good cases" are there? Compared to bad. Yes it's screwed up in ways but it's still the best we have!! No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

Yes it is. But if he decided after that time to become a TI and was checked he wouldn't show up so he would be in the clear. No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

I read your post on that thread but then doesn't it become irrelevant because he didn't have to register. Yes it took two years and a legal battle but at the end of two years he could then go on to be a TI. No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

I was asking about if you had a case of someone streaking and ending up on there. Yes I heard about that case and it's sad. But I think it's a little off topic. Sad to say he's still in prison. I think case after case could be brought up of people that are wrongly accused and put in prison. Our justice system isn't perfect but it's the best we have right now. Another thought. Child victims have been known to say they weren't abused when in fact they have been and vise versa. It's sad really that such evil exists or that people will go to that extreme to get back at another parent. No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

it's clear that in your mind, they probably did more than they were actually convicted of. But it works both ways, and shows why DAs are prone to over charge. Someone that is innocent (or guilty of a minor offense) yet being threatened with years in prison might choose to take the deal in order to avoid jail, to avoid bankrupting themselves, to move on. Some may find, or think wrongly at the time, that being labeled a sex offender is preferable to the risk of losing in trial. And they may be right - juries are no different than the people posting here, ones that forgot that Americans are presumed innocent. Backinthesky asks what my stake in all this is? I believe in the Constitution and generally like to push back against rabid witch hunts where due process or presumption of innocence would be cast aside in the name of victims' rights. Promise - it wasn't clear to me if you're talking about an actual instance or a hypothetical where a victim went skydiving and encountered a convicted sexual predator. Either way, it's not enough to warrant blackballing from the TI ranks anyone that has ever made a list. Your glib "he should a got a better lawyer" rationale doesn't cut it in this country. I'll push back the other way. What about the perpetrator getting lesser charges to save the victim from going through a trial. I don't see a witch hunt I see that many in today's society rather push for the rights of the one convicted of a crime then the victims of the crime. The ONLY person in any scenario that didn't have a choice or a say in it was the victim. The guy that CHOOSE to run naked across the street still made a CHOICE. No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

It is a sad thing. Do you have a case in mind where someone is on the registry for streaking as a kid? No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

When doing the search you would come up with a person and then listed would be what they were convicted of or plea bargained down to. But, again there can be a BIG difference to what occurred and what the person got in a plea bargain. No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

They can run a simple search of the national registry No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

Forgive me I didn't even think beyond the US. Thank you for reminding me.

Yes having it legally binding is ideal, but you've given me something new to look into. I still think it would be step in the right direction to start with the USPA and these others. No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

So a person that wasn't certified or couldn't get certified is still able to do tandems ? No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

No you're right two wrongs don't make a right, but nothing is perfect and never will be. It's coming up with the best possible solution and I don't think everyone will ever agree on what that is. No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.

But it would go beyond a recommendation if the USPA refused to certify them. The problem with taking something out is the possibility of someone that has committed a more serious crime being able to plea bargain down to something like what would be excluded. No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried.