obelixtim

Not sure if that is true at all. As far as I know very little meaningful testing has been done with this scenario anywhere, and I'm sure chopping every time is not necessarily the best way to deal with it. RSLs play a part in this, they need to be disconnected before a chop. There are a lot of variables, and like many problems, what is successful one day, may very well kill you the next. You will always get a variety of opinions and answers, there simply is no right or wrong answer. I've seen a student land a biplane, they picked up both sets of toggles and steered both canopies together, which I thought was quite a good way to deal with a two out that has biplaned, but I would not go so far as to say that is the perfect solution. Like has been said, every scenario has to be dealt with on its merits. Logically, if you have a stable situation, and you have to steer, you need to first make sure your RSL is disconnected (in case you need to chop if it turns sour) then be VERY gentle with inputs to steer. Doing nothing is an option, at least you have plenty of fabric over you and shouldn't land too hard. I wouldn't be worried too much about making the DZ if there is clear ground underneath you. Staying calm will aid your chance of survival. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

5K is plenty altitude to get a decent track in. As has been said, you don't need to stage the breakoff, At breakoff everyone needs to track like hell. Bigger formations will prolly mean staging breakoff, but not necessary for 10 - 12 ways. During the track it is NOT the time to be looking for an altimeter. You need to be scanning for other jumpers, and avoiding when necessary. If you know you are at 5 K on breakoff (which you should be if your base man is diligent with breakoff), then all you need to do is count to yourself, as you track, if you get to 10, its time to wave off and dump. That should have you activating at 3K. It should not be necessary to track that long if you know and trust your fellow jumpers. This is why you need to be careful if there are rookies on the load. Pre jump briefings and jumper discipline is really important. Plan the jump and jump the plan. Anyone who doesn't, needs to be axed. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Well plenty of aircrew in WW2 managed it, so yes it is possible. Their training would have been pretty limited. I'm sure quite a few didn't manage it either, even with training. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Fill a rucksack with wallets??? My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

And if you are over the Atlantic or Pacific ocean, or over the North or South Pole, or somewhere over the Himalayas, and have managed to find yourself alive under an open canopy, you have a few new problems on your plate. ETA: The explosive decompression at 40 grand would incapacitate everyone pretty instantly anyway... My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Two of my Uncles never came home, and were never found. I did find another two buried in Italy and Belgium. Another who was also an airman survived, but was captured, and spent 3.5 years as a POW, and according to my mother, came home as a walking skeleton, having survived the infamous death march from Eastern Europe, as the Germans withdrew ahead of the Russian army. I met him once...he was a skeleton with skin, muscles wasted away during internment. Another striking feature of the cemeteries (of both sides) was how young these men were, late teens, early 20s most of them. Never even lived, poor buggers. What a colossal waste. And for what? My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

I've visited many of the WW2 battlefields and war cemeteries, looking for the resting places of several of my older relatives who did not make it home. What is striking about the cemeteries, is the number of graves marked " An unknown soldier of WW1 or WW2" where bodies were recovered but could not be identified. There are also servicemen (particularly airmen) buried in various village and town cemeteries throughout Europe, although wherever possible, a lot of these were disinterred after the war and reburied in designated war cemeteries. It is possible these two airmen are amongst these "unknowns", and may not have been victims of a war crime. Just an afterthought.... My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

At 30 mph wind speed, that would give openings at about 1000 feet and 3000 feet respectively. In the chaos of events, that sounds fairly realistic to me. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

OK, the SS were not known for their humanity, and they could well have met that fate, in which case it may be very difficult to find them, as the SS did have form for trying to hide their crimes. Allied airmen were known as terror fliers (to the Germans) at that stage of the war, due to the incessant raids on German cities. It would not be far fetched to imagine the SS troops meting out their version of "justice", and then hiding the evidence. Typically, winds at ground level are less strong than at altitude, so with a 30 mph wind speed at 10000 feet, the canopies would drift anything up to about 4 miles maximum. I would not expect them to be open at 10000 feet, due to the time it may have taken them to get out and open. Would easily lose 1 or 2 thousand feet at least in the chaos after being hit. Quite probably more. Somewhere around 1 to 2 miles would be the most likely distance they would drift IMO. The canopies would descend about 1000 feet per minute, so from that, if you know the wind speed you can make calculations from that. Their unmodified canopies would have no inherent forward speed of their own, so the wind speed alone would determine their drift. Good luck. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

If they bailed out and were able to open, would they not have been captured after landing? My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

If you wouldn't jump it you shouldn't put it in an instructional video. It sends the wrong message. It's great you're excited about skydiving, but personally I don't think videos like this are a great idea unless you're an instructor and you're absolutely certain about the information you're imparting. The routing of the bridle not being to manufacturer specs is a good example. You need to have a good reason to suggest an alternative. We've seen people come through here who are absolutely certain that either they can learn skydiving from stuff they've read online, or that their instructors are wrong because of similar. What's your goal of creating this channel? I agree. Its a good idea, but it has to be totally comprehensive, as in how it would be done by a master rigger who knows all the small things to look for. It isn't that difficult, and a printed check list (maybe in poster form) should be prominently displayed at every DZ. I once found a packing pin under a reserve flap that had been in place for 4 - 5 months, on a rig which had been jumped about 60 times, by a guy who was just learning to do CRW. Potential for a chop was huge, and would have resulted in a total on the reserve. His face changed colour several times when we showed it to him, and the rigger responsible had his rating revoked on the spot. The ribbon had torn off the pin when he removed it, leaving the pin in place and he had not checked and counted his tools in on completion. That rig had been checked before every jump, and no one had picked up the hidden pin. You couldn't see it unless you turned the rig on its side and looked at the overlapping reserve flaps. So you need to know where, and how to look for things that may not be obvious. At meets, a group of us riggers would inspect every rig before kick off, and sometimes we would test each other by intentionally creating a problem, and seeing if it would be picked up. That was a bit stressful, even though you knew something was amiss and were looking for it. Wasn't good to fail those little tests, but it kept us on our toes. Such a video, while a good idea, should be made with advice from a variety of riggers, to make sure everything is covered. Missing something could be problematic for someone who thinks the video covers everything. And such a video needs to be viewed and understood by everyone who straps a rig on who has attained an A licence. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Not worth the hassle. Which discipline would you have? Tunnel might become one (beats synchronised swimming), but that's not skydiving. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

You got the wrong end of the stick here. I was not specifically criticising the OP. My comments were aimed at the general skydiving population who take no interest in finding out about their gear. Asking questions is the best way to do that. There are no stupid questions. However. I would expect an A licence holder to know enough about their gear to be able to pack it, untangle it, inspect it properly, assemble the 3 ring, and give good gear checks. And also have an understanding of how the AAD works, and how the deployment system works for both main and reserve. There is plenty of downtime while earning an A licence to find out these things. I guess some people just spend their downtime sitting on their arses with their brain switched off. And THEY are the ones my comments are aimed at. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Whoever he is, you can't question his decision making. And at any level of competence, that is one of the most important things. Make a decision, and stick to it. That's the lesson young Skywalker. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Madrid. Ocana. Did a good job with a friend. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

So he did not assume that it was a universal constant, and this concerns you? Ok. Yes, because he should know that by now. This gear is what saves your life. Relying on a rigger or an AAD may be required by law or DZ rule but you need to know as much about your gear as you can. The basics of how it works is .. well basic. Knowing that you may have a PC hesitation that you have to blow off by rolling a shoulder or setting up my save your life. And it's YOUR responsibility to know what to do to save your life. I've know jumpers with hundreds of jumps who didn't know how to hook up a 3 ring. This means that they didn't know if it was wrong. At drove me nuts. Totally agree. There is no excuse nor reason for ignorance. Ultimately, your life is your responsibility. People need to wake up. This is not tiddlywinks we are playing. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Hah. I remember when the first news of DB Cooper's amazing skyjack came out. I was jumping at Livermore back then. Many Nor Cal jumpers were convinced Bill Dause did the job but then the witness descriptions and FBI drawing came out and that myth died fast. 377 BD is DB backwards....... Coincidence? I think not.... Dan Cooper smoked and drank. Bill does neither. Dan Cooper was reported to above average height. Bill is not. Dan Cooper jumped out of the plane. Bill would have ordered everyone else to jump and flown the plane himself! top Pffffttt...flimsy details. Anyone can quit smoking and drinking. Height reduction surgery..... The plot sickens....... My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Agreed. Cable length is critical. However its not simply a matter of snipping the ends off with a pair of sidecutters, easy as that is. You don't want burred ends on the cable, able to snag the loop. That could make things interesting in a chop. Its something you should leave to your rigger. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Hah. I remember when the first news of DB Cooper's amazing skyjack came out. I was jumping at Livermore back then. Many Nor Cal jumpers were convinced Bill Dause did the job but then the witness descriptions and FBI drawing came out and that myth died fast. 377 BD is DB backwards....... Coincidence? I think not.... My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Red is a good colour when you go walkabout looking for your handle after biffing it into space. The camo ones hide themselves. When big old B4 ripcord handles were dropped, sometimes you could hear them coming. Everyone would be diving under cars or running for cover. Getting hit by one would certainly make your eyes water....Solid handle with 3 feet of cable whirling around like a stingray with a line trimmer would ruin your day for sure. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Still looking for DB Cooper I take it.... My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Of course there are other factors to consider. Is the canopy configured to be flying at full speed or with brakes set, with no input from the jumper/load? Load distribution? Canopy correctly trimmed? Lots of variables if we add in differing weather conditions. It would be difficult to conduct a meaningful series of tests because you can't really have a "control" to measure variables against. The best you can do is standardise the particular test canopy and load balance. What we are looking at is just the general tendency of canopy behaviour in this scenario. Normally I would say a canopy will maintain a heading all things being equal, with nil wind conditions. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Some skydivers just leave their teeth in a glass of water on the ground....and their faces flap in freefall. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Wise words. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

Not necessarily the main DZ. Any safe landing area, which, as you correctly say, is the priority. Making oneself smaller should not preclude the ability to select a good landing area. My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....