ScratchTX

Another late one, but this has ALWAYS worked for me, even for the really persistent hiccups. But the hiccuper must be really willing to fully participate. You need another person to do it to you. These instructions are written for the other person (i.e., how to stop someone else'e hiccups.) Have the hiccuper stand and face you and make and maintain eye contact. They must focus on you the entire time. If you are a little bit kinky, it will be easier for you to do this... draw on that dominant/daddy/military officer/strict teacher whatever energy works for you. Don't be mean, just mean business. Firm. But encouraging trust. They must abandon their diaphragm to you. Tell them: "Take a deep breath...now hold it... hold it.... hold it..." Make sure to maintain direct eye contact. No smiling or giggling. Keep telling them to "hold it" as you see them start to become a little uncomfortable... their eyes will open a little wider..."hold it..." they start to look like they may not be able to make it... just before you can tell they can barely hold it any longer, say very sharply, "Now blow it out really hard!" As soon as they have expelled their breath, before they have had a moment to think about it or do anything, say forcefully and quickly: "TAKE ANOTHER DEEP BREATH!!' and then repeat the "hold it, hold it, hold it..." step. Redirect eye contact to you if necessary. Have them "blow it out again really hard!" and TAKE ANOTHER DEEP BREATH. This time, when they reach that critical exhale moment, tell them gently (but still firmly), "Purse your lips and blow out very very slowly." Their hiccups are gone. And you've had fun. If you are, um, flexible enough, you can do this to yourself once you get good at it...

Yes good answers, thanks very much! Hope to get there someday. --Scratch

yes, most likely. I know I did shoot some distance up above the glass a few times, but generally I was probably going only just above it when it felt as if I was going "way up there." And most of the bouncing around off the walls was at the glass level or lower, true. that wouldn't be me) I hope to get to the L-1 tunnel sometime, too. But lately I am barely getting to the dropzone so it might be a while. Thanks for the perspective --Scratch

When I had some coached tunnel time in Orlando last year, I found myself spending a lot of time waaay up near the top, and bouncing off the walls. What would this translate to in an outdoor tunnel? I'm picturing long crashes to the net...kind of ugly and asymmetrical after a slide out of the air column, too, I imagine. I'm sure I'm not the only lightweight person who tenses up when having a hard time in a wind tunnel -- are there any videos of this happening in an outdoor tunnel like the L-1? Or a good description of what happens/best way to handle it? I've watched the video clips on the L1 website and can see that, unless you TRACKED out of the airflow or something, you'd be hard-pressed to miss the net - so no real concern there. Is the net bouncy enough to make a big plummet down to it simply fun, and not a problem? Or is there a height from which falling out of the airflow is really not recommended?

Yep, definitely the five-minute version, not the five-hour one. But truly, I think there would be an audience for a 8-10 minute video. Sure, some people don't want to know even that much but hey, they wouldn't be watching the video in the first place. I'm sure many other people besides me and the guy who posted above have friends and family who were interested in understanding the basics. It would not be too difficult to explain the basics of skydiving and equipment without going into excruciating detail. I'm thinking the level of explanation my 12 year old niece wanted -- we talked for about 20 minutes about relative wind, exits, body flight (hey I can explain it better than I can do it!), PC's and deployment, three-rings and cutaways, simple canopy flight and landing. We also talked about risks, malfunctions, wings level... We even got into accepting the risks, waivers, personal responsibility (my indoctrination since she said she wants to skydive)... AND the little sprout even grasped the airspeed/windspeed concept with no trouble! With a tight script, good illustrative visuals (video and graphics) and well edited skydiving beauty shots, I think this would be fun! As a bored video producer/writer/director/editor languishing in a slow period at a community college video dept., I'd love to work on something like this on my own time. I think it is a good enough idea to warrant some attention, really. Anyone else interested in giving it some more thought? (The DVD version could have more extras -- more detailed explanation, more instruction, maybe some entertaining short subjects by creative skydivers, etc. Oh, and I guess that's where we'd put sitflying, if such a thing even exists... :>)) --Scratch

Check out this article: http://www.performancedesigns.com/docs/wingload.pdf

You know, it's not just the initial experience of fear, either. I remember crossing a high, narrow suspension footbridge swaying hundereds of feet above a canyon below. I was afraid, yep. I stayed afraid every inch of the crossing. I crossed it by staring at the back of my friend 12 inches in front of me, planting one foot in front of the other, keeping a white-knuckled grip on the handrail. This seemed like just "toughing it through the fear," and as if it somehow was worth less than accepting and abating the fear. But the experience made me more comfortable with not only facing the *initial* experience of the fear, but dancing to the extended mix as well... The racing heart and rapid breathing was fear; there it was, hello, all the way across. Every experience of spending time with fear helps reinforce that fear just IS, and is nothing to be afraid of. And the view from the other side was breathtaking. Even/especially when that reality is fear. My first response to that was "yes, I agree, well said." My next response was that I'd like it more if it had been said in first person singular, instead of sounding as if it was for all humankind... I get a little tired of this thing of people "knowing" what makes true "living" for others. People are so different with who and where they are in life, and what "living" is to them. People with "small" lives can be happy and fulfilled. People who live afraid of their fear can feel love, happiness -- they can work around it. But then I thought, well, this IS a skydiving board... It is probably pretty safe to make that statement if the "we" in it refers to people who have more than a passing interest in skydiving. So I'll cut you some slack... :>)

The most striking thing I've realized about fear is that it is a response to something that hasn't happened yet. But wait, what if the scary thing is already happening right now? Even with things that *seem* to be current and happening in the moment, the fear isn't about what is happening, but what could or will happen. Reserve canopy opens with severe spinning linetwists? The fear is that you won't be able to clear it and you will hit hard and be injured or die. Skidding on an icy patch of highway? The fear is that you will not be able to gain control and you will go off the edge or hit something. Standing on a stage and singing to a crowd? The fear is that they will ridicule you. Stumbling on the edge of a 500 foot cliff and falling off, to your certain death? The fear is still about what has not happened yet -- it as about what is yet to happen when you hit. It's really a good and useful thing to be able to imagine and picture what could or will happen in a situation :>) Definitely! If we didn't think about that, we wouldn't pull... But *living* something that has not yet happened, having an emotional reaction to it as if it is happening right now, is a different thing. That's cool when you're watching a movie and you want to take that fear ride. It's cool as an alert to a potential threat; a notice to do something. But it's not cool to live there. It obscures your clear view of what is actually happening. "How can you be two places at once when you're not anywhere at all?" So the ultimate way to accept, embrace and abate fear is really just to stay in the moment, isn't it? I think that is what the tools and strategies discussed here are all about. And since "just staying in the moment" is so much easier to say than do, I know that I, for one, appreciate all the tools I can get! Good thread.

From Slashdot more info at urls below. Amazing stuff. Science fiction, except it isn't. How long before we will be able to jack into cyberspace? http://www.napa.ufl.edu/2004news/braindish.htm http://www.wired.com/news/medtech/0,1286,65438,00.html

This sounds interesting. I'm one of the few I know who really didn't enjoy the tunnel (went Skyventure in Orlando as part of coached training). My impression of my 20 or 30 minutes in there is grindingly loud motors, hard walls, harsh lighting, repeated negative reinforcement for failing to relax (HIT that wall! PING pong back! BOUNCE off the other side!), stressful exits through narrow doors, no sky, no ground... I'm sure really focusing and relaxing in there would get me to such a zen centered place that I could relax and feel my body skydiving anywhere, anytime... and I did have some good moments flying my body with my coach after I got the hang of it a little bit, but it was just too devoid of the good stuff for me. The whole experience package didn't make me want to go again. An outdoor tunnel sounds more appealing. Yes, I'm sure I would fall out, since I hit the walls in the indoor tunnel, but that seems like a more gentle teaching consequence (kind of like walking back from landing out) rather than a punishing correction. I assume you can get back in once you fall out, right? what does that mean?

Yes, thank you! Great post. I think everyone agrees that it's a good idea to attempt to intervene if someone is about to do something stupid, including jumping impaired by any substance or state. But this whole demonization of "drug users" as some weird cultural group of people, is just bizarre. It's not whether someone is a "drug user" that matters, it's someone's relevant and present actions and abilities that matter. Sure, sometimes there can be a connection between drug use and attitudes re: acceptable risk, personal safety, and others' safety. But sometimes there is no connection, or a favorable connection. You just can't draw conclusions about someone's actions, behavior or abilities based on whether or not they can be identified as a "drug user" or not, any more than you can draw such conclusions about someone based on whether they are an "alcohol user," or a "gun owner" or a "base jumper," or even a "religion user." And yes, it makes me really sad too that we have gotten to the point where someone should fear even asking certain questions, because of the chance that someone else will decide that those questions brand the questioner as a threat... geez, that's almost like being afraid to check certain books out of the library or join certain organizations because... hmm, never mind.

Forgot to include that relevant info -- none. Cessna 182. So it's just the four of us up there. As for the next reply (someone losing track of direction and dumping almost under you) that's one of the things I'd be concerned with in theory... but in reality, on a clear day, with a very identifiable N/S landmark (freeway) and the skill level of this person, I'm not sure how serious a concern that really was in this case. I guess shit can always happen, but still... it's that balance of planning for the unexpected on one hand, but not trying to design jumps around every possible far-fetched thing that could possible happen on the other. Not sure where this one falls for me now that I'm thinking about it after the fact, curious what others think. --Scratch in TX

This weekend, I did a fourway where (at my request) we agreed to break off high (5000 instead of 4500k). One jumper said since we were breaking that high, they would go into a very steep dive away at first, then flatten into a regular track. I thought about it and said that it made me feel kind of warm and fuzzy to be able to see everyone at breakoff as I'm tracking away and waving off, and I'd really prefer they not dive away, even though I was planning on opening a little high (3500). No problem, they agreed to not dive away if it made me uncomfortable. I'm wondering what other people's thoughts are on this -- if everyone really is tracking away from the center of a small group like this, is this something you would be concerned about? I suppose I could still see them if they were lower than me, but my skill level is such now that breakoff and separation is a pretty busy time -- it's just a lot easier for me to see the others on a quick scan if they're more or less on the same level as me. Or, if you're on a jump and the group agrees to a high breakoff, how do you spend your extra time before you pull? (Just to add: I didn't have any reason to particularly doubt this person's skills or abilities at all -- they are significantly better than mine -- it's just the general idea I didn't like.)

thanks for the ideas and input, all. I like the small patch of loose gravel idea. Sadly, it's hard to get the cops to care since it never lasts long plus we are not exactly a white middle class neighborhood over here so the cops aren't too responsive (except when they over react and shoot people). I have talked to the guy before and was only successful in getting the loudest engine rev ever, before they stopped for the night. He's not a classic "biker," more a hood/gangsta type. Thing is, he has at least two little kids and there seem to be a few more living at the house. His kids think it is cool. He's a moron. Maybe I'll go find out if the bike is a Kawasaki or Yamaha or whatever and print up an authentic looking flier from the company, to all [brand} sport bike owners... a reminder of maintenance tips as we approach the fall season: revving your bike at high speeds with no load will damage the engine...

Whoo hoo, didn't realize I was stirring it up! Interesting. But just to clarify -- it's not one of those loud pipe bikes, I don't think (I hear/see them at the huge bike rally here every year.) It's a cheapish looking-sounding bike, not a tricked out fancy anything. It sounds normal at normal driving speeds (rarely heard). My Toyota Corolla would sound loud and tortured too if I put it in neutral and held the accelerator to the floor... (Hey maybe with all the SUVs out there dwarfing me I should think about loud pipes for my Corolla... :>)

Need another perpective on this: My neighbors across the street have a bike that sits in their driveway. Every weekend he starts it up and sits in front of the house for about five minutes, revving the engine to its max. I'm no bike expert but the engine sounds like crap to my untrained ear, and like it's being pushed to its limit. It's loud enough that you can't hear anything in the house (conversation, movie, music). Then after 3-5 minutes he peels out at full throttle down our very quiet, one-block-long residential street of elderly people, cats, and two families with small kids. Turns and races up the adjoining blocks. Come backs, revs the engine ultra max again to the adoring cries of "daddy! daddy!" from his very young daughters. Shuts down the bike for a few hours until he does it again. This happens several times a day most every Friday, Saturday and Sunday; usually before the "magic hour" of 10 PM. Questions for other bikers: - Why would you do this? - Is this GOOD for the bike? Necessary? - Does the appeal of going VROOM VROOM VRO_BLAT_VROO_uh_OOOOOOM really really loud outweigh everything else? - From a biker's perspective, does this seem as inconsiderate and assholic (oops I guess my history with these neighbors is showing) as it seems to me? - If you were really into your bike and loved doing this, is there anything anyone could say to you that might make you think otherwise about doing it? Alternatives? Or is this just good all american fun and I am just turning into bitchy neighbor lady? I'm really looking to gain some insight here; I don't get it.

Thanks so much! I had stopped at the regular ProTec listing and didn't see the "sale ProTec" ones. Perfect! Will finish off the clashing geek look I have been trying to achieve...

Can you still get them? A few years ago, I considered replacing my freebie, used black ProTech helmet with a new one, and saw funky colors like purple granite and pink granite in the catalogs. At the time, I decided that I couldn't afford a new ProTec and that I had too much dignity to wear anything other than basic black on my head. Now, I have a little more money and thankfully much less dignity, but I can't find those weird ProTec colors anywhere. Anyone bought a purple granite ProTec lately, or know who sells them? I've looked at ParaGear, Square One, etc. as well as doing a google search for them at snowboard shops, water sport shops etc. Only finding primary colors and one place that sells "granite tan," sounds like a suburban countertop.

Did you ever get a reply to this? I've wondered about it, too -- the real name search doesn't work for me either.

[reply The single-belt-through-the-lift-web will keep you from becoming a missile and will keep the CG within limits even during an impact, but is less useful for personal protection since an impact would generate high rotational rates. Thanks, that's what I was picturing. I might not become a missle but I imagined that with some restraint systems I could rotate far enough to slam into someone else pretty hard. In a small plane it seems I could still move half the length of the plane...Still better than unrestrained though, I guess, where there would be nothing to stop me and everyone else except the front cockpit wall.

How snug do the seatbelts need to be to be useful? Is threading through a leg strap or main lift web effective if it still allows a lot of movement? In many planes, depending on where I am sitting and where the seatbelts are attached, I end up with what seems like a lot of potential motion anyway -- either from a long seatbelt tightened over my lower legs, or from a seatbelt where the bottom of each side of the belt attaches to the plane in the same place, and I attach it around my harness. I'll still use them because I get why they're important, but I wonder how much help they would be in a crash. (This is not just for 182's and 206's, but other planes as well.)

Stayed in the plane on an unplanned hop and pop a few weeks ago -- radio problems prevented us from going to altitude as planned. Offered chance to exit at 2500. I felt uncurrent (would have been my third jump that day after a nine-month layoff from semi-currency), had only done two jumps on my new canopy and no subterminal openings yet on it, wasn't entirely sure I'd solved the intermittent PC hesitation problem I'd been having months before, and hadn't practiced poised head-high exits from this plane much, usually just dove from it. The other two up jumpers ended up getting to 3000 anyway, but I had already decided not to go and rode the plane down with the student and JM and felt dumb. Was an okay decision, but I could have gotten out had I stayed more current, had I pushed my comfort zone on different exits, etc. You reap what you sow. (Good thing it wasn't an emergency -- although I believe I would have exited just fine, it was mostly a confidence issue.)

I think that history has made some of us doubt that the section that states "...provided that such investigation of a United States person is not conducted solely upon the basis of activities protected by the first amendment to the Constitution" is sufficient protection of our rights. The secrecy provisions and prohibition of sharing information reduces governmental accountability in this area. See the Church Committee report on COINTELPRO for more info on this history: http://www.icdc.com/~paulwolf/cointelpro/cointel.htm If neither you nor anyone you know has ever had their rights infringed on improperly by government intelligence agents or law enforcement agents, you would probably have more reason to believe and trust the Patriot Act as written. Those with other experiences will of course believe otherwise and want additional accountablility. I don't read this forum a lot but wanted to just offer that info and link. (edited to add: I have not read the entire Church report. But skimming it, and reading the "Introduction and Summary," and especially the "Conclusions and Recommendations" will explain what I am talking about.)

The "watch thread" feature is not working for me. One of the threads that I am watching has received many posts since I added it to my list, but I get no emails notifying me. I checked both my dropzone.com email address, and my email address listed in my profile... (I also checked the spam folder of my profile email address, just to make sure they weren't going there, but they are not.) I think I have everything else set properly in my profile -- any suggestions?

Damn, no one is saying anything to support the half of me that is arguing against doing it... :>) So much money, so much medical care, so much time... I know I'd be happy when it's all done, though. It's just hard to change course and think seriously about this when for 45 years (well I guess only about 30-35) I've been just living with these teeth, no big deal. (Dave, pm-ing you with question about Drs. in this area) --Scratch