base689

> Has anyone tried the Dagger from Vertigo with vents? ?!?!?!?!?!?!? ?!?!?!?!?!?!? Has Dagger got vents as option?!?!?!?!?!?!? ?!?!?!?!?!?!? First, I think vents are NOT an option on Dagger's. Second, I think that bluntly applying vents: 1) in the Fox/Flik position and shape 2) in the Black Jack position and shape 3) in the Troll position and shape on a Dagger is NOT a good idea because: 1) Dagger is NOT tested for flight with vents (at least officially: we do not have any evidence that Vertigo ever made any test with vents/valves on their Dagger); 2) if you do so, you cannot imagine how Dagger is going to open/fly/land/whatever... The only BASE parachutes that have got valves (presently, there is not any more any BASE manufacturer that applies "only-vents" to their canopies) as standard or as an option are: Fox/Flik from BR, Black Jack from CR and Troll from Atair. Full stop. Just my 0.02€. Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

>What would be an estimate for the number of BASE numbers currently issued annually (that is, over a 12 month period)? How long before BASE 1000 goes?? In the latest 2 years, there have been an average of 6 BASE jumpers completing the word B.A.S.E. every month. Now (Sep 2003) we are at about BASE #850, with 150 left to 1000, at a rate of 6/month, in 25 months from now there should be a bloke/doll whose number will be BASE #1000, that would be roughly in October 2005. Just for those who love statistics. Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

...still needing to see what are you dynamic corners mod on your Prism, Tom!!! I perfectly understand any issue of wrap around corner in 2 pin rigs, where the side flap are closed over the bottom flap and so it is preatty easy to manufacture a wrap around corner to hide the dynamic corner itself, wrap around cloth laying on the bottom of container and so NOT catching air. In case of Prism, where instead first you close onto themselves the side flaps and THEN you close the bottom flap OVER the side flaps, I hardly imagine how you succeed in doing a wrap around sort of stuff, granted that side flaps are UNDER bottom flap. And if the bottom flap is the one that incorporates the wrap around sort of stuff, in such a case, this wrap around sort of stuff would very likely to catch air, because to wrap around the corner starting from bottom flap it must go towards up over and along the side flaps, good way to catch air. So, unless I see a couple of pictures of your Prism set up, I hardly imagine how you managed to do dynamic corners on Prism's... Also, the idea of sliding "stiff part" of dynamic corner implemented by Bombproof Rigging is a very good idea indeed, but, again, it seems to work properly only either on velcro rigs or on 2 pin rigs, doesn't look like working well on a 1 pin rig. ...I need pictures... Thanks so much in advance Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

> Some rigs will require additional work to make a retrofit of some kind of open corner (the Prism is like this) because of the tension direction and container cut A LONG TIME AGO you promised to send me few picture about the dynamic corner mod you got on your Prism, but still I am not seeing any photo at all... Seriously, as soon as you will have some spare time to take a couple of picture of your "open-corner" Prism opend and closed (plus any other picture that can help understand how the mod must/can be made) Ciao from your friend from South Europe Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

A good rule of thumb, by which you cannot go too wrong, is the following table where are reported the naked weight of jumper and "proper" canopy size: 60 kg - 132 lb: 220-225 ft² 70 kg - 154 lb: 240-245 ft² 80 kg - 176 lb: 260-265 ft² 90 kg - 198 lb: 280-285 ft² 100 kg - 220 lb: 310-320 ft² Any jumper whose weight falls in between the above weight, is free to choose either the smaller or the bigger canopy size, considering that the bigger canopy you have above your head, the slower (and the better ) you will fly. Of course, case by case, jumper by jumper, put in the choice process issues like: experience, usual location of sites jumped, usual condition of landing of sites jumped, body fitness, whatever, can make switch the decision from a certain canopy size to the preceeding or following size. Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

Hi Doug, It's nice to hear from you and I am really glad to hear that you are settling in a new land, hopefully a more free-from-police-country. Yes, it's true, also we, here in South Europe, are experiencing these new "gift-from-God-to-the-world-of-BASE" newbie BASE jumpers that once they have survived few tens of BASE jumps, they think they know it all and moreover they can do wahtever they want and jump any sort of objects, regardless of meteo and hours of the days, absolutely neglecting the call-the-local rule, so dear to the tradition of BASE jump, and, from a practical point of view, quite life-saving attitude. Our small group is slowly increasing (yes, it was a dream to remain 5 or 6 active BASE jumpers in this part of the world) but, because FREEDOM is to choose both your friends and your BASE jumping mates (who immediately become your close friends), our group still remains a group of friends that enjoys jumping together in safety and enjoys to meet other foreign jumpers as well. Yes, I know that time and money (more money, in my case... ) refrain us from travelling worldwide and meet you and other friends we have all over the world (possibly #726 has an idea of making it to the Petronas...), but please, Doug, consider that whenever you want you have a place to stay and sleep here at my place, and, moreover , now we have 7 objects not so far from my place that can be jumped any time of the day (=much preferably sunset time/night time ), 4 of which can be jumped with any wind direction, so that, if I am packed, a friend shows up in the middle of the night, possibly coming from a long journey, we can go and have a little flick in the night together Take care my friend, I wish you all the best for your life, that does not include only BASE, and don't forget that you have got a good friend here in South Europe. Hope to see you soon

> how much weight does the valve mod add on? Uhhmmm, in terms of total rig weight, I would say valve mod adds a neglectable weight (actually, I weighed my complete rig before I added the valve mod). In terms of pack volume, yes, valve mod adds some noticeable increase in pack volume, but after few pack jobs, I get used to it and succeeded in putting canopy into my container as neatly as before the mod. Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

From BR website: Fox 225 7.75 lb 3.5 kg Fox 245 9.25 lb 4.2 kg Fox 265 10.50 lb 4.75 kg Fox 285 10.75 lb 4.9 kg Fox 315 12.25 lb 5.5 kg (estimate) My rig, a Prism P5 + Fox 245 Multi Vtec+covers, weighs 16.50 lb - 7.5 kg (real measurement), so my Prism P5 only weighs 7.25 lb - 3.3 kg, and if we assume all Prism's to have the same weight (I do not have real weights of different sizes of Prism), we have the following weights for complete BR rigs: Prism+Fox 225: 15 lb - 6.8 kg Prism+Fox 245: 16.50 lb - 7.5 kg Prism+Fox 265: 17.75 lb - 8.1 kg Prism+Fox 285: 18 lb - 8.2 kg Prism+Fox 315: 19.50 lb - 8.8 kg Other BASE rigs from other manufacturers, I would say, weigh more or less the same as per corresponding canopy size. Hope it helps Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

> I would guess at around 850ish??? Yes, I can agree with that. Plus, I would add to complete: BASE #'s are 850ish NIGHT BASE #'s are 140ish NAKED BASE #'s are 20ish (NAKED BASE #18 issued on August 2003) Just my 0.02€ BASE #689 NIGHT BASE #124 NAKED BASE #14 Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

> The lowest non-freefall deployment I know of was 111 ft - 34 m May I remind you the famous INDOOR jump done several years ago (around 1990÷1992) by BASE #230 (UK jumper) who was D-bagged off the gallery of a famous cathedral? BASE #230 jumped off 102 ft - 31 m with a non-BASE canopy (I am afraid that at the time, BASE parachutes either did not exist or were at a very experimental stage... ...possibly not available in UK...). Congratulations to his rigging abilities and moreover to his balls!!!! > The lowest non-freefall deployment I know of was 111 ft - 34 m May I say that there is a European jumper that last year jumped (D-bagged) a cliff on the seaside in Southern Europe few cm's below 88 ft - 27 m? In that jump he landed on dry sand (not on water!); he used a Vtec-only parachute. It is very well documented with photos in his website. This chap is very modest and does not look for publicity, so I am not saying here about his name nor about his nationality. Also, in a personal e-mail, he told me that he did also better (=lower ) when he did another D-bag jump indoor, inside an industrial "building", jumping a Vtec-only parachute (with vents larger than a standard Vtec parachute) off 82 ft - 25 m!!!! And this jump was definitely over hard land!!! Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

> but since this is jumpable... Who decided your smokestack is jumpable?!?!? Just having seen the one jumper that jumped it 10 years ago? Did he do the jump of his life luckily walking away with it in his jump-of-a-life-time or is it repeatedly and "safely" jumpable? You CANNOT know it, since currently you do not have any information about landing area, landability into or outside factory premises, and so on... > who knows maybe 10 years time ill be a base jumper and ask the company for permission Sorry to destroy your dreams, but you will never have the permission from the company to jump it daylight and legally. What guarantees can they have that you don't smash yourself down, and destroy parts of the factory, and the mess with a fatality, police, whatever...? > as i dont know how far you can glide from that hieght i couldnt really say if there was safe landing if you can glide with ya parachute 60 metre's from there chimney base there would be safe landing in open paddocks You COULD, granted you got a flying parachute 50 m below exit point, 100 m is object's height, so you are flying at 50 m of altitude. Conservatively, a BASE parachute has an efficiency of 2 (for every meter you go down, you travel 2 m forward), so you COULD get to the open paddocks 60 m away from chimney's base, but... ...what if you cannot exit exactly in the direction facing the paddocks? ...what if you open slightly lower? ...what if releasing your brakes you find yourself with a good flying parachute at 40 m of altitude, maybe 35m? ...what if at 35÷40 m of altitude you get caught but a wind gust (not even that strong) in the opposite direction? ...what if in the "journey" towards the paddocks, 60 m away, you encounter the factory fence/wall that is 5 m (let's say) high? Remember that you must clear any object in the flight path (walls(fences/light poles/whatever...) with your body with a good clearance (see above wind gusts). So. In order to say that your chimney, and ANY object, is (repeatedly and "safely") jumpable, a BASE jumper must evaluate the object (exact object height, possible directions to jump off, landing area (=reachability of landing area from designated exit point), alternative landing areas, bust factors involved in the jump, whatever else...). > whats the lowest object advanced base jumpers will jump from ? It looks like a question way ahead of its (=your) time... At your stage, I think you don't need really to know which is the lowest height jumpable... But, again, the height jumpable is directly correlated to landing area (=availabilty and easyness of landing area), in the sense that the lowest the object is, the easiest must be its landing (easiest=soft consistency and availability (=must be just under and all around the object)). Then again: what is the surface under your low object? Because if the surface which you are going to land on is flat rock/concrete/tar, I could have in mind a "lowest" height-1 jumpable, if the surface which you are going to land on is paddock/meadow/mud/similar surface, I could have in mind another "lowest" height-2 jumpable. If you are going to land on shallow water, I could have in mind another "lowest" height-3 jumpable. If, finally, you are going to land on deep water, I could have in mind another "lowest" height-4 jumpable. Please, consider that in case of height-4, such a height-4 can be something around 25 m, which height-4 could be easily taken down to 20 m - 15 m - 10 m - 5 m - zero, simply because in that case you don't really have the need to jump WITH a BASE rig, granted that if the water is really deep enough, a diver with good ability/training can dive (feet down) off that height (25 m). So the story of a BASE rig, parachute, whatever, is no more necessary... Consider, finally, that clavadistas in Acapulco do their clavados (=dives) from 42 m or so feet down AND arms/head down. And they do jump off their "exit" point on the natural wall over the "La Quebrada" canyon WITHOUT a BASE rig. Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

A chimney/smokestack of 330 ft - 100 m of height is not low, it is quite well jumpable, as far as only "height" is concerned. But any object, to be jumpable, need to have more than only "minimum height" to be jumped. To be jumpable, an object needs to have: enoguh height to deploy the parachute, a decent exit point to jump of the object, a decent landing area that can be reached safely (and conservatively!) from the point where you have an open canopy over your head. End of story about jumpability of any object, smokestacks in particular: If, given your exit altitude and canopy deployment altitude, you start flying at an altitude that DO NOT allow to: 1) land where it is safe; 2) reach the OUTSIDE of the factory environment, you are very likely: 1) to hurt yourself if you do not reach a safe landing area; and/or: 2) to get caught by police in the process of escaping. A 330 ft - 100 m smokestack in the middle of a field in the middle of nowhere, it is a very jumpable object. A 330 ft - 100 m smokestack in the middle of a factory site and maybe even coming out from the middle of the roof of a factory building, could be impossible either to climb or to be jumped safely and/or to escape uneventfully. Just my 0.02€ Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

Great news that you completed the word!!!!!! WAY TO GO!!!!!!! Completing the word gives you such a feeling of accomplishment... and feeling of happyness as well!!! Once you know your number, please post your BASE #!!!! See you soon!!! Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

> You have to understand my position as someone that doesnt BASE jump and is in the stage of gaining knowledge/info... No worries, mate! > Your knowledge is listened to with respect. Thanks > I ringraziamenti 689. L'apprezzo. Correct Italian language. Thanks so much again Remember, never stop asking. Ignorance is something than can kill you in BASE. Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

Let's clarify. There is a big misunderstanding here. Let's explain how things are. Vtec have been introduced first by Basic Research on Fox parachutes as an option. Vtec are vents(= rectangular holes) on the bottom skin just in front of B line attachment. Such vents helps the air in during primary inflation allowing immediate pressurization of paracute (you have an immediate steerable parachute bla bla bla...). But vents are just vents, holes I mean. As the air can go in at the same air can go out, in case of turbulence during flight, in case of flare on landing, during the flight itself a lot of air escapes out of the canopy through the vents. Such a secondary effect is a negative effect. Vtec "ONLY" are just vents = holes. Then it came Consolidate Rigging/Adam who was studying his own system of vents/valves/whatever. Already aware of the negative effects of vents-only parachutes, he succeeded in developing his PAC valves, pressure activated and controlled valves. PAC are vents that have got in the inside of parachute a piece of "cloth" that allows the air to go in but stops air from going out (more or less effectively). Then it came Atair that introduced as an option to their Tool, their MDV (mono directional valves) valves. MDV valves are vents that have got in the inside of the parachute another differently shaped (funnel shape) piece of cloth that lets the air go in but stops air from going out. Then it came BR who had by now developed their own system of valves on their Fox's and Flik's, introducing Vtec+covers. Vtec+covers are vents that have got in the inside of the parachute another piece of cloth that lets the air go in but stops air from going out. So. Any time we are speaking about Vtec "only" we are speking about parachutes that have got only vents (= holes) in the bottom skin (air can go in but can also go out). Any time we are speaking about Vtec+covers and/or PAC valves and/or MDV valves and/or any other type of valve, we are speaking about parachutes that have got vents (= holes) in the bottom skin plus a certain type of valve inside the parachute that allows air to go in but stops air from going out. Vtec "only" helps in having a steerable canopy quicker. "Valves" helps in having a steerable canopy quicker too. Vtec "only" have the downside of having poor flight characteristics, poor flaring power during landing and could deflate the canopy in turbulence. "Valves" helps in not degrading flight/flare perfomance because of the vents (=holes). Vents = only holes Valves = vents plus valves Valves have all the benefits of vents-only and no downside (theoretically if the valve were "perfect" ) Is that clearer now? Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

1. 190 lb naked plus about 25 lb of equipment (rig+shoes+helmet...) makes 215 lb suspended weight: in order to have a load of 0.75 lb/ft² or less, I would advise the following parachutes: 1) Fox 285÷315 with Vtec+covers 2) Flik 293÷322 with Vtec+covers 3) Black Jack 280÷310 (already includes PAC valves) 4) Troll 290 with MDV valves Which brand of the above is quite personal, ask more around. Which size of the above, the bigger size would make you fly slower, which is such a good thing

> Regular D-bag and line stows Regular D-bag and line stows would work fine indeed > or use the tail pocket and just s-fold the canopy into the container Using tail pocket and BASE packing and S-folding (in five layers) into your skydiving rig would: !) give a very good idea of how your pack job is done properly or not; 2) train you to BASE pack, which is a very very good idea, which solution would take you to do your first BASE jump with your BASE packing after having already performed 10-20-30 BASE pack jobs, which give you a good sense of safety (you realize on your skin that you are really capable of BASE packing, and packing well indeed). Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

Hi Mish. After having had a look at your profile, granted it is correct and updated, it shows no BASE jump done yet. Now. Without any will of being offensive, I think that asking information on the Internet about B jumps seems way premature, in your case. Generally speaking about the "average" B, "average" A, "average" S, "average" E, definitely the average B is the most advanced and difficult BASE jump, due to a lot of things, bust factor included (and access-to-the-roof issue...). In my opinion, it would NOT be safe to do your (and ANY) first BASE jump off a B, and so, asking info on B jump is useless, granted that you are going to do your initial BASE jumps off an S, an A, maybe an "easy" E, for sure not off a B. So, after you will have done few/lot of BASE jumps off different objects, for sure you will have come in contact with (hopefully) lot of BASE jumpers who can give you all the beta about how to jump this or that B, and for sure they will take you to jump the above mentioned B together. Just my 0.02€ Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

Hi Atle! Thanks for posting a picture of your smoke pants. One question arises, though, because the reinforcement that can be seen in the inside of your "originally rain" pants is misleading: Are the holes in the front of the pants or in the back of the pants? Thanks so much for your reply and congratulation for your inventive ability and also for your tracking skills!!! Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

Simply because my rig had big rings and so I keep the same standard!!!!! And even if it would be possible to attach risers with minirings onto harness with big ring, for BASE I prefer so much to have risers with BIG rings because they have got a much better load ratio, as BASE #428 wrote above, and so, they (=big rings risers) have a much better "tollerability" with respect to manufacturing tolerances, i.e., even if they come slightly out of specifications (with respect to "perfect" manufacturing measurements), they still have a good safety margin. Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

Hi Dexter, sorry for the off-topic. Have you read the evolution of your idea of "SL-to-be-carried-with-you" Static Line? Look for my post on the BB. I have already jumped that set up, working really fine indeed . And reply to my post suggested also a way to make it safer (=with respect to possible entaglements). See you soon Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

Furthermore, I would like to add the following. If you want to use the WLO by Vertigo, you must buy the WLO toggle/riser system, you CANNOT use only the WLO toggles. The reason of this being that the WLO toggles have their "stiff" part (that in all the toggle/riser systems is sticked under/into the keeper on the riser to set the brake) being a straight steel pin, and its keeper on the riser is made just for and only for the straight steel pin. Plus, they have got a snap (besides the velcro) to be kept secure (=more secure). I have got a BR complete rig (Prism+Fox), and for using WLO toggles on my rig, I had to buy the complete WLO togglle/riser system, whose risers I ordered with LARGE rings (if you ask, Vertigo is going to put large rings on their risers). Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

Hello there, The present post is to inform you that last week I did a SL jump with the SL/break cord with "SL-carry-with-you" set up. Perhaps I have been the first to use it, I dunno, for sure I have been the first in Italy to do it. Anyway, this post is NOT to brag about who is first to do what, but to share information. One of our local A, horizontal handrail. I manufactured a "SL-carry-with-you" exactly as per the photo "sling.jpg" in the attachment, with the exceptions: 1) the Static Line is NOT made from spectra (or any other canopy line) but is made from a 4 mm dyneema climbing rope, whose sheath is quite hard/robust and the "kit" itself is quite stiff; 2) I did not have the 3 loops "sticked into themselves and sewn" but rather I did 3 knots (I dunno the name, it is a very good knot used in sailing...). The set up with break cord is exactly as per the "Static2.jpg" attachment. I had the "branch-attached-to-bridle" of the kit to stay on the upper side with respect to horizontal handrail: the purpose of this being is that once you break the break cord, the whip stroke you have as a result is towards "UP", so not hitting anything along the way. If I had the "branch-attached-to-bridle" of the kit on the lower side, for sure in the whip stroke it would have hit any part of the steel structure below, not that this would mean automatically entanglement, but, you know, just in case... being in the upper side, it simply CANNOT hit anything. My jumping mate, who witnessed the deployment (no, he did not have his videocamera at this stage... ) did NOT notice anything strange. Deployment was clean as usual and I did NOT leave anything on the structure , diferently from #726, who left his SL onto the structure (we will recover it next time) My next step is to have my rigger to manufacture the "SL-carry-with-you" with the SAME dyneema rope as I have now but having the 3 loops done with the "sticked into themselves and sewn" technique and NOT with my very good knots, which are way bulkier than the sewn loops.... I will keep you informed on the setup!!! Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

Hucker, I am with you 100%. Even considering our LEGAL terminal wall, about which lots of people brag about its beauty, its fantasticness, lots of skydivers read about it, buy a BASE rig, make a 3000 km trip and off you go the exit point... Yes, it's legal, yes, it could be "easy" for a well trained newby, but for an untrained newbie can be a nightmare. No naming sites. Never. It is NOT necessary. It is unfair for the locals that you brag about your fantastic BASE journey, and leave the locals to live and cope with the consequences (BASE wannabies that WANT to be taken up the exit, jumps with an impossible weather/wind (impossible also for very well trained and experienced locals)...). Just my 0.02€. Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

Yes, I believe and agree with your data. To go from 2.3:1 "within" the air to 3.4:1 with respect to ground, you have to increase of 50% the value of your indicated air speed ("within" the air mass) through tail wind. When you are flying at 90 MPH "within" the air mass (indicated air speed), you need to get a 133 MPH true speed with respect to ground: i.e., you must have a 43 MPH tail wind. You fly horizontally within the air at 90 MPH (indicated air speed), the air mass (=wind) travels at 43 MPH, so in the end you are travelling horizontally with respect to ground at 133 MPH true speed. 43 MPH wind: a very very high wind!!!!!! And granted that somewhere up there you get such a 43 MPH tail wind, how on earth can you have "guaranteed" such a 43 MPH tail wind throughout the 21 miles horizontally and throughout the 6 miles vertically?!?!?!?!?!? I am not a super metereologist, but that very strong wind is very unlikely to exist on such a wide area (volume of air, I would say...). But granted that Felix is NOT using a Skyflier but a rigid wing, Skyray type, his speed (horizontal and vertical, but for the "wind" gain only the horizontal speed matters) would be higher than the 90 MPH you get with a Skyflier, so needing a tail wind much stronger than the above 43 MPH wind: in the end, if your efficiency in zero wind conditions is 2.3, to get up to 3.4 of efficiency, you must have a tail wind that is 50% of your horizontal indicated airspeed. Anyway, if Felix's staff is not just crazy, I guess that the main component of such achievement is to wait for the "once in a lifetime" meteo conditions that would allow him to get the 3.4 efficiency required to complete the plan. On this point, I am 101% with you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Stay safe out there Blue Skies and Soft Walls BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com