TomAiello

PLEASE post a pic of that! :D http://www.motorace.com/body_safety/body_safety.htm I'm a big believer in body armor. Everyone at the cave kept giving me funny looks for it last week. On the other hand, I believe I heard that Slim thinks he'd be dead now if he wasn't wearing a full suit of Dainese armor when he had his wall strike. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

At your level of experience (1000 jumps, flying a 7 cell), I doubt the landing area is going to be a problem for you. Still, it can be spooky the first couple times. How do you know? I had trouble taking 5 seconds on my first two jumps at the Cave. It's really spooky to be falling with cliff walls all around you. In a heartbeat. That Cave is probably the most amazing object I have ever even conceived of, let alone jumped. The Norwegian expedition cost around US$2000 (depending on the exchange rate to the NKR). That's quite a bit cheaper than the Aerial Extreme expedition. I've heard that Adrenaline Exploits is planning a Cave or Cave/Copper Canyon combo trip, but I'm not sure how much that will cost (BASEhoundSam? Any word?) Very little. There is no climbing or rapelling involved, as the winch does 95% of the work. You do have to do some manual rope hauling and stacking, but anyone ought to be able to handle it. One of the Norgie organizers, Vibeke Knutson, is a woman. If you'd like to get her email address, PM or email me and I'll pass it along. She should be able to give you a good idea of what's involved (assuming she made it home after the all night party last night in Tampico). -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

Try contacting Rick Harrison at Cliffleaper@aol.com. He's the official BASE number keeper, and has plastic cards and such--I'm not sure about patches. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

According to Stein Edvardsen (Norwegian BASE Federation President), the first wingsuit BASE flight was made by Partick de Gayardon (spelling?) in winter or spring 1996 at Lysefjord, Norway. Stein took him there, and they hired a helicopter to get to the top, as the roads were still closed. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

I am in Tampico now, having just finished eight days at the Cave with the Norgies (big thanks to Stein, Vibeke and Ronnie!). I would say that the Cave is an intermediate level object. To jump it safely you must be able to take five second delays (underdelay is quite dangerous), and hit a reasonable BASE landing area. The Norgies require 50 BASE jumps to get onto their trip. I am not sure about prerequisites for other expeditions, but that sounds about right to me. I wil try to write a bit more detail once I get back to California the day after tomorrow. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

It may not be strictly necessary to have hundreds of jumps to survive a Bridge Day jump. However, it is necessary to have the skills and awareness developed in those jumps to survive the beginnings of a BASE career (tens of jumps from multiple different objects). Not every jump you will make in your early BASE career will be as easy, or as forgiving of error, as Bridge Day. I am curious what the BASE (not skydiving) experience of those people is. I'm not knocking your decision to jump at Bridge Day. But please, please be careful making jumps from other objects. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

Hi Rod, You should post this kind of request at BLiNC as well, since there is a far greater likelihood that an active BASE jumper will be reading that board than this one. Here's a link: http://www.blincmagazine.com/cgi-bin/forum/dcboard.cgi?az=list&forum=board Have fun out there. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

Do you know when Dag made that jump? -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

I made my first BASE jump three months, and 250 skydives, after my first solo skydive (about eight months after my tandem). I had been a climber in a previous life, and my only goal in skydiving was to accumulate experience for BASE. I often wish I had done more skydiving (particularly CRW and Accuracy) before starting BASE. My first jump was made from a forgiving 700 ft span with a nice, big road to land on. I made quite a few accuracy jumps on my first BASE canopy, and received packing and exit instruction from a mangy, 20 year old Australian who had around 250 BASE jumps (thanks Pete!). My first jump was made on a borrowed Perigee Pro and Mojo 260. My next 25 or so jumps were made on a rigger-built velcro rig (basically a Vision copy) with a clapped out old PD235 in it. After that my gear arrived (I'd ordered it before my first jump, but didn't get it for a while), and I jumped a FOX 265, with multi bridle attachment (no Vtec then, but I had it retrofitted 250 jumps later) in a Prism (BR single pin rig). That said, I wish that I had done the following differently: 1) Waited until I had my own real BASE specific gear before diving in (some of those PD235 openings were downright scary). 2) Made more CRW jumps before starting BASE (CRW is the best way I've seen to learn close canopy control without the risk of an object strike). 3) Practiced more accuracy with odd (cross and down-wind) approaches. 4) Gotten more live exit practice into a pool (I never blew an exit in the early days, but I know that was pretty much just dumb luck). I went back when I had around 100 jumps and made around 400 practice exits from 12 feet into a foam pit, with video so I could check out what I was doing. 5) Spent about five hours getting diving lessons so that I would have developed enough low airspeed body control to save myself if I did blow an exit. One thing I'm very glad I did was to sit down with my family and explain BASE to them, and what the risks were, and that I understood the risks. This saved me all kinds of grief later (when I put myself in the hospital). -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

Basic Research used to use balloon jumps as a part of their First Jump Course (to practice zero airspeed exits). At various times, Balloon jumps, bungee jumps, the "pendulumator" (a set of ropes hanging out of a tree somewhere in Norway) and swimming pools have all been used to practice dead air exits. The bottom line is to practice your exit over and over until you know that it will go well on your first real BASE jump. My favorite way to do this is into a swimming pool, because you get repeated jumps very quickly, to hone the muscle memory. The "pendulumator" is also a good method for doing this. Balloons and bungee both have the downside that you really only get a few practice exits at a time, and it can take a very long time to rack up sufficient practice to (practically--nothing is for certain) guarantee a stable exit on your first jump. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

You should see Dilbert on "If all your friends jumped off a building, would you?" I'll see if I can dig up the strip... -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

Dude, you're looking at the wrong Master's teams. Mine has an average age around 25, lots of college students (so the ages really average 20 and 30 in two big lumps) and is basically a big social club. So far it's yielded me three long term relationships and more "social" hookups than any DZ I've ever been to. Plus, if you swim with someone every day, you get to peruse the merchandise before purchasing, if you know what I mean. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

When I was in college, we had this sadistsic assistant coach who made us swim three lengths (so, 75 yards) underwater with no breath. Then, to make it worse, if you didn't make it, he lined up everyone else who had made it, and you had to swim a 50 (again underwater, no breath) with your teammates pushing and shoving you as you went. I think it scarred me for life. Masters swimming (1 hr per day) is so much more fun than that nasty, painful, four hours per day we used to do. And it has girls too! -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

"Because it's more fun to be an unemployed, itinerant jumper." -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

[ducking] I thought Australia was part of New Zealand. Isn't that why they call it the West Island? Maybe I'm confused. All those little tiny third world countries look the same from over here in the developed world. [/ducking] -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

But how would your FX74 open off a 250 ft building? And how does it sink between power lines? Of course you are way better at landing (and accuracy) with your accustomed canopy. But someone with 900 7 cell jumps is going to be way better prepared--and the 7 cell will be able to do things that no one can do on an elliptical (sinking into a 20 by 20 clearing, for example). I'm really not trying to hassle you here, just kind of rambling. And dude, why didn't you swoop the FX at Bridge Day? Now that looks like big fun... -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

I know of four cases of a first parachute jump made as a BASE jump. One was a Bridge Day only jumper, who is still showing up at Bridge Days today. One now has a whole bunch of BASE jumps. One died within their first ten BASE jumps. One was critically injured and has not made a parachute jump since. You pick your odds, and you take your chances... -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

i'm sure some people would. i've heard of at least one person base jumping before they skydived. i just don't think the average person with less than 200 jumps is ready for base. i'm very glad i waited til i had a 1000 jumps to start. I'm with Levin. I started BASE with 250 skydives, and am pretty much consistently BASE jumping around twice as much as skydiving at this point (I don't quite have twice as many BASE jumps as skydives now). American BASE jumpers often try to downplay the need for skydiving experience, as most of our objects are subterminal, so the real skills needed are accuracy and canopy control (which are poorly developed on most modern skydiving gear, since it rarely flies similarly to BASE gear). However, the more I travel, the more I wish I had made more skydives before starting BASE. There is definitely room for improvement in our terminal air skills (just ask the Norges what they think of American tracking skills). I believe that our typical approach (few skydives) has contributed to at least one fatality this year. Still, if you are certain that you want to focus on BASE, you ought to tailor your skydiving toward training for it (by flying big 7 cells, for example). Being a great canopy swooper will probably hinder you when you try to BASE jump--but having a ton of terminal experience will certainly be very helpful (as well as increasing your fun level exponentially). -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

1200 Feet?! That's not Groundrush! 1200 feet is exit altitude. 300 feet is good, conservative pull height. Groundrush starts when you're still in freefall at 250 feet. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

Just for reference if anyone aside from Dan and I is still following this: I load my Troll at .724. "Textbook" BASE loading is .75. General practice appears to be a bit below .75, hovering, as bps noted, somewhere between .7 and .75. I have PM'd Dan with specific questions about my wingloading. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

I've been listening to them for the last 20 minutes, and I can't stop laughing. Does Clay know about the "Dirty Deeds Done With Sheep" song? -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

You'll have to excuse me for missing that. Remember, on my rigs you use a hook knife, or you spin into the ground, but the only time you grab the handle behind the mud flap is when you are already on the ground (or in white water). -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

I recommend you send Dove after them. After reading her plans for the sniper suspects, I'm sure she could come up with a suitable treatment for your management. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

The majority of the world's most experienced jumpers (I do not count myself in that number) tend to jump their BASE canopies loaded well below your recommendations. Perhaps your product ought to be revised to meet with the standard practice and recommendations of modern, experienced jumpers. The people at PD have more jumps on Stilettos than I do. Dan, I have 96 BASE jumps on a Troll. How many BASE jumps do you have on a Troll? How many BASE jumps do you have at all? You don't see me making relatively uneducated comments about swooping canopies, do you? I find it interesting that the people involved with the Troll who have real BASE experience (Stane, Robert, Robert) all seem interested in my feedback, and in improving the canopy. On the other hand, you don't seem very interested in hearing feedback at all. Your typical response is along the lines of "I am the manufacturer, so I must be right." Perhaps if you were a little less defensive, you would take my feedback and try to figure out how to improve the canopy. Remember, this little interchange began with a POSITIVE comment on my part (as I recall, I was complimenting Stane's valve system). I am unlikely to hold my tongue when I see something that could be improved. Some manufacturers will take criticisms constructively. Some will be defensive. This will not change my opinions of the product, nor will it change my willingness to speak my mind. Perhaps, as Dave suggested, we ought to move this conversation to PM or private email? -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

I've had a chance to use the CR valves quite a bit, and have demoed the BR valves, and inspected the Troll valves. The valves on the Troll are hands down the best valve system on the market. I'm not a big fan of the unvalved Troll, but the valves themselves are a significant improvement on existing technology. Dan, are you guys willing to retrofit your valves onto other manufacturers canopies? I've got a FOX that's desparately in need of some new valves. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com