TomAiello

I agree. Some of those people _do_ know and like him. Perhaps they worry about him. Regardless, being a super nice guy is not a free pass on ethics or safety. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

I'm in absolute agreement with Avery. Miles (and Shane, and to a lesser extent several other people in their crew, like JT) is a great guy. He's very friendly, super helpful, outgoing, positive and nice. I can think of few people I'd rather hang out with. But Miles (and the rest, as above) is also a horribly unethical and not terribly skilled BASE jumper. His antics at our legal span are way over the line, and his idea of BASE skill appears to be "how bad can I flail and live?" A "rad" jump is not the same thing as a skillful jump. If there hadn't been trees to break the fall at Bridge Day, I'm pretty sure that his daughter would never really have known her father--and that would be a true tragedy. In short: Great people, horrible ethics. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

In the words of a Red Bull Marketing guy I overheard "any publicity is good publicity." I'm sure they'd love the publicity. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

General Warning to All: I see a lot of short, insulting, attack posts in this thread. I'm banning JTHolmesJR, because that seems to be all he wants to contribute. I won't ban Treejumps or Huckfinn right now, because you are both at least trying to discuss in addition to throwing insults. However, from here on, even if your post has redeeming qualities (i.e. actual discussion of the issues), I'll ban anyone who includes anything that even comes close to a personal attack. Calm down, folks. We can talk without screaming. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

Hey, ease down there. BR is doing their best to notify people, and we all know the risks when we jump. Let's not let this thread turn into either a witch hunt or a flame fest. Every BASE jumper is some part rigger, some part test jumper and some part madman. That's just the way the game is played. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

I've been using large rubber bands (the "other" standard skydiving size), cut in half lengthwise, to hold my multi for several years without incident. Do you have any thoughts on that? Thanks! -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

I know of four instances in which black banded tailgates have hung up. One in Belgium, one in Australia, one in Twin Falls, and one in the PNW. In each of these cases the rubber band was girth hitched (larksheaded) to the tailgate, and the wraps of the rubber band were inboard of the knot, so the rubber band hung up on the knot holding it to the tailgate. In three of these cases, the jumper landed on land with minimum incident under a bow tied or still inflating (after clearing the hangup) canopy. In one the hangup cleared with sufficient altitude for a normal landing. I don't know that a brown rubber band would have broken easier and not hung up in these situations, but I bet it would have. Does anyone have the link to the photos that CRWper (I think?) posted on BLiNC? I don't remember if that was a black band or not. That report was quite detailed, though, as I recall. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

I believe the technique used by Nicknitro is superior. If you take a bite of the lines, you distort the canopy's trim during opening, in a potentially asymmetric fashion. CR used to put a stow band there as well, but they discontinued the practice for pretty much the reason I outlined. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

There are none. Zero skydives required. I talked to Miles about this earlier in the summer. His target market is "people who don't have enough skydives to get into one of the courses" (his words). Party on... -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

I voted for you, Mick. For those of you who don't know him, Mick is a first class guy, as well as a kick ass DJ. For those concerned with spam, I voted a while ago, unchecked the "mailing" boxes, and haven't gotten any email from them at all. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

I keep coming back to this thread, and I still can't find the words. Jason is a great loss to all of us. He was friendly, helpful and enthusiastic. He never failed to bring a smile to my face. He was the only person who's ever had a 180 and object strike after I gave them a 180 (American energy drink) at the exit point. I was looking forward to knowing him for years, and becoming better friends over that time. I will miss him. Liv, I cannot believe how strong you are. Your concern for others in this situation is amazing, as I believe you are the adult person most impacted by Jason's death. Know that you have friends around the world who care about you, and don't forget to take care of yourself. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

In my opinion, the way to best deal with approximating this risk is to stand down when you can see enough variables that the situation has an outcome variability outside your personal risk envelope. In other words, there comes a time when the "I don't know" is big enough that I'm just going to walk away. That's my last, best and only way to have 100% control of the outcome. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

Ah. I see. I was confused by the thread drift (since we were originally discussing slider down tailgated lineovers). Thanks! -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

I personally don't use them for anything. The advantage of using a black band girth hitched to the tailgate is that you can use the same band for many jumps. I once had one last past 50 jumps. This is (a) easier, since you don't have to carry a bag of rubber bands around, and (b) more environmentally friendly (how important that is to you is a personal decision) because you don't leave rubber bands at the bottom of objects. The disadvantages are (a) greater potential to remain unbroken in a hang-up situation, and (b) greater likelihood to hang up because you are using a girth hitch (larkshead) to hold the band onto the tailgate (in order to gain the longevity advantages). -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

That's interesting. Why did you stop work on that? It was for a very specific jump which had very unusual (to say the least) parameters. I ended up doing it with the canopy pre-spread, and attached with break cord, but totally unbagged. edit to add: In my opinion, the method I used doesn't really qualify as a BASE jump, strictly speaking. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

I am not following you. Are you saying that wrapping the stabilizer inside the other folds, while leaving the tail outside was the culprit? Or are you saying that letting control lines wander outside was the culprit? Or both? If the latter, wouldn't that make the tailgated line over that PK had impossible? If the former, why would putting the stabilizer inside or outside the other folds matter? Since the "main" folds must come out before tailgate blows open and releases the control lines, I can't see how the position of the stablizer can be the cause (it's essentially the same by the time the lines are free to move outside). As I said, I don't follow. Can you elaborate? -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

Karen, Thanks for posting this, and for generally calling it to the attention of jumpers. I know that you, personally, and BR/Apex generally are getting some flak over this right now. I appreciate that you (both singular and plural) are willing to step up, admit that you can make mistakes, and try to set things right. Much appreciated! -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

I'm guessing that they thought, at the time, that they were superior for the purposes. Making incremental advances (and the accompanying missteps) is the way that all of our gear gets better in the long run. I doubt they were trying to make money off them (even the "expensive rubber bands cost, what, 20 cents a piece?). This kind of thing happens all the time in other industries (like skydiving, but also things like automobiles). Something makes it all the way through prototyping and field testing, gets released, and only after it's in use in the real world does it get enough use to reveal a problem. Just because some folks in the field think something is dangerous isn't generally sufficient justification for recalling it. In general, that's reserved for (a) when the manufacturer decides it was a bad idea, or (b) when it is demonstrably unsafe, usually resulting in an accident of some kind. BASE gear manufacturing is a small, and not terribly lucrative field. You can't really expect a BASE company to do as much testing as a car company, for example. Even General Motors has safety recalls. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

Au contraire. I really think this is a situation where a quick, widely read (in a geographic sense) communication medium (such as this) can be very advantageous. Karen's use of this forum to spread what is essentially a safety bulletin from a gear manufacturer is probably one of the highest, best uses for it. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

I'm going to stick this to the top of the forum for a while. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

It depends on the design and rigging of the deployment bag. I once tried to build a really big, flat d-bag, and hold air channels open with separators. I didn't get very far, but I can see how such a setup would give you inflation as fast or faster than a TARD, and with better control of the opening. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

Call the police station and report it stolen. It's worked a surprising number of times. Or, just call the police station and tell them that they have your gear and you want it back. Ask them what you need to do. I've had that work, too, and they generally leave with a better impression of you, in particular, and BASE, in general. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

In BASE, often deeper delays can be safer. It's very object dependent, and it's one of the things that makes skydiving mentality dangerous in BASE. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

BASE bridle attachments are very over-reinforced, though. I've put more than 100 static lines on a single canopy, and never had any attachment point wear issues. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

Those. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com