TomAiello

It probably depends on the make of the canopy, but I've definitely talked with canopy manufacturers who told me that the bridle attachment was purposefully engineered to tear away before other parts of the canopy broke off, in order to make it possible to do a "Karnowski" (that's the new official name of the unpacked jump where you hang from the bridle at line stretch, then either cut off or tear away the bridle and/or attachment to get the canopy flying). I believe this was originally intended for skydiving (in case the PC/bridle wrapped the tail of the aircraft) but I could be wrong. I'll agree with you that the bridle attachment on my Apex canopies (especially the multi equipped canopies) looks _a lot_ stronger than 400 pounds. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

Wait for rescue. Either (hopefully) your friends who brought rescue gear to the jump (because we all do that--right?), or guys with flashing lights and helicopters. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

Cubic Feet per Second. It's a way of measuring flow, usually used (as in this case) by kayakers and rafters to describe how high a river is (i.e. how much water is flowing through it). -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

If you're hanging from the tower structure itself, and relatively uninjured, it's possible to climb back inside and onto the ladder. Otherwise, you're stuck waiting for rescue (either from other jumpers on the load, or more formal rescue from emergency response personnel). -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

Try PMing BASEhoundsam. He's a PFi who has some demos and is closer to you than Morpheus. Normally, you'd probably want to talk to BASE733, who's also a PFi, and works with Morpheus, and probably has demo suits, too, but he's probably somewhere above 20,000 feet in the Himalayas right now. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

In Andy's defense, he did initially plan to buy BASE gear and travel to take a First Jump Course. We (that being myself and several UK jumper, but if you want to blame someone blame me) convinced him that he would be better off doing more skydiving, which is why he went on this skydiving trip, rather than coming to take a BASE course. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

The video that I posted in the other thread was not of the jump being discussed in this thread. It was a different jump with a similar issue. The jump in that case was static line (not PCA) was from a freestander (not a guyed tower) and was done by an experienced jumper (not a student). -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

Totally off topic, although that's the nature of this type of thread, but what's even more fun that kites in electrical storms is wingsuits in electrical storms. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

I don't think there's a universal answer to that, but some of the things I look for are: (a) Judgment and restraint: knowing "when to say when" is a critical survival skill in BASE. Someone who rushes into BASE itself is generally more likely to be injured while BASE jumping, in my opinion. (b) Adequate preparation: Honestly, I'd like to see students with upwards of 1000 skydives, and a good helping of CRW and Accuracy experience. Realistically, we're looking at typical FJC's requiring between 100 and 250 skydives, with only a very few discussing specifics of jump types. (c) Good mentorship: Someone who's taken the time to establish contact with qualified jumpers near their home, who have the judgment and experience to mentor a new jumper. (d) Contact with local jumpers: Someone who understands the way the BASE community fits together, and has therefore taken the time to make contact with their local jumpers, ask advice, and form relationships which they can draw on as they progress. There are other things, too, but those are some big ones. Hmmm. If you count several local jumpers making the time to answer questions, give guidance, and sit down for a chat about starting BASE, risks, and preparation as being "turned down", then perhaps. Personally, that sounds like an excellent start to a BASE career--very different from being "turned down." What was sketchy about it? (a) Choice of object (low, guyed tower) (b) Choice of gear (converted skydiving canopy, converted skydiving rig) (c) Something (we're still not clear what) wrong with the PCA technique (d) Choice of Instructor (a guy who was recently busted taking a first timer off a building) On this forum, at least, we have no idea what training he received. Did he do any exit practice? Did he learn to pack? Was their a discusison of PCA technique and potential problems? What training was given for avoiding object strike in the event of an offheading into the (quite close) guy wires? Was there a discussion of rescue and getaway plans? I have no idea--do you? Was doing the jump at his level of skydiving experience a bad choice? Perhaps. It's really hard to say without some in depth feedback about what he's been doing for the past month. 66 jumps. Ok, now what kind of jumps? Were they on a large 7 cell? Were they freefly jumps done on a ZP 9 cell? Were they BASE specific canopy drill jumps done on a BASE canopy with good coaching? Without more information, I don't think anyone can say. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

How many of them had the advice and guidance that Andy had? -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

what?! at least he didnt mention insects. a threat of violence and 24 hrs. makes no sense tom. I'm happy to discuss it more via PM. The short version is that I think that Andy's participation in this thread can still be useful to him, and generally to all of us. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

I don't see that at all. I see people strongly disagreeing with Andy's choice of how to pursue BASE, specifically his ignoring their advice, his selection of first jump instructor, his selection of first jump object, and his selection of first jump gear. That's very different from disrespecting a choice to pursue BASE jumping. Perhaps, rather, it's got some local BASE jumpers who want to help keep Andy from becoming a statistic. Time and again I see people "befriending" young jumpers who want to take up BASE, and "helping" them by putting them into dangerous situations that they are clearly unprepared for. I'd suggest to you that these are not real "friends," nor are they actually "helping" anyone, least of all the new jumper. In this light, perhaps we ought to consider the fact that those who are really helping are those trying to slow you down and put you on a safer path, if a somewhat slower one. If those people mind being named here, perhaps you can PM their names and contact info to the concerned locals, so that they can contact them and get some objective reports on Andy's progress? Hmmm. Perhaps that's not as high a recommendation as you might think. I never knew him, but the stories I've heard definitely qualify as "mixed" at the very least. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

If it did, that would open up a whole different question of why a D link was used. Normally, BASE bridles are just girth hitched into either a metal ring sewn to the canopy, or fabric-on-fabric to the bridle attachment point. With that setup, though (Fury in a converted Dolphin, which sounds like the "Death Rig"), there's no telling. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

I'm currently uploading two copies, called "Static Line Bridle Tear" and "Static Line Bridle Tear Full." 1) Just the jump, shot from the ground, encoded with DivX and about 1 MB. About 20 seconds. 2) The ground footage, plus the POV footage from the jumper, which includes footage the entire time he rigs the static line attachment. It's kind of hard to make out due to camera angles, but maybe you can see something there about how he set it up. Quicktime, about 60 MB, around 9 and a half minutes. If someone sees that the uploads have been approved and posted, can you post here and let people know? -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

To be fair, Andrew did have a PM from Andy, so he might have more information that was relevant when he formed that opinion. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

I think that describing that as "an unforeseen equipment problem," is going a long way to understate it. I've never heard of a similar case. Have you? Because I'm sure I'm not alone in wanting to hear about that, if you have. All of my best guesses as to what caused that little "unforeseen equipment problem" point toward either gross user error or negligent gear maintenance. Either of those things indicate an extremely substandard teaching/learning environment. It sounds like you must be speaking from substantial experience with both BASE jumping and the instruction thereof. Can you please share your experience with us? -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

Fuck's sake...I hate waiting two days for an answer to a simple question. Ah well...at least it's not a whole month then aye. PM's are still available. When you are banned, it's only from the one forum. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

Andy, I've edited the threat out of your post. Under the understood guidelines for bans in this forum, I ought to be banning you for 28 days. I'm not going to do that. I've banned you for 24 hours. Try to use that time to step away and cool down a little. There are a lot of good people who are trying to help you. Virtually all of your experienced locals, and certainly all of them with reputations for good judgement and skills, are among them. Try to listen, take a step back, and re-evaluate where you are going, and what you are doing. I'm sure that Jason will be seeing this as yet more evidence of my moderation bias, and re-bumping the thread about Nick's forum . -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

Andrew is probably a very good person to ask that question of, because he had a very similar situation less than a year ago. I don't know what he said in his PM, bu I bet you can learn some things from his experience that will help you as you move forward. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

Come on, Mac, you know better. Making personal attacks might make you feel better, but it's not going to change Andy's behavior. Wouldn't you rather have a discussion with him and actually change the long term outcomes? I've banned you from this forum for 14 days. I'm sure you and Andy have each other's phone numbers, and you've also got the other forum with this discussion, where the moderation will be a little more understanding of emotional outbursts. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

Dude, just fake up a logbook and go get on the airplane. Deception worked when you bought that BASE rig--until the seller contacted your mother and she took it away and made you return it. If anyone is wondering, no that's not a joke. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

I believe that the jumper already posted it on Skydivingmovies.com. Let me see if I can find it, or maybe he'll read this and post it for us. The only way I could see something like this being really bad is if the bridle didn't tear, and the jumper was left hanging from the object. I'll try to dig out the video and throw it up there. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

I have video of a bridle being cut in half on a static line jump, after the canopy reached line stretch. In that case, my best guess was that the bridle had somehow blown up and around one of the bolts holding the structure together. Unfortunately, no retrieval of the remaining part of the bridle was made, so I don't think anyone can say for certain. However, in the case you are referencing the question is different, because that one was a PCA. I'm not clear on how the bridle, which ought to have been managed by the PC holder, could have gotten loose and wrapped around something. Totally wild guesses might include poor PCA technique (premature release of the bridle/PC) or poor placement of the PC holder (so that the bridle was dragged over a sharp edge before line stretch pulled it tight). -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

SkyDiveAl, that's a personal attack. I've banned you from this forum for 14 days. -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com

You were PCA'd, and somehow the bridle wrapped around the tower? What do you suppose caused that? Do you think this indicates some sort of problem with the equipment? Or the configuration? Or the choice of technique for the jump? -- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com