dreamdancer

an estate with negative fiat value is no estate and there is no karmic payout. Nice dodge. If the workers are responsible for the success, how are not also responsible for the failure? the entrepreneur takes that responsibility (in the same way that they keep/are responsible for the profits if there are any). I see - so the workers get all of the benefit and none of the risk. Nice scam. if the entrepreneur fails then they get laid off - and usually quicker than the ceo. (do you agree that the worst moochers are those who inherit and do nothing) stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding

an estate with negative fiat value is no estate and there is no karmic payout. Nice dodge. If the workers are responsible for the success, how are not also responsible for the failure? the entrepreneur takes that responsibility (in the same way that they keep/are responsible for the profits if there are any). stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding

an estate with negative fiat value is no estate and there is no karmic payout. stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding

if there is no estate there can be no karmic payout. stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding

the second you wrote "automatically", then the whole premise of voluntary became a bald faced lie it's 'automatic' in the same way that a spreadsheet is automatic. once the last of the karmic credits are inputted then the karmic 'balances' can be automatically worked out and paid out of the estate. no lawyers, accountants, or irs needed

then this absolutely doesn't read as "voluntary" then this reads as some horrible proposal of a law to force it on everyone or, it will drive more people to make very explicit wills to avoid this pile of crap still stupid it's all voluntary

Gee, and all these years of recruiting, interviewing, and hiring people, I thought we had to set their salary at whatever wage the job market required to attract the workforce we needed. The supply and demand thing. It doesn't matter much how long it takes to train someone in a field, if there are tons of them unemployed in the area, they are going to be cheap. And skilled workers, with or without college, who are in very short supply, are going to be expensive. the current fiat salary can still be set as the market dictates so that side of the equation isn't affected at all. however, for karmic accounting purposes, one hour of worktime is one hour of worktime - no matter who does it. stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding

Which is why it's stupid. what other basic currency do we have? stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding

Again, that's stupid. Does it take into account how difficult and demanding each respective hour of work is? No. Does it take into account the time it takes to reach the point of being able to do that hours work (at least 4 years of expensive university tuition for an MEng vs 4 minutes training on how to use a broom)? No. Does it take into account the uniqueness and added value to the company of each person's contribution during that hour of work? No. It's rubbish. Even if you buy into the concept of 'karmically' splitting a companies wealth between those who contributed it, it is insane to argue that each person contributed an equal amount, 'karmically' or otherwise, during each hour of work. the current fiat 'wage' takes into account all the factors you list - training, experience, skill. karmic accounting takes each hour of worktime (added up throughout the workers life for different employers) and values it as a basic currency - which is all we've really got if you think about it. not gold or fiat money but our ability to work

Doesn't have to worry about a will if that's the way he wants his wealth to be distributed and if everyone involved can agree on the proportion of their input into the wealth creation and therefore the proportion of reward they deserve. the karmic input into wealth creation is the actual hours worked for the employer (worktime). a simple case would be an entrepreneur who employs a hundred workers. each worker, if they had worked the same hours, would then receive 1% of the estate. That's stupid. All jobs are not equal, which is why all jobs are not paid the same in the first place. Has the guy who sweeps the floor in the factory had the same input into wealth creation as the engineer who designed the production process? different jobs are paid in different fiat amounts - which is all fine and good at whatever the current market fiat rate is. karmic accounting adds up the actual hours you have worked for others and values each worktime hour (engineer or floor sweeper) as karmically equal

Doesn't have to worry about a will if that's the way he wants his wealth to be distributed and if everyone involved can agree on the proportion of their input into the wealth creation and therefore the proportion of reward they deserve. the karmic input into wealth creation is the actual hours worked for the employer (worktime). a simple case would be an entrepreneur who employs a hundred workers. each worker, if they had worked the same hours, would then receive 1% of the estate. stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding

If the proposal is a voluntary action on the owner's part (i.e., he can decide whatever he wants to put in his last will and testement) - then this whole thread is even more a waste of time. If the owner wants to will his property to his kids - I'm fine with that If the owner wants to will his property to his employees - I'm fine with that If the owner wants to will his property to his cat, give it to charity, or put it in a giant pile and let it get rained on until it melts - I'm fine with that the common point here is that the guy gets to decide what happens to HIS stuff, body, money, etc\ with a karmic accounting system the owner doesn't have to worry about a will - his or her wealth will be automatically distributed to all those who helped create it. the owner's children will also know that they won't be able to mooch off unearned wealth but will have to make their own, entrepreneurial, way in the world

i think this strand of libertarianism is more widely known as 'minarchism'. stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding

isn't all libertarianism voluntary? stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding

So, when you die, your maintenance guy gets your house instead of your wife/kids? It's the same logic, after all. So when a CEO fucks up a multinational company . . . why are the workers laid off rather than the CEOs? with karmic accounting workers can still be laid off - but they will still have a 'karmic claim' on the ceos estate so that at least they don't lose everything. and the ceos children know they will have to make their own, libertarian, way in the world. pull themselves up by their own bootstraps and all that

So, when you die, your maintenance guy gets your house instead of your wife/kids? It's the same logic, after all. if the homeowner and the maintenance guy are both signed up to karmic accounting then a small percentage of the homeowner's estate will go to the maintenance guy (and other small percentages to any other workers the homeowner has employed). stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding

the state doesn't confiscate or distribute anything - or tax anything. this is a perfectly voluntary libertarian redistribution

yes, while allowing entrepreneurs to flourish it also values the efforts of workers

the state doesn't confiscate or distribute anything - or tax anything. this is a perfectly voluntary libertarian redistribution

karmic accounting just borrows the name for a catchy title - but it does mean that the inheritor will have earned it in their own lifetime. what do you think of the idea in principle? I think it is another way for the socialists to expropriate wealth from those who have it. An inheritance tax justification if you will. You say you should redistribute the wealth back to those who earned it. Well that happened when it was earned; the labourers got paid what they agreed to work for, the money lenders got paid what they agreed to lend for and the risk taker got the rest. Now he owns it and will distribute it as his will dictates. End of story. Just how is this "theory," and I use the term lightly, any different than Marx's Labour theory of Value? This has nothing for libertarians. If you think it does you need to re-read Locke. i fail to see where libertarianism supports unearned inherited wealth. surely the core of libertarianism is that every individual is free to contract as and where they will. karmic accounting allows this so that entrepreneurs can flourish - within their own lifetime. their estate is not then taxed but redistributed back to those who helped create the wealth in the first place - everyone is satisfied

karmic accounting just borrows the name for a catchy title - but it does mean that the inheritor will have earned it in their own lifetime. what do you think of the idea in principle? stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding

no, it's quite a neat idea that does just what says on the tin - melds together left and right libertarian strands

for karmic accounting purposes the crux is that it is tied to real workhours (socialism) and not some notional fiat amount that makes up the parallel 'wage' (capitalism). stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding

according to your philosophy children would be killing their parents (for an unearned redistribution) left right and center

So you would do away with all inheritance then? Who exactly decides who "earned" and who didn't? this is an idea to replace 'unearned' with 'earned' inheritance. in this case the entrepreneur would have agreed a system of karmic accounting with his employees and his estate redistributed back to them. What if the entrepreneur used private contractors rather than full time employees to do the bulk of the work. What happens then? the private contractors would employ people so the redistribution principle can be carried to these workers. But the private contractors themselves are doing work as well. It's just that it's managerial work. Is it only the people who do physical work who are said to have "earned" this other income? no, managerial work also counts in karmic accounting - but only for the real hours worked. so if a manager employs twelve workers fulltime they will all get an equal/one thirteenth karmic share. stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding