polarbear

Don't allow the reserve to mildew. If you think it got wet, have it repacked and inspected. There are other factors with getting a canopy wet than just mildew...it can increase the porosity, which will decrease the flying/flare charcteristics and will increase the opening time (bad for a reserve!) Water will harm any nylon canopy. If they get wet, drip-dry them out (out of the sun) as soon as possible. Get advice from your rigger.

PD claims that the other differences in design (other than fabric) have a bigger effect with zp pilot chutes. In other words, two different 26" zp pilot chutes may have very different drag characteristics...with two F-111 pilot chutes, the differences are smaller. Thus, an F-111 pilot chute of a given size will have more "predictable" drag characteristics. I switched from a 26" zp, to a 30" F-111, on a heatwave 170, and it contributed to softer openings.

I had a heatwave 170, loaded at 1.35, for about 110 jumps. I think it was a great canopy. No instability, I landed it crosswind and downwind on many/most jumps (better surf). The fabric is the same zp used in diablos, hornets, triathlons. There are many of these canopies out there with more than 500 jumps (maybe more than 1000) that are still in good shape. Try before you buy, then you'll know!

I also am very interested in this dialougue. I currently jump comparable sized mains and reserves, but had planned to go no smaller than my PD160R as I downsized the main. I agree with most of the 2 canopy out arguments, but I personally find it much more likely that I will be out under a single reserve than a duel-canopy configuration. I guess I don't believe that a small, 7-cell F-111 canopy is going to have all that good of a flare, particularly considering that you won't be used to flying it. I am also concerned about the opening issues with smaller reserves. I will accept them on a main, but spinning line twists on a reserve doesn't sound like fun. I think I just might take up PD's offer and demo a reserve. By the way, I have personally seen a Velocity 103 and a Tempo 150 in a perfectly stable personal biplane. Granted, this is only one instance.

I find that most people underestimate the weight of their gear. Most rigs that I have actually weighed (and I mean new, modern ones, and not gigantic student rigs) come in on average around 20 pounds. My rig, which is a brand new mirage M3 with a 150 main, 160 reserve, and cypres, comes in at 22 lbs. By the time you add jumpsuit, goggles, helmet, altimeter, gloves, etc., I find that equipment typically weighs between 25-30 lbs. A single parachute weighs about 6 lbs on average; unless you jump a teeny-tiny (sub-sub-100) main/reserve/container it is unlikely that your rig weighs only 10 lbs. As to the real question of this thread, listen to the advice of your instructors...they know your flying capabilities and should be able to give you informed suggestions. You might think about getting a used main; it is very possible you will get bored with a larger (210) canopy after a relatively small number of jumps. If you were to buy this canopy new, and then sell it after 50 jumps, chances are good you would loose money. If you bought it used, you should be able to break even.

In my rigging experience, I haven't come across any one single rig which is clearly better than the others in terms of reserve deployment. I would agree that this mostly has to do with the packing of the rigger (which should be good) and the *correct* use of the system by the wearer. As far as the different pilot chutes go, there doesn't seem to be one method that is obviously better. The external PCs have less flaps to push aside and clear during launch, but the springs used in these systems are not as stiff as those used in internal PC system. The extra stiffness of the internal springs helps puch through the extra flaps. I actually think that the most important thing for a good pilot chute lauch (aside from proper body position) is the packing. The reserve closing loop really needs to be the correct length. The correct length is a loop which keep sthe pilot chute spring completely compressed. A loop this tight makes it harder to pack, but if the pilot chute is not fully compressed, it can lose a significant amount of its' launch capability. Loops can stretch with time, so its something to watch for. Ever seen someone with a pop top that is "elevated" above the reserve container, meaning the pilot chute isn't compressed all the way down? Its a good bet that chute won't get the best launch it can. Truthfully, though, all of the rigs out there seem to be pretty close. Lets face it, if one rig was really better (or worse) than the rest, by now it would be obvious. Every rigger has rigs which they consider easier to pack...why not ask your rigger, and go with what he/she suggests.

"One size change will not injure any experienced canopy pilot" That's a bold statement. First of all, how do you define experienced? The way I understand it, we are talking about people with around 100 jumps. Does that qualify as experienced these days? Second, it WILL NOT injure any experienced pilot? There are "experienced pilots" out there who suffered from lack of square footage...you might get away with saying it PROBABLY won't injure someone, but I don't think it's fair to say WILL NOT. I never said Clay couldn't handle a Heatwave 170; quite possibly it would be a good canopy choice for him. All I'm saying is be careful...there is a difference between pushing the envelope and tearing it open.

I would agree...snap hooks are more dangerous and at least on my canopy not any faster than a carve.

I think I would have to agree with chromeboy...nobody knows your flying abilities but the people you fly with; the advice from your *informed* instructors should be good advice. However, my personal recommendation would be not to make all three changes at once (F-111=>ZP,190=>170,Square=>elliptical). I would say maybe make two changes (only if you want more performance, obviously). Go with a ZP 190 elliptical, or a ZP 170 square. At the wingloadings you are talking about, any one of the changes you want to make will cause a performance change. It may very well be true that you can handle the Heatwave 170, but it may also be true you can't. Go slow. The fast mains will wait. I bought my heatwave 170 in a simialar situation...my previous main was a monarch 215. However, I borrowed and jumped a triathlon 190 and a sabre 170 for about 40 jumps before I went to the heatwave. This gave me the opportunity to step down a little bit. I also wasn't loading the heatwave quite as much as you will be. Oh, and don't kid yourself, dude. Going from a 190 to a 170 is still downsizing. It WILL make a difference. It will give you more control and flare to work with, making it 'easier' to land, but ONLY if you use it correctly. Ultimately, it's all academic whether or not you can handle it...the proof, unfortunately, is in the pudding. One thing we can all agree on, I'm sure, is that making the transition from an F-111 190 to a heatwave 170 can be a big step, so be careful, OK? :)

My first main was a Monarch 215 at 1.0 wingloading. It did open hard, but it flew very nicely...I agree that it will out-surf a sabre. I would take a Monarch over a triathlon (but that's me). You can check out my review if you like.

I went home and tried it last night, and my rig came right off. I jump a brand new mirage, custome made for me, with full ringed harness, a bum strap; all my straps were VERY tight; and I am a "fat bastard" (well, sort of-maybe chubby bastard). It took very little effort. I agree that the key seems to be having the leg straps forward on your legs...it would not come off with out the leg straps forward. Another thought I had is that during a premature opening, the force will only be input to the rig through the risers. Therefore, when you pull the rig off, make sure you are using ONLY the risers. I did it this way and it was no problem to slip out. I am not sure if this would happen in freefall...I have never had my leg straps move at all in freefall, and that is both on my new mirage and on my old Talon which was NOT made for me and DID NOT have a bum strap. It does seem interesting to me that premature openings while in a sit must have already happened to people hundreds of times; yet I do not know of anyone falling out of their harness from it. In any case, I consider this a serious issue. I really would like to hear what harness/container manufacturers would have to say. I, for one, request that the phenomenon (and possibly your video) be reported to H/C manufacturers and that they give a response..

Absolutely, Bob could/should try gentle front riser carves on his Triathlon and work his way up. As for trying full blown hooks, I would say no, not on the Tri. It is true that a longer recovery arc would makes this safer, and the Tri ought to roll out too quick. The best safty Bob could have, however, in doing a full blown hook is LOTS AND LOTS OF EXPERIENCE - and I mean more than a few hundred jumps. Bob should know ALL the inns and outs of his parachute if he is going to bet that it recovers at the exact altitude he wants (ground level!) after a hook turn. Insurance may not be a bad idea either. By the way, the Bob I know hooks a Velocity 90.

I guess I have to agree that bigger recovery arcs can be safer. I just don't believe that the "optimum" safety occurs at 1.5-1.7. I guess I just feel that mistakes that will certainly be made by new swoopers can be much too costly under that high of a wingloading. To each his own. One thing I am sure we can all agree on is that whatever you fly/swoop, remember it can be fast enough to hurt, so be careful.

In response to a previous comment made about 1.5-1.7 being the proper wingloading on which to hook, I must disagree. Many of the world class, highly experienced canopy swoopers out there learned on "biggies". In fact, many of them swooped in the 1.0-1.1 range for hundreds of jumps. I myself am swooping at 1.3 on a 170 and find that to be possible, thrilling, and perfectly reasonable. I certainly don't have to start a turn low to the ground...I do a 180 front riser carve from 400 ft. Perhaps you meant real, true "hook" turning, meaning a sharp, abrupt turn with the pilot swinging out from underneath the canopy and getting the pendulum effect. But even then, there are canopies out there that can have a recovery arc of a couple of hundred feet at lower wingloadings. And in any case, I would never suggest that a beginning swooper start with a true "hook" turn. In my opinion, that sort of thing needs to be done only by truly experienced pilots. Carving front riser turns and straight front riser dives can be done on basically any canopy that has low enough front riser pressure and is stable when front risering. This sort of thing, on a larger canopy, can allow the pilot to learn to deal with higher-than-normal-speeds, how to judge the flare, how to plan the swoop so that the lane is clear of obstacles and outs are available, and all of the other aspects involved with high-speed approaches, all with a higher degree of forgiveness than a 1.5-1.7 wingloading can allow. Of course, it is true that some canopies would be too big for real pratical swooping value. But most people flying true "skytrucks" (lower than 1.0 wingloading?) are either students or extremely low-time jumpers, or people who are not really interested in swooping. I still say, get on a canopy that you are comfortable and profficient with straight in landings and learn to make it go faster. Keep going until you can't make it swoop any farther/faster. Then, go ahead and consider something smaller.

I would agree with most of the things said in this forum thus far...you should be comfortable and profficient on the canopy you are on doing straight in landings, you should posess good judgement, you must be patient and willing to progress slowly, and you must be willing to learn. I would add three things: 1)Look for EVERY opportunity to learn from others (especially the highly experienced/profficient). You must also think about what others tell you...not everyone out there who swoops is really as good as they think they are. 2)Start swooping on a fairly large canopy-learn the techniques when mistakes don't cost as much and only downsize when you are TOTALLY bored with your current canopy. 3)(I believe the most important) make sure that you really want to swoop. I have some people who seem to swoop because their friends think it is cool...not because they really want to swoop. Do it because it is fun and because YOU get a thrill out of it...not for any other reason. Constantly weigh the benefits you experience from swooping vs. the risk, and make a decision. If it seems that the benefits aren't worth the risk, maybe you should stop. There is no shame in flying conservatively. One final note; once you start down the "dark side", forever will it dominate your destiny. You will almost CERTAINLY get injured eventually if you swoop long enough. It may just be a sprained ankle, but it will happen. Be prepared to accept that.

I usually write lengthy reviews, but I'll make this one short. The bottom line is this reserve is the toughest, most well-built reserve out there. Don't fool around with your last chance...spend the extra money and get a PD reserve.