rynodigsmusic

Your right, but, your more likely to lose a good job over marijuana than alcohol... so, we might could begin with that problem first at least? "As an aside, I wouldn't advise some people to be so open about admitting illegal drug use while online. A lot of prospective employers, etc. do quite a bit of online investigations of applicants' names." "We didn't start the fire"

I am glad were in SC at least! But, I was curious about the brilliance you heard. So, you'll follow that man into death, and not a man (and yes I believe God) who died for love? I have to ask, have you read a Gospel? and I still am curious about the brilliance part!! "We didn't start the fire"

Sorry man, all I heard was sad mockery, I just feel sorry for him really... but, death is a thief, and even a thief can find life. Some of Gods greatest testimonies are forged just like this. I am amazed sometimes how he reveals things through the Gospel. One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: "Aren't you the Christ? Save yourself and us!" 40But the other criminal rebuked him. "Don't you fear God," he said, "since you are under the same sentence? 41We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong."42Then he said, "Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.[f]"43Jesus answered him, "I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise." Edited to add: I did laugh at some of those things though "We didn't start the fire"

Yeah, that sounds like bolas to me! But your right, to address his initial post, I would say that the reason there is a "separation" of smokers and non-smokers, seemingly anyway, is because of the lack of understanding. The smokers, at the time understand what they're doing and enjoy the atmosphere and comradarie of other smokers (whether the others are smoking or not), and the non-smokers dont always understand, but some of them have been known to tear into a bottle pretty deep I think. I think its a little beyond paranoia caused by the "high". If weed was as socially accepted as alcohol, there would be little "separation" or judgement. As it is, mostly because an envioronmentally and socialogically induced ignorance, there is an appearance, of "smokers" and "non-smokers" not understanding one anothers habits. And understanding goes way beyond just tolerance. Still, this is an intriguing discussion. Even I take miss jane to the dance from time to time "We didn't start the fire"

Funny enough, someone would be offended somehow. This whole thread is really making me think, but there are few people on here who have admitted to being regular smokers, or pot growers, and surely for good reason (legalities/judgements ect) BUT... I wonder how many are and do? and what the discussions would be like if marijuana was never criminalized in the first place? I think the thinking would be alot more open and shared, but wonder what it would be like. For instance, if a Rastafarian or someone from a culture that never recognized this particular herb the way Americans do, would post, what would they say? Great point on the diamonds by the way Also, I wonder what would happen if skydiving was outlawed? Its not always understood by the general public, its an addiction (or can be viewed that way) that costs plenty and can take you away from the "world" to get your "fix". Its a good thing it is understood by at least those who can understand it. The more I think on this weed legalization, the more I favor its "regulated acceptance" on a moral and legal level... not to mention the benefits of the hemp material. Good or bad, weed aint going nowhere (so to speak). "We didn't start the fire"

Didnt you just put pot in "that" category as well? Once again people are still blaming the weed instead of trying to understand the physcological dynamics of why some go to harder drugs in the first place. Either taught, like you, or not, like others, it doesnt mean your going to desire to try something as radical as sticking a needle in your arm. Curiosity seems to play right along with peer pressure ect... ect..., but really its just the path and experiences of the person right? I do know recovering addicts who live incredibly fulfilling lives now. The more we put a stigma around pot, the more it sparks the curiosity. In Amsterdam, where its tolerated (legal in a quiet way), few Hollanders smoke on a regular basis. I want this to stay in the bonfire, but your post made me think, and I think alot when im around a bonfire and interesting discussions arise, so, what the problem is? I was thinking that coke, heroin, meth, oxycontin ect.. are designed, and weed is not, its inhanced of course (like any useful herb is), but not really designed the way hard drugs are. But then, I thought, well, if I go and pick a bunch of poppies, or coca plants, or peyote for that matter, and lose my head, does it mean those should be legalized as well? Then I thought, what difference does it make, and I am understanding JCD38493's posts more and more. It seems to be the laws surrounding the drugs that cause most of the problems. If something is taboo or illegal, there seems to be an attraction to it by certain personalities, and by no means am I saying they are weaker personalities. But Im curious to what you all continue to think on the matter. "We didn't start the fire"

Laughing is good as far as I can tell, and the platypus discussion is hilarious. I have thought about God having a sense of humor alot as well, and what I have come up with is that is a great understatement! Just relax, laugh if you can, and let be what is... how much could you have changed, and would you have changed anyway? Love is a great peace that surpasses all understanding. "We didn't start the fire"

What I heard from speedracer was the truth, but I just wanted to add that Jesus spoke about the love of money being greater than the love of God, and visa versa, however he did go on to say that when the love of God is greater, that "those things" will be given to you as well, after the love of God enters, "those things" become gifts of God rather than rewards of man, and it that the heart finds gratitude in increasing measues. The world rewards us with money, but God rewards us with the spiritual gifts of heaven. Can you have both is the question? and Jesus answers by saying "with man, this is impossible, but with God, all things are possible.", after all, many of the prophets of past, David, Abraham, Solomon, ect... were extremely wealthy and appreciative of that prosperity. If you dig into what Jesus is saying and really think about it, you will see that you cant "buy" your way into heaven, and you cant un-buy your way out of heaven. If your desire is to be kept, you will be kept indeed. Also, you can ask yourself how much sense does it make to say that only poor people will find heaven, and only rich people will find hell? Rather, the rich person usaully has a greater desire for money (which is a false control as SR said) and the poor man has to rely on more than money, by nature. So, its easier for a poor man and more difficult for a rich man, but in the Gospel it is revealed that neither are excluded from the Kingdom of Heaven at all. Unless of course someone can show me differently. As for the "rules" of salvation... persevereance in grace is really the only "rule", (although its more a gift). If one leaves grace in his heart, he wont desire to get it back, but the Gospel leads me to believe that he could if he wanted to, as Jesus does say that all things are possible through God. As always, I may have wrote too much again. Merry Christmas though "We didn't start the fire"

"Herb" seems to be like any herb, good for something. Since it is illegal it is already surrounded by a stigma, regardless of its purposes for use, either medicinal, recreational, or even spiritual. I agree with a poster on here that said the reason people keep it quiet is because of the judgement associated with it. Just one example is assuming that someone cant be a safe skydiver because they smoke pot, or they cant be taken seriously (as if thats really a good thing) I do believe however, that one should not be "high" while jumping, packing, rigging... manifest may be okay though (relax im just kidding), but I think the same thing about alcohol and other drugs as well. However, I know it does go on and to be honest, thats just an example of how eccentric skydivers really are, whether you agree or not, and no amount of "policing" will change that, just push it into a corner like this poster has observed. As far as the leagalities are concerned, we have a long way to go as far as the majority realizing that marijuana is something that can be regulated just as alcohol. But I find it fascinating that we believe Guns, Alcohol, Tobacco are "legally (and morally) okay" but marijuana posession demands you go to jail, or be radically looked down upon. I think everyone should just lighten up a bit personally. Drug cartels are not about the drugs, they are about the money, the power, and the territory, they would sell sugar if it was illegal and they thought they could make alot of money off it. dont think so? Why this saying "Guns dont kill people, people kill people". Edited to add: Plus I want to add that most smokers nowadays are finding their weed within our own borders, as it is being grown more and more and more in places you may least expect. And I certainly have never seen weed destroy the life of a man the way I have harder drugs, like meth, heroin, and crack. Although, it does tend to make people lazy, tired, and "unproductive" (if someone does see it that way) When does too much of a good thing, become a bad thing? in regards to marijuana, we are tying to control something we cannot control at all. The only way you can "control" something is by trying to understand it. Just my two cents. "We didn't start the fire"

"We didn't start the fire"

The religious faithful absolutely do not want this to happen; and isn't it an irony that it is the skeptics that would most welcome it - because we are open to evidence and will follow it to whatever truth to which it leads. It would be game over for those that live by faith-based principles if we are ever presented with the answers to the big questions. Kind of like the philosophers in the Hitchhikers Guide who realize that if the ultimate questions get answered via actual observation and objective analysis of information; they'll be out of a job. I think maadmax's previous post addresses everything quite clearly... he has a way with thrift that I do not, but, instead of using assumption against believers, why not address it within your own heart and mind as well? Begin by asking yourself, whats most important to you in this life, and then trying out the possiblity that science is not going to satisfy your desire for that importance, and that it is possible that the spirit of God is real? There is an assumption that those who live by faith, live by faith without reason; but what happens is that man sees God, believe it or not, that doesnt take much faith, its quite blatent and clearly cannot be denied, but what takes faith is keeping that vision and that power in the heart after the "baptism". What I was vastly unprepared for was the amount of suprising revelation that followed and continue to follow, which, if you read in my posts are the reasonings that support what was found. And the way God designed his eternal grace was that it has to be lived to be understood. Grace is kept apart from the knowledge of the world, just as love is in nature. Meaning it cant be understood in the mind without being understood in the heart (where you keep your greatest treasure, where things are sacred to you, the place you only share with trust ect..) Okay, science can study love, and even "apparently" unite us in love (still doubt that one though, sorry), and understand how it works, and affects the mind ect... but the power of love is eternal and goes beyond our understanding. For example, what if I told the US that we need to get rid of all our weapons, become completely defenseless, and fight our "enemies" with love and understanding? The US would not elect me president, but just becasue it is not understood, does not mean it is not the right way, or is just an un-realstic dream... its more than possible, but we woud have to find love beyond our own understanding, which is what Christ offers. It was not fully understood why he went to the cross until he was ressurected, and his spirit began to teach those who would listen. Do you really believe this? forgive me, but it doesnt show that much depth in thought to be honest. what if the greatest risk in life is the one you never take, that is, would you risk death to find life? If the answer is yes, then you are a much deeper person than that quote from a "hitchhikers guide", because you realize that life is more than just being alive. "Therefore I tell you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat or drink; or about your body, what you will wear. Is not life more important than food, and the body more important than clothes? "We didn't start the fire"

I know i took one sentence out of your paragraph, but i felt the need to address it. Salvation is not For some, the search takes a lifetime. But your right, when it is found, it is found, and that is the promise. Not sure why you told me not to mock God though, unless you think I was? "We didn't start the fire"

Paranoia is fear based and love is greater than fear; For me that is not something I had to look too hard for, just seems to make sense to me. I am aware that can be an arbitrary statement to the more argumentative types, but for me, I find the answer in this question, "Does love save us from fear, or does fear save us from love?" Sounds true to me :) This is where it gets a little fuzzy in my head... Theres something here, but I have to think on it. Sounds like the revelation vs reason thing we were discussing earlier with champu. The assumption in your scenario is that the reason comes before the revelation, or that the reason found the revelation, but at least in my case, it was the revelation that found the reasoning. I wasnt looking for reason to support the revelation of God, (It was far more powerful than I can explain), instead, the revelation gives the reasoning quite freely and suprisingly at times, if I remain open and free to think freely. And, if my mind is open within the revelation then perhaps its not as objective as it appears? If I am considered objective because I am filled with a gratitude (that goes way beyond my worth), through the revelation, then you would be right. Theres a sensative line here somewehre, but it is a line still. The supreme being could also be considered the scientific mind as well. There are plenty who believe science is the truth and the ultimate hammer. And I dont think I am just being argumentative, at least I hope not. I can see the reach for reason and understanding here, and it is appreciated, but its racked with inconsistency, assumption, and bias in my mind (I say that with all respect). Ultimately, the revelation of God is being grossly underestimated. I did not reveal anything, God reveals himself, and the experience is quite humbling to say the least, in a very grace-filled way. My experieince did not happen in a church with many poeple ect... I was completely alone in a room in my apartment, the rest im afraid you wouldnt believe. Back to the objectivity thing. I think the problem isnt God, its what people believe in regards to him. But, we should discuss that a little further. For now, ill just post this. "We didn't start the fire"

Im trying to understand your mind in light of these statements, and Im having a little difficulty (which is not your fault at all). The brainchemistry thing is very interesting, but I dont think it really addresses the point about how love gets to one mind from another. I believe it has to be let in, and it seems you think differently. How things work have never been much interest to me, but why things work has, and this could be the difference between yours and my brain chemistry, but I am fighting to understand where your coming from. For me life is a miracle, so explaining how it works is not as important as understanding why it works. Nothing in life is worth anything without life. Again, you and I think differently but that doesnt mean we are wrong. If the absolute scientific truth, met the absolute spiritual truth, the one that is more important to life would have the greatest universal power, (as it relates to life) but it seems that the design of our minds is so, that some crave one over the other. Basically for me I have found that life has no worth on this planet without love. That there is something incredibly fascinating about how powerful love actually is... it just ignites us and fills us with life to the fullest. It doesnt take anything away, though we still deal with loss, on the contrary, it gives and gives and gives. While the balance seems to need both the light and the dark, my hope and my desire is to persevere in the light. "We didn't start the fire"

God didnt make salvation easy to find. He speaks of that in the parables of the pearl and the treasure. Not even miracles (especially done in light of modern technology) can open the eyes to salvation... it has to be let in. You may be convinced by an angel in a burning bush, but the influence of the world is always working in our minds, many may find resons to doubt even after such a miraculous occurance. Unbelievable Miracles can be quite Unbelievable at times. "We didn't start the fire"

there is something very truthful about this statement. It also amplifies a "theory" (truth to me) that we are spiritual beings with very deep needs and wants in that "realm" (or some may submit to the word dimension). There is a voice of trust, of love, of hope, of confidence, of power, of light, of freedom ect... in this world of suffering, pain, confusion, worry, doubt, barriers, loss ect... We can get lost in one only to be found in the other. Depending on the voice, which seems to be a point in your statement, it seems we can either be led or misled, and i would have to agree that many are being misled... and if you dig into your soul, you may or may not agree. It seems a spiritual truth is that we must be lost before we can be found... and yes, that is also in the Gospel. "So that the blind can see, and so that those who see will become blind" "We didn't start the fire"

There is a difference between a faith that satisfies and a faith that more than satisfies. Maadmax was just expressing a deep humble gratefulness by saying that God has already more than "proved" himself to him. The detriment, as I understood it, is to his heart. Its like someone giving their life for you, and then you asking for proof that it was real. Or someone takes loving care of you your entire life and then, when they die, you ask for "proof" that they actually loved you at all. Someone can express love to someone else in great measures their entire life, but if that love is not believed or accepted, then it cant be recieved with the full measure it was given. I think you understand. "We didn't start the fire"

That comes from an iterpretation in James: 14What good is it, my brothers, if a man claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save him? 15Suppose a brother or sister is without clothes and daily food. 16If one of you says to him, "Go, I wish you well; keep warm and well fed," but does nothing about his physical needs, what good is it? 17In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead. 18But someone will say, "You have faith; I have deeds." Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by what I do. 19You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that—and shudder. 20You foolish man, do you want evidence that faith without deeds is useless[d]? 21Was not our ancestor Abraham considered righteous for what he did when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? 22You see that his faith and his actions were working together, and his faith was made complete by what he did. 23And the scripture was fulfilled that says, "Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness,"[e] and he was called God's friend. 24You see that a person is justified by what he does and not by faith alone. 25In the same way, was not even Rahab the prostitute considered righteous for what she did when she gave lodging to the spies and sent them off in a different direction? 26As the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without deeds is dead. It is a very convicting passage for a believer, if its not understood properly and discerned with grace. One of the main points of the Gospel is that grace is found through faith and not through works, but this passage seems to contradict that in a way. Unless we understand what the "doing" and the "deeds" are that James is speaking of. Clint Black sang a song a while back and it was a good song... it said, "love isnt something that we have, its something that we do." It is more difficult and takes greater faith to love in spite of hate or a "loveless" spirit than it is to do something good for someone because a misintereptation in the bible makes you believe that you have faith because of what you do. For example. Does someone have faith because they drink from a cup with wine in it? (while I greatly respect that tradition), or do they drink from the cup because they have faith? In the same way, does a man who does good deeds automatically have faith, or does a man with faith automatically do good deeds? Faith that recieves love is a faith that will give it, even if in just the smallest of ways... Jesus says that faith grows, therefore, the ability to give/do love will grow as well. Also, the bible says that only God makes things grow. Also, you should know by now at least in my posts, that I dont think any of us are good. That I think only God is good and that good is expressed in countless creative ways through us. I dont believe it is the truth to say that a Christian is good simply because he has faith, and neither does James it appears. Jesus says that we must practice what he taught... practice is doing, at least the way I see it. "We didn't start the fire"

Because the message is grace through faith "We didn't start the fire"

And for some reason this is mostly all you hear. I get some pretty uncool things said to me also, but those things are not all I "hear". Besides Im interested in discussing and sharpening as much understanding as I can, Im not as interested in arguments believe it or not. I was just making a point that a man can be humble/desire to be humble, without faith and with faith, even if that faith believes in hell. Its no worries if you disagree. "We didn't start the fire"

I Agree... (Luke)37And no one pours new wine into old wineskins. If he does, the new wine will burst the skins, the wine will run out and the wineskins will be ruined. 38No, new wine must be poured into new wineskins. 39And no one after drinking old wine wants the new, for he says, 'The old is better.' " The old does not want the new because they dont recognize it is better. In Christ, there is a new covenant that should be accepted as Gospel... 7to give his people the knowledge of salvation through the forgiveness of their sins, 78because of the tender mercy of our God, by which the rising sun will come to us from heaven 79to shine on those living in darkness and in the shadow of death, to guide our feet into the path of peace." The fruit of that knowledge would be unrecognizable to those consumed by the old wine. But you should know that the conversations we have in the forums would be a little different in person, but what is written here may be read by others, that dont understand (and Im not just talking about non-believers), so, I feel the need to elaborate more than I normally would. Plus, I think I must enjoy these forums more than I know "We didn't start the fire"

What is heard is not always what is being said, and what is said is not always what is being understood. But humbleness can be found in both "attributes", so if I can understand that humbleness can be found in atheism, then why cant others understand that it can be found in God as well? Instead, the humble man of God (completely unworthy) gets ridiculed by the humble atheist. At least thats the intent I got from your previous post anyway. "We didn't start the fire"

Sounds great, but doesnt mean you wont either (assuming your not dating any longer?) I have a friend here in kuwait who is about to marry a muslim woman and he has been considering converting to Islam. And my brothers fiance had to convert to Islam to marry her ex-husband, who eventually had her kicked out of the country. I saw her confronted by her kuwaiti ex, and three days later she was "kicked out" back to the phillipines. They have a child together and that is another story altogether. I can say that with everything that has been presented to me, she has no rights to that child. Converting to Islam is more than just a spiritual conversion (assuming one accepts it as truth), and you need to be completely aware of that especially if her family is very religious. I have some bitterness toward this woman for bringing my brother into the divorced family of a filipino (convert to Islam), a kuwaiti ex husband (who she married 2 times actually) and a 2 yr old fully kuwaiti child (as it relates to kuwaiti law, the child can never be filipino, and the father recieves monies from the government of Kuwait to support the child)... Its really sort of a big mess, but I cant control who my brother falls in love with, and, I believe he is in love with her, so my role now is to contain my bitterness and support my brother in his happiness as best I can. The bottom line is, that my brothers fiance has a child in kuwait that she will not get to live with, and the conversion to Isalm has played a major role in the ex husbands attitude toward her, and he has used that against her in his mind and in his actions. Not only are the religions different, the cultures are different, and the traditions ect... You'll need to grow in sensativity when your families are together, thats for sure. Nevertheless, religious families of both Judaism and Islam can either be moderate or radical. From what Ive seen, most families are more tolerant than what we often think when they see the happiness in thier loved one is pure. Either way use great respect and attempt to gain as much understanding as you can, because they arent going to change anymore than you want to right? Ultimately though, I still say follow your heart. Barriers are made to be broken, I did make friends with a Palestinian Muslim who openly hugged me in public in the old city of Jerusalem, and I think about him alot. Hope that helps for something at least. "We didn't start the fire"

Try to follow your heart. "We didn't start the fire"