alan

Presumably we are talking about turbulence at low altitudes, such as during landing, at least my post indicated such. At higher altitudesyou can do what ever you choose and bounce around a little and go on. Also, I was specific about todays designs, which except for s few specialty canopies, are designed to be flown with front risers as a significant source of control input. Front or rear riser input will have the effect of changing the trim angle and change the angle of attack as a result. Brakes will slow your forward speed, reducing pressurization and distort the airfoil, making it less efficient and more prone to abrupt changes in altitude as a result of turbulence. Increasing the angle of attack with brakes won't necessarily put it closer to the middle of the accpetable range of the canopy, it may actually put it nearer the critical angle for a stall. You have to know your canopy. I think most of the recent canopy designs that are most commonly in use today are designed for front riser use and are not prone to collapsing, as the older designs were. Especially the 7 cells. As I said in my previous post, there may have been some merrit to the old advice of brakes and some of those canopies are certainly still flying today. Yes it is, but during most landing approaches we are not at or near the extremes of the canopy's design limits. An exception would be a high performance landing approach.....which most of us know better than to attempt in turbulent conditions. A few of us exercise poor judgement and we generally read about them. alan

Try reading the Canopy Reviews in the Gear pages. alan

This may help a little. http://www.afn.org/skydive/sta/highperf.pdf It is a little hard to read though, the quality of the scan or whatever was poor. alan

A main canopy doesn't need to be TSO'd for use in the US, just the reserve. alan

Practically speaking, most of us seldom keep a canopy for more than a thousand or two thousand jumps. There is considerable field evidence that zero-P canopies last much longer than that when given a reasonable amount of care and that goes back to the early fabrics. The fabric commonly used today by the major/popular canopy manufacturers has improved UV resistant characteristics, so it will last even longer. Bottom line, for all pratical purposes it is unlikely you will still have the canopy if and when it begins to show evidence of significant degradation due to UV exposure unless you make a habit of leaving it lay out in the sun. alan

Yes, years ago brakes in turbulence was generally the accepted advice. May have even had some degree of validity on the canopy designs that were prevalent at the time, but with todays canopies, brakes is bad advice. When there is mechanical turbulence on my DZ, I usually choose a crosswind approach and fly though it with as much speed as possible. You may still have to deal with it at the end, but with a little planning, I am usually in a relatively calm area at this point. seems to work for me. alan

Have you flown one yet?

I've flown an FX, VX, Modified VX, Velocity and Xaos -27 all at wing loadings from about 2.0 to 2.5 in variety of conditions, including hot days with light and variable winds. I've been able to land them all nicely doing a simple straight in approach. I'm curious as to what you mean by "fly them in pretty hard for landing". I agree, you should have a load of experience under heavily loaded ellipticals before attempting to fly one. I think a pilot with enough experience to fly one should be able to land it on an easy straight in approach. If you can do that, then move on to high performance approaches. All the aggressive approach does is lengthen the surf, the landing is the same. alan

The number of pack jobs on it is at least as important if not more important than the age. One point to consider with regard to pack jobs, they may include "pencil packs" which means the packing data card may indicate 25 or 30, but the actual number could be lower. Glidepath made and makes a good product. If a reputable rigger has inspected it (Kruse, perhaps?) then $400 sounds like a pretty fair price. A new Tempo can be had for around $600 to $700. Precision, PD, etc. go up considerably from there. A friend of mine recently bought a similar Cricket reserve for $300 from a guy in Canada. Found it here in the classifieds on Dropzone.com alan

Hmmmm.......I can personally recall two incidents where the pop top snagged and deployed. I guess it is a tie on anecdotes. But I do agree it is virtually impossible to wriggle loose a reserve pin on a Reflex or Racer. I've seen several premature deployments on non- pop top rigs due to the pin being push or pulled by a dragging reserve cable...on older designs. alan

I don't think it is about being "right". I think it is about what pages on this site will allows us to find the information we need. For example, in the Gear and Rigging Forum: Post: I recently sent my new XYZ container in for a repair/modification to the reserve tuck tab. Can anyone with experience with their customer service give me some feedback on how long I might expect to be without my rig? or Post: I sent ny new rig XYZ into the mfgr for what I was told would be a a minor repair. I was told to expect it back in about 2 or 3 weeks. It has now been 5 weeks, can anyone else who has run into this problem with them give me some advice on how to get a better response from them? or Post: I am thinking of buying a brand new XYZ rig. Can you give me some input on their customer service? Random endorsements are great for the Talkback Forum. An endorsement as part of a detailed review is most useful in the Gear Reviews page. Oh....I agree, Wings does have great customer service. alan

The question is not who makes that distinction, but what makes that distinction. Common sense should. Yes, this forum is getting right up there with Talk Back. We used to get opinions and advice from a variety of people with the skill, experience, and knowledge to make it valuable. I've noticed many of them appear here less frequently. I can only wonder if it might have anything to do with all of the clutter that seems to be so popular. And that now makes your original comment less rude and intolerant?

Sure, if the is something noteworthy to discuss. This turns into little more than an opinion poll. XYZ has great service. XYZ doesn't. And on and on and on. Customer service would seem to me to be an important and relevant part of a good gear review. If my opinions on these kinds of threads bug you that much, there's a simple solution............... alan

Exactly. And for everone that says Sunpath, Mirage, etc. sucked, there is someone else that can come here and say they were great. You missed your own point. Every major manufacturer has messed up....and maybe did you ever consider that that could extend to customer service. Hey, lets just turn this forum into an opinion poll. alan

Tampering doesn't have to be an intentional act of sabotage for the purpose of causing harm. Some well meaning jumper(rigger?) may offer to "help" to tighten a loose top, not really know what he is doing but knows just enough to try and the poor newby doesn't know any better. The tampering is concealed and may have fatal results. Not good. alan

The Dropzone Gear and Rigging forum is where you can discuss any gear related questions and issues. Yes, but the reviews page would be more appropriate. I can't see the question or issue here. Post: I bought a new Sabre. I love it and love the service from PD. Post: I bought a new Talon and love it. I think RI has the greatest service and reommend it to everyone. Post: I bought a new Vector III and love it. The tuck tabs on the riser covers wouldn't stay closed, but I sent it back and the service was great. Everyone should get a Vector. Post: I just got my new Spectre(Cobalt, Stiletto, Triathlon, Diablo, Crossfire II, Xaos.........) and have never had better landings or openings. I recommend it to anyone. So, we all just take turns telling everyone how happy we are with our most recent gear purchase. alan

Niether have I, but then I never said they did either. I do hear it quite often from uninformed jumpers though, referring to pop tops in general, be it a Reflex or Racer. Some even claim it for Javelins, Wings, etc.. Yes and more than a few are fooled by it. See above. Snag point is there even on CRW-flap rigs......just not as easy to get at. A loose top on any rig that has an exposed reserve pc can snag on a door on exit/climb out, break the loop and deploy the reserve. Pin protection is the only real benefit I can see and it is a biggy. Is it worth the other baggage? I don't know, but some of the posters here seem to be more concerned with how sexy their rig looks. alan

No, the point is that if every newby that buys a new rig with a problem, sends it back, likes the customer service, thens decides to tell the world he has a new rig and loves it and everyone should get one because it is the greatest, then we could all spend our days reading the same dribble about Javelins, Mirages, Talons, Voodoos, Infinities, Teardrops, Reflexes, Vectors, Racers, etc., etc., etc., and then next week/month we can all read it all over again. I got a: pick one (Javelin, Mirage, Talon, Voodoo, Infinity, Teardrop, Reflex, Vector, Racer, etc., etc., etc.) and I really love it and recommend it to everyone and anyone, especially since it wasn't quite right, but they fixed it really good and were so very nice about it. There is a gear review page for everyone who has a new rig, canopy, jumpsuit, whatever. Use it. alan

Why not just buy a container that doesn't have to be sent back for a modification to do what it is supposed to do in the first place? Thanks, but I'll stay with a manufacturer that sends it out right the first time and still has great customer service, that way I won't be missing out on the use of my new rig while it is back being modified. That is what I am missing by not jumping one, isn't it? alan

It does not operate based on altitude, but rather pressure and changes in pressure and the rate of those changes. Have you tried contacting the manufacurer for specifics? alan

A simpler fix would be to simply follow the manufacturers packing instructions, specifically step 10 on page 10 of a recent Sunpath/Javelin owner's manual. alan

Don't work hard, work smart. Make sure the closing loop is the correct length, this make take some trial and error on some rigs or may mean referring to the manufacturers' instructions. Don't be afraid to adjust them though, even if it means taking a little more time. Speaking of time, get the air out of the canopy. Get a temp pin in and sit on it for a little while.....taking a break. Or, just stack some weight on it. Close a flap or two, then massage it and put the weight on again. Wrap the closing loop around your packing paddle or fid to save on your fingers and hands, it will give you some leverage. Bottom line, work with your head, not your back and arms. alan

Actually that nickname goes back a long time. Back to when the Stiletto was one of the first "elliptical" canopies to be widely marketed. Back then, few if any jumpers realized the importance of flying the openings as Chris described. Lack of knowledge and experience lead to many off heading and spinning openings. Now we know better and with the clarity of hind sight, the nickname is largely undeserved, or at least no more so than any other elliptical canopy in use today. alan

I don't agree that there are a lot of flamers here. This is a moderated forum so people often voice opinions that may be unpopular or contrary to your own, but flamers, as a general rule, usually get shut down pretty quickly. alan

Ummmm.....the Wings has a partially exposed reserve top that can have the same or similar seating issues as the Reflex, although it is not a pop top. In my opinion, a fairly recent model of the Infinity is more rigger friendly. Wings has great customer service, but then they should, they get a lot of practice dealing with small problems with their rigs. They usually end up with happy, satisfied customers. alan