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There is a canopy comparison chart in the back of any Para Gear catalog. It has three columns - name of a canopy, its volume in cu. in., and its size in sq.ft. It says: Icarus Safire 169, 452 cu.in., 169 sq.ft.; Sabre 150, 413 cu.in., 159 sq.ft.; Sabre 170, 451 cu.in., 179 sq.ft.; According to this chart the area difference between Icarus and PD canopies is about 9 sq.ft. in this range of sizes. I think it is very close to the truth. I jump Safire 149, and was demoing Sabre2 135. Sabre2 looked just a little smaller above my head then Safire 149. Well, it is definitely a subjective way to measure two canopies, but I usually trust what I see. If you add 9 to 135 you'll get 144 sq.ft., which is the size of Sabre2 135 in the Icarus measuring system (very close to 149). Hope this helps. Anton

You are right, Michele, there is no a certain cut-off between light and heavy loadings. It is a mixture of experience, individual capabilities, and a type of canopy that matters. Loading 1.5 is VERY HIGH. The difference here is that some jumpers with enough experience CAN handle such a loading. Although if mistake is made, the result is usually fatal (take a look at fatalities reports paying attention how many jumps they had - if we assume for now that # of jumps is an indicator of experience level). Also take a look at PD and Icarus web sites: http://www.performancedesigns.com http://www.icaruscanopies.com/choosing.htm These manufacturers give their opinions concerning wing loadings with PD being more conservative than Icarus. I think they suspect that people will not really stick with what they suggest, that's why their (I mean PD's) recommendations are slightly over moderate. There are a lot of useful info on the PD's site. Check out their articles, manuals, and seminars. I expect you'll find answers to all your questions there. If we consider a particular canopy, then suspending more weight to it will increase the total speed of the canopy keeping the glide angle the same. The total speed consists of the horizontal and vertical components which both increase too. This increased total speed generates more lift needed to support heavier suspended weight and also allows to generate more lift when flaring (that's what attracts many jumpers). But the "side effects" that comes with the increased speed and higher loadings are the very fast turns and a lost of lots of altitude. All these together leave you much less time to react and consequences of a wrong decision will be more radical if the jump deflects from planned. (I think this is exactly what they mean by forgiveness). No matter what canopy you choose make sure you are comfortable with it and can handle it in the worst situation. Hope this helps. Anton

Sad news. I knew him personally, we were jumping together last summer in Hollister and Monterey Bay. It is still hard to believe for me that this happened. He was a very nice guy, friendly and cheerful. I will miss him ... There were a lot of posts on this issue, but it happens too often. It sucks when it happens, especially with your friends. OK, lets try to learn something from this accident. I'm sure everybody (including me) has (or will have) something like that happened to them sometime in their skydiving career. What I mean here is a very familiar scenario: long spot, something more than a student main canopy in the container (which has a very good flare, but also fast forward speed to provide that flare, and in addition pretty responsive turns), trying to make it back to DZ instead of starting to look for alternatives not too late (sometimes there is no much choice of alternatives though), not able to make it back but still trying -> low turn at the very last moment to face the wind, and (usually) very hard landing in the turn. If you haven't run out of luck yet (Andrei has) and your canopy is forgiving enough it is going to be just veeery memorable landing, otherwise hospital if you r lucky again. Well from my point of view, the best that can be done in a situation like this is to start looking for the alternative landing areas up high when you still have some time left to make a decision and (hopefully) some options where to land. Because if you choose to make it back and it turns out to be impossible, then you will not have a chance to pick out the place to land (your luck will). It might be a house, a barn, forest, somebody's back yard, barbed wire fence, steep hill, highway, power lines, or whatever else. I wonder also how in a hell people who have rather heavy loaded (> 1.2 : 1), let say 9-cell canopies are going to land them in such an emergency situations in congested or restricted alternative landing areas should such a need arise? If you have any opinions on this subject matter, please share them with us! Also it might be helpful to know what main was Andrei jumping? Anton My condolences to all Andrei's relatives and friends.

Thank you guys for your replies! (unexpected rhyme!). I'll contact PD. Btw I know Kolla, she helped me to change slider for my Spectre - I didn't like its slooow openings at all. Blue Skies! Anton

Hello everyone, I've heard good things about Sabre2, and I'd like to demo one. Where can I order one for demo and how long is a waiting list if there is any? Blue skies, soft landings! Anton

Pyke, What p/c manufacturer are you talking about in particular? I e-mailed SkyKat Gear shop and their p/c made by Cazer Paraloft require sewing. I'm looking for one right now and want to find out which ones are not sewn in.

Does the installation of the kill-line p/c to the main canopy require any sewing?

OK guys, thanks for the inputs. Now after Dave touched the subject of PC sizes here is another question. I want to buy a ZP pilot chute for a 149 sq. ft. main. What brand and size should I get? There are quite a bit of them on the market nowadays. Blue skies, safe swoops! Anton

I saw it at several dealer's sites that manufacturers recommend to use pilot chutes made of F111 fabric. I know for sure that Sun Path doesn't make pilot chutes of zeroP fabric for Javelins (even kill-line collapsible). The questions is what is wrong with ZP pilot chutes? As far as I understand they last longer and they are smaller in size. Any thoughts?