erdnarob

Just illustrating what I was saying earlier about the drifting distance between freeflyers and belly flyers. Thanks Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

Thank you very much for that quite "complete" report from the FAI. I can see it matches quite well what I have posted earlier. Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

What a good idea. The only problem I can see is that the skydiving market is small therefore designing such a product and selling it will make the cost relatively high. OTOH such a device exists already to locate main parachutes which have been cut away in order to better recover them. If I remember the device was costing 200-300 $ or so. I didn't hear about that device for years. Last time it was in Skydiving Magazine which is not anymore under publication. Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

There is a person in Canada who has an actual museum of jumpable skydiving equipment. This is Jim Wilson. Jim is refurbishing skydiving equipment often with the help of manufacturers and jump them. Personally I have at home a complete Niagara Cobra (Paracommander like) round parachute system including the reserve but it is not for sale. See the picture. That equipment was jumped twice in 2009. Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

Even if the picture is a bit blurred, I can see that each ring is resting metal on metal which is exactly the way it should be. That allows the middle and the small rings to play the role of a lever while the loop which passes into the small ring only plays the role of a pulley. That way, the force reduction is : for big rings: 10 x 10 x 2 = 200 ; for small rings: 8 x 8 x 2 = 128 I agree that a bit more of tension between the harness and the riser would show better the 3 rings set up. Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

Congratulations for becoming member of the "riggers club". Now, it will be up to you to keep current with the always continuing evolution of skydiving equipment. I can see that you don't hesitate to travel. A good idea would be for you to attend the Parachute Industry Association (PIA) at Reno Nevada next February 2011. A lot of manufacturers to speak with up there and numerous very interesting seminars given by a lot of the most prestigious names of the parachute industry. The biggest mistake a rigger can do is to hide behind his rating and claim he is OK and knowledgeable. Unfortunately it is often the case. Same for some doctors. I have seen riggers who have taken their course many years ago and being completely beyond new technologies or safety bulletins. Do not hesitate to communicate with other riggers and frankly exchange your hesitations or doubts or contact directly the manufacturers. Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

If your Swift reserve is more than 20 years old or/and more than 40 repacks, you should get a porosity test. Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

Excellent attitude to go and look when your rigger is doing your rig assembly. Later on at the next reserve repack, make a simulation. Ask somebody to hold your rig fully packed (reserve and main) on the ground. Then with the cut away handle being pulled, remove the main pilot chute and simulate a cut away by pulling the main reward (in order to better peel the RSL Velcro). In a real cut away that pull is made vertically or so. Expect some resistance to first extract the main, get the rubber bands undone, get the risers protector flaps undone, to get the 3 ring release, to get the RSL peeled off, get the reserve extracted from its container and see the Skyhook coming in action. Results: You should finally get your main completely unhooked from the rest of the rig, the reserve out of its free bag and the free bag still attached to the Skyhook connected with the main parachute via the RSL. Isn't a nice story ? Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

D license or D cup ? Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

Where is Ballunar and what are the ground features on that DZ? Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

Thank you Wendy for sharing other statistics. All together we should hopefully get near the reality. Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

Thanks for participating to the thread. I have no figures about fatalities when landing with obstacles. What you say matches what I have always said : being able to choose the landing area is for me very important since any hazards can wait for us when you land elsewhere. Personally I have landed about anywhere (not on purpose) : junk yard, near electric lines, besides a highway, near a river or a lake, in a very tight glade, in town...name it. I have been extremely lucky. For that reason I recommend everybody to get familiar with low flat turns just in case of having to use them. OTOH as soon as possible, a jumper should have a canopy with a loading factor fast enough to be able to penetrate into the wind as much as possible. That is an important factor allowing the jumper to choose better his landing area. But we have to admit that swooping or low turn or hook turn is still the main suspect. Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

Always ready to give info when available, here is an extract (in attachment) of a document where you can identify my sources. The whole document was available at the PIA symposium at Reno Nevada in 2007. A seminar was dedicated to this facet of skydiving. Are you by any chance a marathon runner ? Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

Swooping seems to be the first reason for fatalities with an well open canopy. I agree that canopy collision is also a contributing factor. As far as I am concerned, several jumpers I have known have died at landing while just one was involved in a canopy collision. Chances of canopy collision are less likely to happen due the space generally large enough. OTOH many jumpers using high performance canopy are swooping. What we can hope is that more and more people wanting to swoop would or should take a canopy piloting course which is becoming more and more popular. About the traffic circuit now, it is the role of the DZO to enforce the regulations at his DZ. When it's done and monitored circuits are done properly. Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

Here are some statistics which have been released in 2007 by the FAI. They concern the year 2005 for Skydiving across the world. *36 countries supplied the information *More than 6 millions jumps have been made by a bit more than 800 000 jumpers *64 fatalities happened or one fatality per 96 000 jumps or one per 12600 jumpers *tandem fatalities 3% *solo fatalities 97% *41% fatalities out of the 64 happened with the main parachute well open *16% fatalities out of 64 might have been avoided by AAD use *84% fatalities out of 64 seem to be caused by human error 3 fatalities out of 64 or almost 5% involved first jump students In Canada the month of April and July seem to be the most prone for fatalities (for the past 14 years) which corresponds to the beginning of the skydiving season and the warm and humid weather of July. For comparison purpose: Swimming: one fatality for 38 600 swimmers Scuba: one fatality for 31 300 divers or one every 95 000 dives Boating: one fatality for 15 400 persons Bicycling: one fatality for 47 200 persons Marathon running: one fatality for 4065 runners What is very disturbing is the 41% of fatalities under a well open main canopy. Swooping... I hope that could help with this thread Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

I agree with you. Freeflyers with higher vertical speed are exposed to the the winds aloft for a shorter time (with respect to the belly flyers) therefore they are drifting less. That's why generally they jump after the belly flyers. At certain wind and aircraft (aloft) speeds, even with a 10 seconds delay, belly flyers jumping after freeflyers can have a trajectory crossing the freeflyers one near opening altitude. I made some calculations and drawings which show that. I have also seen an Internet site (5 years ago maybe) where you could see an animation with possibility of choosing delays and speeds. You could clearly see in some case the crossing paths I have mentioned. Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

Not at all since as a person who is knitting a sweater with a single thread, the lines would have a certain thickness and volume. Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

Say a typical DZ landing area measurements are 1000 ft x 1500 ft. Now a canopy opens at 3000 ft with a glide ratio of 2 to 1 (I am conservative here). That means without any wind a canopy can fly horizontally twice its height which makes 6000 ft. OTOH an airplane flying at 85 MPH is doing 125 ft/sec. If the separation is 10 seconds between groups, the horizontal travel of the airplane is 125 x 10 = 1250 feet. Lets suppose now there are 5 groups with no wind. Group 1 is dropped (before with respect to the jump run) at 3000 ft before the center of the landing area Group 2 is dropped 10 seconds after the group 1 which means 1750 feet before the center of the landing area Group 3 is dropped 10 seconds after group 2 which is 500 feet before the center of the landing area Group 4 is dropped 10 seconds after group 3 which is 750 feet after the center of the landing area group 5 jumps 10 seconds after group 4 which is 2000 feet after the center of the landing area If there is now a medium wind. Well we have to do some calculations but I can see that the whole process will be moved upwind. What I am trying to explain here is that very often people are reluctant to wait a well measured 10 seconds after the precedent group. Most of the airplanes are just traveling 1250 feet during those 10 seconds while your canopy is able to travel 6000 ft and more when open at 3000 feet. The problem arises when winds are high. Spot are then more touchy. Figures do not lie. Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

A lot of money since that would require many hours of highly specialized labor. But I have seen at least one case where it has been done almost the way I have described... it was an experimental parachute which has been jumped with success. """"""One day scientists will maybe be able to modify super spider genetics and program them to spin an entire canopy including lines and steering lines and ...using a single thread. Wouldn't it be nice ????? Anybody can dream. Such canopy would be the lightest, the strongest and without a stitch including a minimum volume.""""""

Some Twin Otter door have air leaking above the door. Even in the Summer at altitude it can be cold for people near the door. I have seen at different places people using a 2 inches or so diameter tube of foam of about 4 feet long, the type used by kids in swimming pool. That tube is placed between the door top and the inside bar to apply pressure on the door and stop the air leak. That tube can be easily removed in case of emergency. Personally, I have never seen any blanket used for that purpose. Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

I my precedent post, when talking about spotting training I had in mind the way to evaluate the spot location, not the spotting itself. We all understand that both are important ie. finding the spot location by appropriate means and techniques for exiting right at the spot. Sorry if there was some confusion. Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

You shouldn't rely on one isolated case to make up your mind. All AADs have had their problems (bad pressure sensor, cutter with sharp edges at the hole, electrostatic firing, firing when the jumper was doing spiral turns.... and last but not the least, wrong use of the AAD by the owner who often never read the owner's manual or do not understand it). I guess that now more than a million of jumps are made every year using AADs. Statistics are such that few firing cases are not significant. First one has to find the cause of the problem which is generally not that easy. OTOH AADs are to be used as back up devices only, just like car air bags...You still have the responsibility to be safe. As I said in the mean time, AADs are saving lifes. DB COOPER #290 Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

Yes it is possible but at higher costs and weight. When a suspension line comes from the riser (attached by a knot) to the attachment point (A line for instance) at the canopy and connected there by an appropriate knot, this line is thread inside the longitudinal seam and get out at the B attachment point. Then it goes to the risers, another knot and it's back to the C attachment point, goes inside the seam to the D attachment point then goes inside the lateral seam to the next D attachment point and so on... That way, the suspension line inside the seams acts as a reinforcement. You get then a continuous line construction. That method was used before for round army parachute (though with stitching). With some imagination you can rig the whole canopy with a single continuous line. Now, the actual design could also be done without using a sewing machine. You will have to use knots and glue. One thing to remember, a finger trap is self sufficient as long as there is a tension on the line. When a force is applied on a line, the finger trap squeezes the part of the line inside hard enough it cannot move. The bar tack is there more to secure the position of the finger trap than to resist to the applied tension. Try it yourself : have a suspension line, make a loop, do a finger trap of 3 inches or more, attach the loop to a solid anchorage and pull at the other end of the line. I bet you that nothing will move and the finger trap will remain intact. Imagination is better than knowledge Albert Einstein Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

Unfortunately spotting training is almost a lost habit. Not only jumpers are not interested too much to get that training but find it not necessary. The main reason is that malfuctions are relatively rare and people rely on the performance of their canopy to bring them back to the landing area from a long or missed spot. What they forget is that a good spot can save them a lot of money in case of a malfunction. Losing the main or just the freebag is quite costly. Not being able to land in a familiar area because of a missed spot can also result in injuries since about anything can wait for them on the ground (trees, fences, roads, hidden hazard like steel bar or junk of any kind). On the other hand, people find out their lack of skill and knowledge in technique of spotting when they get their pro rating and have to organize a demo downtown for instance. Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

Femur break and aorta rupture due to opening shock were part of articles published in Skydiving Magazine years ago as well as broken ribs. I had a Vector III with tuck tabs and I remember that at few occasions with a Sabre 2, I got some very hard openings. One of them had my canopy opening within 180 feet (calculated from the Vigil 1 downloaded graph (altitude-time)). This was a real slammer. Now with another Vector III with magnets and a Katana my openings are always the same. Maybe the Katana helps too. But there is not anymore "so so" openings even if I don't cup after my tracking. Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.