NWFlyer

I learned something I didn't know from this article - that SFO has continued to use private screeners since the TSA was put into place. I live in the area, but about 98% of my travel is from Oakland so I don't know SFO well enough to know whether there's a noticeable difference in how they do things. http://www.npr.org/2010/11/18/131427580/airports-weigh-congressman-s-call-to-ditch-tsa However ... it may not make that much difference. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

Ski gloves bad! About the only thing I can do with ski gloves when I'm wearing them is wipe my nose! No way do I want to try to find my hackey. Do a search for "winter gloves" or "cold weather gloves" and you'll find lots of good recommendations. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

No one's stopping you from putting on a tiara in Florida. I'm just sayin'. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

Well, my weapon of a can koozy isn't going to do much good unless the aliens are armed only with Nerf guns. But I think my work laptop will make a fine shield. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

And does she actually become Queen? I thought it was some other title since she's not a blood descendant. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

Since we're in Reno I think it's almost required that we have a March Madness-style bracket pool. I'll be happy to volunteer to run it. $20 buy-in sound about right? "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

and that's pretty much contingent upon a different leadership and different social environment and different litigation environment - right now, it's skewed towards acknowledgment of big brother And a different political environment, too. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

IF you needed "highly Trained" people yes, I'd agree...How many years of college/special training do these want-a be Cops have for their "highly skilled" position? From what I find...a matter of days! (and pass a background check) Maybe so for the job they're doing today, which TSA management has turned into a procedurally-based, highly micromanaged, low-skill, low-thinking, low-empowerment job. If we want better quality we're going to have to attract a different type of person and create a different type of job. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

I suspect there are people in the biz with perfectly good judgment. It's more likely that the procedures disallow that level of judgment and they are handcuffed by (call it whatever you like - fairness, PC thuggery, changing rules, litigation paranoia, ......etc ad nauseum). Yep, I agree. I travel an awful lot and have had occasion to interact with a lot of TSA agents at a lot of different (primarily U.S.) airports. Most of them are not jack-booted thugs on a power trip. Most of them are not brain-dead idiots. They're people trying to a job that is defined and managed through heavy-handed micromanaging of procedure rather than through training, growth, and empowerment. I've seen the same thing in private industry, but government agencies seem to have a special ability to create automatons. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

My favorite part of that one is the smile on the evaluator's face. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

Do you have a problem with that approach? I mean seriously the most probable terrorist attach is going to be a young male Muslim. While I sympathise with the plight of the very many innocent young male Muslims that would be inconvenienced why waste resources searching Grandma Jones? The problem is when it's applied in a way such that all young Arab males are put into one security line and all grandmas are put into another. It's the dialogue and the observation and well-trained analysis that you see from Israeli security that is lacking in the U.S. - the ability to read body language, and voice, and affect and put together a risk picture that's more sophisticated than "brown guy = bad guy." A few years ago (pre-9/11) I went on a little weekend jaunt by myself on the Olympic Peninsula in Washington. My car broke down and I wound up stuck for a couple days in Port Angeles, WA. There's not a lot to do there without a car, so I hopped on the passenger ferry to Victoria, BC for the day. Coming back into the U.S., the agents asked me a lot of questions, and were *really* curious about why I had only gone up for the day and why I didn't have my passport with me (this was back when you could go to Canada from the U.S. w/o a passport). I probably fit a profile of someone who might be carrying drugs back from BC "young, traveling alone, day trip" but through asking more questions and getting reasonable (and relaxed) answers from me (and taking a look through my backpack), they got the full story (stuck in town, trip was unplanned, etc.) and could make a judgment that I wasn't bringing drugs after all and let me go on my way. That's the kind of conversation and judgment that's lacking in our security procedures today. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

Just a reminder ... this post wasn't another "let's whine about TSA" thread ... it's a "take some fucking action" thread. Even if you think it won't do any good ... do something. Call or email your senator, or one of the members of the committee. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

Interesting article on that topic. It's a year old but still relevant. http://www.thestar.com/news/world/article/744199---israelification-high-security-little-bother?sms_ss=twitter&at_xt=4ce0361af7973d2e%2C0 "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

Now would be a good time to write your Senator if he or she is on the U.S. Senate Committee on Commerce, Science, and Transportation. That committee has a hearing on Wednesday, November 17 on TSA Oversight. Hearing: http://commerce.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?p=Hearings&ContentRecord_id=9ad9e372-c415-4758-805a-4b4a295ccb8b&ContentType_id=14f995b9-dfa5-407a-9d35-56cc7152a7ed&Group_id=b2afa036-c20d-49ae-9211-b5ef8d7ea62d Committee members: http://commerce.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?p=CommitteeMembers It's Congress that's going to have to take some action on "security theater" because apparently the TSA believes it has the backing of the courts. (That ruling came about before the latest TSA rules which seem to say "You can get an xray or you can get a full body pat-down, but once we decide you have to get one, you have no other options." http://consumerist.com/2010/11/you-might-be-in-serious-for-refusing-to-be-tsa-screened.html Here's but one example of a guy who tried to opt out in a very calm and reasonable manner ... this is his direct account; it's also gotten a ton of media attention in the last couple days. http://johnnyedge.blogspot.com/2010/11/these-events-took-place-roughly-between.html Let your Senator know what you think about security theater. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

Wow. I was almost tearing up at the end of the story. Thanks for sharing this. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

Well I'm sure your sys admins are having fun cleaning up that loophole. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

Sheeple ... Of course, if there's 40,000 people in the company and someone can accidentally send an email to all of them, sounds like they need to get better control over who can and can't send to company-wide distribution lists. It's doubtful someone accidentally added all 40,000 employees to the "TO" line (or that your email system would allow that many addresses... or maybe it does and that's your problem!). "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

No one said she's a student. What would you be doing differently? "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

Yeah, seriously, the guy should have thought of you before he gave you his airplane for free. Nice deal - enjoy it. I know zero about where to tell you to go for your info, just felt the need to dish a little crap. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

sounds like they did more then inspect it. your words...not mine! Okay, so I picked a poor word in my original post. I think I've made it crystal clear what Chutingstar did or did not do in my subsequent posts. Moving on... "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

so you're saying that it's free for folks to sell their equipment through them? is their website not true? see attached pic. I'm not saying that. I'm saying that I didn't ask Chutingstar to sell my gear. Chutingstar did not sell my gear for me. Chutingstar performed an inspection for the buyer. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

from their web site ...A check will be sent to you for the sale price once the gear is sold, minus the inspection fee (varies by number/type of items) and commission (15%). so on a $2500 rig you're giving up $350+...or in this case, he's going to paying that much more. to the OP...just send money if you want the rig, it might just save you a few dollars. just my $.02. Nope, didn't cost me a thing. That quote - I assume - refers to Chutingstar actually taking responsibility for selling the gear. In this case, I was selling the gear myself, marketing it myself, and negotiating a price directly with the buyer. The buyer asked Mike at Chutingstar to inspect my canopy, and asked if I could send the canopy to Mike. I don't know what Mike charged the buyer for the inspection, but there was absolutely no cost to me as the seller. Once Mike had completed the inspection, he let me know; at that point, the buyer and I arranged payment, and once payment was taken care of, Mike released the canopy to the buyer. Everyone was happy. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

Usually it's (as billvon also said) from a trusted vendor - and purchased with a credit card, which comes with its own set of buyer protections. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

Yeah you do. This person has a business now that I won't patronize because of your experience. Very small community indeed. To the OP, you really can tell a lot through conversations. I've sold two canopies on dropzone.com. One was brokered through Chutingstar - the buyer was local to Mike and I knew Mike and had no problem sending it to him. Even if I didn't I probably would have been comfortable brokering a transaction through Chutingstar or any of the larger dealers/rigging lofts - they've spent quite a bit of time building up their business reputations and aren't going to risk that by screwing over a random seller online. There's no upside there. For the other, I also got a dealer involved that I knew. The buyer and I had conversed back and forth and I didn't have any real concerns but having a dealer in the middle helped to facilitate the transaction. Now, on the other end of the spectrum, when I bought my first rig, I bought the container/reserve from an individual seller who, after just a couple conversations, put the rig in a box and sent it to me with an "I trust you" assurance. I paid shipping, and agreed to pay to ship it back if I didn't want to buy it (but since it was exactly as the seller described and fit me well, I did end up buying it). I was, frankly, surprised that he was willing to do that as, at the time, I'd never left my then-home DZ in Washington and he was in North Carolina and, AFAIK, didn't do any vetting of me (other than our conversations). In later transactions where I was the buyer, I've bought from people I knew (or with whom I share a lot of mutual friends) so there wasn't an issue of trusting a total stranger. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

When you buy a shirt on the internet do you also use Mad John for that? Do you buy a lot of shirts online that cost a couple thousand bucks? Do you buy a lot of shirts online from random individuals? "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke