OzoneJunkie

Hmm, yeah, I know what you're getting at. I think using sidesliding to start a carve is good, especially if you start out directly facing the person you're going to carve. Or, you can turn away from them slightly, start some forward motion, then turn back in to face them. Either one of these methods, you need to take care in keeping the orbit smooth and circular, not elliptical. And I think the sidesliding motion, at least to me, has less tendancy to become "wobbly". As far as doing higher speed carves, more angled (where you tend, although it's not necessary, to bring your arms in a bit more to your sides) is more forward motion than sidesliding motion. And during that forward motion, there is a turn involved to keep you facing your target. But that turn is subtle - I feel it's more subtle than doing a twist-based headdown turn. But it's there. There's something to be learned from carving around a large group, where your radius is much bigger than a single person. Also, a dual carve has different dynamics, where the radius can be even smaller than a single person centerpoint. I've found that practicing them all, you really get a feel for flying that faster, back-based carve. EDIT: yah know, what's funny about carving is that when you're not trying to do it, there's times you're trying to fight it, and when you want to do it, it sometimes feels like it's hard. Orbiting occurs so often when 2 people are approaching each other, but not directly on a face to face collision course, and they start to fly by each other, and they turn to face each other. Then, since they feel that a gap will occur, they continue to drive forward. And they continue to try to face their target, so they turn. Hey, free orbit!! (Sorry for the multi-edits): One thing to note, if you didn't turn to face your target, and kept your forward motion, eventually you'd break orbit, or become very elliptical. It's not the sidesliding that keeps you in that orbit, it's definately (to me) forward motion with turning.

Wow, thanks for all the

Sorry, can't answer the question, but, when I first read the subject, thought it said: why are there more guys jumping tan girls?

post a pic! er, ok. of me, or a paradox mirage? :P adam on the left, me in the middle, thomas (from the orbit punks) on the right 2nd pic - just me - lame still from my digital videocam

yeah, i'm pretty much a n00b, too. Best trick to date is only Paradox Mirage. But, hey, it's fun.

yo, JT - quick question - you freestyle footbag? Thought I read in another thread that you did. I meet a lot of kickers, but not a lot of peeps into freestyle....

Yeah! I want an occasional, random "you're the man now, dog!" piped into my ear http://www.yourethemannowdog.com/

Better to wait then to participate in the double-blind beta testing program...

and the ever-unpopular "user death imminent..."

2003 Dec 10 : The Magic Headdown Position Ok, am I allowed to air a repeat? This was posted in another thread a while ago, and I forgot to include it in my text file above. I think this tip is valuable enough that it bares repeating (with some minor edits). So, blah, blah, here we go... Q: What's the hardest thing about flying headdown? A: Holding the headdown position. ok. guess what. WRONG!! Headdown isn't about holding the magic position. There's no such thing. You angle your body to accomplish your needs at the time, be it forward, backward or side sliding movement, steep tracking, etc. I think this is part of the problem that makes headdown seem harder to learn than it actually is. Too many people trying to hit a position they think is correct, and wondering why they don't stay headdown. So, here's my suggestions/exercises (it's called the "pendulum" exercise): Leave the plane. Belly to earth. Slowly de-arch. Bring your arms in (all the way - you won't be using your arms yet). Straighten your legs, and open them, in a straddle position. You'll slowly go head low. Allow the relative wind to take you onto your back. Now arch. You'll slowly return to a headdown-ish position, and continue onto your belly. Repeat. You'll basically be penduluming back and forth between being on your back/headdown and on your belly/headdown. Important things to note/do: 1. Keep your head level, eyes straight ahead. This will allow you to observe where the horizon is relative to your body angle/attitude. Be very specific about this. 2. Keep your arms in the whole time. 3. Do this exercise perpendicular to jump run. At 6k, stop, go belly to earth, check your position relative to jump run, check below you, etc. Track or deploy if necessary (you flew up/down flightline, or someone is below you, blah blah...). 4. Repeat this jump 3 or 4 times. Then repeat it again, this time with your arms out. 5. Lastly, and importantly - let the relative wind do the work. Even if you go severely onto your back or your belly, apply the proper arch/de-arch, and let the wind take you back over. Even if it takes some time. In fact, that's the point of the exercise. Don't try to stop the pendulum movement short by trying to stay headdown. Instead, do go all the way past headdown each pass through the pendulum. Later, when you're better, you'll just use body torque to bring yourself quickly into position. But this exercise is about 3 things: A. Learning/feeling the relative wind and how it works in relation to headdown flying. B. Not concerning yourself with the mythical magic headdown position. C. (Similar to A) Learning how to move your body relative to the horizon to adjust to the desired angle of flight. Safety notes: You obviously are going to be moving around a lot when doing this exercise. I suggest taking all precautions to keep yourself out of other groups' airspace. Many people, when doing forward/backward type of exercises will track perpendicular to the line of flight, first, as soon as they exit the plane. I used to go out last, track a bit away from the line of flight, then start the exercise. I'd stop the exercise at around 6500, go flat, and look around (above/below/etc), and pull if necessary. This is a nice exercise to do when you're at the dz, and feel like spending a day doing solos. Do, say 8 or so total jumps doing this exercise. 4 with arms in 4 with arms out. I can't really express how important this exercise was to me when first learning to fly headdown, as well as learning forward and backward motion. Ultimately, this is something that you can apply to sidesliding, as well.

Heh, yep. Jump ticket: $17 Crap sneakers: $10 Swoop gone wrong: priceless ;)

You need to download the file. We'll get a link up shortly that will let you watch it in-browser. In the meantime, just do a rightclick, and save-as. It's a quicktime file - so you'll need apple's quicktime viewer (my bro, who made the video is one of those MAC people). Nope, nothing we're trying to sell.

heheh, I told my bro to remove that "ordering info" stuff from the site. We don't have a video for sale or anything like that. We were working on one a few years ago, when the site was first put up.

Hey, we finally got around to putting a little video we have up for public consumption. It's ~30mb, and requires quicktime. We have a smaller (10mb) version, which I may put up later, but for now, it's just the 30mb version. This video was put together a couple of years ago, but, well, guess it's still fun to check out. Enjoy. http://www.finepointmedia.com/o3j/o3j_trailer_lg.mov EDIT: do I even need to say this?? to download: right click, save as EDIT2: the page for the file, if needed, is: http://www.finepointmedia.com/o3j/

Uhm, no. Unless you're doing 50mph vertical in a wingsuit. Then, maybe. I've missed my audible maybe 4 or 5 times in 1600+ jumps. But, let's put it this way, if I have my helmet on in the plane at the first alarm altitude, it hurts my ear - that's how loud it is. It is FREAKING LOUD. Just check with my brother - he has the Pro-Dytter, not the Pro-Track. But others on the dz have the Track - and the skytronic wins in the loudness dept. EDIT: I can only assume that the FX is as loud as the previous models - if it's not, and I bought the FX, I'd be pissed

My brother has some model of the pro-track (either the latest, or the one before) and the skytronic is definately louder. I have not heard a louder audible. I can't speak for their newest model (the FX) - yet. EDIT: I will say this - I have heard similar issues about getting the skytronic serviced - that it's not easy, or fast. And I usually order batteries in some decent quantities, because getting them is not so easy - Radio Shack doesn't carry that model batt. So, even I have some hesitation about buying a new skytronic. But, 6 1/2 years of service for the first one I bought, I suppose isn't bad. Well, for what it's worth, I probably will buy the FX, unless I find another in it's price range that is as loud as it.

I have the first version, the skytronic, and the 2nd version (looks the same, more features) - the skytronic pro. I don't care about anything other than having 2 alarms, it working, and it being loud. The pro does have some logbook crap that I've never looked at. My older one (version 1) is dieing (dying? hate spelling that) after 6 or so years of service. I'm going to replace that one with a new audible - possibly the skytronic FX. Anyone, the skytronics are very loud - I always get looks on the plane when it goes off. That's it's best feature. I know the fx has a bunch of fancy-pants features, but, whatever. Loud is good :)

practicing your track??

yeah, totally sweet.

Same as an orbit. When you move around an object at your centerpoint.

Since everyone flies differently, I'm not gonna outright disagree with: I definately use pieces of my helicopter technique for doing single 360s. Namely, besides twisting, I use my arms and legs, but in a less exagerated form than my helicopter. It definately makes my 360s faster than just twisting, for me. EDIT: ok, my bad, you did say, for just a simple turn. Yep, gonna agree with that - for a simple turn (less than 360) I only twist. My apologies.

I was thinking a bit about this, last night, after I posted the tips on turning while headdown. After reading the other thread about this topic, I decided that I wanted to clarify and add just a few small things. In regards to doing arms-only or legs-only turning, it wasn't really apparent in my post - but, it is important to realize that the "twisting" part of headdown turning plays an important role in doing fast helicopters, being thru arms, legs, or both. Using legs, without twisting, will gain speed, but it's the twisting that really kick-starts the whole motion. Also, when doing twist only motion: I basically initiate this motion with twisting, as described, but, the feel of the move, as I do it at least, is to keep your arms in their normal position, but to pull an arm back, keeping the upper torso and arms the same, relative to each other. It's like, cutting through the air behind you, with your hand. Basically, that (bad) tendancy for people to rotate their non-docking hand/arm/shoulder out while doing single handed docks, is very similar to the feel and motion of starting that twist/turn. I don't know if this helps or confuses, but it IS how it feels to me, when doing this action.

Hey, I know you asked me to post some tips on this, so I did so, in the other thread (FREEFLY TIPS). Hope this helps :) http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=786811

2003 Dec 09: Turning While Headdown As with headup flying, turning while headdown is most easily accomplished by twisting at the waist - in effect, rotating the upper torso. Twisting is a bit of strong word for the motion, however, as it's not as drastic as the word implies. Basically, it's very similar to how you would turn to look at someone to your side, if you were sitting in a chair. You tend to rotate your head, and the upper torso, if necessary. So, simply keep your shoulders level with each other, and turn that upper body. There's other ways to rotate, however, and those other methods are more useful if you want to rotate faster. You can use your legs by themselves to turn. You can use your arms to assist you turn. Or, you can use a combination of all three techniques. With both the legs-only and arms-only technique, the concept is the same. Lets first look at the legs-only method. The goal is to present these body surfaces in such a way that the relative wind will cause the entire body to rotate. If you have ever taken a piece of paper, and folded it in such a way, as to create a Y, and let the paper fall, you see that it rotates as it falls. This is basically what you need to do with your legs. You start with your legs open (in the straddle position - which is just both legs open - neither in front or back). Now, if you put your right leg back, so that the lower part of your leg (and upper, if you are flexible enough) is catching air, this will begin to rotate you (to your left). Without doing anything with your left leg, you'd most likely get some forward motion along with your rotation, and begin an orbit. But, if you put your left leg forward (keep in mind that your legs are more open than closed, here) - you'll balance your position. If this seems similar to the tip I gave for flying a headdown single handed dock, you're right, it is similar. But, it's one of those things that, you have to do a few jumps and try it, and get the feel for the differences. With arms-only rotation, you're doing something with your arms that will cause the wind to rotate your body. Placing your left arm in front of you, as if holding a bowl of cereal in the palm of your hand, say, at waist level, and putting your right arm behind you, again, same position, and same level, you'll see that the air is hitting your forearms - and will rotate you (again, to your left). The thing to realize here, is that your forearms are not perpendicular with the relative wind. If they are, that means your arms are too high, relative to your torso. They need to be lower, around waist level. Your forearms need to be at an angle to the relative wind, not flat with the wind. This angle is what deflects the air, causing the rotation. Now, as far as practicing all of this, there's a few things to do. One common exercise is to trade off 360s or 720s, with a flying partner. I suggest doing these, initially, using the torso-turning technique. Practice the arms only and legs only techniques on some solos. But, with these, rotate more than once or twice. Try to continue the rotation, and build some speed. Adjust your legs in and out, (one side more or less, if necessary), to keep your body on axis. You want to rotate fast and smooth, but it must be on axis. If you are off axis, you'll wobble, or drift. Again, this becomes a "feel" sort of thing - finding that balancing point. Once you can rotate arms-only, and legs-only, you can try them both at the same time. Check out Eli Thomson or Charles Bryan - those cats rip helicopters at sick speeds. When you have practiced all of this, you'll be able to use the arms/legs techniques even for single 360s - and can make them very fast.

They used to hook us up with a jump ticket per tandem. Don't know about AFF, cuz I never brought one. I don't think they do anymore (for tandem), so I voted "no". To be honest, they should keep the jumptick-per-tandem policy - I have a lot less motivation to recommend my home DZ...