sabre210

excogitation and Yuri. Here's another one for you SHUT = THE (FUCK) + UP * (GO AND GET LAID) enough already! ian

Hey Lika We have close numbers (i'm 843) and identical jump numbers (232) and we both jump predominantly in our Capital cities. Just thought i'd point that out. i'd just like to say 2 things. Firstly, i had a brief look at your weblog and it seems to me, you're basing this 'boredom' thing on just the last few jumps at most. Before that, you have lots of emotional faces at the top of each jump page and your choice of music to sum up each jump seems pretty upbeat, as do most of the write ups. What i'm trying to say is you sound like you're in an emotional trough (slump) at the moment and whilst there, it's tempting to think you've felt this way for ever. You haven't. Reread your weblog, sounds to me like you've been having a lot of fun up until recently. Don't let your dark mood taint your recollections. Secondly, i think it's fair to say we all go through these moments. Moments where jumping seems to be more of a joyless compulsion than a fun pastime. When you find yourself here, then i would definitely take that as a sign to take some time away from BASE. Maybe a week, maybe a month, maybe a year....who knows, but BASE and BORING just don't add up, as proven in this mathematical equation BASE + DANGER + (LOTS OF) FUN = (NEVER) BORING BASE + BORING = (LOTS OF) DANGER + (NEVER) FUN Talking of boring, here comes Yuri_base to prove the above is mathematically incorrect. ian

I see the baton has officially been passed on. Congrats Goldsmith, you now proudly can take your place in the dz.com Hall of Fame. Step away Dmcoco....your time is up. ian

Hard to say Jason, but like Mikki I would expect the troll to take a bigger slice of the european pie. I'm basing that on absolutely nothing conclusive i must add. ian

Good luck and take care. Remember, it doesn't matter if this tower has been jumped 100 times or zero times before. As no one is around to tell you the "hows and whys and ifs" on this jump, it is effectively a virgin object and as far as you're concerned, you ARE opening it. Should it transpire later that people have jumped it before, it really doesn't matter. A second opinion from someone more experienced is never a bad thing however, and if you can get a local (even retired) jumper to take a quick look first then i'd say that would be prudent. One final point. A 450ft outside ladder climb (without fall protection) is a lot harder on the arms than a caged climb of double that height. Unless you are super-confident and have no fear of heights, you'll probably grip the rungs twice as tightly which means you'll tire a lot quicker and your arms will be like blocks of concrete by the time you reach the top. I fucking hate those climbs. ian

Tony Make sure your plan takes into account the right winds. I mention it, as you didn't. It's a freestander so I'm assuming it's positive at the base. You are planning on turning from the ladder and exiting, which means you have a limited range of ideal wind directions to jump it in and an exit point which probably isn't conducive to your strongest launch. Jumping a freestander in any kind of head wind could spell disaster as your forward speed in DBS on opening is going to be minimal. Add a head wind, (even a slight one) and you're sinking straight down, or even worse, backing up until you pop the brakes. As you sink straight down,the tower is getting wider and wider to meet you. Even a nil wind night isn't ideal IMO and a crosswind is increasing your likelihood of an off heading, so you really need a light tailwind. This wind will push you away from the object. For me then, the wind envelope on this kind of jump is actually quite narrow. The direction is limited more or less to about 120degree sector from the rear. Depending on how positive the tower is will determine your delay, but at most it sounds like a 1sec max jump, as your exiting from the ladder with no overhang at all. Knowing your getting closer to the tower the longer you freefall it could spook you into doing a throw and go. This could be a very bad move as your airspeed is low and consequently your chance of an off-heading is greater. This jump actually sounds like one where going stowed MIGHT be the best option. Less to fuck up on the exit point, but perhaps more likely to fuck up heading wise (depending on your body postion on stowed jumps) and more likely to take the wrong delay, and more likely to have a pc hesitation. This doesn't even take into account where the landing area is in relation to the ladder and any obstacles on the tower or between you and the landing area. In short, this sounds like it is quite a technical little jump. More so than most bridges and wire antennas. Don't be fooled into thinking it is anything but. It may have bags of altitude (not far off the perrine) but not all of that is useable. Not trying to scare you off the idea. If you're going to jumping objects which don't come with instruction booklets (off piste jumping), then it's best to go in there knowing exactly what to expect and what to avoid. Have a good plan but be 100% prepared to change that plan as things become more apprarent. Towers are strange beasts. Once you get 100ft up things start to look and feel very different. Landing areas which looked easy no longer do and the exit point you thought looked sketchy now looks like the best option. Having a plan on the ground and dogmatically sticking to it at the exit point, despite it now being completely unsuitable is a recipe for disaster. A question though. You say there are no platforms. Are you certain of this or do you mean there are no platforms like the crows nest type which overhang slightly on many antennas. It would be unusual for a freestander to have no platforms or access grates leading off from the ladder at all as this would limit the workmen/maintainance to just the one side of the mast.

Quoteif you launch with your hand held high...doesnt that hand 'descend' with the rest of your body..?[/reply ] Surprisingly no, well not as fast as the body. You see you're holding a pilot chute and this combined with your spread fingers creates drag which slows the hand down compared to the body. The key is, once you reach line stretch, let go of the pilot chute fast.

In very low jumps, i prefer to self PCA rather than s/l or d-bag. It's easy to config and is simplicity itself. You take your pilot chute and grasp it in your right hand. Raise your right hand as high up and as far behind you as possible. Launch head high and agressively. Wait till the PC is ripped out your hand by the deploying canopy then let go. Best to try this from higher altitudes first though, preferably over 500ft. If after 2 second you don't feel the canopy deploying, then it means you may have dropped the PCA too early and are now in freefall. Immediately release the PC to salvage the jump and do not, repeat, do not trust yourself to do this to yourself on lower jumps. Have fun ian

join the club. ian

Hey Gweeks, I have given this idea much thought myself and have infact used an overhand loop in the bridle closer to the pins/shrivel flap to effectively shorten the distance fallen before the canopy extraction begins on several occasions. What i haven't done is utilise the third piece of breakcord which controls the pilot chute and excess bridle beyond the loop. Contrary to what Nick said (and this isn't me having a go Nick so go easy on me), i think when you're getting into the sub 140ft static line arena, 8 feet would make a noticeable difference. It may not seem like a lot but if you were looking at say 120ft static line that is effectively a very large percentage of your total available altitude. 8 feet could be the difference between a fully pressurised flying canopy and a partially pressurised and plummeting one. It could mean the difference between flying over an obstacle or flying into it. The Carry with you set up is a good setup but it doesn't solve the issue of having to fall the full length of the bridle before anything begins to happen. Of course removing the full length bridle and pilot chute and replacing it with a specifically made shortened one simplifies the system even more, but then of course you don't have a pilot chute as backup, but then it could be argued you shouldn't be jumping so low if your tie off method isn't absolutely bombproof, but then you could argue that shit happens, but then you could argue how much the pc would save you anyway, but then.....etc etc etc ian ps. Will, thanks for the compliment but i'm really not.

Thank you Andres It seems there are several lessons that are reinforced by Marios accident. Firstly, unless it is absolutely necessary (i.e. tie off point is not accessible before climbing out to the exit point), prepare, check, double check and get a buddy to triple check all your knots, routing and security of the anchor point BEFORE you climb over the rail or climb out to the exit point. This is especially important as the majority of the time, the last person to exit is usually the static liner, as they are responsible for PCA'ing all previous jumpers. By tying off beforehand at least you can have a second pair of eyes to check out the config. This however is not always possible due to space restrictions at the exit point. Use a backup breakcord loop of longer length than the first. If the first breaks prematurely at least you have a second chance to get the canopy out. Protect your breakcord. Do not allow your breakcord to be compromised by the rough surfaces you tie off to, friction by excessive movement on the exit point, by standing on it with your hanwags as you climb over the rail (i've done this personally) or by any form of premature loading. Manage your anchor point, pilot chute and bridle at all costs by; stowing all excess bridle that is not required in facilitating your climb out, using a tailgate bungee; by continually ensuring a direct and uninterrupted routing between pins/shrivel flap and tie off point, by carefully considering how the wind is going to affect the pilot chute and bridle as you wait to exit; by carefully planning how you are going to climb into position without entangling your bridle or any ropes/slings you are using. Always check, and double check AFTER you have climbed over the rail or moved into position that the bridle and breakcord have not been compromised in any way and that you have not wrapped any part of yourself around the bridle during climbover. I know Mario did many of these checks and ultimately he fouled the system possibly as he/or just before he launched, but i think they are all points worth reiterating, especially the point about managing and controlling all the components in the system.

Hey Andre It is a terrible tragedy and I am saddened to hear of the circumstances. I have a few questions which hopefully you might be able to answer. 1. Why did Mario climb out first then turn to tie off? Was this necessary or could he have prepared the break cord and anchor point first and THEN move into position on the exit point. The reason i ask is that preparing your break cord, anchor point and checking the integrity is so much easier and safer to do when you're not in the stress situation of being directly on the edge. 2. Did mario tie off to an intermediate anchor point, like a sling or piece of rope OR did he tie the break cord directly onto the metalwork of the A? Was it a rounded railing or was it angled metalwork? 3. Did Mario use a main loop of breakcord and a backup loop? 4. Did he use a single strand or did he loop the breakcord. 5. As skeamer asked, did he s fold the excess bridle and control it with a bungee. 6. Was he waiting for a gust, or was he waiting for a lull? I'm sorry to bombard you with questions, but my intention is to see if there are other secondary or even contributary issues which could be highlighted in this terrible fatality. Static lining is a whole new skill set and can be stressful due to the lower altitudes at which you are often considering jumping from. ian

These comments i should add are nothing whatsoever to do with the tragic fatality mentioned in the initial post, of which we know little or nothing of the experience or circumstances. My sincere sympathies go out to the family of the deceased. ian

In addition here's how i'd approach that if i were a person looking to fast track it into BASE. Cost of doing 50 Crw jumps with instruction plus maybe kit hire and travel to and from the dropzone = $1000 at least. Penalty to not have these on FJC = $50 (or even $500). Result = Bargain to not do them. Same goes for jump numbers, riggers ratings, etc. Cost to acquire them far outweighs the penalty for not. Therefore not really an incentive. At the end of the day, the only real incentive for anyone to acquire these skills is the incentive to stay alive and unbroken. If that isn't enough incentive then i fear you're pissing in the wind with financial ones. ian

The guidelines are out there, the information is out there, the instruction is out there, the right equipment is out there, the collective wisdom is out there. If people choose to ignore all or any of the available assets, then there is little anyone can do and we should really think long and hard before we try and regulate to save people from themselves. It IS a slippery slope as NickDG has pointed out in the past (which is why i am a tad surprised at his suggestion to regulate more but i dare say i have misunderstood him) and to paraphrase Leia talking to Peter Cushing's Character in Star Wars "The more you tighten your grip, the more star systems will slip through your fingers." Skydiving is a great sport but it's in a regulatory downward spiral as far as i am concerned. That's a helter skelter that is very difficult to get off, so why get on it. Legal BASE seems to be the stumbling block, because from where i'm standing, no amount of fatalities or adverse press coverage is going to prevent me from finding new and devious ways of getting on, and then off, the endless supply of non legal jumpable objects we have at our disposal. And yes i said endless; in the respect that by the time i have crossed off all the objects on my hit list, there will be another bunch going up somewhere just ready to go. If Legal BASE is the price we have to pay to remain non-regulated, then i will not bat an eye for a single moment when it slips off into oblivion. Legal base is a luxury: non-regulation is a necessity! BASE without legal objects works just fine, BASE without freedom from regulation just does not. I vote we provide care for those who care. and let the others take their chances head on with gravity. BASE is self regulatory in it's absolute nature. Even if you show it the respect it deserves, it CAN kill you, so for those who show no respect, it's simply a matter of time and probability. Harsh. No. Impact is harsh. ian

Anyone can see that's been retouched Abbie. Here's the original before Nick doctored it edit to remove copyrighted material ~TA

See you can be funny when you try...i'll give you that one. And i hear there might be a job going as scriptwriter for Chuck Norris' new movie "A FORCE OF ONE II" if you want me to put a word in for you. ONE MAN.........ONE CANOPY.........ONE BRIDGE......... ian

I don't think it has ever been released sadly. ian

I asked you why you thought that. You came back with a smart arsed remark. I pointed out that it's a bit rich (macho, cliched, etc), you telling experienced jumpers what they should do and when they should quit, and that life isn't so black and white. You come back by pointing out to me that we're all in it for different reasons. Nick.(deep breath) I KNOW. That's what i'm telling you! You're the one with all the answers for everyone, not me. Dude, Lay off the crack pipe magot gave you, or the blow backs down his magnum barrel, and when that mist clears and you read the thread again, you might see that. You are 100% right. People get into BASE for different reasons and after considering many options and risks. If follows that they get out of BASE for different reasons and after considering many options and risks. Questioning your motives, re-evaluating what is important in life, re-prioritising the various aspects of your life, re-assessing longevity and mortality, that doesn't mean it's time to quit jumping like you seemed to think. This isn't a feud with you Nick. I genuinely don't agree with the train of thought (DOUBTS = TIME TO QUIT) and i think it promotes a mindset where people become afraid to talk about their doubts or their fears because it might be perceived as a weakness. I'm not mud slinging for the sake of it. I simply do not agree, but hey, that's personal too.

Like a lot of things that have come out of your mouth recently, it's just a cliched pile of pap designed and posted to make you sound hardcore. I mean, telling people like Ray (and the hundreds of other super experienced jumpers who often think about whether they should call it a day before it's too late) that to even consider quitting means they should, well.....it's time we took that big inflatable toy ego off you and made you sit on the naughty step. Stop watching those Steven Seagal movies dude. In the real world things are never THAT black and white.

Care to explain the thinking behind this pearl of wisdom.

We can only hope it is the same Tony. If it is, it's shame the injuries weren't serious. Might have knocked some sense into the muppet. ian

Just a quick note to say thanks to the locals in Barcelona and also thanks for all the phone assistance during my recent "work trip". Look forward to returning the favour. ian ps. I didn't get sacked but my boss isn't pleased.

Hi John For 2 second delays off pretty much everything i go hand held. I stow for above 2 or occasionally i will go stowed below 2 if the object or conditions favour it. My reasons are simple. I feel more comfortable doing this. ian

Jaap Only you know why you choose to run the BASE wiki. If your intentions are genuine and honourable then continue to do it. Bottom line is, if just one person reads it and takes heed of some important piece of knowledge (no matter how trivial it may seem, or how obvious it may appear) and in doing so it saves them making a fundamental error and perhaps paying with their life, then i guess you could consider it worthwhile. BASE is constantly evolving, simultaneously for the better and for the worse, and sometimes it does feel like the lunatics have taken over the asylum, but evolution is a wonderful process. Only the successful lines and successful methods survive in the longer term and that is perhaps what BASE wiki is essentially about : championing that which works, and discrediting that which doesn't.