Unstable

*Next point (sorry, I know it's terribly rude to reply to one's own post) How long can Aviocom go without issuing some sort of statement in regards to these recent rescinded approvals? I mean, I keep checking their website for a letter or something saying "We're working on it" or "BRB", "TTYL", "OMG WTF?" =========Shaun ==========

We had a jumper at our DZ do the exact same thing just a few days ago ~ paid $750 for a unit two days before this whole thing blew up. He called me and asked it I thought it was a good deal ~ $750 for a 2 year old AAD, SBs checked out, seemed ok... Long story short, he jumps a wings, and last I heard, Wings was not planning on taking any actions at this time, or at least when I talked to them yesterday. I dont' know man ~ I think the Cypres crowd can play the "I told you so" game, but the fact of the matter is it was a reasonable price for a Unit that proved to be terrible timing. If I had a crystal ball, I wouldn't have put a 2-pin argus in my rig either back in 2008. =========Shaun ==========

****I debated whether or not to post this in the gear forum, but my focus here is on practicality of training methods, not necessarily the gear in and of itself. Mods, if you feel you would rather move this, go ahead...Putting it here was debatable in the first place... ********** Here in the Midwest, the Bread and butter of Small to Mid DZ's is SL and IAD. It is no secret. A Cessna can turn more $$ per hour and cater to a larger clientele wtih 1 instructor and 3 students versus two instructors and 1 student. I've been a Sl instructor since 2004, and I've taken students up at about 4 DZs. One thing that always surprises me about SL is the First Free Fall ~ done after 3 consecutive PRCPs or PPCT's. Anyone that has instructed for a few years knows that, well, sometimes students surprise the hell out of you, especially the Top 98% or the bottom 2%. Have any DZ's ever considered putting SL/IAD students out on their First Freefalls and maybe their first 10-second delays with a rig equiped with a modern AAD on the reserve and an FXC on the main? Yes, FXC is not a modern 'set and forget' format, but for this application, it would do a fine job. I know the Air Force does this with ALL their first jump students. Advice or concerns? *edited for spelling. =========Shaun ==========

Okay, I'm going to let the business side of me take part here ~ financially, is there any way Argus is going to be able to sustain itself through this barrage long enough to even fix the problem if and when they come to identify it? So, if X Y and Z container manufacturers don't ban the Argus, then will jumpers be left with an unmaintainable AAD with no source for cutters, parts, service, et cetera? I guess my post here is a desire to steer the conversation to not the immediate flood of Argus bans, but where the next year or two will lead them.. =========Shaun ==========

+1. Well Said, Rigger Paul. It seems other AADs went through growing pains of sorts. Hell, there are videos on youtube of various AADs misfiring. Talking to some gear manufacturers today who confided in me that they will not be taking action at this time, cited specifically the 'difference' in reactions to different manufacturers. *Edited to change a few sentences that could be read as too aggressive in my wording, just trying to avoid confusion. =========Shaun ==========

See Beatnik, I think you are probably one of the most interesting people on this forum. Seriously. I'd love to meet you in person and buy you a drink. You and I have gone back and fouth and discussed countless things. I would love a PC jump with you. Again, however, your post has inspired no desire in my what-so-ever to jump, pack, inspect, repair, or pretty much come within 100 feet of a 'dactyl. =========Shaun ==========

Ok ok ok ok Let me throw a wrench in your plans here man ~ forgive me, I missed Freaks this year, but didn't like two people break backs/legs landing those things? I to have heard horror stories of unreliability. As a matter of fact, I know one in Wichita owned by a rigger friend of mine. A jumper bought it brand new, and after 3 jumps and 3 sequential malfunctions, threw it in the dumpster behind the DZ and drove off. It hasn't been jumped since. I understand the kick with the vintage crowd ~ hell, I love my Paracommander jumps, but I don't get the deal with the 'dactyls. =========Shaun ==========

THANKS!!!! =========Shaun ==========

The Astra had it's own growing pains when it first came out, just like any other AAD's....it came out near simultaneously with the Cypres, and Cypres took the center stage. I've always wondered in my mind what would have happened if the Astra would have come out 5 years later......Totally hypothetical, but it very well may have fared better. =========Shaun ==========

+1 =========Shaun ==========

That's a factor in the probability of a failed cutter. =========Shaun ==========

Maybe there is something I'm not grasping at this moment ~ Lets say that we have 2 argus ground fires, one of which is did not fully cut the loop. Now, I'm not counting Poland, because one could (arguably) assume that that was a rigging issue. Okay, then at this point, Aviocom has 22 documented Saves. Logically, doesn't that indicate that the odds are 11.5:1 that the Argus will make a significant safety improvement in your skydiving? =========Shaun ==========

I just got off the Phone with my friends at JumpShack ~ "At this Time, they are not planning on taking action. However, they will council with Mr. Goortz (spelling?) and make further determinations from that point" =========Shaun ==========

I'm not thrilled with this whole situation. As it stands, I have been waiting on 2 cutters since early last fall. Since there are two folks here jumping 2-pin argus units, I was able to lend them the 1-pin cutters that came with the units origonally. Not a huge set back, but I just feel like an idiot when these folks ask me where their replacement cutters are every week. =========Shaun ==========

I wish I could offer some better advice ~ Im in a position too of being bummed out ~ mostly because of all the changes going on (First kid on the way, Graduating grad school, looking for a job) For me, exercise is the thing that helps. A good sweat each day will at least keep the upsetness at bay long enough to accomplish wha I need to. =========Shaun ==========

Thank you Mike. I have at least two customers of mine who are going to get a phone call tonight which they are not going to like... = ( I'm very curious as to the desposition to this problem. So the cutters manufactured before September 2007 (IIRC) were recalled, Argus issued a statement saying that of the recalled cutters, none were defective, but we keep hearing stories of Argus units not cutting the loops... What gives? =========Shaun ==========

0:0:5 Pretty Crummy weekend actually ~ winds, Tstorms, hail, all that good stuff here in Kansas. I did 5 chest reserve repacks, which I always enjoy. So I guess that counts as my 'humps' =========Shaun ==========

I would like to second Jerry B's rebuttle of this argument. I find that a lot of folks who comment like this tend to only refer to Dolphin's they have seen (that is, Mid-to-late-90's) models..) The newer dolphins have full tuck tabs across the reserve flap, riser covers, full bridle protection... et cetera. I would place them in the same "freefly friendly' tier as any Mirage or Voodoo. Mike Furry even released a letter allowing the rigger to place the #3 bottom flat above or below the reserve PC, packing it just like the Javelin. =========Shaun ==========

When I took the couch course, the big 'trick' was our evaluator who would switch packing data cards on the rigs and think it was funny. Also dumb stuff like the evaluator sneaking off the seatbelt or something along those lines. =========Shaun ==========

I've always been fascinated by skydiving gear, rigging, and packing, even long before I was a jumper. I love rigging. =========Shaun ==========

Yeah, they sell CS Osborne dies ~ looks like most of the sizes are in the $32 range. Can't beat that! =========Shaun ==========

There are a few things I just don't understand ~ I was bidding on a 1963 Military Chest container on ebay that was modified for sport jumping, and I bid $150 thinking it would be a good training tool for if I supervise any riggers on earning a chest rating. In the last 3 minutes, two surplus dealers got in a bidding war and the winner ended up spending $320 for the thing. What surplus dealer in the right mind would BUY an old junker chest for $320? I mean, how do they stay in business? I thought $150 was pretty generous..... $320?!?! A few days ago I saw a surplus store in KC has a completely ratted out harness for $200. Harness only. Nothing else ~ no parachutes. Most the hardware was already stripped off. I have come to the conclusion that Surplus dealers are usually high on crack cocaine. =========Shaun ==========

Hey Phree ~ I asked much of the same question not long ago ~ check this out... SAILRITE They have the best prices on Grommet dies hands down. Also, they sent me a rebuilt kit for my 20u with an adapter for a new presser foot and upgraded spings ~ $100. They are a skydivers best friend. =========Shaun ==========

I'm still very curious about this rig ~ SEREJUmper sent me Cazar's home phone number, I'm going to give him a buzz and see if I can learn some of the history. I will report. =========Shaun ==========

That really is such a shame. You're right ~ the only places I ever find "treasurers" are old Army Surplus stores that have hardly and customers and throughput. There is a rack of BA-22's on a warehouse shelf in Wichita, complete with Mid 80's C-9s, et cetera, but of course they want an arm and a leg. Again, the Commemorative Airborne guys have some real methods ~ I guess they have enough Backdoors to keep their stocks up and real. =========Shaun ==========