freeflybella

The mormons have you ALL beat! Utah Baby Namer click on "Best of" (Cream of the crop) Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

...whyar... Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

Welcome Back Kotter is by far the best theme song. Ever. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

In my opinion they should get off the flight or be prepared to compensate the people who are subjected to their kid's behavior. Walt I hear a bunch of whiny bratty adults who maybe should stay home until they GROW UP and understand that there are all kinds of people (yes, that includes kids) in the world. It's so fucking easy to point the finger at other parents. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

And anyone with a toddler knows that being stuck in airport for 11 hours with said toddler is just mindnumbingly stressful. I'd want to collapse on my seat and let my baby wave bye bye to planes all he wanted, too. At least he wasn't trying to run up and down the aisles as mine would've done! Anyway - getting kicked off the plane? After waiting 11 hours to get on it? Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

OMFG - I hate that one. I'm an old school art director (read: no internet) and was interviewing for a freelance gig at a digital agency that wanted classically trained print ADs. At the end of the interview, the dude said he would in touch shortly and asked me about my bandwidth... (Since I was at a digital agency, I thought it was weirdly relevant question) "uh...I have comcast high-speed internet..." blink. blink. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

Was that Johnny 9-lives on her back? Oh, the irony... (A serious congrats to Mike. I have a brother who just kicked a bad habit - it's a huge accomplishment) Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

That would be kind of like people claiming that they lost everything in Hurricane Katrina when they've never set foot in Louisiana. Isn't it weird? Hurricane Katrina is the new Hitler and holocaust. My dad (a retired Army colonel) can't have a discussion with his "pinko, commie, liberal" daughter without bringing up the looters in New Orleans ("They weren't looting chainsaws and hammers!"). Edited: My old favorite: "'Not wearing a shirt' is the new 'wearing a shirt'". My new fave: "'Katrina' is the new 'Hitler'" Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

Well, I for one, will not be having an abortion...it's my choice. Besides, MY "rights" trump YOUR "rights". ?? I hope it was clear that I meant in the best case scenario, a woman and the man she became pregnant with/from made the decision together. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

I think that you missed my point. The way that today's society and thinking is progressing, we will be doing abortions on women who's circumstances have led them down a rough road, and they won't be able to show that they can properly provide for the child. Also, are you saying that personal adversity doesn't produce a much stonger personality that someone who has been coddled every second of their life? I believe that we are talking about babies who are fortunate enough to forego death before they ever have a chance to prove themselves in society, but the mothers have decided to give up for whatever reason. Let's say out of the 40 million that have been destroyed over the last 45 yrs. 10 million turned out to be the dregs of the earth. Would you destroy the 30 million just to be sure that you eliminated the 10 million? We don't DO abortions on anyone - we allow women/men to choose whether or not to have one. And as far as adversity is concerned - geez, I don't even know where to begin to try and wrestle that weird gorilla... 1. People generally overcome adversity when they have a good foundation of morals, ethics and a support system. Our government "tries real hard" to provide that in the adoption and foster care system (with the limited resources and funds available) to abandoned and unwanted children - but they're not always successful. And for those that don't end up in "the system", the odds are less favorable for abused/neglected children at home. 2. I'm not sure what you mean by "strong" - I'll guess you mean resilient? Sociopaths are "resilient". Narcissists are "resilient". Recidivist criminals seem to be pretty "resilient". Anyway, it's just nutso to talk about millions of kids aging out of foster care, living on the street, being abused or neglected as getting the adversity they need to be strong. Finally, the argument about all the "lost" people. We do not take care of our people. You can't say that things need to change and construct a solution based on unreality. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

Are you saying that all of the ducks need to be in a row for the next 20 yr. if you plan on having a child? We now have 30yr. olds living at home with mom still making their beds. A little adversity can be a good thing. Adversity?? Are you fucking kidding me? The 30 year olds living at home with moms making their beds have moms. They have families. Sure some might need something here are there but they have a foundation. Absorbed?? Sure we absorb the unwanted. In homeless shelters and prisons. If I remember correctly, you're a christian with family values. It appears that you have a very limited view on the VALUE of a family. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

Tunnel vision for sure. Abortion is outlawed = crime, homelessness rates go up = society at large suffers/pays. Show me a country that cares for ALL it's unwanted, derelict citizens and I'll consider the life of a fetus over the choice of the parents. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

I agree. Dateline is still a TV show. They do still have to tell a story for ratings. The unsnapping of the overalls detail might have been a red herring in the overall story. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

That is a pretty good example of how gender and sexuality differ. Had you been transgendered, it wouldn't be a 'given' that you had girlfriends. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

I agree. Pretty amazing stuff. I say wow to the parents for being able to recognize and respond with love. They did highlight one family who could not understand at first. They insisted that the boy be a boy (he had a fraternal twin sister and they assumed it was sibling rivalry/jealousy). It wasn't until s/he was almost 12 that the family finally came around. That kid was pretty messed up. The other family, who researched and accepted what was happening earlier on - had a pretty happy little girl (born a son). Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

If a person's gender is hard wired - then it stands to reason that all transgendered aduts were transgendered children and transgendered infants. The question then becomes, at what age does any child identify with one gender or the other. Apparently the answer includes children under 6 years of age. And quite possibly varies - as in such issues as speech development, memory, etc. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

Again, it's not a sexuality issue. It's a gender identity issue. There is more to gender than sexuality and genitalia. I think a point in the story on Dateline is just the opposite. That gender is hard wired and not a choice. Do a search on the case of a little boy whose penis was snipped off during circumcision. His family's doctor convinced them to raise him as a girl. It's just not that simple. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

Probably not, but at 6 years old I doubt its much of an issue at all to the kid. Seems like the parents might have some issues if they are layin that kind of crap on a 6 year old or drawing absurd conclusions from the fact that a 2 year old unsnapped his onesie. I always thought that being transgender was in the same ballpark as being homosexual, that is was something you started realizing about yourself once you went thru puberty and started realizing your feelings about your own sexuality. Gender identity is different from sexuality. Don't you think it's possible that if a kid could be born without an arm, or with 2 uteruses or with his intestines on the outside that another kid could get female brain markers and male body markers? Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

cheers. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

QuoteI havent read Diet for a New America , I checked it out and it didnt seem like an objective assesment fo the evidence. Even though it appeared to be arguing a point I agree with, I would like someone more objective looking over this kind of issue. I dont need someone to tell me about the ethics of the issue, but the science of health benefits needs to be investigated objectivley and I prefer sources that have less of rant style. [\reply] Interesting. Personally, I'm not looking for proof that a compassionate lifestyle works best for me or that someone who follows a raw diet feels healthier. Try it for yourself - find what works for you. Also, to say that John Robbins style is "ranting" is something I've never heard before. Maybe you should go ahead and read it? Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

I'm vegan for ethical reasons as well. And don't read physics pubs. Although I'll check out that link from home. Have you read the China Study? or Diet for a New America (originally published in the late 70s - has much info on how animal-based diets affect the environment)? Nope - haven't read "studies of benefits" of raw food. A small personal data set is all I have for now. But I don't know of a single person who has gone raw (people who do this generally are highly aware of nutrition and what it takes to remain healthy) and felt worse for it. Personally, I don't "prepare food" - much. I live very close to a vegan hot food bar and bakery and usually buy dinner there. Going raw would mean actual meal planning and prep. EEK!

You're right. There are alot of misconceptions out there. And although I don't try to force my opinion or beliefs on others - I really do try to explain and educate when the time is right. Raw, huh? Haven't been able to go there yet. I have alot of admiration for that diet. Especially since I've seen the health benefits. I'd bet your body just glows!

I wasn't saying it was an open & shut case. Something other than "just two cruddy people neglected their kid" doesn't sit right with me about this case. There seems to be something missing. Almost all of the top 30 articles I found on the web said the same exact thing as the original article posted here. So there isn't much for us to go by to make a decision about what has really gone on here. Public defenders often neglect getting a psych workup for their clients even when the client is obviously impaired. I have countless patients that belong in a forensic hospital, not a prison. I've read their C-files, which often contain court transcripts. Many of my patients have been given a tremendous disservice by their attorneys. This may or may not be the case here. All I'm saying is, there is more to this picture. Most capable adults would know not to solely feed an infant soymilk and applejuice. I think this couple is grossly mentally impaired in some way, regardless of whether or not they are vegans. Just to be clear - we agree. It kind of sounds like you're arguing a point that you think is different from mine.

[B]ABSOLUTELY[/B] agree. I was never arguing that these two were normal, well-adjusted people living an uninformed vegan lifestyle. I was arguing just the opposite - that to say they were vegans, and to condemn the vegan lifestyle based on these two is ridiculous and that there was obviously something amiss - homicidal, negligent, mentally ill, whatever. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

I guess this is why it took the jury 7 hours to deliberate. Doesn't sound open and shut to me and I've only read a few news accounts. Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi