davelepka

Any reason not to go with a top hinge arrangement on the standard metal door? Just like the majority of 182 jump planes? I've got at least 1000 jumps split between a pair of 185s, both with a top-hinged metal door. Never had any problems, and never noticed much difference any time I jumped a 182. Probably the simplest, easist and most secure way to go.

Not the laterals, but possibly the location of the lower attachment point. It appears to be too far up her torso, above the pelvis, allowing the bend in the stomach to cause a seperation between you two. If you could adjust the harness so the lower attachment point is lower, it will pull her pelvis up toward yours when you tighten the lowers and limit the washing around to only her legs. I see this problem all the time, and it does look very similar to loose laterals.

I never said that the canopy does not respond quickly to control input, in fact I said that the aerodynamic reposnse to control input was the primary response to an input. It's the first thing that happens, and it happens right away. What I said was the the weight shift of the pilot, the secondary response, effects a bigger degree of change in both amplitude and time. The toggles get the party started, but your fat ass swinging around under the canopy is what really gives the input some 'teeth'. All of that aside, there are some fundamental problems with calling ground handling 'flying'. In some attitudes, yes the canopy is flying like a proper wing, such as when the canopy is facing directly in to the wind and is roughly directly overhead the pilot. In that case, you could make some direct comparisons to a canopy in flight aloft, but if you vary too far off of that orientation, the principals of 'flight' effecting the canopy are not the same as a canopy aloft. If you think of the old standard that, 'The canopy doesn't know if you're upwind or downwind, it flies the same in any direction', you know that the reasoning is that the air moving across the canopy is always coming from the same direction, that being the direction of travel. This is why it's called the 'relative wind', becuase it's direction is relative to your direction of travel. In ground handling, there is no 'relative wind', there is just 'wind'. If you want to face your canopy into the 'wind' and keep it primarily level, it would be a similar circumstance to a canopy aloft. Anytime you deviate off of that attitude, you are exposing your canopy to a wind compnent which it could never experience aloft, and therefore the principals governing it's 'flight' will differ. For example, say I am attempting to kite my canopy in light winds, and while I cannot generate enough lift to get it up over my head, I can manage to inflate it and get it to wash around behind me three feet off the ground. The direction of the wind relative to the canopy is roughly perpendicular to the direction of 'flight' of the canopy. The nose is pointed straight up, but the wind is hitting the bottom skin square-on. This configuration would never be possible with a canopy aloft, so you cannot compare the two situations apples to apples. While this example is an extreme version of attitudes you cannot attain while aloft, it doesn't take much deviation from striaght-over-your-head and into-the-wind while ground handling to go beyond what would be possible aloft.

The real answer to this is, "Whatever the DZ you want to jump at thinks is the safe way to proceed considering your total number of jumps, your performance on those jumps, time of the layoff, and their personal experience with you in the past". You can count on the SIM to give you the bare minimum that a DZ is required to do, what they actually want to do beyond that is up to the discretion of each individual DZ. I have seen this question come up several times recently, and I'm always surprised at how concerned some jumpers are with this area. How about trusting in the staff ay your chosen DZ to make the safe, prudent call, and just leaving it up to them to deciede what your best course of action would be? It seems they were smart enough to instruct you thus far, so have some confidence in their ability to finish the job.

I don't think that's the thing to figure out, What they need to figure out is that the plane is not appropriate for RW bigger than a 4 way if you intend to chunk it out the door. If you're willing to have your base exit with divers, who remain forward in the cabin until the base is leaving, then you should have no problems. I jumped out of a Twin Bonanza for years that had room for two jumpers on the package shelf aft of the door. However, weight and balance prevented the jumpers from sitting aft of the door for take-off. The simple solution was for those two jumpers to sit in the lap (more or less) of the first row of jujmpers forward of the door for the take off and initial climb. At 800 to 1000ft, the jumpers would move rearward to the package shelf and take their seats. Another, more modern, story, Jumping Spaceland's roving Skyvan two weeks ago. The load organizer puts together a 9-way magic carpet formation, and being an ace freeflyer agrees to fly the outside video slot. The problem is the rule in that Van is 9 jumpers max behind the red line. The simple solution was for the LO/video guy to remain forward in the cabin, and rush the door once once the formation had left. Sure he gave up the killer exit shot, and had to play a serisou game of catch-up once he got off the ramp, but 9 jumpers is the rule, and it's not optional. It's a simple matter of jumpers realizing the very real effect that have on an aircraft's weight and balance, and acting accordingly.

One of the problems with the PAC is the low tail, and not just becasue of the risk of a tail strike, but also because the low tail can have it's airflow blanketed by the floaters (as already mentioned). One solution is for the floaters to stay tight to the fuselage. The other problem, and this one contributes to the first problem is the jumper to door size ratio. With a door simialr in size to an Otter/Caravan, but holding fewer jumpers than an Otter/Caravan, you simply cannot have as many floaters or divers in the door as those other planes. With the doro set up in an PAC, it's possible to get most of the load either floating or in the rear of the aircraft, and when you add in the disturbed airflow to the left elevator, that's just too much weight to keep the nose down. If you look at other planes with similar jumper to door ratios. you're left with the Skyvan and Casa. Both of those planes have the space to allow for a majority of the load to either be on or right next to the ramp, but as we have seen many times, the big tailgates will stall when this happens. This is why you see the big red lines in the cabins that state "No more than X jumpers beyond this line". Those operators take the weight and balance serisouly, and realize that their airplanes are different that some other planes where size of the door or cabin is what creates the limitation of jumpers in the door or door area. I would go so far as to suggest that if you could keep the weight and balance under control, you could have floaters in any position outside a PAC, and the elevator would retain enough control authority to keep the nose down. Any aircraft, even without disturbed airflow over the elevator will stall if there is too much of an aft CG condition. Keep the weight (meaniing the jumpers) under control, and the airplane will remain upright. Another huge part of this is communication with the pilot. Jumprun speed is a comprimise of saftey and comfort. Safety in that you want to maintain a fair margin above the stall speed, and comfort in that the floaters shouldn't have to fight to hang on, and the divers shouldn't get blasted as they celar the door. If the pilot is aware that a larger group is going to be leavnig the plane, they can err on the side of safety and add a knots to the jumprun speed. By opening up the margin above stall speed, it gives the pilot more time between recognizing that the airspeed is beggining to fall off, and the actual stall. During this time he can try to lower the nose via the elevator, or add power to increase airspeed (and thus control effectiveness). If the pilot is not aware of a large group, then that extra margin does not exist, and eh may recognize the condition too late to do anything about it. Once the nose has begun to rise, it's adds drag and reduces airpeed and control effectivness, and as good as utrbine engines are, they do nto produce the 'instant' power needed in these types of situations. They take time to spool up after the throttle is advanced before they actaully produce thrust, time the pilot may not have. It's really a simple proposition. If you want to be a big boy (or girl) and do big ways out of a PAC, you need to take responsibility for your actions. Inform the pilot of your plans, so he can take whatever precautions he sees fit. Learn to dive so you don't feel pressure to crowd the door for a quick exit, and you can stay forward in the cabin until the base has left (or is at least on 'set' in the count). Let's face it, there are PACs flying jumpers all day, every day somewhere in the world, and they are not falling out of the sky. It's in these very specific instances that the stalls are occuring and two or three should be more then enough for people to catch on to the protocol. I hate to say it, but I think part of this is an offshoot of the 'modern' jumper. They don't pack, they don't hang out at the bonfire, dont' know shit about much of anything. They know how to show up with their fancy jumpsuits and $9000 rigs, and make a few jumps, but they have no concpet about weight and balance, airflow over elevators or the mechanics of a jumprun. Yet they still feel like they should be on the big ways with all the cool kids, even though they can't organize themselves out of a cardboard box.

Hey, fuck you asshole. That's 100% uncalled for. I suggest you back that up with some facts and reasoning, or apoligize to the guy.

In general, the control stroke for rear risers is quite short compared to toggles. If you used rear risers for falt turns, keeping mind you use a flat turn when you are low and needing to change direction with a min. altitude loss, if you were to stall one side of the parachute doing a flat rear riser turn, that would make a bad situation even worse. Stick with the toggles, and their long, forgiving control stroke when manuvering close to the ground. In terms of rear riser loops, the main reason they don't exist is becasue toggles will give you a lower descent rate than rear risers, and therefore are the better option for getting back from a long upwind spot. When you have the wind at your back, you use the min descent rate to increase your exposure to the that wind and get the most distance from your given altitude. Rear risers can lower your descent rate, and can do it inducing less drag allowing for a higher forward arispeed, but they cannot match the descent rate of deep brakes. You can use rear risers to get back from a long downwind spot, where keeping drag to a min and airspeed high is of value, but those spots are generally not that long, and if they are, you're just fucked anyway and are going to land off. As an aside, I jump with a guy who installed rear riser loops on his rig. He's an older guy and for the sake of ease-of-operation, he wanted to loops in place in case he wanted to hang on his rears for any length of time. As already mentioned, when coasting back from a long spot in deep brakes, see if you can't grab onto the lateral, hip ring, or the upsidedown 'V' made at by the legstraps at the hip. What this will do is transfer the work to your hands, and let you rest your arms and shoulders. The toggles are hooked over your hands, and your hands are doing all the work hanging onto whatever you can grab. To go one step further, if you are jumping a student canopy, even in full lfight your descent rate will be quite low. Let it fly, and learn to manage the traffic. There shouldn't be that many canopies aloft by the time you reach the pattern, and those that are will be other students (very slow moving) or instructors and tandems (easy to work with). The point is that paying attention to traffic and sequencing yourself into the pattern are key skills to learn on the slower student canopy. As you move toward more of a 'sport' canopy, your descent rate and airspeed will both increase, and your time to sequence yourself will decrease. Having the experience of doing it on a slower canopy will help to prepare you for future jumps when you might not have the luxury of 'stopping' to wait for everyone else. Get in there and get it done (which is way different then 'git er done', which is retarded).

Just a quick word on saddlebags and skydiving gear, keep in mind that saddlebags are right next to the chain/belt drive, the rear wheel and the exhaust pipe. I'm sure everyone knows that heat (like from an exhaust pipe) isn't good for gear, and if your saddle bag gets pushed in to the chain/belt/wheel, like in a minor fall or if they come unstrapped, that's not going to help your gear either. skyjumpenfool, I understand (I think) that you are not putting a rig in a saddlbag, but using the tops of the bags and the passenger seat as a 'table' to hold your gear bag. I just replied to your post because it was at the bottom. To add a few thoughts about wearing a rig, even if your canopies saty in the rig, the contunued exposure to UV, road grime, and whatever the other cars/trucks throw at you form the road is not going to be good for your rig. This is a life saving device, handle it accordlingly.

Pop or no, and TSO issues aside, you really mean to tell me you would order a $3000 Vector III in all white and then airbrush it? That takes commitment for sure. You could never sell it, the first fall you take on landing would screw the whole thing up, and even a different rigger packing the reserve would keep shit from lining up just right. How about a tasteful, factory colored rig, and maybe an airbrushed jumpsuit? Fancy patterns and stripes are some of the most expensuive options on a jumpsuit, so ordering a plain all-white suit eould actually save you money, and then you could airbrush the shit out of it. Those guys at the mall prove it can be done, and even if you fall down and trash it, you could just get a new one for less than 1/10 the price of a container. How about just buying some regular stuff and just skydiving?

Go to both. Check their websites to see if either have any events going on that weekend, and if you're interested in that event. For example, if Perris is doing "Kick the visting jumper in the nuts day" on friday, maybe hit Elsinore that day, and then Perris on Saturday. But really, they're only 15 or 20 min. apart, so if you have time each day, try both. Once I had been to both and waivered in and all that jazz, it wasn't uncommon to spend the day at Perris, and then get a call from some Elsinore peeps for a sunset bigway at that DZ, or vice versa. Plan on less jumping and more getting 'settled in' for the first trip. Sign the waivers, get your gear checked in, get the once over of the DZ and landing areas, maybe do a solo for your fist jump to get the lay of the land, etc. Next trip, you can hit the ground running and make ten jumps a day.

It true. They have tiered licensing systems where you start off with considerable restrictions as to what, where, and when you can drive. There is continuing education linked to obtaining any of the advanced licenses. Beyond that, you can be pulled over and ticketed for driving in the passing lane without passing (and they regularly enforce this). You can be ticketed if you are found exceeding the speed rating of your tires. If everyone was well-trained, took it seriously, and was operating equipment within it design intentions, you could have an autobahn anywhere. In the land of the free, and the home of the brave (and stupid), it would never work.

"Hit the Turbo Boost Kitt!" "Michael, were too close to the bridge for Turbo Boost." "Fuck you Kitt, with my stunning good looks and tight jeans nothing can hurt us. I'm taking over and manually activating the Turbo Boost!"

The 'busy' times at Z Hills are during the winter months, when most if the US is not jumping. Those are experienced jumpers on vacation, and have no effect on the student operations. In fact, more experienced jumpers mean that the planes will fly more loads during a given day, so that's a bonus for you. The DZ is in charge of putting jumpers on one load or another and typically the first thing they do is put their tandems and students on a load, and them fill in the rest with fun jumpers. Nobody knows how many students there will be at any DZ at any given time, there's no way to predict that. Being 'busy' will be a plus for you becuase more jumpers equals more loads, and more people to hang out with at the bar after jumping. Whenever you go, you will be your instructors #1 priority, and you will be well taken care of. Call today and reserve a trailer on the DZ for the time you plan to be there.

You have to admit that in comparison to AADs that came before it, the Cypres out performs them by leaps and bounds. As such, it's not unreasonable to expect higher maintenence costs or a shorter life expectency. I jump with an old timer who likes to tell the story of breaking lines on a Strato-Could or something during the muddle of a jump day, and he just threw an overhand knot in the line and kept jumping. Now I jump a smaller Velocity, and if I break a line, it needs to be replaced no questions asked. It would be nice to be able to keep jumping until the end of the day, but I trade off the higher performance for the more strict maintenence requirements. In terms of the life limits, until the other AADs have been in the field for a period of more than 12 years, the jury is still out on that one. Without a significant number of units operating problems free for 15+ years in the field, we cannot say for sure if the 12 year life limit on the Cypres is a jack or not. When you take the fixed cost of ownership of the Cypres and break it down over 12 years, the yearly cost seems reasonable in my eyes. At this point the annual cost is less than the cost of a full day of jummping. The Cypres2 without the bi-annual battery change is a big step forward, it takes the upkeep down to two trips to SSK over the entire life, again, that seems very reasonable given the nature of the device.

Indeed. I bought a new Cypres 14 years ago and jumped it throughout it's entire life cycle to the tune of 4000+ jumps over the 12 years. No problems, no trouble and it's hard for me to argue with that.

I was google mapping something not too far from my home DZ, so naturally I scooted in that direction, and then zoomed in as much as possible. I was albe to see my car in the parking lot, the Caravan sitting on the pad, jumpers walking in from the landing area, and one of the tandem canopies in-flight just above the hanger and it's shadow in the parking lot. Kind of cool and kind of spooky at the same time. While I was minding my own business jumping one day, goolge was taking sat. photos of my every move....

My standard reccomendation to any jumper is that if you have the time, the money, and the weather, go to the DZ and jump. There's no sense in waiting until a later time, when you might find yourself without the time, money, or weather. Deland is a class operation, and you'll be learning from some of the top guys in the business.

Here's where you miss the point - the level of complexity and the amount of fine control you have over a helicopter requires an in-depth knowledge of the aerodynamics, the control systems and the how the two work together. A modern z-po student canopy loaded at .75 to 1 is a bit simpler. Left turn, right turn and flare. That's about all a student needs to know in realtion to the operation of the canopy. You can have a successful canopy flight including a stand up landing using nothing but those three inputs. Of far more importance to the student is knowing where to fly the canopy, and how to get it there. Their time is far better spent learning the effects of the wind with realtion to ground track, flying a landing pattern, and how to select a landing area (the DZ is the obvious choice, but when that is not an option, knowing about power lines next to roads/buildings and that corn can be 8 feet high can make the difference between a safe landing and not). At some level you have the correct idea, that new jumpers are being shorted in terms of what they learn in the way of canopy control, and some of that includes the aerodynamics. Something should be done, but certainly not until they have a grasp of making a basic skydive and are ready to take on the additional information. This is why students jump student canopies, because their size and design makes their operation simple and forgiving. In a perfect world, there would be continuing education connected to earning advanced liceneses and being allowed to jump smaller or higher performance canopies (actually there is a world like that, it's called Switzerland). In the US, however, the powers that be have chosen to take a pass on that sort of idea, and left it all up to guys like Brian Germain, and their optional, for-profit courses.

I'm sure that the 210 you had in mind would have been a modern z-po canopy, but even if you were shopping for an F-111 210, there is a HUGE difference between a 210 and a 265. What you need to do is sit down with one of your instructors, and discuss the canopies you have jumped to date, and your current level of skill under canopy. From that you can hone in on a range of sizes +/- 20sq ft, such as a 200 to a 220, or a 190 to a 210, and go from there. You will want to look for a reserve about the same size as your main, and within the range you and your instructor come up with, Then you will need to locate a container that will accomodate the main and reserve of your choosing. If you look for a container that was made for the exact size canopy you're looking for, you can count on being able to downsize at least once in the future while keeping the same contianer and resvere. If you have unique needs in regard to harness sizing, or are just having a hard time locating the exact size, you can generally use a container made for canopies one size bigger or smaller than the one you intend to jump. A larger container will actually make it easier to pack, but then you will have less flexibility when moving down in canopy size (too small of a canopy in a container will be a loose fit and can comprimise safety). A smaller container will be more difficult to pack, but you may be able to use it through two canopy downsizes. If you were looking for a 210, an F-111 265 is the last thing you would want, and buynig a container that could hold it would aslo be a huge waste of money. You mentioned having used gear inspected by a rigger you trust, what you need to do is apporach that same rigger and ask for assistance in locating good used equipment. Some canopies and some rigs are known as 'less than' and if you can avoid getting stuck with them, you'll be better off in the long run. Proper gear selection is a big deal. It can and does have an effect on your safety, and the enjoyment of your jumps. Enlist the help of a professional (that rigger) for this first rig. By the time you are ready to change part of it, or buy another one, you should be more familiar with you own needs and the equipment in general.

It's an important distinction to make, especially when low to the ground. Your can flap your arms up and down all you want (with your toggles in your hands), but unless you allow the secondary response of the weight shift to occur, the change to the canopy will be minimal. Understanding this, and being mindful of your position under the wing can go a long way toward keeping you of the corner. This is why the FJC course teaches no turns greater than 90 degrees below (let's say) 400 ft, and no turns greater than 45 degrees below (let's say) 200 ft. Keeping the degree of the turn limited the lower you get reduces the divergance of the pilot from under the center of the wing, and in turn the lag time between input and response from the canopy. You don't explain it to the students that way, but that's the idea behind that rule.

Being a newbie, if she has befriended this experienced jumper at the DZ, and become used to jumping with him or he has helped her progress in some way, it makes perfect sense that she would want him to be around on a trip to a new DZ. Especailly if she has the money to pay for his travel and jumps, to her the only obstacle is him making the time to go along. If you really think about it, the fact that another friend is going to be present, and that they are not planning an overnight both point toward an innocent invitation on the lady's part. HOWEVER, if it suddenly becomes 'late' and the girls don't feel like flying home that night, it might be the furthest thing from innocent when the three of them get the hotel, but that's just wishful thinking on my part.

You have hit the nail on the head. What the other posters left out was the result of the aerodynamic changes to the wing, which is exactly what you pointed out, that being the suspended weight shifting around under the wing. As long as line tension remians, any weight shift under the wing will casue a change in attitude to the wing. When you apply an input to the wing, asymetrical drag will casue the wing to veer off in one direction or another, but the bigger cause of change in the weight of the jumper trying to continue in a stright line. Apply a left input, and the canopy will veer to the left, and you will try to continue in a straight line ending up off to the right side of the canopy. Now you are in a banked turn. Your movement below the canopy is the main source of control over the canopy. This is why you can get stuck 'in the corner' when making a low turn. When you make a turn, you end up behind and to one side of the canopy. This is why a turn produces a turn and dive, you are effecting the roll and pitch at the same time. If you find yourself low, and try to stab out of the dive, you can lower your toggles very quickly, but the canopy will not respond in kind. Before the canopy can pitch up and arrest the dive, you the jumper need to move from behind the canopy back to the center point. Once you are back under the center of the canopy, then the canopy can being to pitch up out of the dive as you move forward of the center. It's that critical time period between lowering the toggles and you moving back under the center the canopy, where if you are going to hit the ground, you just hit the ground. This is, of course, because you can apply input with the toggles but it is meaningless until your weight effects the lions share of the change in attitude. Look at flying your canopy more as placing yourself correctly under the wing as opposed to effecting aerodynamic change to the wing itself. Yes, you do effect aerodynamic change, but it's just the precursor to the weight shift really making things happen.

What is so hard to understand about this? You pay your money, you take your chances. I'm not sure he can make negative feedback stick if his beef is that it doesn't work. If you shipped the item pictured in the auction, packed securely, in a timely fashion the guy is out of luck. I would leave the situation as it sits. You have already offered the guy more then he should have expected based on the terms of auction. He refused, and that's that. Stand by the terms of the auction.

You 'might' be able to freefly in a Dolphin. If the mods work like their supposed to, you shouldn't have any problems. They do address the concerns for freeflying, but that's only if they work. Whoever brought up secondary riser covers, let's remember that the Javelin doesn't come with secondary riser covers, and I know at least one top VRW team jumps Javelins. Speaking of no secondary riser covers, pick yourself up a good set of velcroless risers (Infinty makes a nice riser). If your tuck tab should pop open, and your riser sneaks out, it's really no big deal unless your toggle comes unstowed. Velcroless toggles are far more secure than velcro toggles. Make sure you get a fresh BOC pouch, and the extra birdle protection. If you have zero exposed bridle, you have zero problems (or at least the same problems as other 'freefly friendly' rigs). Speaking of bridle problems, make sure you have the correct size main canopy and correct length closing loop. A 'soft' rig like a Dolphin will not stay shut with a loose canopy or a long closing loop. Set it up the right way, and do the work packing and closing it. This will keep tension on the pin, the pin cover flap closed, and help keep the bridle tucked under the side flap on it's way to the BOC. 'IF' all of that is in place, you'll be fine. A Dolphin can work for freeflying, but there's no room for a sloppy rig set-up. Other containers are far more tolerant of odd iszed canopies or other mis-matches, but not the Dolphin.