Lucky...

It's not, "aren't" it's were or were not. I'm not talking present tenths, I'm talking past tenths, circa 1930's. I don't think you are able to understand average Joe American digging thru garbage cans, not just the dregs of society, as they are considered by many now. Point is, homeless guys now aren't like homeless then. Furthermore, even if the working people who were made poor and / or then homeless weren't digging thru trash cans, they were still begging or scraping by and also fucking. I think you fail to remember that the poor and homelesss in the 30's were the middle class, unlike now. Actually I read something recently that stated the divorce rate was down during the GD. What are you basing your assertion on? And most pregnancies really aren't planned, other than the fucking might be planne dor at least deliberate planned; that's how Jesus (gag, puke) nature had it planned, they attach a bonus to sex and a drive, that furthers the species. From a species survival perspective, those who have the least probability to have long-surviving offspring will render the most offspring, so it would make sense that they would procreate more. What else effected the birth rate were infant mortalities via nonexistent prenatal care, a product of the GD. Sure, I even said it could be < 7 Million, could be as little as 1 million, I don;t see it less than that. So let's agree on a number and then we'll go to what the real discussion started out as: TAX CUTS, MY RICH FRIENDS. Of course the neo-cons all scatter when we start talking taxes and the effect on the economy. Not sure what you're trying to say there in bold. Again, as far as the number, I spent hours trying to find the number of dead that died as a result of Hoover's tax policies and all his other Lassiz Faire idiocy. I don't care if we reduce to a ridiculously low 1M and go with that; the point still stands that Hoover cutting taxes, not deficit spending and being idiotic enough to think the market would fix itself w/o killing many is how this issue started and I would like to further that as well. So what do you think is a fair number tax cuts my friends killed in teh GD?

You are the king of losimg primary argumemts and then drifting off to fringe arguments and being petty or abstract to TRY to translate that as being the primary argument. Even guys in your corner see it. You've refused to answer so many of my questions, as in: 20 questins is over, as I answer all of yours; your credibility is null. I asked what swell and draw refers to in riveting practice, you replied by saying blind riveting. A blind rivet draws and then swells, not swell and draw. Again, kid, kid, kid, if I went to a MRO (maint repair org) and referred to pulling some blind rivets as, "I will go swell and draw those rivets" they would be watching me very closely andd if they found 1 reason to be rid of me they would. Kid, you admitted, you're a trailer mechanic and obviously you want to pretend you're an acft srructure mech; do you think anyone is fooled? Actually it was jcd11235 making that brilliant prognostication. AS I WROTE: Again, w/o going back there, I said 6061 is the best aluminum to be welded and every acft alum part I've seen welded is 6061. You made so kind of statement that all or many alloys can be welded. I think I replied by saying that even tho they may be welded, they don't weld nearly as well so they waren't used. You did represent that it isn't much diff - one alloy to another. So you say it's ALF, but you don't make a claim as to why. Now you want believability . Please tell us why that assertion is incorrect instead of trying to convicne us with your pseudo knowledge of acft, metals, etc. Do you see how silly it looks to say: "you're wong, but I won't tell you why?" The number of millions of dead were in dispute, the major statement that Hoover's policies, "sucked balls" is not; we both agree. But the further question of why they sucked balls would be in dispute, unless you think 'tax cuts my friends' was bad. See, I want to pin you down on your statement as to why Hoover's GD recovery sucked balls and you're run-runnin on empty, runnin dry. That is what is in dispute. Will you answer? No, you cherry-pick.

But the motivation for teh crime is part of what they think. Actus Reus and Mens Rea are the elements that comprise a crime, the latter IS the formation of thought and motive and is part of what drives a person to the crime.

Considering the two mentioned ideologies are doing better than the, uh, free one, they are sponsoring the, uh, free one, let's leave the walls up so they can continue to support the the, uh, free one.

As I said before, I'm not Obama's fan, but some of you guys definitely make me feel sorry for him, while providing yet another example of what pieces of shit some conservatives really are. You just keep feeling sorry for him and yourself. Maybe you should consider returning to mother Russia where the state provided you with everything. Right? I bet you found it easier to bash Christians back home too. I find that easy here . The funny thing now is that the ole shoe is on the other foot. Libs like where we're going, so we now get to say, 'If ya don't like it; leave.' Yeah lucky, the libs like it so much, Princess PeloUsi is gonna put you in jail if you don't buy health insurance. Leave? I have faith in the United States Senate. Like I told my wife: "Me leave? No, you leave". You told your wife to leave? That might have a negative effect on your wedding anniversary.

Look at it this way. Couldn't Obama pander to the coprorations and just roll thru his presidency wearing Armani suits and traveling to Europe every chance he gets? He could ditch HC, which could blow up on him whichever way it goes and has created some divide, but he cares about people and is willing to ruin his legacy over it. He could be, as I'm sure many Republicans refer to him as, a 'good house monkey' and just go along like the real chimp, GWB and walk away loved by corp America and hated by the people, but he cares about people, if you will, "lesser" (my words) than he and is willing to gamble when it doesn't behoove him. That's a great man, a great president and a sacrificer of all when most men would not. Just ask yourself what he has to gain by pushing HC and you'll see what a great president he is. If you go to neckville south you would find people hating Lincoln and the civilized, intelligent world knows he is great. So: 1) Try not to judge him until he has time to fullfil some issues. 2) Try to listen to the country/world and see what they think, compare it to your position and factor out the unbiased truth/reality.

Which is illustated by survey after another, surveys not from the street but from presidential academicians. Lincoln #1-2, Hoover, GWB 6th from the bottom along with Pierce and Buchannon at the bottom; pro-slavery. Bit of course that's a liberal conspriacy, Hoover, Nixon, GWB were all the greatest men of all time.

As I said before, I'm not Obama's fan, but some of you guys definitely make me feel sorry for him, while providing yet another example of what pieces of shit some conservatives really are. You just keep feeling sorry for him and yourself. Maybe you should consider returning to mother Russia where the state provided you with everything. Right? I bet you found it easier to bash Christians back home too. I find that easy here . The funny thing now is that the ole shoe is on the other foot. Libs like where we're going, so we now get to say, 'If ya don't like it; leave.'

The guy is nuts, he wrote: President Roosevelt, in his speech that summer, told America "all private plans, all private lives, have been in a sense repealed by an overriding public danger." In 1940, Wendell Wilkie was the Republican nominee. And there is no better example of someone repealing their "private plans" than this good man. He gave Roosevelt the critical support he needed for a peacetime draft, an unpopular idea at the time. And he made it clear that he would rather lose the election than make national security a partisan campaign issue. Shortly before Wilkie died, he told a friend, that if he could write his own epitaph and had to choose between "here lies a president" or "here lies one who contributed to saving freedom," he would prefer the latter. I worked on the B-1, it's a POS. I also worked the B52, its a clumbsy great acft. The B-1 isn't the 1st acft in, it comes in aft the path is cleared. It had so many problems and cost so much based upon its performance. Bang for buck it sucks, but it looks cool. The guy is nuttier than SNL portrays himself to be.

I voted < 1 year, as it would take time for the mess to fall apart. For teh first 6 months people would kinda be in disbelif and wonder what their parameters were. Then as people started to figure it out and make their own rules as a society, we would then see the degadation and eventhe Freemen types, perhaps pseud0-Freemen in this case would not like what they have and want to pay taxes to get back to where we were.

You have the sarcasm, the rhetoric an dteh borderline insults, just not teh roadmap between your taxes and my potential HC. Same with my taxes and your military.

Show me the roadmap. You can't; one doesn't exist, it's just your cliche' - not outtta my pockerts.

Oh, so when the gov competes with the ins co's via public option, that's what you're talking about? Ohhhhhhh, now I get it. It was all very well rounded rheotoric, they never really posted line-by-line how they were going to ensure all people coverage and fix the problem. Post their ideas if you wish, but please spell them correctly because I'm [SICK] in love with proppper grammmeeer. Actually we're both showing our hypocrisy. [insert Deliverance voice here] Pull yerself up by yer bootstraps and be a man, ya sissy. Get on out of that wheelchair, Nancyboy, I don't wanna hear yer cryin'. To simplify the issue to that of getting a job when my GF has worked for 29 years at the same place but can't retire due to pre-existings, and many people with a myriad of other other issues is ridiculous. Tell me how your money goes to pay for teh HC bill. Are you a millonaire? Considering over the last 29 years vitually all of the debt is attributable to the Repubs, where does this personal responsibility BS play in? Actually I want my country to collectively pay as I've collectively paid them by military service and labor all my life. I want all Americans to have guaranteed HC.

Of course it is. But, since you've already said that health insurance isn't enough of a priority for you to provide it for yourself, why should it be such a priority for me to provide it for you? Tell ya what, you draw the connect betwen HC expenditures and tax collection and I'll tell ya whatever you want to hear. Hell, I could earn more than you and pay more in taxes, presently or in the future. Furthermore, it's abotu pre-existing conds and a myriad of other issues other than just public option.

Funny how the D's are supporting breaking all the promises they made just a few years ago..... My how times change. Funny how you don't list them.

1) There is no citation 2) The article has no reference as to how the author came up with via the language in the bill 3)http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qa3827/is_200111/ai_n9015518/ - That should show us what a RW nut this guy is, just an editorial by another extremist. Shame on you Rush for not posting an actual source

There are people who work (working poor) who are above the threshold for welfare, yet can't even come close to HC. The you have people with pre-existing, people like me who haven't had HC ins for years and would probably not be able to get it oe get affordable coverage due to the ins co's knowing people like me have deferred ins and would be a big risk. People like my GF who can't retire after working for 29 years at the same plce, she has pre-existings that prohibit her to retire and still have ins. The list goes on, but I guess you are comfortable to have a corporation decide who get care and how much it will cost. I feelbetter the gov making that decision. I certanly don't feel better having the gov make those choices for me. So corporations who make those decisions and make you believe you are making them is best then?

I generally address last word while you cherry pick and avoid the tough qustions like your hero, Saran Palin. Withourt going back to the other trhead, didn't you say or infer you give some kind of backdoor advoce? At the very least, you did say that the market won't hold it's value - just look at it dropping today giving back yesterday's gain. I could testify as an airframe expert. Not from an engineering persepctive, but as a mechainic/builder of airframes. Not close to an economics expert, Ipost data and watch people run; that validates my points. You act like it's a personal reason that is deep and dark, the original statement by me coverd Hoover, his policies and the effect of suffering and death, you want to open part but not all of the questioning; in court that wouldn't permitted - here you just look silly. Truth that is obvious to all; you can't honestly go down that path w/o entering the other issues. Ok, so the death toll was probably a lot < 12M, was it 7M, was it 5M or 1M? Now we move onto the other issues. Again, w/o going back there, I said 6061 is the best aluminum to be welded and every acft alum part I've seen welded is 6061. You made so kind of statement that all or many alloys can be welded. I think I replied by saying that even tho they may be welded, they don't weld nearly as well so they waren't used. You did represent that it isn't much diff - one alloy to another. As for blind rivet, I've been in aviation all my life since being a kid and have never used or even remotely heard that a blind fastener can be shot by, "swell and draw." As I stated before, shooting a blind rivet is a 1-step process after you have it loaded in teh hole, you can't partially shoot it if you want it to turn out well, so even using your crazy guess as to 'swell and draw' it would really be draw and swell, as the blind fastener draws teh shank, then swells, so your scurrying has worked agianst you. You remind me of that SNL skit where the chick knows more than everyone else. It's ok that you don't understadn swell and draw in regard to shooting solid rivets on acft, few people do since it's an obscure career field.

Yea, but you're not in charge - welcome to your opinion, but the gov is lots more than that and should be. Yea, but you're not in charge - welcome to your opinion, but the gov is lots more than it[sic] should be. -fixed it No I'm not in charge, I'm just watching the thing play out and become more like I want.

Not to mention wet vacs, which are so versitile and hard-working they can also vacuum dry stuff; it's a travesty.

And BTW, one of your many pseudo hats; stockbroker. The market won't hold, look at the losses today...... yea, how's the market doing, Mr. I look at the market day-to-day.

Do you really have to posture? POST: which didn;t I answer. Do I have to go back and find the list of questions you didn't answer? You finally said no more 20 questions after the swell-and-draw and your errant answer of blind rivets. The you backed off and said you never claimed to be an expert in aviation structure - no more questoions. WHICH QUESTIONS DID I NOT ANSWER? No, you're trying very hard not to answer why Hoover fucked teh GD recovery, as you then would have to admit that doing nothing / cutting taxes was a negative approach, and you don't want that. DO YOU REALLY THINK PEOPLE HERE ARE THAT STUPID AS TO THEM NOT BEING ABLE TO SEE YOU AVOIDING QUESTIONS? Diff issue? Unrelated? Really? I agreed immediately that it was a bad source and that the number is tough to discern, but probably more like 7 million, maybe less. I think it's wide open as to how many died, but to say that 1 million died is very believable. So here was just one of teh many statements that I made: Gee, they did it after Hoover cut taxes slightly as the GD kicked off, almost 3 years later and 12 mill dead Hoover almost tripled them and FDR raised them a little a year later and then again. So my point still stands: - Hoover cut taxes - almost 3 years later easily 1M died - Hoover tripled taxes - healing began So you've made your point that 12 Mill was erroant, it still could be close, but I doubt it, now you find yoruself arguing a moot point - pretty silly-looking. The passage you drew the 12M from was the same one that is posted above. Since you debinked the 12M, now move on to another point within that or just continue to acquiesce (agree). The questions I now ask are related, now quit repeating an issue that has been agreed upon by all sides that the toll was at least 1M and let's continue the discussion. It wasn't a guesstimate, as I had a source, a bad one, but it waasn'tmy number - I did a quicky search that I agree was errant, but that at the very least, 1M people died. And your opinion of how Hoover cut taxes and that "sucked balls" will stay suppressed - just not honest.

Only if a person w/a hairlip says it.

Sorry, I apologize to Lucky. I got carried away No prob man, just tell me how I can punch a clock to get paid for all this, I'll even fix the typos The OT you must have collected by now would allow you to retire I think Other way, all the fucking time I spend here costs me OT . I really have learned a lot while at all my clubs I frequent. This place probably has the largest and most diverse group of intelect over other clubs I frequent. Just laying things out there, if people are credible, they honestly and completely answer questions and research a bit to at least get close to the thruth, it's a great exchange and I have learned a lot from some people or from others who challenge me to research things. Of course there is the troll-factor where people just jab and don't research, answer questions, or try to find the truth.......the truth is someimes ugly to us and we have to / should admit it.

I just found an absolutely brain melting NewsBusters article that simultaneously a) slams Obama for not going to Berlin and b) slams him all over again for having been to Berlin already. Beautiful. and then slams him for all the things he said while there and all the things he didn't say. It's amazing, the D side bitches about: - Katrina - WMD's Iraq/Afg - 5T debt increase - Tax cuts to the rich - Libby Commutation - and whole bevy of shit The R's have nothing and look desperate trying.