Skydivercop

LMAO...I love it when these turn into a "My dick is bigger than your dick" conversation. Just a joke...take this lightly fellas! Ain't that the question of this thread? Could it be, these intelligent, educated and experienced skydivers got complacent at the wrong time/place, or were victims of being in the wrong time/place? I didn't realize I needed 1000 jumps to know how dangerous but SIMPLE landing should be. And before anyone starts on the accuracy, landing in winds, etc, etc, etc, I'm referring to simply getting your ass on the ground. I'm not questioning any of y'alls qualifications/experience. But I think we've, at least I have, hit on the problem of deaths at landing. We, on this thread alone, have made the business of landing too complicated. Read: LANDING IS SIMPLY SURVIVING THIS JUMP FOR THE NEXT. If you choose to do 300 ft hook turns for a downwind landing, you should announce those intentions on the plane, so ALL the jumpers know who is doing what. We do it for the freefall portion, so where's the problem doing it for landing? I don't see where that is a problem. I call it courtesy, sorry if that inconveniences anyone, but my life is not an inconvenience. You alluded to a great jumpers death...shouldn't we be trying to learn from that? Isn't that the best way to honor both his death and his contributions to this sport? My 2 cents...and then some! Been great talking/sparring with you guys. AJ aka Sonic A-Hole Sonic Beef #93 "Thaaaaaat's Right!"

You answered that for yourself...the first jumper. The lower jumper under canopy has right of way. If a HP jumper sees me under him/her and "cuts" me off, they are simply wrong. I think we've come down to courtesy here, and we're drawing straws. I don't know what DZs you jump at, but please list them so I avoid them. At the DZs I've been to, and again that list is limited, I've yet to run into a problem of the HP crowd announcing their canopy "flight plan" on ride to altitude and giving us larger canopy jumpers a little leeway, so we avoid exactly what this thread started as. I choose to jump the larger canopy because I feel as someone wrote, it is there for me to survive THIS jump to make the NEXT jump. That's not to say swoopers are wrong...that's their bag and this is mine. But the swoopers/HP jumpers I jump with and in fact do RW with also announce and share their landing space with us more "traditional" jumpers. I hate to see deaths occur under operational canopies and I hate more we're arguing over the semantics of landing patterns and "who's first?" As someone stated, this is skydiving 101, as simple as it gets and we're sitting here making it more complex than it has to be. My utmost respect to all jumpers, and even more to those who have differing aspects, as mine is/can be shallow. But lets not argue just for the sake of arguing. Who's the lower guy? The guy below you you're about to hook below and piss the fuck off, that's who! Can it not be said more simply? AJ aka Sonic A-Hole Sonic Beef #93 "Thaaaaaat's Right!"

At the expense of sounding naive, and after only 4 years of jumping and 4 DZs, I've always been taught or heard the "low jumper has right of way." Also, as I stated earlier, the FJC out of the ISP covers landing patterns. Listening to you has definitely opened my eyes to when I visit new DZs. I must have been fortunate in my "career" up till now. AJ aka Sonic A-Hole Sonic Beef #93 "Thaaaaaat's Right!"

Apparently I did...break it down for me. AJ aka Sonic A-Hole Sonic Beef #93 "Thaaaaaat's Right!"

I agree Wendy. The pattern I was taught was to locate the target, turn to face it and wait until touch down. Sparky Not to be a smart aleck, but what are you telling me? When you coach/instruct a new jumper, you just tell them to turn and face the target until touch down? Of course I know you're not, so please don't get stuck on the differences in how you were taught then and what is taught now. As a matter of fact, you guys, the older jumpers, are the ones who developed our current way of life. I was simply trying to point out we're taught landing patterns (in this day and age). If you're not, there's something wrong, and if you don't follow a landing pattern there's something wrong. I sure as hell won't jump with a haphazard jumper. AJ aka Sonic A-Hole Sonic Beef #93 "Thaaaaaat's Right!"

Did they ever exist? I've not been in the sport long enough to comment, but I'd guess not... What's the problem here? If you have earned a license from FAI or USPA, you should have learned landing patterns during your FJC. I don't have a problem with swoopers (and I jump a big 235) as long as they state, as they do at my DZ, on the plane their intentions. I.E. downwind/upwind, right or left patterns. If this isn't happening at YOUR DZ, then YOU are at fault, because it shouldn't be tolerated by any jumper. People who don't want to raise a stink for safety's sake because they don't want to appear as lame-asses are just as bad as the kids who don't want to upsize because it isn't cool. Now, I realize this won't fix all HP landings, and I agree totally a separate swoop/non-swoop area with OPPOSITE landing patterns would greatly assist in avoiding mid-air collisions. IMHO... AJ aka Sonic A-Hole Sonic Beef #93 "Thaaaaaat's Right!"

Sonic Beef!!! AJ aka Sonic A-Hole Sonic Beef #93 "Thaaaaaat's Right!"

John, I think you're wrong, I bet both the RNC and the DNC are spending $50+k a year each to have a couple of people sitting around posting on DZ.com to influence those 5 folks on DZ.com that are riding on the fence and not firmly planted in either belief system. Dude, how do I get that job??? Has to leave a lot of time for jumping! AJ aka Sonic A-Hole Sonic Beef #93 "Thaaaaaat's Right!"

I'm single because I'm an a-hole! LOL AJ aka Sonic A-Hole Sonic Beef #93 "Thaaaaaat's Right!"

So why are you single then? My luck is so bad, I actually had a girlfriend break up with me because I agree to disagree. Well, at least that is what she said! AJ aka Sonic A-Hole Sonic Beef #93 "Thaaaaaat's Right!"

Now that's grace under pressure! :D AJ aka Sonic A-Hole Sonic Beef #93 "Thaaaaaat's Right!"

You shaved your ball girl??? Did you take pictures? AJ aka Sonic A-Hole Sonic Beef #93 "Thaaaaaat's Right!"

Well, that is just BS. WHAT skydiver doesn't fart in the plane??? ;) AJ aka Sonic A-Hole Sonic Beef #93 "Thaaaaaat's Right!"

The newbie, kinda like me, who can't think of anything cute or witty to say, maybe like me. But it's not me. :D AJ aka Sonic A-Hole Sonic Beef #93 "Thaaaaaat's Right!"

LMFAO!!!!!!!!! AJ aka Sonic A-Hole Sonic Beef #93 "Thaaaaaat's Right!"